Poll of the Day > Well, shit. I know someone who went to the Charlottesville rally. Lost his job.

(+) Yeah! (+)

SmokeMassTree posted...

The way you just described it definitely sounds like a racist rally.

But even so, just attending shouldn't be grounds for ostracizing them.

I disagree.
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I'm just saying this is a very slippery slope that I'm not okay with us as a nation or even as a species going down.

What is the next thing people will be doxed/fired over? Supporting Trump? Supporting the police?

Ryan's, aka SMT, whole online thing is to troll and rile people up. He evens does it on Facebook. Nothing he says should be taken seriously.
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Don't dox me sundog

SmokeMassTree2 posted...

What is the next thing people will be doxed/fired over? Supporting Trump? Supporting the police?

If people get fired for being at a Nazi rally, they might be fired for being at a football game.

1 -> 2 -> ?

think about it.
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SmokeMassTree2 posted...

Don't dox me sundog

Don't post pictures with your first name.
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SmokeMassTree2 posted...

I'm just saying this is a very slippery slope that I'm not okay with us as a nation or even as a species going down.

What is the next thing people will be doxed/fired over? Supporting Trump? Supporting the police?

Why do you think ostracizing someone who wants to kill millions of other people for being born a certain way is wrong?
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SmokeMassTree posted...

Bro I just said I'm willfully ignorant on the subject

If you're going to remain willfully ignorant on the subject then what is the point of commenting on it? At that point your commentary is just based on assumptions drawn from your preconceived biases and has no real value.

Is that what that rally actually was?

Their message or whatever, reason for gathering was that they want to kill millions of people?

SmokeMassTree2 posted...

Is that what that rally actually was?

Their message or whatever, reason for gathering was that they want to kill millions of people?

Yes.
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Zeus posted...

That's a terrible justification for doxxing and terrorizing people. It's straight-up victim-blaming.

Nah, bro - dude attends a rally for a bunch of guys who want to kill/exile black people, that guy's not a "victim" by any sense of the word.

That's just society working its magic.

SmokeMassTree2 posted...

Trump 2020 because of you SJW fucks thinking it's okay to straight dox and get people fired over attending a rally you don't agree with.

This is just comical at this point

I'm completely OK with Nazis getting fired. That is 100% an alright move in my book.

You can try to minimize it by calling them "people I disagree with", but they're also Nazis. They hate people based purely on race and skin colour. I'm totes OK with them standing in the unemployment line until they clean up their shitty attitude.

If they don't like it, maybe they shouldn't be Nazis. I'm not and it's worked out OK for me.

SmokeMassTree posted...

Y'all really need to stop using that word unless you're referring to actual nazis in WWll. It comes off as childish and takes away any meaning the word actually has.

The meaning the word has is "those far-right racist fucks who goose-step, hate Jews and non-whites, support fascism, and are generally just all around fuck-ups of human beings." And that is an accurate descriptor of both the ones around in WW2 and the ones around today. I fail to see the issue here.

I'd understand your concern if we were using the word to describe some random right-winger, but we're talking about actual, genuine, Swastika-and-Sieg-Heil Nazis. This isn't a misuse of the term.

SmokeMassTree posted...

But even so, just attending shouldn't be grounds for ostracizing them.

Why not? Again, they're Nazis - you know, guys venerating Hitler, killer of tens of millions of innocent people? These are not people who deserve your respect or sympathy. They decided to stand, in a completely public space where they 100% knew they would be filmed and photographed, and wave their dumb symbols while airing their shitty views; if they didn't think those photos would eventually be posted online and get back to their employers, then not only are they Nazis, they're really dumb Nazis to boot.
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SmokeMassTree2 posted...

I'm just saying this is a very slippery slope that I'm not okay with us as a nation or even as a species going down.

What is the next thing people will be doxed/fired over? Supporting Trump? Supporting the police?

Except it's not a slippery slope, because being a Nazi has generally been a fireable offence for decades if it got out; the only difference between then and now is that it's much easier for that news to spread thanks to the internet and social media.

People haven't taken the next step and been fired for political views (except where those views are in direct contravention of their terms of employment), so I fail to see how this constitutes a slippery slope.

People aren't being and shouldn't be fired for supporting Trump or the police, as those are not hate groups whose very existence is dedicated to the marginalization and extinction of entire swathes of the population simply for having the temerity to be born with the "wrong" colour of skin. Nazis, though? I'm OK with them being fired. Those guys can get fucked.
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Golden Road posted...

SmokeMassTree2 posted...

Is that what that rally actually was?

Their message or whatever, reason for gathering was that they want to kill millions of people?

Yes.

I feel like you're not telling the truth

I'll actually look into this and get back to this topic with my replies

A quick google pulls up this article

https://mobile.nytimes.com/2017/08/14/us/charlottesville-doxxing.html

This isn't a slippery slope though right

Does anyone have a link to a non biased article? Some of these are ridiculous
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I'm done until someone can provide me an article where they don't take atleast three cheap shots at Trump while trying to explain what happened.

