Current Events > Pathfinder wrath of the righteous is pretty overwhelming

(+) Yeah! (+)

I am familiar with the basic ruleset as i played kingmaker, but this game is just built different. Like 20 classes (with 5 to 6 subclasses each) + 10 more prestige classes + mythic path and i am unfamiliar with most of the classes aside from the basic. Trying to figure out fun builds is like learning rocket science.

But it's cool tho. The variety is insane.

Just ended up rolling sylvan sorcerer. Probably won't multiclass. Dunno which mythic path to choose yet. Basically druid + animal companion but with sorcerer spells and abilities. Gonna focus in conjuration and transmutation (aka summon and buffs)

Mythic path just means extra bonuses making you even better.

I want to pick this up when it comes out later this year for the PS4, but I still haven't gotten that far in Kingmaker due to a glitch.

basically, my character can't attack in turn-based mode (my preferred method of playing) but can in real-time.

I might re-start so I can get ready for this.

g0ldie posted...

I want to pick this up when it comes out later this year for the PS4, but I still haven't gotten that far in Kingmaker due to a glitch.

basically, my character can't attack in turn-based mode (my preferred method of playing) but can in real-time.

I might re-start so I can get ready for this.

Kingmaker isn't much more stable on PC fwiw

that sucks.

g0ldie posted...

that sucks.

It had to dumb down a bunch of mechanics and classes to get released. WotR is a much more faithful adaptation in comparison.

Yeah, there's a LOT of options for building your character. In some ways though it is easier for Wrath (compared to Kingmaker) because you can cover for stuff with the Mythic Path. The default Angel path tries to set up a lot of baseline useful stuff for the player, including party-wide buffs that last for an hour or more(this saves time too, since you can cast 5-6 party-wide buffs instead of layering 20 spells before a big fight).

If you're thinking about a summoner style build you could go for the Azata: this gives a suite of super powers to choose from and an extra companion character. Some of the spell boosting options are good to a silly degree.

If evil is your thing the Demon path is stable enough as a set of buffs. Thematically it might clash with the animal summoner theme though. Basically you get to 'rage out' in tough fights, but the rest of the time things aren't influenced as much.

I keep wondering how do you even play tabletop of this lol. There are just so many to keep track especially on higher levels.

thanks.

I was already thinking about trying out WotR just because of the mythic paths, even if I didn't finish KM, or was unable to continue playing through it.

besides the issues I had, it seemed pretty interesting, from what I played, and I'm curious about how it character alignment will affect stuff.

edit: at post 8

I can ride my giant kitty :>

DuneMan posted...

Yeah, there's a LOT of options for building your character. In some ways though it is easier for Wrath (compared to Kingmaker) because you can cover for stuff with the Mythic Path. The default Angel path tries to set up a lot of baseline useful stuff for the player, including party-wide buffs that last for an hour or more(this saves time too, since you can cast 5-6 party-wide buffs instead of layering 20 spells before a big fight).

If you're thinking about a summoner style build you could go for the Azata: this gives a suite of super powers to choose from and an extra companion character. Some of the spell boosting options are good to a silly degree.

If evil is your thing the Demon path is stable enough as a set of buffs. Thematically it might clash with the animal summoner theme though. Basically you get to 'rage out' in tough fights, but the rest of the time things aren't influenced as much.

Yeah, probably gonna pick azata. I just read the wiki it adds lots of powerups for summon. And you can summon golems too.

apolloooo posted...

I keep wondering how do you even play tabletop of this lol. There are just so many to keep track especially on higher levels.

In the old days you had to just memorize it and keep the books you needed nearby, which unless we are playing Shadowrun is what my group still does. There are also programs now that you can on tablets, pcs, or laptops that help keep things organized.

apolloooo posted...

Yeah, probably gonna pick azata. I just read the wiki it adds lots of powerups for summon. And you can summon golems too.

