Poll of the Day > I'm going to replay...well, at least some of the Metal Gear Solid series

(+) Yeah! (+)

Starting fresh tonight, lads.

My PS3 has unfortunately stopped working, so I'm only currently able to play the Metal Gear Solid games available on modern systems. I wanted to play them in timeline order, but the broken PS3 has stopped that plan. I've purchased the Master Collection Volume 1 for Switch, which will let me play MGS 1, 2, and 3. I have Twin Snakes on GameCube, but I think I'd rather play the original MGS instead.

I'll stop with those three games for now. The only two main MGS games unavailable to me are MGS4 and Peace Walker. I have MGSV on my PS4, but I won't skip those other two games just to get there. I'm hoping they announce Master Collection Volume 2 at the Tokyo Game Show later this month...but I doubt they will.

It's been years since I've played this series, so here we go.

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I hope you play VR Missions - I loved it; and ESPECIALLY the expansion VR pack they added to MGS2 Subsistence

you ever done a foxhound run?

I'm not sure I'll play the VR missions, I'll probably just head straight through each game.

I don't think I've ever done a Foxhound run either, but I did do everything needed to get a Platinum trophy for MGS3 back in 2011.

I've just defeated the first boss of MGS1. So far, I'm very impressed with the quality of the voice acting and the very cinematic characteristics of the cutscenes. None of the other MGS games leaned into being as movie-like as this one did.

The concept that Solid Snake is being purposely misled by his superiors is made a lot more obvious than I remembered. I always thought it was a huge revelation, but this time it's so clear that it's hard to see it as a spoiler at all.

The graphics leave a lot to be desired. I get that this is a hardware complaint more than anything, the fact Sony was able to make a console capable of 3D gaming in like 1995 is actually a big accomplishment, but PS1 games are really tough to look back on, even more so than N64 games (which the N64 was clearly the console with far better graphics). Still, character models are good enough, as are their animations. Also, the Switch version looks a bit better than I remember the PS3 digital version looking.

Aiming is a huge pain. The first boss fight feels a big silly when you can't even see where you're aiming. Again, an issue with the hardware more than anything. I'm kind of glad I'm not playing them in timeline order, since this would be really tough to play right after enjoying the great controls of MGSV.

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I've just defeated the third boss, Grey Fox. It's really nice how fast paced the game is, it never seems to get dull. I know that the next boss has always caused me trouble, we'll see if that happens this time.

The throwback references to Metal Gear 1 and 2 are interesting, given that very few people ever played them when this came out. I get that Hideo Kojima was continuing a story he already established, but it's just funny how Metal Gear Solid is considered by almost everyone to be the first real installment in the series. The Zelda series is obviously not even close to being as plot driven, so it was rare for even a subtle reference to be made to previous series, never mind expanding on direct events from previous entries.

One thing that does have me confused is the repeated use of the phrase "currently existing technology". I've never known what they're even talking about with that phrase, and searching it online shows I'm not alone. The best explanation is that it's a poorly worded translation for "civilian market technology", rather than advanced tech not available on the market.

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maybe they mean cuz it's fictional technology

Metal Gear Ac!d deserves a remaster

I've defeated Psycho Mantis and completed the first Sniper Wolf boss fight.

This section contained the first serious amount of backtracking in the game. It's still a bit tedious, but not as bad as I remembered. A silver lining of it is that it gives me plenty of time to restock on rations and other items.

The controls are still the main problem with this game. Sometimes when sneaking up on enemies to choke them out, the game alerts the guard without giving you a chance. Also, the aiming controls, especially the first person aiming in the Sniper Wolf boss fight are horrible.

The voice acting and general story telling is pretty great, though. This is as enjoyable to replay as ever.

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I'm nearly finished the game. I've made it to the point where you input PAL codes into the computers. I've just input the first PAL codes.

The game mostly holds up as it progresses, although there are some things that are getting stale. There are a lot of "gotcha" moments in this game that just feel cheap. In the cargo elevator, there are mines near the platform that you can't detect since the radar is out. The only way to know they're there is to be damaged by them. Not cool.

