Current Events > You are allowed to prevent either Hitlers birth or Trump running for president

(+) Yeah! (+)

mario2000 posted...

2nd option

changing history in such a major way would have monumental consequences

lol @ the rightists in this topic virtue signaling over it

Especially after the last 8 years of Obama being called Hitler and how he was going to put white people in FEMA Death Camps, along with one of their favorite nicknames of Hitlery's..... but no, this hypothetical? No, this is going to far!
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Ths is some seriously pathetic trolling topic creator.
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DifferentialEquation posted...

mortimerjames posted...

not choosing banishes you to pit of eternal torture

which is basically equivalent to living in a world where Trump isn't president

You should be ashamed of yourself.
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I voted for Hitler's birth without reading the original post.
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World War 2 and the Holocaust had more causes that lead to them than just "Hitler was an asshole"
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Frankly, I expected more of us to be big enough sci-fi nerds to know the right answer.
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Why do are people trying to act like picking the trump option makes you dumb? Self preservation is a really good reason to not mess with existence of hitler.
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As terrible as Hitler and the genocide was, changing the past is not a good idea at all. There is no telling what kind of future would emerge as a result. Global super powers would almost assuredly be different, especially when you take into account the fact that the USA would likely not have developed the nuclear bomb. No WW2, no bomb, and while this sounds great, what if another country developed an even worse weapon, and future iterations were built off of that? What if, without nukes as a deterrent, there were way more land invasions, way more countries trying to overtake one another by force?

As terrible as it was, history requires it. Otherwise, we would not have the world we have now. Whether that is for the better, or for the worse, no one can truly say, but at least with this world we know what we're getting, and can work with it.
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WindMouseHanpan posted...

I'd rather deny Trump the presidency than save 6 million Jewish lives from death.

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Hitler's birth

WWII shaped the modern world. I wouldnt be quick to mess with it.

Prevent Trump means someone else gets elected as a Republican nominee. Maybe Jeb, idk. Maybe Hillary gets elected, maybe someone else does. But the US would probably be in a slightly better place right now. Though Trump's main value comes from whoever comes after him, in 2020/2024. That will be the main indicator on whether or not his Presidency is worth negating.
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I didn't read the fine print

Still would have voted Hitler. Super Hitler sounds amazing.
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this poll has very scary results. do you people even realize what would happen if you prevented Hitler's birth? there is a reason there a time travel rule to never mess with Hitler. People never stop and think about the ramifications. you should know there is a like 90% chance that after you stop hitler, you will never even exist. by preventing hitler you actually would cause even more loss of life. more people alive today would suddenly never exist than anyone that died in the war.

Stop Hitler's birth and you get Command and Conquer: Red Alert
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Then there needs to be a third option for "not fucking with the timeline".

If the only options are "mildly fuck with the timeline" or "really fuck with the timeline" I'm going to choose the one that causes more chaos every time.
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scorpion41 posted...

Hitler's birth obviously. The man orchestrated the murder of 6 million innocent people in the modern age. Trump is just a dick.

This.

Unless Trump goes on to start a nuclear war or something, Hitler would be the obvious choice.
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MrOnionHead posted...

This.

Unless Trump goes on to start a nuclear war or something, Hitler would be the obvious choice.

so to save 6 million lives you kill 6 billion?

No dpubt my vote goes to Trump.

What Hitler did was bad, but killing him would alter a great deal of history.

Stopping Trump alters far less.
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Bullet_Wing posted...

I'm not in the camp who thinks Trump is as bad as Hitler (or anywhere close), but I'd choose Trump here.

It's highly possible by stopping Hitlers birth, I'd stop myself from being born and otherwise fuck up history. Stopping Trump getting elected doesn't hurt anyone (except Trump's ego)

It's not just possible if it's extremely likely. Most people's families were affected in one way or another by WW2.

My grandmother moved from Liverpool to Canada right after the war. If the war hadn't happened, she likely would have never moved to Canada, nor met my grandfather. My entire family line on all sides would be altered drastically
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if you really wanted to stop WW2 you would stop WW1. or change the outcome of the war so that Germany doesn't get sole blame, and punished for it. but again, this would probably unmake billions of lives

Bagamak posted...

MrOnionHead posted...

This.

Unless Trump goes on to start a nuclear war or something, Hitler would be the obvious choice.

so to save 6 million lives you kill 6 billion?

No, just the one.
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MrOnionHead posted...

No, just the one.

your not getting it. your about to change history and possibly cause 6 billion people to never be born. including yourself.

also like i said, you need to go back to WW1. your thinking too small

If we prevent Hitler from being born...
...then we wouldnt have had the technology jump we had, and everything would be different.
Trump might not even be born, and if he was then he would be raised different and be a different person in a more lowtech world.
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Foppe posted...