I remember when I did play (so first 3 months of it being out) I reached chapter 3 or 4 and Azata was considered to be the strongest or 2nd strongest for basically any builds because of how it affected your party as well. May have changed with the patches since, I don't know.

i hope the enhanced edition patch doesnt break the save game lol. i wanna wait till next weekend to play, but i just finished bug fables and didnt know what else to play. i did ask steam forum they said old saves will work with EE, but who knows lol

okay, now i don;'t know how to build my party members. of course i can always go by their default class, but that's boring. i at least wanna try to spec them into prestige classes.

so far: seelah probably gonna spec her into stalwart defender.
lann : zen archer / demonslayer ranger? seems lore-friendly too for him to be ranger demonslayer anyway.
camellia: dunno. probably won't multiclass since spellcaster is strongest with their high lv spells
the same with ember and nenio. dunno about other yet, meeting nenio is as far as i have played this weekend.

https://www.neoseeker.com/pathfinder-wrath-of-the-righteous/guides/Builds
There are ton of busted builds in that guide.

I got rekt hard by vrock in the market square. Level 4 party tbh using only buffs that are available to me. I might just go back and buy some appropriate potion to counter his stun attacks or come back at level 5 >_>

The tavern defense is pretty fun i just greased the floor and use tangle and watch cultists and demons fall like tom & jerry characters.

crpgbro has good, easy to understand builds. Fun game, I've done Lich, Azata, Trickster and Aeon runs.

gunplagirl posted...

Kingmaker isn't much more stable on PC fwiw

It's actually dramatically more stable. That isn't the same as saying it's stable, mind you, but the PC version is much better off. It also has mods that make it better on that front as well, though that's a bit up in the air as to how relevant that factor is.

apolloooo posted...

I keep wondering how do you even play tabletop of this lol. There are just so many to keep track especially on higher levels.

It's not too bad if you're used to large-scale campaigns (doubly so if they are used to westmarch-sized ones). The game also throws in a lot more random side content that you have to keep track of (normally the DM does that, but it tends to be far smaller in nature and not things that you need to constantly keep track of).

Unless you are talking about the builds. Then that's the fun of the whole affair. >:)

And definitely go with Azata if you aren't going evil. It has the generally best overall story additions and just generally is the most fun to play around with. It's also one of the few mythic paths that don't have potential hurdles with getting the secret ending if you plan on going for it, as well as not having conflicts with the secret romance option.

Lich is the best.

I wish I really understood all the variations and synergies of different builds, I usually look up a guide and pick a group that lets me experience most of everything :v

that being said, Kingmaker was easily the longest slog of a CRPG mostly because of all the traveling and territory building.. its a lot of fun, but I feel like I have so many event and whatever cards hanging around that it DOES make it feel daunting

maybe Ill make it a goal of mine to learn how the classes work starting from BG1 to Kingmaker by the end of the year

apolloooo posted...

I keep wondering how do you even play tabletop of this lol. There are just so many to keep track especially on higher levels.

I mean, thats the game. Ive been playing pathfinder for over a decade, and last Sunday my group finished an adventure path we had been playing for six years(Jade Regent).

Its the kind of game where you read through thousands of rules because thats fun for you. Some people call it Mathfinder, and yeah, thats accurate. One half of my group are programmers and the other half are on the spectrum. It is a very rules heavy game.

HannibalBarca3 posted...

crpgbro has good, easy to understand builds. Fun game, I've done Lich, Azata, Trickster and Aeon runs.

Yeah his builds are great, and mainly revolve around getting as many attacks of opportuntiy as possible which is a nice and effective way to approach the game.

Those neoseeker builds are generally intended for unfair and min maxed to the hilt and will often require a lot of fiddly micro management. That's not to say they're bad builds, because they're not but they're not very approachable for a first playthrough.

Sounds like TC has decided to roll a sylvan sorc which from what I understand is quite good, but if there is anyone who wants an easy to use archer or melee class I highly recommend demon slayer ranger.

IronWolf87 posted...

Yeah his builds are great, and mainly revolve around getting as many attacks of opportuntiy as possible which is a nice and effective way to approach the game.

Those neoseeker builds are generally intended for unfair and min maxed to the hilt and will often require a lot of fiddly micro management. That's not to say they're bad builds, because they're not but they're not very approachable for a first playthrough.

Sounds like TC has decided to roll a sylvan sorc which from what I understand is quite good, but if there is anyone who wants an easy to use archer or melee class I highly recommend demon slayer ranger.

Don't forget how strong pets are.

https://youtu.be/cQf8shmW08E

This is a very good guide, which doesn't tell you how to build a character but more like classes overview and explain some synergies which is cool.

apolloooo posted...

https://youtu.be/cQf8shmW08E

This is a very good guide, which doesn't tell you how to build a character but more like classes overview and explain some synergies which is cool.

