Current Events > Has any of the news on Afghanistan changed your opinions of Joe Biden?

(+) Yeah! (+)

Let's see where CE lands.

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no?

despite how everything turned out, this has been what everyone has wanted since the fucking Obama administration. trump even ran on getting everyone out.

this is such a 20/20 false outrage

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No, hes still better than Trump, thats all I ever cared about and why I voted for him.

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ya. just be honest about it is all. I dont believe for a second that he honestly believes the shit he spouted in that address.

but thats just your standard politician bullshit...

also I will say I'm glad we're out of there tho.

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If anything, the optics come across as him being short-sighted for pulling out but it's not like other presidents haven't talked about doing it.

Obama made it seem like he wanted to even though he likely didn't.

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I mean Trump was the one that set this situation up, Biden just followed through. Either way this is something most Americans have wanted for a long time now because everyone knew the war was pointless and the second everyone left it would go right back to being ruled by local warlords. This shouldn't change anyone's opinion on the war, indeed, it should affirm that they were correct all along.

Biden's hands definitely aren't clean though. He voted to begin this mess as a Senator, and history will remember him as such.

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I'm glad we're out. It's one of the few things Trump was also right about. We needed to leave.

I also appreciate Biden doubling down and sticking to his guns. Yeah, it was a messy exit, but the Afghan government was corrupt, cowardly, and obviously mismanaged.

I have two concerns though....

1. Will Afghanistan become a new center of terrorism to the Western world now?
2. Will other countries, like China and Russia, take notes that the USA always abandons friends in need and launch new campaigns of war? Would Biden jump to Taiwan's defense if they are invaded?

Nope, I already had a low opinion about him.

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I am frankly surprised, in a positive way, that he withstood the pressure that has prevented his predecessors from withdrawing.

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Antifar posted...

I am frankly surprised, in a positive way, that he withstood the pressure that has prevented his predecessors from withdrawing.

Same sentiment here.

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Antifar posted...

I am frankly surprised, in a positive way, that he withstood the pressure that has prevented his predecessors from withdrawing.

my thoughts exactly.

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No, Biden always sucked. This just cements it.

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Antifar posted...

I am frankly surprised, in a positive way, that he withstood the pressure that has prevented his predecessors from withdrawing.

Exactly. The Joint Chiefs and generals and shit are all people who have been in the military for like 40 or 50 years. Someone like that will never come to the conclusion that the best option is not to go to war at all. It's just not something they are equipped to think about, their decades of training will always lead them to some reason or another why they should stay because x, y, and z will happen or if only they had more troops, money, guns, whatever they could win the war.

It was always gonna take a President saying, "you know what, no, enough is enough. This isn't worth American lives." The generals will always find a reason not to leave.

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He was always going to be a disaster as president, but I thought he would be a boring disaster. This might be the single worse foreign policy fuck-up in my life-time, so that's...that's something.

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Yes, and for the better.

American troops cannot and should not be fighting in a war and dying in a war that Afghan forces are not willing to fight for themselves.

That's pure balls to say that out loud. Presidential balls.

I'm actually surprised people defend him.

nexigrams posted...

I mean Trump was the one that set this situation up, Biden just followed through. Either way this is something most Americans have wanted for a long time now because everyone knew the war was pointless and the second everyone left it would go right back to being ruled by local warlords. This shouldn't change anyone's opinion on the war, indeed, it should affirm that they were correct all along.

Biden's hands definitely aren't clean though. He voted to begin this mess as a Senator, and history will remember him as such.

THIS. Trump was the one who pulled out most of the troops in the first place. What was Biden spposed to do? Send all the troops back in again??

Yes, slightly more favorably. This was not an easy thing for a president to do, with the media backlash. Needed to be done to get out of this forever war.

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Gobstoppers12 posted...

He was always going to be a disaster as president, but I thought he would be a boring disaster. This might be the single worse foreign policy fuck-up in my life-time, so that's...that's something.

How old are you?

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David1988 posted...

No, hes still better than Trump, thats all I ever cared about and why I voted for him.

Most Americans supported the withdraw, 70% I think it was stated at. It was a shit situation to begin with, Trump made it worse, Biden did what he could do given the circumstances.

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it doesn't change my view on him, and i don't blame trump either.

this is on Ashraf Ghani and his Afghan government, they're already be told about US leaving but they're totally unprepared for it. did he expect US troops gonna be there forever covering his ass?

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No, I didn't care for him then, still don't care for him now.
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Not really. We should have done this two or three administrations ago, but he sort of drew the short straw.

He had two choices:

1. continue the twenty year war and stay in wartime economy when our citizens are at a breaking point
2. admit that we have no business bullying people around in the Middle East and start focusing on his own citizens.

Was the withdrawal handled perfectly? No. Hes just cleaning up George Bushs mess, though.

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Well I support the Taliban enslaving women so yay Biden

sarcasm

Not really honestly. Sad about the state of things there, but we shouldn't be there

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Mackorov posted...

