Board 8 > Mercenaries Draft Week 4 Wartime: Tapped Out, Mill Deck by FFDragon

(+) Yeah! (+)

Gatarix posted...

Corrik posted...

Scare couldnt win the match anyways

Actually, looking at the mercs, I think this is right. One of Seph/Kuja is getting rostered (because paydowns are prioritized) and Scare has no hard disables that I can think of.

Low On Air into Arena Ferox on one merc and Big Fishing Trip on the other. Scare wins that super easily, it's just dumb that he has to burn abilities to win.
---

wait I need an excuse

GOD SKYRIDGE ALWAYS WITH YOUR uh RULES LAWYERING AND uh I HEARD YOU PUNCHED A KITTEN

ANYWAY I WAS TOTALLY GONNA WIN BUT I AM QUITTING FOR UNRELATED REASONS
---

(In other words, we kinda do think this through when we say 'we're doing autoforfeits'. Scare IS going to win unless voter respect says super winded Kuja/fishing Seph or viceversa can beat Corruption Bass, we just think it's really dumb to make him burn abilities because of something Corrik wouldn't do, which is RNG his roster.)
---

forfeit
as tempted as I am to let topic go up out of spite
---

I don't want the team if it's not getting Bormina'd today

Let ganon have it.
---

KanzarisKelshen posted...

Low On Air into Arena Ferox on one merc and Big Fishing Trip on the other. Scare wins that super easily, it's just dumb that he has to burn abilities to win.

It's not dumb that he has to burn abilities to win. Every leader in every match has to burn abilities if they want to win. There's no reason to gift-wrap anyone a win just because Corrik is throwing a fit.

Also I still lean Sephiroth in either of those scenarios, especially if Scorpion or Magus is present to give him time to catch his breath/frog. Kuja is admittedly a tougher sell.
---

-FFDragon- posted...

I don't want the team if it's not getting Bormina'd today

Let ganon have it.

It literally makes no difference to the owner, it's losing either way. Unless you think a team with no arguments is going to beat a boosted-ass Bass while completely hard-disabled, fielding one of Scorpion, Magus or Ocelot and either Low On Air Kuja or Fishing Seph in a small arena.
---

Gatarix posted...

KanzarisKelshen posted...

Low On Air into Arena Ferox on one merc and Big Fishing Trip on the other. Scare wins that super easily, it's just dumb that he has to burn abilities to win.

It's not dumb that he has to burn abilities to win. Every leader in every match has to burn abilities if they want to win. There's no reason to gift-wrap anyone a win just because Corrik is throwing a fit.

Also I still lean Sephiroth in either of those scenarios, especially if Scorpion or Magus is present to give him time to catch his breath/frog. Kuja is admittedly a tougher sell.

Magus would be killing those abilities
---

If it goes up, I'll argue for the team.
---

Gatarix posted...

KanzarisKelshen posted...

Low On Air into Arena Ferox on one merc and Big Fishing Trip on the other. Scare wins that super easily, it's just dumb that he has to burn abilities to win.

It's not dumb that he has to burn abilities to win. Every leader in every match has to burn abilities if they want to win. There's no reason to gift-wrap anyone a win just because Corrik is throwing a fit.

Also I still lean Sephiroth in either of those scenarios, especially if Scorpion or Magus is present to give him time to catch his breath/frog. Kuja is admittedly a tougher sell.

There is also no reason to make things harder for an active player because someone quit. Scare can try to get into Corrik's head and accurately predict who is going to be rostered if he wants so he can put Vanille in to field a full combat team instead of Big, for example. You can't mindgame RNG, you can only coinflip. Corrik is much more predictable than a coinflip, so why should Scare be more limited in what he can do with his own roster just because a leader threw a hissy fit?
---

I get that that is your opinion, but you literally have at least Drak saying otherwise.

I get you want to punish Corrik, but if you're going to go against precedent to punish the incoming leader too, I want no part.
---

Magus kills big and pharoah man easily. Sorry bout ur luck scare! Seph easily murders bass
---

Make things harder for the replacement instead.
---

-FFDragon- posted...