Aiming with the PSG in this game has that very annoying sloppy aim effect. Solid Snake is supposed to be genetically optimized and yet he has a serious case of tremors apparently. It makes the required use of this really frustrating. I know you can find an item to help prevent the tremors, but I hadn't found any at the points that it would actually have been helpful.

That said, the game's story has a lot of heart. The narrative Metal Gear Solid provides more than makes up for the outdating control mechanics.

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I've finished Metal Gear Solid 1 finally!

The game was great from start to finish. The plot seems to layer on itself a bit too much, though. The revelation that Solid and Liquid Snake are the sons of Big Boss and also are twins is foundational to the entire premise of the series and yet it's revealed in a very nonchalant way. The implication that dominant genes are inherentoly superior to recessive based on their increased presentation in offspring is a nonsensical point for Liquid Sn I ake to be obsessed with, as is his ramblings to provide soldiers a new world order in which they have a place "like they did in the Cold War", which also makes no sense given the real world social push back against those that served in Vietnam. I kind of wish I kept a notepad handy for pointing out logical inconsistencies like this, because there were a lot, too much to keep track of really.

The ideas are certainly there for a good story, but the execution of the story needed a lot of work. Overall, the game is fun and interesting enough for me to not really care. Gameplay wise, the controls are very dated but sneaking around is as fun as it always has been. My biggest gameplay issue is that there often are "gotcha" tricks that seem unfair, like the hidden claymores I mentioned in my last comment.

I'm going to start MGS2 right away and likely finish the Tanker Chapter before I go to bed tonight.

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Also, I had the most BS game over during the Rex fight:

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Mgs 2 might be my favorite of the mainline series (mgs1-5).

Are you gonna play rising?

Which ending did you get?

green_dragon posted...

Mgs 2 might be my favorite of the mainline series (mgs1-5).

Are you gonna play rising?

Nope, never played it before and it's generally not considered canon.

MrMelodramatic posted...

Which ending did you get?

Meryl, of course! I don't know why anyone would give up during the interorogation and get the Otacon ending.

I've been super busy this past week, but I've made progress in Metal Gear Solid 2. I finished the Tanker chapter and I'm very shortly into the Plant chapter.

The controls and graphics are such a massive step up from MGS1. First person aiming is without a doubt the most essential update. The increased ways to manoeuvre add a lot to the gameplay.

This was the first game to cement Ocelot as being a major antagonist. It's great to see them build on the post credits conversation between Ocelot and Solidus to make the central plot of this game.

Iroquois Pliskin is a very interesting character to introduce, despite it being obvious to the player who he is. I'm not sure that the plot point of Solid Snake supposedly being dead really lands in any way, nor has it yet played out as being consequential at all, but it does add a bit of world building and depth.

One thing I've noticed is the stark personality change that Solid Snake has had. He doesn't really seem like the same Solid Snake in MGS1. It's hard to place exactly how his personality has changed, but it's noticable.

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Had a bit of time in the past few days to play more MGS2. I'm on my way to Strut 2.

It's funny playing this game knowing the plot of the entire series. It's clear that a lot of details were very specifically chosen, including why the voice acting for the Colonel is so wooden. I feel that storytelling is one of this series' greatest strengths, and the added understanding that comes from replaying games is a very interesting way of adding replayability.

I'm still noticing inconsistencies in character personalities. Like I mentioned before, Solid Snake hardly seems like his MGS1 self. Colonel Campbell's differences are explained in the plot, so they get a pass. Ocelot is mostly the same but the nature of his true allegiance is made much more obvious in this one.

Raiden isn't really a very interesting character, despite the background character building they do with his conversations with Rose. I know that kind of ends up being the point of the character, but the experience itself tends to suffer for it.

On the gameplay side, there has been a severe amount of backtracking in this game, even more so than in MGS1. Some of the backtracking, including where I am now in the game, which is needing to locate a PSG1 to enter Strut 2, is a purposeful throwback to MGS1, but it just doesn't translate to being a particularly fun experience.