If we prevent Hitler from being born...
...then we wouldnt have had the technology jump we had, and everything would be different.
Trump might not even be born, and if he was then he would be raised different and be a different person in a more lowtech world.

that's a good point. without WW2, I bet we wouldn't be as advanced in 2017 as we are. 2017 might be more like 1970 or something. WW2 created a big tech jump for the world

Foppe posted...

If we prevent Hitler from being born...
...then we wouldnt have had the technology jump we had, and everything would be different.
Trump might not even be born, and if he was then he would be raised different and be a different person in a more lowtech world.

So really, when you think about it, Hitler gave us Donnie. Can this dude get any worse!?
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Vindris_SNH posted...

WindMouseHanpan posted...

I'd rather deny Trump the presidency than save 6 million Jewish lives from death.

Lolno, I'm thinking of the bigger picture.

If those 6 million lives could be saved without completely altering history, of course I would do it. But, the fact is, if you eliminate Hitler and stop WW2, the entire world would change. History would take a completely different course, and no one can say it would be better because you never know what might happen. Like I said, what if someone even more mad than Hitler came into power? What if another country developed an even worse weapon than nukes, since America would never have had a need to develop them to bomb Japan? Not only that, many people who have helped shape the world and society may not have even been born. Technology might not even be remotely as advanced as it is now.

You could save 6 million lives, but what if a similar madman starts another WW2, and a holocaust that leads to the deaths of 15 million? Would you save 6 million people, only for 15 million more to die in an alternate history?

This is why you can't mess with history. You don't know how things will turn out, how such change could effect the future. I am by NO MEANS supporting the Holocaust or Hitler, it was an absolutely terrible thing, and one of the worst things in the history of the entire world. They were as far on the end of wrong as they could get. But, the fact is, it happened, and if you were to remove that part of history, there is no telling what the world today would be like. It is far too big of a risk, were it even possible to do it.
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I thought pro-abortion libs on here were fine with people never being born?
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WindMouseHanpan posted...

Vindris_SNH posted...

WindMouseHanpan posted...

I'd rather deny Trump the presidency than save 6 million Jewish lives from death.

Lolno, I'm thinking of the bigger picture.

If those 6 million lives could be saved without completely altering history, of course I would do it. But, the fact is, if you eliminate Hitler and stop WW2, the entire world would change. History would take a completely different course, and no one can say it would be better because you never know what might happen. Like I said, what if someone even more mad than Hitler came into power? What if another country developed an even worse weapon than nukes, since America would never have had a need to develop them to bomb Japan? Not only that, many people who have helped shape the world and society may not have even been born. Technology might not even be remotely as advanced as it is now.

You could save 6 million lives, but what if a similar madman starts another WW2, and a holocaust that leads to the deaths of 15 million? Would you save 6 million people, only for 15 million more to die in an alternate history?

This is why you can't mess with history. You don't know how things will turn out, how such change could effect the future. I am by NO MEANS supporting the Holocaust or Hitler, it was an absolutely terrible thing, and one of the worst things in the history of the entire world. They were as far on the end of wrong as they could get. But, the fact is, it happened, and if you were to remove that part of history, there is no telling what the world today would be like. It is far too big of a risk, were it even possible to do it.

all the history class sleepers will ignore this post. they just want to feel like heroes and they can't be bothered to actually think about the situation

Iron-Tarkus posted...

scorpion41 posted...

Are people seriously voting the second option?

Yes because

NibeIungsnarf posted...

Trump cause messing with current events is fine, but messing with history is stupid.

Yeah this was pretty much my reasoning.
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What kind of idiots would pick Trump over-

*looks at poll*

*sigh*

Never mind...
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DezCaughtIt posted...

Iron-Tarkus posted...

scorpion41 posted...

Are people seriously voting the second option?

Yes because

NibeIungsnarf posted...

Trump cause messing with current events is fine, but messing with history is stupid.

Yeah this was pretty much my reasoning.

But Trump is already part of History for many things including his presidency. Your logic is flawed.
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DepreceV2 posted...

DezCaughtIt posted...

Iron-Tarkus posted...

scorpion41 posted...

Are people seriously voting the second option?

Yes because

NibeIungsnarf posted...

Trump cause messing with current events is fine, but messing with history is stupid.

Yeah this was pretty much my reasoning.

But Trump is already part of History for many things including his presidency. Your logic is flawed.

Yeah but you're talking about like 9 months compared to decades upon decades

In an ideal situation I'd pick neither and leave shit alone.
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DepreceV2 posted...

DezCaughtIt posted...

Iron-Tarkus posted...

scorpion41 posted...

Are people seriously voting the second option?

Yes because

NibeIungsnarf posted...

Trump cause messing with current events is fine, but messing with history is stupid.

Yeah this was pretty much my reasoning.