I mean, that's just it: you can really do just about whatever you want and it's fine. You can min-max a better build, but most of the time even if you min-min you are going to absolutely crush a lot of the enemies without really trying too hard after a while. Both Pathfinder games start hard but then somewhat peter off as your builds start to come together.

And, really, that's fine. If you are really paralyzed with the choices you can just install Toy Box (which you probably should do anyways just so you can fix potential issues down the line/get to take advantage of the enormous QoL it adds ~.~) and then enable gestalt classes. It will absolutely demolish the difficulty if you don't use official rules (ie. basically everything positive in Toy Box's gestalt options being turned off and the like) but it lets you run pretty nutty nonsense in terms of the class options. Not just in the sense of OP stuffs, but in the sense that you can really go ham with the prestige classes in a super fun way (and arguably closer to the the "true" D&D spirit considering their original implementation way back in the original D&D).

I am playing the difficulty before core. Challenging i think. I have to put at least some thoughts into it. I finished kingmaker with the same difficultly, but the scale of choice is just too different. I am starting to get it now, even already have plans

I find it hilarious that the insect swarm fight (jeslyn that can summon bug plague) is waaay harder than the actual boss. Fuck that fight, took almost an hour and dozen of retries. In the end the strategy that works is running as fast as i can to the jeslyn, grease its floor and watch it stumble like tom and jerry character before it can cast summon swarms. My horse and smilodon tank the mooks while party member whack the demon ass while it's prone.

apolloooo posted...

My horse and smilodon tank the mooks while party member whack the demon ass while it's prone.

https://i.imgur.com/YkQ4JFq.gif

Glitterdust and Grease are your best friends in the early game.

So these mythic feats. Aren't these kinda too busted???

Thundering blows: you can create melee character who can't hit shit like darkness from konosuba but still able to dish out AOE damage.

Boundless healing: basically turn the basic touch healing spell into ranged spell AND makes it scale to your caster level.

Etc, etc

This game seemed so much up my alley it was absurd, then it pivoted into this weird HOMM lite shit and I was like, double you tee eff, mate?

apolloooo posted...

So these mythic feats. Aren't these kinda too busted???

Thundering blows: you can create melee character who can't hit shit like darkness from konosuba but still able to dish out AOE damage.

Boundless healing: basically turn the basic touch healing spell into ranged spell AND makes it scale to your caster level.

Etc, etc

Not really, no. Heck, the ones that you could make the argument for being busted aren't even the ones that you are talking about, though I don't know if I would say that any particularly are.

Kakapo posted...

This game seemed so much up my alley it was absurd, then it pivoted into this weird HOMM lite shit and I was like, double you tee eff, mate?

They literally have the option to turn that off. It's entirely on you. Inversely the base game was designed to be a kingdom module that could potentially be done westmarch so it isn't exactly something that people didn't know about going in.

Kakapo posted...

This game seemed so much up my alley it was absurd, then it pivoted into this weird HOMM lite shit and I was like, double you tee eff, mate?

Yes! This was my complaint too. I quit at that point. I wasn't going to slog through that HOMM/Resource management bs.

Looking at the post above, there was a way to skip all that bs?

Do different mythic paths change the story? Or is just for gameplay mechanics?

Harlun drops adamantine full plate in market grounds now

so thats cool

Shamino posted...

Yes! This was my complaint too. I quit at that point. I wasn't going to slog through that HOMM/Resource management bs.

Looking at the post above, there was a way to skip all that bs?

Correct. When you are starting the game (and, IIRC, all throughout) there is an option to turn the crusade battles to auto-mode. At which point it is effectively gone as you aren't doing anything with it.

Zikten posted...

Do different mythic paths change the story? Or is just for gameplay mechanics?

Yes-ish. The mythic paths range from doing essentially changing nothing to completely rewriting the entire script (the main bits somewhat still happen but there is definitely a pretty enormous overall impact on the story). All of them have side quests that act as companion quests to the main story and they tie in pretty relevantly, though much like before they vary in terms of how much they change things overall. The only exception to this is the Legend path which is just effectively the path where you turn everyone down and thus there isn't exactly a whole lot of stuff that could be unique to it as you are just doing the "my path doesn't interact with this" option 100% of the time (ie. it's just a mechanical one).

Zikten posted...

Do different mythic paths change the story? Or is just for gameplay mechanics?