Still, MGS2 remains an interesting game with great gameplay and a very deep and intriguing story. I'm hoping to make some decent progress this week.

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Out of the main gameplay setpieces, I say MGS2 is the best... while of the more regular gameplay MGS5 is the best.

Are you going to play Ground Zeroes, or just jump directly to Phantom Pain?

Lokarin posted...

Out of the main gameplay setpieces, I say MGS2 is the best... while of the more regular gameplay MGS5 is the best.

The story is something I've really grown to appreciate. It's very unsettling just how accurate Kojima was in 2001 to what we see in the 2020s.

ParanoidObsessive posted...

Are you going to play Ground Zeroes, or just jump directly to Phantom Pain?

I'll play the main mission of Ground Zeroes, it doesn't take long. I'm still stuck without being able to play MGS4 or Peace Walker until Master Collection Volume 2 releases, which is likely at least a year away. Honestly I was strongly expecting them to announce it at the Tokyo Game Show, but they said nothing other than they're "working on it".

Small update: I defeated the Harrier boss fight (which was amazing, best boss in the series so far). Then I got a game over moments later from slipping on seagull poop.

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Lots of progress, nearly finished the game. I'm just about to board Arsenal Gear.

The section immediately after the Harrier boss fight was the most annoying part of the game. Lots of "gotcha" game overs, the seagull poop was only the beginning. There's also a part where you need to cartwheel jump over a gap but the camera angle makes it hard to see exactly where you're pointed, so I got a game over from that.

The swimming section wasn't as bad as I remembered. The Vamp boss fight started very easy and then became just frustrating. I'm not a fan of old game mechanics where you clearly have hit the enemy and yet no damage registers, and this is particularly annoying during the Vamp fight (and yes, I know you can't damage him with the auto lock feature, but even first person aiming sometimes does nothing to him).

Emma is a great character. Despite being introduced so late in the game, she has a good amount of motive developed. It's a huge shame she isn't around for longer to really allow her character time to have a bigger impact. Missions where you escort a slow follower are usually awful in games, but MGS2 manages to make this section reasonably fun. It's probably because she isn't a huge hindrance to your progression, just enough to make it clear that she needs you help.

Otacon and Emma's final conversation before her passing is absolutely heartbreaking. This is much more emotional than the hamfisted Stockholm Syndrome remorse Otacon felt for Sniper Wolf when she passed in MGS1. However, the backstory Otacon gives afterwards for leaving his family is really strange to the point of being out of place both for the game and for Otacon's character.

I'm likely going to finish this game this evening. Then I can start one of my favourite games of all time, MGS3!

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I finished Metal Gear Solid 2. Wow, what a mind melter of a story that game has.

The game's plot really comes to a head in its final hour. The very concept of reality falls apart, forming one of the game's main themes. What is real? Does whether or not something is "real" even matter? Are truth and real synonyms or can one exist without the other?

The deeply insightful dialogues regarding the role AI has in society is insanely prophetic. This game was released in 2001, and yet it's so accurate to what we've actually seen in the past 10 years that it's easy to forget that this isn't a modern commentary. Having it be based in 2009 was a bit premature, but these issues actually faced the world within a few years of that. Do we allow people to stew in their half truth ponds, perpetuating a version of reality that suits their palate? Do we strive to seek a more just and absolute truth? Who gets to be the arbiter of that reality?

There are few video games that come even close to being as good as MGS2 is in regards to posing intriguing social commentary. That said, the story has some flaws.

Solidus Snake's rationale for his actions was to implant his mark on the history books. Did he not already do that by literally being the President? He wants freedom restored to the people, but the plot is so vague about this that it's hard to see exactly what details Solidus really wants. Similarly, Fortune wants to take over control of Arsenal Gear for some reason? The entire backstory of Dead Cell needed a bit more clarification.

Then, of course, is Ocelot. I know that a lot of his motives get answered in MGS4, but his wildcard chaotic persona doesn't seem to have much reason beyond serving as a convenient way of furthering the plot right now. At this point, at very least, he's shown himself to be a quadruple agent, and that list just keeps growing as the series goes on.

