Poll of the Day > Why do racist people call both Indians and Native Americans Indians?

(+) Yeah! (+)

I asked this question to a few people and I've gotten various answers.

The first one was these 2 racist assholes that was harassing this girl that worked with us just because she was half black and half Mexican(nothing was done to them when she filed a complaint because I live in one of the most racist part of Texas). They told me:
"You just gotta say the *insert stereotypical Native American sound by making gestures like you're slapping your mouth here* Indian, or the dot *insert gesture of them putting their finger on their forehead here* Indian.

Then another guy I worked with at a different company told me that one is an Indian, and the other is a sand n word.

Then I asked the same question in this dad joke group I'm in when someone made a racist Native American joke, and they all told me that they're both just Indians. Then the thread got removed before I could inquire further.

Like I get it, they're racists and don't care, but why call them both the same thing when they're clearly not the same thing whatsoever?

I feel like you're probably trolling, but I'd say CGP grey did a good job of explaining it.

https://youtu.be/kh88fVP2FWQ

Notschmendrake posted...

I feel like you're probably trolling, but I'd say CGP grey did a good job of explaining it.

https://youtu.be/kh88fVP2FWQ

This video is stupid as fuck, because we don't call Canadians or South Americans Americans. Also, it might not be confusing in this video's context because they're only talking about Native Americans, but when talked about in general context, using the word Indians when a country called India exists is straight up idiotic.

lihlih posted...

This video is stupid as fuck, because we don't call Canadians or South Americans Americans. Also, it might not be confusing in this video's context because they're only talking about Native Americans, but when talked about in general context, using the word Indians when a country called India exists is straight up idiotic.

Cool, go tell that to the actual people you're talking about, living on actual reservations in the US. They use the term Indian to refer to themselves often, so I'm sure they'd be happy to have you come tell them how idiotic they are.

Oh wait, you are straight up trolling. Nevermind.

lihlih posted...

Like I get it, they're racists and don't care, but why call them both the same thing when they're clearly not the same thing whatsoever?

Why would they make a distinction for not thems? If they're generally racist to every other race, it's an us vs them thing, they only need to know if people are an "us" or a "them".

calling a native American an Indian isn't racist.

just like calling someone black instead of African American isn't racist.

It's because Columbus thought he found India or some shit

Notschmendrake posted...

Cool, go tell that to the actual people you're talking about, living on actual reservations in the US. They use the term Indian to refer to themselves often, so I'm sure they'd be happy to have you come tell them how idiotic they are.

Oh wait, you are straight up trolling. Nevermind.

Except I was going to reservations yearly for a while. It's usually the old people that's been told all their life that they're called Indians that stick to that term.
It doesn't matter though, you're using the "you disagree with me, so you're a troll!" defense, which pretty much only trolls use. Thanks for outing yourself so early so I can just ignore what you say.

Kyuubi4269 posted...

Why would they make a distinction for not thems? If they're generally racist to every other race, it's an us vs them thing, they only need to know if people are an "us" or a "them".

That's true, but you'd think they'd want to make a distinction just so it's not confusing.

Krazy_Kirby posted...

calling a native American an Indian isn't racist.

just like calling someone black instead of African American isn't racist.

The second statement makes sense, the first doesn't. Not every black person is African or American, so of course you don't call every black person African American, that'd just be straight up stupid. While Native Americans aren't Indians, except for a few who go through the process of getting themselves naturalized in India.(never heard of anyone doing this, but I'm sure there has been Native Americans who went through this process)

Mostly because a lot of us grew up in a time where 'indian' was the norm and you specified 'indian indians' if you were referring to people from the sub-continent. It's hard to break the habit. Especially since 'Native Americans' is a lot more cumbersome to say. I'd wager at least some are concerned that Native American itself is a racist term and may have gotten flak for using it (likely from some overly-sensitive person) leaving them confused. I did once when I was about 12 or so and got told to call them 'First Nation People'.

a racist calls both Indians and Native Americans the word "Indian"
but is a person that calls both Indians and Native Americans the word "Indian" necessarily racist?

AltOmega2 posted...

a racist calls both Indians and Native Americans the word "Indian"
but is a person that calls both Indians and Native Americans the word "Indian" necessarily racist?

I'd wager not since the term 'Native American' only became popular in the public in, like, the last decade or two.

People are stupid and bad at changing.

Notschmendrake posted...

I feel like you're probably trolling, but I'd say CGP grey did a good job of explaining it.

https://youtu.be/kh88fVP2FWQ

Generally this.



Notschmendrake posted...

Oh wait, you are straight up trolling. Nevermind.

And also this.

Either that, or you're phenomenally naive.



Metalsonic66 posted...

It's because Columbus thought he found India or some shit

Ehh. There's some debate about this. Some people assume he believed that (or more precisely, believed that he'd found new islands not that far from the coast of Japan), and that it was essentially an outgrowth of his initial mistake (namely, miscalculating the size of the Earth and steadfastly refusing to accept the truth when pretty much everyone else he ever met told him he was wrong - he basically blundered into the "New World" by total accident). So he used terminology that reflected his belief that the Americas were basically just islands not that far off from India and China.

