Board 8 > Game of Thrones Offseason - The more immediate problem is that we're fucked.

(+) Yeah! (+)

(spoilers topic)
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This wait is gonna be stupid. Should've just been a 13-episode season. Still put a 3-4 month break in the middle if you want, but don't make us wait a year for only 7 episodes and then another year for only 6 episodes. Grr.
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That would never have happened. Aside from the additional stress it puts on the filming and the CGI team, HBO always wanted to stretch the IP over as long a timeframe as possible.

I do wonder whether the fact that critics are finally trending down on GOT, plus the long night, will result in S8 having significantly lower viewership than S7.

I personally doubt it, and that's probably only possible due to the abbreviation of S7 and S8.
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reluctant tag
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SeabassDebeste posted...

I'm sad on your behalf. I was actually probably able to enjoy the season more because the show 'broke' for me much earlier, so I sadly came to expect garbage like that.

It was going well for me until Bronn and Jamie surfaced on the other side of the ocean from the Epic Loot Train Battle. It's like they planned backwards, and no two episodes had agreement how the over-arching story should play out. and at times, even that is too kind.

But don't feel too bad for me! Think about how hype I was for the loot train battle. And in 4 months I'll have forgotten my major gripes and say "yeah how did Gendry run so fast, whatever, I'm dying for season 8 to get here"
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Atlus just confirmed Dancing All Night: Game of Thrones
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ratings are going to go up. everyone watches this show now and we're headed for some big stuff and it's going to be hyped and advertised like crazy.

the real question is... will the showrunners have read enough negative press that they don't want to feel like they're messing up the show, or are they going to be too oblivious to it? this season's interviews sounded like they weren't worried about it, but, it's not like they were going to delay the shows to fix concerns.
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What's depressing the most is how much objectively good work does go into the show. The people in charge of makeup, CGI, set design, casting, music, etc. are almost universally doing incredible jobs. The issues with the show are almost 100% traceable to writing, and sometimes directing and acting. Those should be the least difficult/expensive parts to get right compared to the massive technical work that 90% of the crew work on.
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neonreaper posted...

the real question is... will the showrunners have read enough negative press that they don't want to feel like they're messing up the show, or are they going to be too oblivious to it? this season's interviews sounded like they weren't worried about it, but, it's not like they were going to delay the shows to fix concerns.

Yeah that one director flat out said he doesn't care about the complaints because the show is popular.
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That's how all shows work though. Directors/writers are the bosses, and they very often suck. That's why a good director with a good script means you're gonna have a damn good show - there's usually no question that the rest of your production team is gonna nail it.
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The writing has become awful, but i realized watching the last episode the thing that bothers me the most is shitty pacing. They let the finale breathe a little bit and it was so much more satisfying than the rest of the season because of it.
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SeabassDebeste posted...

The issues with the show are almost 100% traceable to writing, and sometimes directing and acting. Those should be the least difficult/expensive parts to get right compared to the massive technical work that 90% of the crew work on.

it's crazy how common of a problem this is in media and yeah, at this point, I just don't know anymore. you'd think that for people who get paid to write and direct and it is literally their job they would be able to do it without screwing it up. but then I realize that good writing is actually really, really hard to pull off.

basically while the actors get paid tons of money, the writers get paid very little. relatively speaking. now how do you think they are going to attract good writers if they aren't willing to pay them very much? that's where my line of thinking started to go anyway once I put some real thought into it.
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Question- Should I play Telltale's Game of Thrones?
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So how does it feel to forever not know what was the original plan for the White Walkers to take down the wall?
How does it feel to think that maybe if they didn't go behind the wall to give them a free dragon, they had nothing to fear from at the first place?
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If the wildlings can make a strong push into Castle Black then I'd imagine the wights could get a lot accomplished. I'm not too worried about that
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OliviaTremor posted...

Question- Should I play Telltale's Game of Thrones?

I mean, there are worse ways to spend your time, but it's pretty easily one of Telltales worst games. Not aggressively bad, just boring and unsatisfying
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OliviaTremor posted...

Question- Should I play Telltale's Game of Thrones?