I just read five that were littered with anti trump propaganda.
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SushiSquid posted...

Yellow posted...

Jen0125 posted...

knivesX2004 posted...

Awesome.
Fuck him.

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SmokeMassTree posted...

I'm done until someone can provide me an article where they don't take atleast three cheap shots at Trump while trying to explain what happened.

I just read five that were littered with anti trump propaganda.

Him failing to condemn actual Nazis - which is the political equivalent of screwing up a dunk on a six foot tall net - is kind of a big part of this story's aftermath.

Also, do your own homework.
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Right because if he doesn't condemn every single sub group, he supports them.

foh

SmokeMassTree2 posted...

Right because if he doesn't condemn every single sub group, he supports them.

foh

Put it this way - he was asked for a comment on the situation and he said he condemned violence "on all sides."

You know, not the Nazis who crashed into people with a car, killing one and injuring 19 more. Not the guys who were there marching because they want a whites-only country (and who had gone on record as saying that they supported Trump and felt he embodied their views). "All sides". They were all apparently just as bad in his eyes.

When your two sides are "Equality" and "Nazis", it's false equivalence to suggest that they are equally right and valid viewpoints. And this isn't just a leftist thing either - Trump got slammed by numerous members of his own party, and several veterans groups, who basically smacked him upside the head and reminded him that condemning Nazis isn't exactly a difficult or controversial thing.

Also, President "I'm not afraid to say 'Islamic Terrorism' and place blame, even when the story is still developing" was incredibly gunshy around the words "White Nationalism" or "Domestic Terrorism", despite the fact that both were highly relevant to this situation.
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Exactly.

On all sides

So he actually did condemn it, it's just that he didn't do it the way you wanted him to.

Cry about it
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SmokeMassTree posted...

So he actually did condemn it, it's just that he didn't do it the way you wanted him to.

No, he didn't condemn it the way Democrats and, more to the point, Republicans wanted to.

I honestly couldn't give a shit what Trump thinks. Whether he condemns it or comes out with a Hitler moustache tomorrow is of absolutely zero consequence to me and wouldn't really change what I think about him. The people who were understandably upset were people like Senators John McCain, Marco Rubio, Cory Gardner, Ted Cruz, Jeff Flake, Orrin Hatch and Ben Sasse (all Republicans); Kenneth Frazier (member of Trump's "American Manufacturing Council", who resigned over Trump's failure to condemn the white supremacists); Mike Huckabee and Mitt Romney; and former Republican congressman John Dingell ("I signed up to fight Nazis 73 years ago and I'll do it again if I have to").

You didn't understand why articles all over the web are slamming Trump; I simply gave you an education on the subject.

And, again, condemning violence "on all sides", when the two sides are people who support civil rights and Nazis is pretty much the greatest example of false equivalence I could ever come up with.
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Those people need to get over it. He isn't a puppet that they can control. He doesn't need the approval of the corporations that they are in the pocket of.

It doesn't matter what each side stands for, he condemned the violence that was occurring from both sides.
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SmokeMassTree posted...

It doesn't matter what each side stands for

Um... yeah. It really, really does.

Again, Nazis. I'm kind of amazed I need to explain this.

SmokeMassTree posted...

He isn't a puppet that they can control.

Apparently he is, because today (two days late, but whatevs) he took a second swing at a condemnation, this time explicitly calling out the white supremacists, labelling them "evil", which is exactly what he should have done the first time around.
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Dude, you can say nazis 8923423 more times and it isn't going to make your point any better.

SmokeMassTree2 posted...

Dude, you can say nazis 8923423 more times and it isn't going to make your point any better.

You're right, it's not. Mostly because my point's already correct; it doesn't need to be any better than that.
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@SmokeMassTree2

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-40914748

"A few feet away, a young white man with a buzzed haircut and sunglasses leaned towards them over a facing barrier. "You'll be on the first f*****g boat home," he screamed at the black woman, before turning to the white woman. "And as for you, you're going straight to hell," he said. Then he gave a Nazi salute."

There was Nazi's there

Oh cool Zeus is back to defending Nazis.

And he still hasn't condemned the riot his white supremacist buddies created.
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As to what the rally was about @SmokeMassTree, I believe it started as a defense of a Confederate monument that had been scheduled to be taken down/removed.

But, once literal Nazis start showing up, doing Nazi salutes, waving swastikas, beating people... is it really defensible as "just" free speech? Certainly not the violence. Certainly not running over innocent bystanders and killing them.
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SmokeMassTree posted...

Those people need to get over it. He isn't a puppet that they can control. He doesn't need the approval of the corporations that they are in the pocket of.

It doesn't matter what each side stands for, he condemned the violence that was occurring from both sides.