But Trump is already part of History for many things including his presidency. Your logic is flawed.

The topic title is about his presidency. If you had to choose the safer choice is to mess with events ~2 years ago compared to nearly 80 years ago.
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the poll results make me hope no CEman ever gets access to a time machine. This board can't be trusted with time travel. they would think they were saving the world, and then destroy it out of ignorance

time travel should only ever be used for study. observe the past and change nothing.

I'd rather run the risk of changing the events of the past couple years then potentially fucking up the world.
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Trump is the obvious answer

You're altering a handful of years, not the entire 20th fucking century and the modern day
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Is there really, REALLY 112 people who favor the death of 6 million innocents over a man being in office for 4 years?

Disgusting.
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This is really the topic for showing who's too much of a fucking nerd and who isn't.
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MabusIncarnate posted...

Is there really, REALLY 112 people who favor the death of 6 million innocents over a man being in office for 4 years?

Disgusting.

Have you thought about the situation at all? Apply yourself a little. Its not hard @mabusincarnate
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Rika_Furude posted...

MabusIncarnate posted...

Is there really, REALLY 112 people who favor the death of 6 million innocents over a man being in office for 4 years?

Disgusting.

Have you thought about the situation at all? Apply yourself a little. Its not hard @mabusincarnate

I can't wrap my head around being the deciding factor knowing that many people would be tortured and murdered. I get it entirely, and who knows what happens beyond that moment in history if Hitler never existed, but to prevent the holocaust from happening? I couldn't live with myself.
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mortimerjames posted...

But heres the kicker, preventing Hitlers birth will change the timeline and crazy stuff can happen like a super Hitler is born or maybe a different guy just does exactly what Hitler did.

God this argument is annoying

I realize the whole time travel thing is also from movies, but stop basing arguments off of movies
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Why the fuck do people think things like "CAN'T CHANGE THE PAST, IT'LL DESTROY THE FUTURE!" or "BUTTERFLY EFFECT!" are actual measurable things that can be observed? You can't speculate that changing history will always lead to a worse possible outcome, simply because it's impossible to say either way. So the best you can do is look at the actions of something, this being Hitler's birth, and determine if changing that event is beneficial based on what we know. Speculation about the unknown and assumptions of a negative are absurd.
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MabusIncarnate posted...

I can't wrap my head around being the deciding factor knowing that many people would be tortured and murdered. I get it entirely, and who knows what happens beyond that moment in history if Hitler never existed, but to prevent the holocaust from happening? I couldn't live with myself.

way more people would never exist. in saving 6 million people, you erase 6 billion from existence. including yourself. the odds of you surviving the history change are astronomical so it's best to just assume you won't. this is why time travel is dangerous. people don't realize what they are doing when they try to change history. in almost every time travel story ever written, the main character changes something thinking they are doing good, and they only make it worse. you are not supposed to mess with the past.

Iron-Tarkus posted...

DepreceV2 posted...

DezCaughtIt posted...

Iron-Tarkus posted...

scorpion41 posted...

Are people seriously voting the second option?

Yes because

NibeIungsnarf posted...

Trump cause messing with current events is fine, but messing with history is stupid.

Yeah this was pretty much my reasoning.

But Trump is already part of History for many things including his presidency. Your logic is flawed.

The topic title is about his presidency. If you had to choose the safer choice is to mess with events ~2 years ago compared to nearly 80 years ago.

Oh I misread the topic. I thought it was death for either of them.
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Tezlok posted...

MabusIncarnate posted...

I can't wrap my head around being the deciding factor knowing that many people would be tortured and murdered. I get it entirely, and who knows what happens beyond that moment in history if Hitler never existed, but to prevent the holocaust from happening? I couldn't live with myself.

way more people would never exist. in saving 6 million people, you erase 6 billion from existence.

There's nothing that supports this claim or at the very least, it's not a fucking given. Quit pretending like it is.
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The Great Muta 22 posted...

Why the fuck do people think things like "CAN'T CHANGE THE PAST, IT'LL DESTROY THE FUTURE!" or "BUTTERFLY EFFECT!" are actual measurable things that can be observed? You can't speculate that changing history will always lead to a worse possible outcome, simply because it's impossible to say either way. So the best you can do is look at the actions of something, this being Hitler's birth, and determine if changing that event is beneficial based on what we know. Speculation about the unknown and assumptions of a negative are absurd.

we can tell that WW2 was a major impact on history that shaped the world we live in today. if you prevented it, and then came back to 2017, the world you returned to would be unrecognizable. assuming you even still existed to see it

Kineth posted...

There's nothing that supports this claim.

yes there is. we can predict the impact on people being born. lots of people were born in the aftermath of the events of WW2. if things happened differently, those people wouldnt be born. the parents wouldn't meet. them not being born would mean other later generations not being born and so on.