Absolutely not
And this is not negative Nanis talking - I actually give Telltale games more credits than most people give them (i.e I don't hate TWD Season 2, I am not bothered by their choice system)
The game is just..terrible. The story is poor, it doesn't feel like Game of Thrones at all
You have some characters from the show, but you know that they can't be killed because this game isn't really canon, so it makes the scenes with those characters predictible

There are only 2 good things about that piece of shit
This song (the footage and some of the lyrics are a spoiler, but still felt like posting it)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_-aETXtqOvc
And Asher is a fucking badass and I wish we will see more characters like him
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Apparently Sansa originally asked Bran to Google Arya's intentions, but the scene was cut.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/bran-stark-actor-says-cut-scene-wouldve-explained-confusing-game-of-thrones-finale-moment_us_59a5d56ee4b00795c2a26a71?ncid=inblnkushpmg00000009

“Funny enough, we did actually shoot a scene that didn’t make it into that episode where Sansa knocks on Bran’s door, and I don’t know whether they actually want to change the story, but as I understand it, Sansa came to Bran and goes, ‘Can you just look some of this up before I kill my sister?’ That kind of sentiment. Sansa just checking that fact,” said the actor.

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EndOfDiscOne posted...

Apparently Sansa originally asked Bran to Google Arya's intentions, but the scene was cut.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/bran-stark-actor-says-cut-scene-wouldve-explained-confusing-game-of-thrones-finale-moment_us_59a5d56ee4b00795c2a26a71?ncid=inblnkushpmg00000009

“Funny enough, we did actually shoot a scene that didn’t make it into that episode where Sansa knocks on Bran’s door, and I don’t know whether they actually want to change the story, but as I understand it, Sansa came to Bran and goes, ‘Can you just look some of this up before I kill my sister?’ That kind of sentiment. Sansa just checking that fact,” said the actor.

They probably wouldn't want to set that precedent because then every time someone in Jon's group is surprised by a betrayal or something would only serve to make them all idiots.
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OliviaTremor posted...

Question- Should I play Telltale's Game of Thrones?

I thought it was ok, and I say that as a rabid Game of Thrones enthusiast that loves the books.

There were definitely a couple parts that I really wanted to keep playing through, and overall the story was fairly interesting I thought.

The problems were:
1) Your decisions honestly don't matter all that much outside of some big ones near the end (I feel like this describes most Telltale games though)
2) It almost feels like fan fiction - there's this important family in the North that gets mentioned like one time? It almost felt like something you'd read on a fan fiction site were the author inserts their own VERY SPECIAL AND INTERESTING FAMILY into a narrative as haphazardly as they can
3) People from the show feel out of place and take some of the drama away. You know certain things can't happen because well, duh, that character has a specific arc in the show the can't interfere with.

I would've liked it a lot more if it occurred in the Game of Thrones universe, but happened in some unexplored time period before the show and books take place. A lot of lore there that could be fun to dive into.

Still, like foolmo said, there are worse ways to spend your time. I didn't hate it and I enjoyed it enough so maybe you will too (if you're able to overlook a couple of the stupider plot points). It is probably the worst Telltale game I've played though. Not awful. Just kind of "eh that was pretty okay".
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EndOfDiscOne posted...

Apparently Sansa originally asked Bran to Google Arya's intentions, but the scene was cut.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/bran-stark-actor-says-cut-scene-wouldve-explained-confusing-game-of-thrones-finale-moment_us_59a5d56ee4b00795c2a26a71?ncid=inblnkushpmg00000009

“Funny enough, we did actually shoot a scene that didn’t make it into that episode where Sansa knocks on Bran’s door, and I don’t know whether they actually want to change the story, but as I understand it, Sansa came to Bran and goes, ‘Can you just look some of this up before I kill my sister?’ That kind of sentiment. Sansa just checking that fact,” said the actor.

I am not even sure I want this scene either

Littlefinger demise should have had nothing to do with Bran power
They could have easily let Arya manipulate him instead - she should be a master of reading people now, isn't she?
Outsmarting a mastermind is so much more satisfying than using a cheat
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Nanis23 posted...

So how does it feel to forever not know what was the original plan for the White Walkers to take down the wall?
How does it feel to think that maybe if they didn't go behind the wall to give them a free dragon, they had nothing to fear from at the first place?