I get that that is your opinion, but you literally have at least Drak saying otherwise.

I get you want to punish Corrik, but if you're going to go against precedent to punish the incoming lesser too, I want no part.

You can call it a punishment, but to me, coming in with a huge fat chunk of GP to spend on securing wins is considerably more effective than a low percentage win chance here that leaves you pretty poor. The more latitude we can give the replacement on what they want to do, the better. In this way we kill two birds with one stone, not punishing Scare's for Corrik's quit and giving his replacement (if any) more to do once they come in.
---

And arguing kuja isnt harder either. Hasted trance kuja would fucking go nuts on the opposing team. It'd be silly
---

Well then like I said, give it to ganon.
---

KanzarisKelshen posted...

There is also no reason to make things harder for an active player because someone quit. Scare can try to get into Corrik's head and accurately predict who is going to be rostered if he wants so he can put Vanille in to field a full combat team instead of Big, for example. You can't mindgame RNG, you can only coinflip. Corrik is much more predictable than a coinflip, so why should Scare be more limited in what he can do with his own roster just because a leader threw a hissy fit?

A leaderless team can't use abilities, though (and it's got everything available). It's still much easier for Scare than it would otherwise be.
---

Corrik's team is pretty strong in low with those two paydowns.

I think if you're not going to Bormina you need to give the paydown money back.
---

If FFD takes over the team right now he wins. No question. Kanz likes to try and micro manage outcomes and steer leaders he wants to win with abilities tho. So no surprise.

Scares team has no answer for whichever 6 is rostered. And thats why 2 were bought down.
---

Lopen posted...

Corrik's team is pretty strong in low with those two paydowns.

I think if you're not going to Bormina you need to give the paydown money back.

See this is something that's actually worthy of consideration

More specifically keeping the bayonetta paydown (so she shakes off the injury) and refunding Seph and Kuja in full

Basically pretend that corrik was making one possible set of optimal moves that still doesn't punish Scare. That's something we could work with (maybe ask the replacement if they'd like to keep bayo's paydown or refund it as well, even). It's a better solution than putting up a match for a quitting leader's team.
---

LOPEn


i need squall problems help

kanz says it works a different way than i think you said it does what do??
---

There is no "punishment" of Scare. Making him fight his match (when every other leader in the game has to do the same thing) is equal treatment, not punishment.
---

KanzarisKelshen posted...

It's a better solution than putting up a match for a quitting leader's team.

Still disagree tbqh
---

Why is ffd not allowed to take it over right now and win the match???
---

tbqh I think getting a replacement right now is the ideal solution, because it removes the ruling issue entirely; it just becomes a normal match.

but I think none of the replacement prospects were willing to take over mid-week?
---

Gatarix posted...

There is no "punishment" of Scare. Making him fight his match (when every other leader in the game has to do the same thing) is equal treatment, not punishment.

Counterpoint: Remember the W41 elimination match meltdown from JC? He fired his entire team, which would have prevented Eddv from poaching. Not only was his forfeit upheld (IF he forfeited - if not he was just assigned one, I forget), but his decision to fire everyone rolled back so Eddv could get Raiden. The admin team has the power to roll back leader decisions as needed to ensure the game runs smoothly. In this case, given that

A) We're doing a shortened wartime and have limited time, thus waiting 48 hours for Bormina makes the schedule dicier

B) We don't want to punish a player by introducing a new element that makes things harder for them (enemy roster selection unpredictability), even if things get easier elsewhere

and

C) We want to give the replacement leader who comes after Corrik (if any) as much room as possible to do as they see fit

Then running the match makes no sense. Allowing for a rollback on paydowns as the next leader decides though, that's a different story.
---

Corrik posted...

Why is ffd not allowed to take it over right now and win the match???

He is! If he wants it it's his, we reset the match to the beginning and allow deferral to occur as normal, and we proceed as usual. We won't force a leader who's present to autoforfeit.
---

Remember Raiden, this is a sneaking mission. Try not to get caught.