Others assume that insistent about the terminology because he'd realized he'd fucked up at some point - and was desperately trying to cover his own ass by pretending he hadn't. Which would also explain why he kept calling the odd little spicy plants he found "peppers", in spite of the fact that they neither looked nor tasted like actual pepper did. Basically, pepper was a spice that came from the Indies, therefore, he needed to explain why none of the plants he found looked anything that was actually found in Asia. His answer being that things like pepper looked different in the wild and when harvested fresh than they did after being processed and shipped over vast differences (which is kind of obvious bullshit in this case).

Basically, it depends on whether or not you think Columbus was a delusional weirdo or a deliberately manipulative liar. There's evidence for both opinions.

In today's episode of "a perpetually offended person finds something not racist, racist"...

To answer your question, it's not racist in the majority of times, but I'd say how it is said or the context of a conversation can make it racist, the same way many terms said with disdain can be pejorative instead of being positive. And in the aforementioned majority of times, I'd say it's simply laziness since saying "Indian" is just faster than saying "native American". The same way friends use shortened nicknames instead of their friends real names: just faster.

ParanoidObsessive posted...

Basically, it depends on whether or not you think Columbus was a delusional weirdo or a deliberately manipulative liar.

Both at the same time

So I guess some of my family is racist against itself.

myghostisdead posted...

So I guess some of my family is racist against itself.

Nah, it's just some people on Gamefaqs being part of the usual groups which finds everything racist or somehow part of white supremacy. You can safely ignore them, the majority of the world does.

myghostisdead posted...

So I guess some of my family is racist against itself.

native americans and first nations folk can call themselves what they want, Indian, Native etc.

sort of how like I'm not going to use the n-word as a white person but I'm not going to insist that black people stop saying it

The_tall_midget posted...

Nah, it's just some people on Gamefaqs being part of the usual groups which finds everything racist or somehow part of white supremacy. You can safely ignore them, the majority of the world does.

this isn't just some online discussion

yes, in real life, objectively calling people indigenous to north america "Indians" is going to result in pushback. go try it. I've seen it happen plenty of times, I worked at a remote fishing lodge on Haida Gwaii. That being said, The Haida are extremely proud people, so they are not going to take it lightly whatsoever.

'all Indians love being called Indians!' -some American who hasn't met many indigenous people but thinks they're an expert because they're posting on a gaming forum lmfao

lihlih posted...

ou're using the "you disagree with me, so you're a troll!" defense, which pretty much only trolls use.

you do this

all the time

you outed yourself lmao

ReturnOfFa posted...

yes, in real life, objectively calling people indigenous to north america "Indians" is going to result in pushback. go try it. I've seen it happen plenty of times; I worked at a remote fishing lodge on Haida Gwaii. That being said, The Haida are extremely proud people, so they are not going to take it lightly whatsoever.

If a Native is insulted by it, fine, at least they're relevant in the context. I will however not entertain the usual state of being perpetually offended for others that so many losers suffering from white guilt on the internet believe makes it their duty.

Native American is a more recent thing for me. Even growing up near reservation we largely referred to ourselves as Indians due to the term American Indian. Ive never been bothered by people referring to me as such. Its more concise and ive never heard it from someone who was trying to imply i was from India so i understand what theyre getting at.

https://youtu.be/4jHDA9CQkSw

TheFalseDeity posted...

Native American is a more recent thing for me. Even growing up near reservation we largely referred to ourselves as Indians due to the term American Indian. Ive never been bothered by people referring to me as such. Its more concise and ive never heard it from someone who was trying to imply i was from India so i understand what theyre getting at.

No, you don't understand, you HAVE to be offended; "winners" on the internet decided that for you.

Adam_Savage posted...

you do this

all the time

you outed yourself lmao

Lol, look at this guy making shit up just because he has nothing to say yet again.

Unbridled9 posted...

concerned that Native American itself is a racist term

No it isn't.

Revelation34 posted...

No it isn't.

Depends. If the crazies all decided tomorrow to crusade to make the term labeled as racist, it might as well become just that. Of course, like a lot of terms out there such as "Indian", nobody in their mind would think it is.

One of my best friends is a Native American named Dusty Blue Eagle Feathers and he regularly refers to himself as an Indian, but seems to get annoyed if other people call him that.

Official government documents and bureaus are still called Indian Affairs.

https://www.bia.gov/bia

My grandma was half Sioux and Cherokee from Ohio. They all called themselves Indian.

lihlih posted...

Like I get it, they're racists and don't care, but why call them both the same thing when they're clearly not the same thing whatsoever?

I feel like you can't possibly be so oblivious as to not realize it used to a mainstay.

Like, you make a lot of oblivious statements but even YOU have to know the history. I mean, jfc, man.

lihlih posted...

I asked this question to a few people and I've gotten various answers.

There's no way you don't know the answer. You're just straight-up trolling. Even if you were only 15, you would know.

There are a million movies out there that use it in the title to refer to Native Americans rather than actual Indians.

Even Lok doesn't make topics this oblivious.

Krazy_Kirby posted...

calling a native American an Indian isn't racist.