All mythic paths have their own unique story. Some like angel and demon have the most changes while the late mythic paths, devil, legend and gold dragon, don't have much story to them. Azata has alright content, most of the story is tied to Aivu your fairy dragon pet, she's essentially another companion in the way she reacts to the world around her. But the quests are kinda barebones but the free crusaders are amusing. You can recruit children into your army if you want along with mimics and trenants.

Lich is pretty cool, I usually dislike evil paths but I think it does a good job into making you feel like an evil motherfucker. Be warned that you're pretty much railroaded into being a pure evil being, some people didn't like that since the game kinda hints that you could be a pragmatic and calculated lich since some of your path events deal with the co-exitiance between the living and the undead. You also get certain undead companions that sadly are pretty much just mercenaries. Trickster story is pretty weak but the path is very mechanically strong especially for martial builds. Trickster to legend is a very powerful combo because you get to keep the very powerful trickster feats. Aeon has a pretty strong story with being able to change the past.

It's on Switch. It can't be good on Switch, right?

Accolon posted...

It's on Switch. It can't be good on Switch, right?

The switch version is cloud only for some reason.

ellis123 posted...

Not really, no. Heck, the ones that you could make the argument for being busted aren't even the ones that you are talking about, though I don't know if I would say that any particularly are.

At least it sounds so on paper lol. The chapter 2 intro was long i barely got any combat. Just did seelah's companion quests, which i only fought some random mobs, which is hardly measure

apolloooo posted...

At least it sounds so on paper lol. The chapter 2 intro was long i barely got any combat. Just did seelah's companion quests, which i only fought some random mobs, which is hardly measure

Ye, the Mythic Feats are super impressive on paper but unless you are playing a low-power campaign a lot of them fall into the wash. This holds especially true when some of the most powerful ones aren't really relevant in the explicit context of the game. For instance, Destiny Beyond Birth is 100% overpowered but not really in WotR. In normal Pathfinder you could play as a race with serious drawbacks as a part of its race through its abilities getting reduced, so it by itself could be something crazy like "+4 Strength, +2 Dexterity for a single feat" if you played your cards right. The most extreme example of this, however, would be with homebrew stuffs where even balanced homebrew races suddenly go nutty. I played as a Pixie one time in which this one ability would be +10 Str/+4 Con: a very obviously overpowered option.

Regardless, the ones that really can potentially be overpowered tend to be more along the more innocuous ones. For instance, Improved Unarmed Strike lets you add your Mythic Rank to all unarmed damage rolls which goes completely nuclear when you start getting to attack ungodly amounts of times towards the end. Mythic Sneak Attacker is also way better than you might initially think as sneak attacking is overtuned in both of Owlcat's RPGs. While it isn't exactly necessary, with it you can very quickly hit a point where you one-shot every single non-boss encounter before they even know you exist. This also plays into the Two-Weapon Fighting Mythic perk where it all boils into basically removing all penalties from dual wielding so you end up in a position where you can delete basically anything if you can do a sneak attack.

Mind you, I still wouldn't call any of these any more overpowered than just general min-maxing. They mostly are there to be the "min-max easy" button and are more to give non-munchkins an overpowered-ish build by the end. Overall they are more about the flavor of feeling overpowered than the actual act, however, and while you could definitely abuse them in normal tabletop games the systems at play just don't let them meet their full potential.

That said, Mythic Abilities are overpowered as balls. Just wait until you hit Mythic Rank 4 and get access to Superpowers (assuming you are still going with Azata). The stuff that gives you is wild; the same for all of the marquee Mythic Abilities from each of the classes.

Enduring Spells is a great goddamn Mythic feat.

So is Death of Elements but y'all refuse to shed your squamous shells and join the skeleton nation.

DrizztLink posted...

Enduring Spells is a great goddamn Mythic feat.

So is Death of Elements but y'all refuse to shed your squamous shells and join the skeleton nation.

Those are Mythic Abilities, not Mythic Feats.

Enduring spell line are more like a good quality of life feats. But by increasing your caster level, either by merging spellbooks or other means, you can have 24 hour duration for buffs that last by round like haste.

ellis123 posted...

Those are Mythic Abilities, not Mythic Feats.

Your face is a mythic ability

DrizztLink posted...

Your face is a mythic ability

You are just jealous that my face hasn't rotted off, Lich.

are teamwork feats still good? it was pretty strong in kingmaker.