This is why the books allude to a magic horn that can break the wall. But at this point we should all be well aware of the showrunners' horrible anti-horn agenda!
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neonreaper posted...

If the wildlings can make a strong push into Castle Black then I'd imagine the wights could get a lot accomplished. I'm not too worried about that

But I thought they can't get close to the wall, like Benjen said?
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What was with Benjen being unable to cross the Wall himself? I don't remember.
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To be fair having a convenient horn that solves every impossible problem is also dumb writing

Unless there's like 1000s of horns, for taking better shits and growing corn slightly faster or whatever, and a couple just happen to kill dragons and giant magical walls
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foolm0r0n posted...

To be fair having a convenient horn that solves every impossible problem is also dumb writing

Unless there's like 1000s of horns, for taking better shits and growing corn slightly faster or whatever, and a couple just happen to kill dragons and giant magical walls

They're probably the same damn horn. Having the wall being destroyed by a dragon in the show might mean it's supposed to happen in the books, too, except the show had to come up with a radically different way for it to happen.

They say shit like "no mortal man will sound this horn and live" so knowing what we know now it seems like foreshadowing of the White Walkers getting the horn and stealing a dragon to smash open the wall.
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Anagram posted...

What was with Benjen being unable to cross the Wall himself? I don't remember.

When he brought Bran to the wall he said he can't get closer because the wall is englufed by magic that doesn't let dead people come near it..and he is one of them
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Eh.

(Book Spoilers + Speculation)

I don't know if The Others get a dragon in the books. IIRC, the show didn't have the "dragon has three heads"/3 dragon rider prophecy the books had. I half expect that Euron's "dragon-binding" horn is actually the one that brings down The Wall and the one the Wildlings had was a fake (IIRC Val or someone casts some doubt on the Wildling horn.) With the major question being if Euron's horn has a range limit/can it bring down The Wall from Essos.
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Nanis23 posted...

When he brought Bran to the wall he said he can't get closer because the wall is englufed by magic that doesn't let dead people come near it..and he is one of them

That just raises more questions, but okay.
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From the Bran article

The GoT finale delivered one of the show's most satisfying deaths with an even more satisfying collaboration

Holy shit some people really think that? Some people really think Littlefinger death was satisfying?
It wasn't Joffrey getting poisoned
It wasn't Ramsay getting eaten by his dogs
And there wasn't anything satisfying about Arya and Sansa "collaboration"
Fuck this is so dumb
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there wasn't even a collaboration

it all happened off screen

the last we saw of the two characters on screen together was them threatening to cut each others faces off

then they are just randomly on the same side again

LOL
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"collaboration" mmmmMMMMmmm
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I keep on thinking of ways the Littlefinger thing could have gone better
Even a simple idea like Arya playing the Game of Facea with him and making him confess he was responsible for Ned's death would be better
She could start with simple stuff like asking why he is suddenly loyal to the Starks when he was on the Lanisster side
He will ask why and she will bring up the conversation she heard between him and Tywin, then she will start hitting him whenever he is lying until he confess the whole truth
I am against Bran cheating and I realize this is kinda cheating too, but it feels much less cheap
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xp1337 posted...

Eh.

(Book Spoilers + Speculation)

I don't know if The Others get a dragon in the books. IIRC, the show didn't have the "dragon has three heads"/3 dragon rider prophecy the books had. I half expect that Euron's "dragon-binding" horn is actually the one that brings down The Wall and the one the Wildlings had was a fake (IIRC Val or someone casts some doubt on the Wildling horn.) With the major question being if Euron's horn has a range limit/can it bring down The Wall from Essos.

Don't forget Sam has the horn Jon found beyond the wall in the books still.... and they mention it fairly often.
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SeabassDebeste posted...

What's depressing the most is how much objectively good work does go into the show. The people in charge of makeup, CGI, set design, casting, music, etc. are almost universally doing incredible jobs. The issues with the show are almost 100% traceable to writing, and sometimes directing and acting. Those should be the least difficult/expensive parts to get right compared to the massive technical work that 90% of the crew work on.