I feel like I need to write down in a mind web all the interconnected pieces of this plot and the motives and allegiances of the characters just to even make basic sense of it. It's almost too much. The central themes of genes, information, truth, reality, and legacy are ones that resonate the strongest. What a strange experience.

I might get around to starting MGS3 tomorrow. This is the last Metal Gear game I can play in release order...and the only other Metal Gear game I have access to playing is MGSV, which I'm not sure I want to jump to. This topic will inevitably have to be paused until Master Collection Volume 2 launches, which is probably a year or more away. Ugh.

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I've started MGS3 and completed the Virtuous Mission.

This has always been my favourite game in the series (it's the only game I ever earned a Platinum trophy on PS3 for), but it's been at least a decade since I've played through it. I'm finding myself being much more critical of it than I ever have.

The first issue I have is just the extreme amounts of exposition delivered in the cutscenes and codec calls. It's about 30 minutes of cutscenes before you even start playing the game, which is ridiculous. In all playthroughs after the first time I ever played it, I always skipped these cutscenes (which really helps) but I want to rewatch them for the first time in ages. Unfortunately, they really aren't worth it. The ideological banter between Naked Snake and The Boss is notably much less profound or thoughtful than the majority of what was discussed in MGS1 and especially MGS2. I'm not sure if they were just trying to paint Naked Snake as being extremely naive or if they were trying to give him basic viewpoints in order to better explain his seemingly one dimensional villain views as Big Boss in the 1990s but either way it really seems cheesy and basic rather than interesting or profound.

The second issue is that the camera controls kind of conflict with the gameplay. This version has the Subsistence controls which allow you to switch between classic overhead view and the more modern camera control view, but neither really seem to work well to give you an idea of your surroundings. I feel more blind in this game compared to MGS1 and MGS2. The lack of a Soliton radar system might be what's making me feel this way. I'm sure I'll get over it.

That said, the game feels like a huge step up from MGS2 in terms of gameplay. Enemies seem smarter than they were in the previous games. Character model graphics are incredible for a PS2 game, probably the best in that entire console generation (although background textures certainly could have used an improvement, especially the bricks on the factory in Rassvet). The environment/setting is much more interesting as well. Naked Snake definitely has a personality that is unique from Solid Snake, and they do a reasonable job of making that clear without going overboard on making it obvious. I've been familiar with this game for so long that I can't even remember whether or not it was obvious that Naked Snake is Big Boss, but I imagine it was.

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My first time playing MGS1 was the most fun I've had in the series, but it's the one I enjoy replaying the least

I've just defeated The Pain. That was probably the worst boss fight in the series so far. His wasp gimmick really doesn't play out very well, and the wasp armour he gains is just annoying to blow away with a grenade.

Prior to this, the Ocelot duel was really fun. Definitely a great throwback in many ways to MGS1. Also, I liked how the cave section gradually let your vision adjust to the darkness. I have to admit that I got a bit lost in the cave either way, I used to know exactly where to go in the cave, even in total darkness. I've obviously gotten a bit rusty.

The Snake Eater mission is so far much better than the Virtuous Mission. I'm a bit confused by some of the story elements though. I've never been thoroughly convinced that the entire premise of taking out The Boss was a convincing proof that the US wasn't involved in the events of the Virtuous Mission. Also, Eva not knowing the secret code that Snake was told should have been an immediate red flag and ended her involvement in the mission. I guess her attractiveness was supposed to be the reason that Snake let it go, but Naked Snake is so overwhelmingly oblivious compared to Solid Snake that it doesn't really seem plausible.

Some of Eva's dialogue makes no sense, either. There's a line she says that implies that Volgin chose her (instead of Adam) to meet with Snake, but one of the main objectives of the mission is to take down Volgin....so why would he be aware of it?

There's a strange amount of charm that this game has that lets it get away with nonsensical plot points, and weak boss fights. It's hard to place exactly what it is. MGS3 is phenomenal, but these glaring gaps could be fixed to make it so much better.