Well, it's no longer politically correct for obvious reasons. However, it's been a slow transition because it was used for hundreds of years and even as recent as the 1990s it was commonly used. That said, I'm sure some people are doing it to be racist rather than the fact they grew up with the word and don't see anything wrong with it as a result because it was accepted back then.

Adam_Savage posted...

you do this

all the time

you outed yourself lmao

O snap!

Blame Columbus, that fool didn't realize he hadn't actually landed in India, and for whatever reason the terminology stuck.

https://youtu.be/cTG73ww5o4A

teddy241 posted...

https://youtu.be/cTG73ww5o4A

I made it 50 seconds. That's some ridiculous shit. "How dare you correct me!" (Even if I'm making a batshit insane statement.)

They've been calling them Indians forever. So it's just a thing not necessarily racist.

What makes me face palm is I know people who claim to be native American and their logic is they where born in America therfore native American. I get that's how the terminology should work but it's simply not the case

mooreandrew58 posted...

What makes me face palm is I know people who claim to be native American and their logic is they where born in America therfore native American. I get that's how the terminology should work but it's simply not the case

I mean, by your logic, no American is 'native' to the country because all humans migrated here at some point. Humans are technically an invasive species to the Americas (among other areas where they didn't originate)

lihlih posted...

Except I was going to reservations yearly for a while. It's usually the old people that's been told all their life that they're called Indians that stick to that term.
It doesn't matter though, you're using the "you disagree with me, so you're a troll!" defense, which pretty much only trolls use. Thanks for outing yourself so early so I can just ignore what you say.

That's true, but you'd think they'd want to make a distinction just so it's not confusing.

The second statement makes sense, the first doesn't. Not every black person is African or American, so of course you don't call every black person African American, that'd just be straight up stupid. While Native Americans aren't Indians, except for a few who go through the process of getting themselves naturalized in India.(never heard of anyone doing this, but I'm sure there has been Native Americans who went through this process)

thank you for having a brain!

The_Viscount posted...

I mean, by your logic, no American is 'native' to the country because all humans migrated here at some point. Humans are technically an invasive species to the Americas (among other areas where they didn't originate)

That's actually the opposite of what I'm saying. You are going by the logic of those I'm talking about.

mooreandrew58 posted...

That's actually the opposite of what I'm saying. You are going by the logic of those I'm talking about.

Your argument was that birth country and ancestry in that country wasn't enough, which is the sole marker either way.

The_tall_midget posted...

Nah, it's just some people on Gamefaqs being part of the usual groups which finds everything racist or somehow part of white supremacy. You can safely ignore them, the majority of the world does.

Seems to be the case.

The_Viscount posted...

Your argument was that birth country and ancestry in that country wasn't enough, which is the sole marker either way.

my argument was they've been called native Americans for a long time to describe their heritage. So someone with no ancestry with them claiming to be native American I find wrong. Yeah I find the terminology wrong but I didn't make the rules on that

lihlih posted...

Lol, look at this guy making shit up just because he has nothing to say yet again.

you literally just fucking did it

Racists do it because they know it gets a rise out of people that don't like racism. It's that simple, you don't need to dig for any sort of deeper motivation.

Regular people do it because change is hard and pushbacks against indigenous racism are relatively recent (see, Canada's last residential school only closing in 1996), such that the terminology has evolved quite rapidly. The "proper" term has switched between "Native American," "aboriginal," "indigenous," and "First Nations" pretty quickly, such that even those that do care about being respectful have a hard time keeping straight what the best term is.

That's compounded by a great many native people not actually caring and often still using the term "Indian" themselves because they're generally dealing with more important problems than white people being embarrassed that some dude a few hundred years ago made a mistake about where he was. If anything, using blanket terms at all is more of an issue than which specific blanket term you use. If you actually want to be respectful, reference the nations' actual names whenever possible.

The_tall_midget posted...

I'd say it's simply laziness since saying "Indian" is just faster than saying "native American".

"Native" is faster than "Indian," and generally works roughly as well in everyday contexts. "First Nations" is technically the same number of syllables, but it's got a bunch of complex consonant sounds that slows it down quite a bit.

Adam_Savage posted...

you literally just fucking did it

What? Because I called you out on your bullshit that you can't back up at all?

and now you're projecting lol

keep it up because it is slightly funny now

idk why you want to oust yourself as the hypocrite everyone already knows you are, but it's working for ya

Adam_Savage posted...

and now you're projecting lol

keep it up because it is slightly funny now

idk why you want to oust yourself as the hypocrite everyone already knows you are, but it's working for ya

I mean, you're the one that made the accusation, so the onus is on you to prove it.

to prove what

the stuff you did?

you know you did it, everyone here knows you did it, wasting time to get proof of something everyone knows as truth isn't worth my time

but if you wanted, you could waste your time trying to find proof against it, your time is worth practically nothing so it's fine

Adam_Savage posted...

to prove what

the stuff you did?

you know you did it, everyone here knows you did it, wasting time to get proof of something everyone knows as truth isn't worth my time

Oh right, just spout nonsense because you know you're wrong as fuck.

we both know im not though lmao

;)

"first nations" make no sense.

the country wasn't a nation to start with