Poll of the Day > Games that punish you for making good moral choices or reward for selfish ones?

(+) Yeah! (+)

Or at the very least reward you much more for making selfish choices?

Most games reward you much more for making the good moral choices over the morally bad ones. Or like Bioshock, you get an immediate reward for making a selfish moral choice, but a larger reward later for the good moral choice.

I can think of some instances in Skyrim where you get collectible item for making a morally bad choice, but there is no real punishment for making the morally good one.

I always thought the concept of rewarding players for making morally good choices in games was silly, as most people don't need motivation to make the morally good choice in a game anyway, and there should be temptation to make the morally bad choice for the choice to at all be interesting.

I didn't play it but I think the gimmick of the game LISA is that you are severely punished every time you make a morally good choice.
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DarkKirby2500 posted...

most people don't need motivation to make the morally good choice in a game anyway

Beg to differ, the bad choice is almost always to do more to get more. The only reason to choose good is because games want to give you stuff for not just slaughtering everyone for their valuables.
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DarkKirby2500 posted...

I can think of some instances in Skyrim where you get collectible item for making a morally bad choice, but there is no real punishment for making the morally good one.

I always thought the concept of rewarding players for making morally good choices in games was silly, as most people don't need motivation to make the morally good choice in a game anyway, and there should be temptation to make the morally bad choice for the choice to at all be interesting.

There are countless games where the baked in reward for the moral wrong is that it's the far easier path. I think even in Skyrim you can just kill NPCs for rare items instead of chasing down a long quest. The reward for being evil is saving a lot of time and effort.

And keep in mind that evil is far more heavily rewarded than good in those games. Thievery will generally net you a lot of items that would be a pain to get otherwise. And, honestly, you resort to break-ins and burglary pretty easy in those games.
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Fallout had balls before Bethesda cut them off and smashed them with a hammer. The first two games are still pretty fucking edgy, even without being as explicit visually as a lot of stuff is today. You can get roped into being a fluffer on a porn set, contract an STD, or join the Slavers Guild (which is exactly as horrible as it sounds, and you're branded with a tattoo that makes everyone hate you).
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Zeus posted...

There are countless games where the baked in reward for the moral wrong is that it's the far easier path.

The "problem" with this as a reward is often, since you are playing a game you (likely) paid for, many people want the additional game play, so it's practically a punishment to allow you the easier path unless the hard path is really hard or there is a severe punishment for failing (that you can't just reload your save from), or the requirement for the good moral choice makes you do a lot or boring menial tasks.
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In Fallout and Kotor I have a really hard time choosing the "bad guy" actions and dialog or just being dickish to the nice npc characters
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In Mega Man Legends you could turn in the money that the Servbots stole, or keep it for massive profit (and an abysmal approval rating).

Edit: actually, I don't remember if they really stole it or not. I do recall them trying to go legit at one point.
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KotOR is the game that springs to mind, if only because most Dark Side choices result in you earning more credits than you would otherwise (and thus being able to buy better gear), and because the Dark Side powers tend to be better than the Light Side ones.

Also, because it's fun to be able to dominate officials into waiving docking fees or fines while Bastila chastises you and Canderous approvingly points out how useful it is.

Plus, technically speaking, if you pursue either of the romance options you're technically skirting the Dark Side, since a pure Light Sider shouldn't be flaunting the Jedi Code that way (and Bastila will explicitly tell you this and try to break it off).



Zeus posted...

And keep in mind that evil is far more heavily rewarded than good in those games. Thievery will generally net you a lot of items that would be a pain to get otherwise. And, honestly, you resort to break-ins and burglary pretty easy in those games.

The funny thing is, in most games, walking directly into people's houses and taking everything that isn't nailed down is basically standard operating practice. Bethesda games are kind of unique in the sense that they actually differentiate between things you're allowed to take and things you're punished for taking.

Though the one problem with games like Skyrim or ESO is how they handle "stolen" tags. It's annoying on the occasions that you enter someone's house on a mission to murder them for being evil, but can't take anything on the way out because it's all "owned". Umm, not any more, game.

(And seriously, how the fuck does every merchant in the entire world KNOW that fruit I'm trying to sell them is stolen? Do they teach some sort of universal "Detect Theft" spell in merchant school?)



DarkKirby2500 posted...

The "problem" with this as a reward is often, since you are playing a game you (likely) paid for, many people want the additional game play, so it's practically a punishment to allow you the easier path unless the hard path is really hard or there is a severe punishment for failing (that you can't just reload your save from), or the requirement for the good moral choice makes you do a lot or boring menial tasks.

This is actually why a lot of people deliberately do the "good" path first and then do the "evil" path in a second playthrough in games like that.

That way, you get the full experience first time, and the second time around you get the bonus of being able to skip some of the more time-consuming quests.

Though honestly, when all you're really skipping is mostly busywork (like, say, when you can skip over a step or two in an ESO quest by using Persuade or Intimidate), you're not really missing out on much anyway. Whether you go out and kill a dozen wolves for their pelts or steal a dozen pelts directly out of a chest, you're still more or less getting the same degree of experience out of it.



Action53 posted...

In Fallout and Kotor I have a really hard time choosing the "bad guy" actions and dialog or just being dickish to the nice npc characters

That says less about the game and more about you as a person, though.

Not that I disapprove. In most games I wind up even when I'm playing an otherwise evilish character, I tend to try to be "nice" to my allies and friends (which is annoying in more simplistic games where being polite or nice nets you "light side" points). It just seems stupid and counterintuitive that I have to treat people close to me like shit just because I'm evil.

If anything, evil characters should be NICER. And get [Lie] dialogue options.


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