Poll of the Day > Does anyone else hate filling out job applications? The process is such a joke

(+) Yeah! (+)

Why do I have to make a user account that I'm never going to log into again?

Why do I have to fill out fields for things that everyone already has on their resume?

Why do they need to know my address or previous salary?

WHHHHHHHHHHHHHHYYYYYYYY

That's why I try to apply to things from Linkedin or websites like that.

I'm not sure why there's not a more universal program. But I have found that most of the jobs I apply for now are just looking for my resume.
---

I haven't had to do so in nearly 10 years now, but yes; I didn't exactly enjoy it.
---

I like to try to avoid those as much as I can, but sometimes it seems unavoidable. And some of the newer sites that are supposed to be breezier seem a little iffy; I've had bad experiences with random, shady companies getting my contact info.

I'd say the programs are pretty universal, in that only a small number of them are used by a wide variety of employers, but almost all of them suck ass. They look and operate like they haven't been updated for at least ten years. It's weird how there are so many arbitrary differences in what's required between companies since I'm convinced almost none of them actually configure their third-party ATS software, or at least none of them configure it well.

paper applications aren't too bad, but almost every internet application i've gone through pisses me off at some point.
---

Who the hell still does paper applications though?

Rockies posted...

Who the hell still does paper applications though?

a few places around where I live do. like I know rite aid does. and the more mom and pops type of businesses. hell one place here didn't even do applications lol they just gave you clip board with a piece of paper on it, and you added your name and phone number to a list of others who wanted a job there.
---

You could set up a LinkedIn profile. I don't know what kind of job you're seeking, but I often get messages from recruiters without having to send out applications.
---

It's generally only gotten worse with time. Many employers make applicants go through 2-3 hours of filling out forms, etc, in an application system to spare their HR departments -- already the most useless people in any given organization -- 2-3 minutes of screening out applicants. And while some systems like Indeed and Linkedin have jobs which either take the information from that service or just allow you to send in your resume, etc, at least some companies will require you to go through their own system.

Granted, if you're a low-level worker, you *could* find the systems useful because you could use that information to apply for multiple jobs at the company or at different locations. However, if you're a skilled professional, odds are that's the *last* time you're going to apply for a job there while your information is still relevant or while the information is still in their system.

Smarkil posted...

I'm not sure why there's not a more universal program. But I have found that most of the jobs I apply for now are just looking for my resume.

Because of logistical challenges, mostly. Either they're trying to accommodate outdated IT systems, outdated practices, or they're concerned about the information itself for some bizarre reason. In general, it *would* make a lot more sense to centralized under a handful of systems so people coming into your company -- particularly HR folk who, by and large, are the least competent and capable individuals in your organization.
---

ixfd64 posted...

You could set up a LinkedIn profile. I don't know what kind of job you're seeking, but I often get messages from recruiters without having to send out applications.

Eh, I think relying on recruiters finding you, like so much of job searching, is a rich get richer game. By that I mean that they're going to be more inclined to contact people who already have good jobs. They work for hiring companies, not candidates. It's their job to find a great candidate for a job, not a great job for a candidate. I have been contacted by them on LinkedIn before, but it's pretty rare, and even rarer that it's something I'm actually interested in.

Don't even get me started on personality and cognitive assessments

Your future employer is gonna love the way you whine about things
---

Mead posted...

Your future employer is gonna love the way you whine about things

Standard manual labor jobs are more tolerable than filling out paperwork for hours.
---

> find job on Indeed.com
> sift through all the fake recruiter ads
> find ad click on it
> have to sign uo for the site
> have to upload CV and cover letter
> put in ur details
> fill out pointless survey that takes 30 kin
> 250 words or less why you want to work here
> wait two weeks for an automated response
> find out your rejected

This is all for a minumum wage part time job at a super market btw
Even if u get an interview first it will be a group interview rhen after that a 1 on 1 interview

The job market is terrible atm

I don't even mind doing paperwork on the job that much, even if it's pointless. But the common job application process seems like something that doesn't benefit either side. All I want to do is give someone a resume to read, and I bet that all that most hiring managers want is to look over a resume. Why put a bunch of extra, redundant steps in both of our ways?