The CGI work is straight up embarrassing and the cast isn't making up for the awful writing so I have no idea what this post is about
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To expand on that, the dragon CGI is so fucking bad and uninspired, particularly when Dany is riding one of them. Everyone is going to look back on this in 10 years and feel really silly.
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Nelson_Mandela posted...

Everyone is going to look back on this in 10 years and feel really silly.

As opposed to other CG which is timeless? It isn't disney obviously
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I already think the dragon stuff is silly. like 15 years ahead of you guys on that one.

anyway uh I assume he's talking about costumes and set. and to be fair the costumes in this show are still pretty good. although I'm not sure if they are still as good as they have been in previous seasons. too lazy to go back and make direct comparisons at this point since my enthusiasm for the show is at an all time low.
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foolm0r0n posted...

Nelson_Mandela posted...

Everyone is going to look back on this in 10 years and feel really silly.

As opposed to other CG which is timeless? It isn't disney obviously

No, but certain things are still impressive technically. GoT is the most basic, uninspired, run-of-the-mill CGI I have ever seen. They just threw money at lazy graphic designers and told them to make dragons but there is clearly zero creativity and it makes me rage harder than anything on this terrible show that people think it looks good.

Watch Jurassic Park if you want to see timeless CGI effects done right and with passion and love.
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MariaTaylor posted...

I already think the dragon stuff is silly. like 15 years ahead of you guys on that one.

anyway uh I assume he's talking about costumes and set. and to be fair the costumes in this show are still pretty good. although I'm not sure if they are still as good as they have been in previous seasons. too lazy to go back and make direct comparisons at this point since my enthusiasm for the show is at an all time low.

They literally cut up an IKEA rug to make Jon snow's cloak
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Dany riding Drogon looks terrible, yeah, but when the dragons are flying free they look great IMO. And no, the cast doesn't make up for the awful writing - that's kind of the point!
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Game of Thrones is still a really good show, I think people get too upset at the silly/dumb things the show does instead of laughing them off
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It's incredibly lazy and thinks the audience is stupid and doesn't care about anything but shocking deaths, nudity, and fight scenes. its an expensive show, if thats what you mean by really good. There used to be only enough stupid things that they could be laughed off or ignored, but now its virtually entirely stupid things. Like yeah, it sucked back in season 3 having to sit through garbage like theons torture arc, but the bulk of each episode was good. It was a pretty good signal that the future wasn't bright for the show that almost every bit that wasn't lifted directly from the books were of noticeably lower quality, and the guys running the show say shit like "creatively, it made sense to us, because we wanted it to happen", like its insulting having two dudes with absolutely no vision or understanding of this world being the ones crafting it for us. If this show was like xena warrior princess or hercules then sure I would laugh it off for being dumb, but my enjoyment of this show is not supposed to be derived from it being campy and bad.

That's actually a great analogy. GoT has morphed into a higher budget Xena or Hercules + HBO shock factor
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When I do read the GoT books, they better be perfect like people hype them up as
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GANON1025 posted...

When I do read the GoT books, they better be perfect like people hype them up as

Well they are very strong on internal consistency and logic, almost to a fault since I think that's why GRRM is struggling so much.
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GANON1025 posted...

When I do read the GoT books, they better be perfect like people hype them up as

I've only read the first book, but it was pretty good and went into way more detail on stuff than the show did. I assume that the books continue to pay the same level of attention to detail.
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I wish there was a good audiobook series of them, it would fit into my schedule more.
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the books are not perfect. they are just really good. especially in certain aspects.

internal consistency and logic is a pretty good way to put it, as EndOfDiscOne just did. if those are things you care about then you will probably appreciate the level of work and detail that goes into them. problem is that the TV show has exposed the IP to a huge audience and most of them would not particularly appreciate these things very much. most people want something that is easy to digest, not something that is well written. that's why the show is immensely popular and the books were not. although they were still popular and well regarded beforehand, but they were not anywhere near the extent that the show has become.

it is nothing but a recipe for disappointment when show watchers try to switch over to the books and find them boring or aimless by comparison. especially because the larger themes of the main story in the book are almost the complete opposite of the themes and values that the showrunners have propped up.
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GANON1025 posted...

I wish there was a good audiobook series of them, it would fit into my schedule more.

there is. the audiobook versions are considered to be really, really good actually.
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