On a final note, I really like the ability to scavenge for food. The codec conversations with Paramedic about the food you find are always entertaining. The inclusion of Calorie Mate is so funny, and a few years ago I bought a real Calorie Mate to try out for myself. I still have the box for it! I remember it being very dry (I needed a tall glass of water to finish it) but it was pretty tasty.

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I think every single fight in the game has both intentional and unintentional cheese.

I wish Calorie Mates were real outside of Japan/online retialers.

I've defeated The Fear and The End. Even more importantly, I've conquered "the ladder".

A lot of my impressions have remained the same. MGS3 definitely has a more simplistic story compared to its predecessors. Cutscenes have a very awkward, socially unrealistic feel to them. Volgin and The Boss act like sitting ducks complaining about the progress that they hear Snake is making, and Sokolov is given virtually zero character development. That said, the characters are generally more enjoyable in MGS3 than previous games. I find myself very entertained calling Major Zero, Paramedic, Sigint, and Eva for advice throughout the game; I never really bothered to call characters in the other games as much. Paramedic is particularly interesting because she provides a lot of informative tips about food that you capture.

The Fear was a pretty plain boss battle. I didn't have to move from the starting location, the Thermal Goggles made him very easy to follow in first person mode, and the whole boss battle was over in about 30 seconds.

The End was one of the most fascinating battles in the series. I know that you can skip this battle by taking him out earlier in the game, but I wanted to get his incredible Moss camo and his weapon (which you get by using the tranquilizer on him), as well as experience this boss fight again. This battle embraces everything about the series, both the stealth action as well as the combat. I figured out in the first minute of the battle that the sun glare helps you determine his location which made the boss much more bearable than iI remembered it being. It's very annoying that he can replenish his stamina, though, which made using only the tranquilizer much more tedious (although I made good use of the cig spray after sneaking up on him to reduce his stamina, too).

One new complaint I have is just how much health Snake has. In MGS1, getting spotted by guards was a near instant game over. In MGS2, you had a fighting chance. In MGS3, I think you pretty much would have to put the controller down and walk away in order to get a game over. I'm playing on normal mode, which feels much easier than normal mode in the other games.

Still, I'm fully engrossed in this game. Despite its less complex plotline, something about this game's premise just works, and really well. I'm also very happy with the very little amount of backtracking that needs to be done.

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Relatively small update, I've defeated The Fury and arrived at Groznyj Grad.

There was a noticeable difficult spike after the ladder in the last post. I was spotted in nearly every area on the mountain, and the enemies seem to infinitely spawn. This is nice to have the later parts of the game actually feel tougher than the earlier parts, I'm not sure either of the other two games felt like that.

I like Eva's character a lot, but the romance attempts seem awkward and out of place. I get that Snake is purposely avoidant with her, but the whole thing seems like it doesn't accomplish much. I think I remember there's a plot significance to it later on, though.

The Fury wasn't a good boss, and was an even worse character. He's like the forgotten member of The Cobras. He's also clearly more insane than the others. The battle itself combines stealth and action, but the flames are too overbearing. I almost got a game over here, but it wouldn't have really felt fair since flames sometimes aren't fully visible or something and you take damage (and get stunned, preventing you from performing any action) even when you thought you were in a safe spot. The graphics in this part are also horrible, you can barely even tell what's going on.

The Cobras aren't nearly as interesting as the enemy groups in MGS1 and MGS2, and those aren't even steep competition. The only thing that saves The Cobras is their background history with The Boss and World War II. I really wish they expanded on this way more. We don't even really get to see the faces of The Pain or The Fury. Maybe there are some codec calls I've missed about them, I don't know.

I'm just starting the Groznyj Grad part now. I need to review how to get the Sneaking Suit here, because from what I remember, it's easy to miss.

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I've infiltrated Groznyj Grad, completed the escape section, and defeated the Volgin hand to hand battle, which was actually one of the better boss battles, and very rewarding to complete with just CQC. It's the home stretch to the end of the game now.