Lmao but trump cried when Obama wouldn't condemn Muslims as a whole for the acts of Islamic terrorists. Smh.
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SmokeMassTree posted...

The way you just described it definitely sounds like a racist rally.

But even so, just attending shouldn't be grounds for ostracizing them.

Sure it should. It's very easy to not go to a Nazi rally, because everyone knows Nazis are jackasses. Ergo, you really shouldn't complain about being treated like a jackass for attending a Nazi rally.

_AdjI_ posted...

SmokeMassTree posted...

The way you just described it definitely sounds like a racist rally.

But even so, just attending shouldn't be grounds for ostracizing them.

Sure it should. It's very easy to not go to a Nazi rally, because everyone knows Nazis are jackasses. Ergo, you really shouldn't complain about being treated like a jackass for attending a Nazi rally.

It was originally about ethics in game journalism though.

Also if you work in an at will employment state you really need to think about what you do outside of work. Your employer can fire you for anything as long as it's not legally classified as discrimination.
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Ohio
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Far-Queue posted...

But, once literal Nazis start showing up, doing Nazi salutes, waving swastikas, beating people... is it really defensible as "just" free speech? Certainly not the violence. Certainly not running over innocent bystanders and killing them.

Yes.

Up until they start breaking other laws of course, like assault/battery and murder.

Free speech should be protected no matter what. Shitty and stupid as these people may be, there's far too great a danger to saying they can't say what they want to say.

That's why the ACLU defends their right to protest. And that's why the Supreme court agreed.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Socialist_Party_of_America_v._Village_of_Skokie

Also, I just want to point out because it often comes up in cases like this, you actually CAN yell fire in a crowded theater. The case for this (which had nothing to do with the popular phrase) was overturned by the Supreme Court.

In 1969, the Supreme Court's decision in Brandenburg v. Ohio effectively overturned Schenck and any authority the case still carried. There, the Court held that inflammatory speech--and even speech advocating violence by members of the Ku Klux Klan--is protected under the First Amendment, unless the speech "is directed to inciting or producing imminent lawless action and is likely to incite or produce such action"
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people realize free speech protects you from the gubberment not your employer right?
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A guy I know invited me to some anti-Muslim rally a month or so ago. I have no interest in those sorts of gatherings though. And it's just asking for trouble... I'm not into marches or protesting even when the cause excites me.
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I've personally known two white supremacists in my life. One was a Native American, the other was a Columbian who was adopted by a Jewish man and a Hispanic woman.
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Zareth posted...

I've personally known two white supremacists in my life. One was a Native American, the other was a Columbian who was adopted by a Jewish man and a Hispanic woman.

I don't know if I've ever met a legitimate one. My grandma kind of was, maybe?... There's also a strange offshoot in my family that nobody has actually met who magically appeared in Paraguay in 1945 (revealed in a genealogy book). We only know this because there are two documented child births there and then, without any prior relatives living there, iirc. Very suspicious..... We all made the obvious assumption and nobody has felt motivated to try to contact them.
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Jen0125 posted...

people realize free speech protects you from the gubberment not your employer right?

This. Free speech is protected, sure. But that doesn't mean there's no repercussions for waving a swastika around.
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https://xkcd.com/1357/
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Kanakiri posted...

https://xkcd.com/1357/

Irony
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Jen0125 posted...

SmokeMassTree posted...

Those people need to get over it. He isn't a puppet that they can control. He doesn't need the approval of the corporations that they are in the pocket of.

It doesn't matter what each side stands for, he condemned the violence that was occurring from both sides.

Lmao but trump cried when Obama wouldn't condemn Muslims as a whole for the acts of Islamic terrorists. Smh.

Did you just compare cutting people's heads off, throwing gay people off of roofs, bombing innocent civilians, and enslaving women to standing around?

Wow Jen
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SmokeMassTree posted...

Did you just compare cutting people's heads off, throwing gay people off of roofs, bombing innocent civilians, and enslaving women to standing around?

Uh, you know, Nazis have a teensy bit more history of doing more than just standing around....
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Yes, actual nazis.

The dudes at that rally tho, standing around
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SmokeMassTree posted...

Yes, actual nazis.

The dudes at that rally tho, standing around

What's it like being a Nazi defender?
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SmokeMassTree posted...

Did you just compare cutting people's heads off, throwing gay people off of roofs, bombing innocent civilians, and enslaving women to standing around?

Wow Jen

i didn't realize every single muslim did those things.
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Jen0125 posted...

SmokeMassTree posted...

Did you just compare cutting people's heads off, throwing gay people off of roofs, bombing innocent civilians, and enslaving women to standing around?

Wow Jen

i didn't realize every single muslim did those things.

Did I say they did
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Yes, free speech just protects you from the government, which will just find some tangent to attack you for it. The public does not honor that ideal as well.