THIS. Trump was the one who pulled out most of the troops in the first place. What was Biden spposed to do? Send all the troops back in again??

Bestoffuture posted...

Yes, slightly more favorably. This was not an easy thing for a president to do, with the media backlash. Needed to be done to get out of this forever war.

These. There's not much more Biden could have or should have done. The U.S. and other involved western countries have spent 2 decades being militarily present there and training the Afghan military, police and other staff members in keeping their country secure. That's more than enough time to train an entire generation.
If Afghanistan is such a pushover at this point, that's on them, not on Biden.

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As someone generally down on biden if anything I am more appreciative of him for not falling for the same thing his two predecessors fell for

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Garlands_Soul posted...

Not really honestly. Sad about the state of things there, but we shouldn't be there

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America "fixing" other countries is pure propaganda to get us to vote for it. It's just a way to assert unnecessary dominance and get money. We don't need to fix the world when our own country needs the help. One bomb could pay someone's medical bills for life.

It sucks that their situation is like this but we need the help too. It sucks that people are starving but I need my own money to feed myself right now.

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Not really. The withdrawal is a huge failure and he'll probably take most of the blame for that. But it's not like it's even close to being a situation of his own creation.

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Master Kazuya posted...

America "fixing" other countries is pure propaganda to get us to vote for it. It's just a way to assert unnecessary dominance and get money. We don't need to fix the world when our own country needs the help. One bomb could pay someone's medical bills for life.

It sucks that their situation is like this but we need the help too. It sucks that people are starving but I need my own money to feed myself right now.

America didn't get money from the Afghan conflict, it cost a trillion dollars.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-47391821

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This is probably a hot take here, but I supported the war against the Taliban. I just didn't support how it was handled. So much money wasted to do absolutely nothing. We spent 300m a day, that's about 50k per person for every person that lives in Afghanistan.

We would have been better off just gifting each of them actually 50k - would of had a more positive affect than what we actually accomplished...which was nothing but a bunch of American casualties.

https://youtu.be/Lv4L6E4roso

Here is my super hot take, and really hope this doesn't get me moderated, because I do think it's an extreme take. But I think extreme measures are necessary here. I would have perpetuated an old school war.

Sent in ALL of our troops, evacuated all citizens to a safe zone (or given temporary refuge in America), then slaughtered the Taliban, and then finally returned power over to the Afghanistan government.

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dirtydog posted...

America didn't get money from the Afghan conflict, it cost a trillion dollars.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-47391821

The defense contractors made billions they are the only ones that made money

dirtydog posted...

America didn't get money from the Afghan conflict, it cost a trillion dollars.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-47391821

It did provide a lucrative opportunity for PMCs though.

Donald Rumsfeld, Dick Cheney, and other neocons longed for military privatization, and in a post 9/11 world they got their wish

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STEROLIZER posted...

Here is my super hot take, and really hope this doesn't get me moderated, because I do think it's an extreme take. But I think extreme measures are necessary here. I would have perpetuated an old school war.

Sent in ALL of our troops, evacuated all citizens to a safe zone (or given temporary refuge in America), then slaughtered the Taliban, and then finally returned power over to the Afghanistan government.

I honestly think we've could have acheived the above in about 6 months. But it would have been old school levels of bloody war to acheive.

Then we could have kept a light presence to help facilitate the building of Afghanistan's own infrastructure, and then we could have left completely.

However, we spent 20 years doing absolutely nothing. Just spending money to maintain appearances. Now 24hrs after withdrawing the country has completely reverted back to its extremist ways, and the Taliban is free to murder and abuse thousands of citizens, especially women. Given the fact that we spent all this time pissing them off it's only a matter of time before they start to retaliate.

We should have ended this war a long time ago, not by pulling out, but by actually winning the war. Purging the Taliban, and saving the Athgan people from terriany

You don't win wars through PR campaigns, and 20% action. You either win it through force, or you don't start the war in the first place. So many women doomed to a living death almost instaneously. My heart weeps for them.

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STEROLIZER posted...

Sent in ALL of our troops, evacuated all citizens to a safe zone (or given temporary refuge in America), then slaughtered the Taliban, and then finally returned power over to the Afghanistan government.

The problem is, I dont think it was ever really America's intention to completely defeat the Taliban. Eradicating the Taliban would eventually necessitate conflict with Pakistan, given the ISI has had a hand in funding/training the Taliban for a long time.

Conflict with Pakistan is obviously not the best idea, since they're a nuclear power, so it was always impossible for this fight to have a real conclusion.

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Nope. This was almost destined to happen. The biggest issues are that the US and it's allies can't stand by and allow the Taliban amass and control military grade weapons and vehicles, incredibly wealth and resources, and suppress and hold the present and future generations of Afghanistan hostage while radicalizing who they can and murdering the rest. Some major shit is probably going to go down in the near future that's pretty much going to involve the US and it's allies heavily bombing the country. I can't imagine what the innocent civilians who want absolutely nothing to do with the Taliban and their families are going to do. The death toll is going to be immense. Negotiation isn't a good option at this point.