The Major Raikov bit was funny, but almost too much of an over the top reference to MGS2. I was very lucky with where I found him, he was right at the bottom of the stairs that lead to the locker room, and no guards or scientists were around. I remember being annoyed at this part in the past due to finding Raikov far away from where you need to take him. I wonder if the remake allows you to carry unconscious Raikov the same way you can carry enemies in MGSV, that would make it a lot quicker than the slow walking that this version has.

Sokolov showed a bit more character development than I remembered him having. He became a more pragmatic and confident scientist by this point, less worried about his fate and more concerned with his family. I'm not really sure what the point of pretending "Tatyana" is his lover, other than giving another layer to her cover story.

The plot is coming together in a more coherent way than it started. Volgin has detailed a lot of his plans and his motivation. The faith he has in The Boss joining with him is strikingly naive, though.

I might actually finish this game this evening, I think there's only about an hour or two left.

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I finished Metal Gear Solid 3 late yesterday evening, and I was too tired to type anything up.

MGS3 is an excellent game, but not the near perfect masterpiece I remembered it being. It's funny how our tastes change as time goes on. The ending of the game is definitely its greatest moment, being perhaps the most bittersweet ending of any video game I've ever played.

The mission to defeat The Boss became a bit more convincing as a justification to prove the innocence of the US as the final plot points came in. I had forgotten that The Boss is literally the last remaining daughter of any of the Philosophers, and hence her significance goes beyond her prowess as a soldier. I also had completely forgotten that Eva was raised in an international school for raising agents of the Philosophers, and that The Boss was a teacher at one of those schools.

What I can't help but wonder is why The Cobras got dragged into all this. The Boss spoke about how The Cobras were a united force during World War II, but split apart following the war to return to their countries, which became enemies as the times did, and therefore so did they. Given the truth behind The Boss's mission, why bother getting them involved? She literally just allowed them to be destroyed for nothing. I guess the revelation that she defeated The Sorrow despite him being the father of her son might be a way for the game to show that she no longer has any care for her old unit, but...that doesn't really make much sense. Her message was that the times dictate our enemies in relative terms, but that she believed that the world should see itself as one.

Similarly, The Boss secretly being the first person to ever go to space doesn't make much sense as if that had been what happened, the US wouldn't have let the Soviets take all the glory with Gagarin. Maybe it was because she mentioned that there was no shielding from the effects of cosmic rays at that point, so there were concerns about publicizing the ethics of that mission? But why, when shielding from cosmic rays couldn't possibly be the biggest challenge behind sending someone to space. Really, they didn't need to be so over the top with it, her point would have come across the same if she had gone to space after others already had. This isn't a huge deal, but it just struck me as being a really pointless thing to have.

Gameplay wise, the final two hours of the game were pretty good, but the motorcycle segments long overstayed their welcome. The final boss battle was very cinematic, but the CQC controls during it really feel awkward, like you're just taking a chance of whether or not it'll work. Maybe that was the point, though.

Despite my long criticisms, MGS3 is an amazing game. I'm not sure I think it's the best in the series anymore. The jungle gameplay is better than the indoor infiltration gameplay of its predecessors, but the boss battles were very hit or miss.

I'd love to continue to MGS4, but...my PS3 isn't working, and Konami is taking forever with Master Collection Volume 2. I wouldn't even be surprised if Volume 2 isn't made available on the Switch when it finally releases. It's likely at least a full year away. So unless I can repair my PS3 (I'll try this evening), this is the end of this topic. I look forward to doing a Part 2 to this eventually!

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Quick update...I caved. I looked at my PS3 game collection and it bothered me that I'd not get a chance to play them again. I bought a used 120GB PS3 Slim on eBay for $120 CAD, which I'm not crazy about, but Master Collection Volume 2 would have cost somewhere around $80 CAD anyway.

It should arrive in about 2 or 3 weeks, but the Canada Post rotating strike is still going, so I won't be surprised if it takes longer. I'll try to keep this topic alive until then.