Current Events > Would society survive without the concept of police?

(+) Yeah! (+)

Yes, it would have to be a different society though. People seem to think abolitionists want the same society, minus cops and that they think that would be peachy keen. That's not it.

The typical argument is that we don't provide for people's needs, and have shrunken the public sphere/social services/social relationships of care in favor of "the economy" and private property so that we now need police to clean up the aftermath through force. The idea would be to take care of people's needs to the point where armed force is no longer necessary to keep things running.

As to whether this would work? I don't know. If it worked, it'd be way better than what we have now. But there's a huge gulf between here and there.

legendary_zell posted...

The typical argument is that we don't provide for people's needs, and have shrunken the public sphere/social services/social relationships of care in favor of "the economy" and private property so that we now need police to clean up the aftermath through force. The idea would be to take care of people's needs to the point where armed force is no longer necessary to keep things running.

Yeah, when people say 'Defund the Police'. They actually mean, defund this particular department of the police, and replace it with a combination of peace officers, criminal investigations, social services, and first responders. Defund the Police actually means, "Reforming hasn't worked. We must completely REORGANIZE law enforcement and start fresh."

legendary_zell posted...

Yes, it would have to be a different society though. People seem to think abolitionists want the same society, minus cops and that they think that would be peachy keen. That's not it.

Yeah, the world isnt going to become perfect just like that.

No one who has any idea what they are talking about wants to get rid of police, then do nothing else.

Absolutely not.

Yes. We had societies long before the concept of police. Nowdo I want a thief taker general back? Not really. But we can invent something beyond the current police system.

Blue_Dream87 posted...

The police system that majority of leftists criticize has only existed for like, 100-150 max years and was born from union busting and slave patrols. Civilization has existed for thousands of years without it, we can survive thousands more with a different system.

This. Modern policing needs to go. We can still have detectives out there solving murders and shit, but this beat cop going on patrol thing where we have these huge squads of heavily militarized stormtroopers needs to end

In the USA cop culture became a horrible thing. Law enforcement itself is beneficial to society, so long as the laws are actually useful to society and not just a few specific groups.

Thud posted...

Easily. If you're armed and not afraid to use it to defend life and property, you don't need pigs. Pigs are really only needed for paperwork, 90% of their "job" is writing bullshit citations.

So I shouldve fired on the car that almost ran me over when I had the light to cross the street? Nah, a cop was behind his ass and gave him a ticket.

Pretty sure Somalia exists without police as we know them. Doesn't mean it's a place anyone really wants to live, but society can and does survive.

Just_a_loser posted...

So a return to the land of the lawless, aka the old wild west?

Because that worked out so great back then.

As much as people bitch about law enforcement, we still need them.

This ended the topic. Everything after that has just been padding.

willythemailboy posted...

Pretty sure Somalia exists without police as we know them.

The non-gangster part of Somalia has police. The bad part of Somalia does not.
So no, society in Somalia does not survive without police. Just random gangs and warlords vying for power. Whichever gang comes out on top, then becomes the police.

pjnelson posted...

This ended the topic. Everything after that has just been padding.

The old Wild West actually wasnt a crazy violent place, thats an invention of Hollywood not that that says anything definitive about the OP question.

Just_a_loser posted... So a return to the land of the lawless, aka the old wild west?

Because that worked out so great back then.

As much as people bitch about law enforcement, we still need them.

pjnelson posted...

This ended the topic. Everything after that has just been padding.

"The Wild West" was a fantasy created by pulp fiction writers around the turn of the 20th century. The west was no more wild than the east coast.

Doe posted...

The old Wild West actually wasnt a crazy violent place,

Yeah, because marshals and sheriffs had to come around.

We bringing back knights and samurai now?

Ninja?

Blue_Dream87 posted...

The police system that majority of leftists criticize has only existed for like, 100-150 max years and was born from union busting and slave patrols. Civilization has existed for thousands of years without it, we can survive thousands more with a different system.

A good answer. Before organized laws, anybody who caused enough trouble for the populace to take notice was a dead man walking. People survived that somehow or another.

CSCA33 posted...

We bringing back knights and samurai now?

Ninja?

I'll take Naruto and Luffy to protect me.

pjnelson posted...

This ended the topic. Everything after that has just been padding.

Only if you're incapable of basic reading comprehension.

mistymermaid posted...

A good answer. Before organized laws, anybody who caused enough trouble for the populace to take notice was a dead man walking. People survived that somehow or another.

Noooo. No. No. Dear Lord, are we are all so bad at history that we don't even know how these things were handled for millennia? Generally speaking, the community would get together and hash out their problems in front of a magistrate of some kind and if someone was found guilty, generally speaking they would have to pay back the aggrieved party. There were other ways as well that never needed police or prisons. They certainly weren't perfect but damn farsight better then what we have now

Just_a_loser posted...

So a return to the land of the lawless, aka the old wild west?

Because that worked out so great back then.

As much as people bitch about law enforcement, we still need them.

The Old West had law enforcement.

LSGW_Zephyra posted...

There were other ways as well that never needed police or prisons.

Pitchforks, exile, and stonings.

I think people are forgetting we now have rides and fast vehicles

If you abolished the police, you would just have gangs form to serve a similar function.

Speaking of feudalism, Zuck is busy building up his own in Hawaii

https://theconversation.com/
billionaires-are-building-bunkers-and-buying-islands-
but-are-they-prepping-for-the-apocalypse-or-pioneering-a-new-feudalism-223987/