OPERATION NAKED CARTWHEELS IS A GO
---

I'll fight it out if he neexs to wait til the results. Can get him the W.
---

KanzarisKelshen posted...

C) We want to give the replacement leader who comes after Corrik (if any) as much room as possible to do as they see fit

eh, the replacement leader doesn't have much room to do anything if they start 0-4. I mean, a comeback is theoretically possible, but who really wants a team in that state.

Also you wouldn't actually have to wait 48h for Bormina -- there's no team leader to wait for, it's automatically randomized.
---

who the fuck is bormina
---

sir bormun's sister

it just means randomizing stuff when a leader times out
---

i wouldn't mind filling in mid-week and then passing the baton onto Ganon after if he wants it

or nvm Corrik's got it
---

I'll proxy til results for FFD.
Defer

Lets go.
---

@ScareChan

Corrik's return as a proxy is accepted (technically also his full unquit if he wants to do that, we'll see). You'll have to fight the match out. Good luck.
---

break the C A G E
Kirby sucks up Samus
Kirby brings Samus, Archer, Ice, Parasol and Fire forms
Done
---

Strike Man tells Flynn to TAKE YOUR BASE. Intentional Walk.
Welcome home, Alucard. Thank you for showing them your fake plan, now show them a REAL plan
---

*ahem* That is the pre-battle Intentional Walk. Thank you Kanz for covering.
... Now is real plan times?
---

Bloody Tears will play loudly throughout the entire match. Additionally, whenever an opponent speaks they will somehow do so in SoTN-style voice acting.
---

I've already been given a win, I dont see why I have to fight when I was told before wartime it was a forefit and in this topic its a forefit
---

No it's a hindfit the fit was in Peace not Results
---

Now THAT is a plan.

Bowser Shell
Mega Man 10 Wily Machine

Done
---

mewtwo KOs Y'shtola, turning heel on his beast kind
mewtwo: "I'm not asking you to say anything. I just want you to listen. Humankind is weak, Squall, also you suck," Mewtwo says, telepathically (can he even talk?) (abil to add 2 weeks to recharge)

I feel as if Lopen said several times in the past that Problems does not force require the ability (in this case, his allied KO) to be used. Instead, he could use the 2 weeks to recharge option to fill the 'use an ability' segment. However if I were to use the KO, it'd have to target Y'shtola. So if my memory and the 10 times Lopen described how the ability worked adds up I'd actually not want to use the KO ability at all. Obviously.

My cited usage was week 29 vs. DC (the only time iirc I used it). I used Problems on Yoshimitsu who selected Tifa to Harakiri. Instead, Yoshimitsu used the +2 weeks ability. DC then put Yoshimitsu on the roster, and force rostered himself out for like Burst Man and DC forfeited the match.

Cited source:

Armstrong, Joanna + Ky [30s], Tifa, Wario, Burst Man
-attacks-
Kasumi [psycho drive], Squall, Bison, Chrom, Beatrix [dom][orders][30s late]
[zack island]

Anyway if my memory is wrong or anything then I accept KOing Yshtola I just think I actually get how this ability functions..........maybe
---

Uh yes that's the whole point of giving the "Listen" ability to the target merc

To give them an out so they don't have to use their rechargeable.
---

Like Squall imposes two conditions:

1. The merc must use a rechargable this wartime.
2. If the merc uses an ability it gets directed at the merc if possible.

Then he also gives them a rechargable, which is a valid solution to condition 1. It doesn't have a target so it's unaffected by 2.
---

I mean, Squall's ability plainly states that the merc must use a recharagable ability.
---

hah suck it kanz AND luis sera
---

That is why I did that, yes. It was an either/or of Yoshi using his Stab or Yoshi using Listen and booting himself from the match
---

Basically Squall's ideal use case is to be used vs a strong merc with a good ability. Then pleading with Squall to listen actually matters.
---

Mewtwo isn't KOing Y'shtola because they are good buddies, being Beasts and all. He still, however, tells Squall he sucks. Telepathically or whatever.

(also because Kanz was wrong and I was right)
---