The reason they do this is so they fan say they advertised but couldnt find anyone, so they end up hiring a cheap immigrant or there friend

Look for jobs on Craigslist. For the most part, you will need to email your resume.
---

I think my favorite thing is when I continue to get rejections from places I applied to years ago.

"We appreciate your interest in the position in our organization, but unfortunately we've decided to move forward with another application. Please look for postings in the future".
---

Smarkil posted...

I think my favorite thing is when I continue to get rejections from places I applied to years ago.

"We appreciate your interest in the position in our organization, but unfortunately we've decided to move forward with another application. Please look for postings in the future".

i applied for a part time job at gamestop at the beginning of the year thinking i wanted to fill some time and make a little extra money. never heard anything from like february until last month when they asked me to reapply for a seasonal position.

i was like yeah no thanks.
---

Applying for jobs online is pointless and most companies ask you to apply online and they dont accept resume drop offs

Kislevic posted...

The reason they do this is so they fan say they advertised but couldnt find anyone, so they end up hiring a cheap immigrant or there friend

Huh? I'm aware that companies will sometimes put up junk postings just for the sake of due diligence, but that's a different issue that has nothing to do with why they need to use bad application systems.

Smarkil posted...

I think my favorite thing is when I continue to get rejections from places I applied to years ago.

"We appreciate your interest in the position in our organization, but unfortunately we've decided to move forward with another application. Please look for postings in the future".

Years sounds like a lot, but I've gotten ones like six to eight months after applying, and yeah, it's stupid. I already figured out that I wasn't going to get that job, so all they're doing is telling me that they probably don't have a high priority to fill postings on their site.

Rockies posted...

Kislevic posted...

The reason they do this is so they fan say they advertised but couldnt find anyone, so they end up hiring a cheap immigrant or there friend

Huh? I'm aware that companies will sometimes put up junk postings just for the sake of due diligence, but that's a different issue that has nothing to do with why they need to use bad application systems.

Smarkil posted...

I think my favorite thing is when I continue to get rejections from places I applied to years ago.

"We appreciate your interest in the position in our organization, but unfortunately we've decided to move forward with another application. Please look for postings in the future".

Years sounds like a lot, but I've gotten ones like six to eight months after applying, and yeah, it's stupid. I already figured out that I wasn't going to get that job, so all they're doing is telling me that they probably don't have a high priority to fill postings on their site.

reminds me once I got a call from a place (though separate location) a year after I had applied to a place. I liked to throw that in the managers face anytime he said "you came to us for a job, we didn't come to you" and always reply "actually you did come to me, I applied to the place closer my actual home, a year before you guys called up asking me to come to work here"
---

Applying for jobs in the bane of my existence.
---

I downloaded a form filler plugin so I could fill out most of every application with a single click.
---

Tell us more about this plugin ^
---

I got rid of it awhile back when I stopped needing it, but I think it was this one: https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/autofill-forms/?src=ss
---

Rockies posted...

Why do I have to make a user account that I'm never going to log into again?

because that's how authentication works. otherwise they could be spammed with applications from bots.

Rockies posted...

Why do I have to fill out fields for things that everyone already has on their resume?

probably because it will be entered into their HR database. resume is nice but it has to be read by a human.
---

How does that prevent them from being spammed by bots? They never do any kind of captcha, and I almost never see ones that require you to open a verification email. It's pointless to make an account. I don't care that I can "track" my application, because if it actually goes anywhere they'll just contact me directly.

They use programs to extract resume data, or at least to search resumes for keywords. Most of them do have some sort of resume extraction tool, although it never seems to put stuff in the right fields (which is why I'm apprehensive about using an autofill tool). But that's really not an excuse, their extraction software just sucks and is out of date. I'm sure modern software could easily extract resume data to the right place.

Also, what would even be the endgame of spamming a job application site? If it's to get a job, that's going to hurt you at some point if they find out. And how many different resumes can you really try out on one job?

Edit: Just thought of one possible reason, could come from third party recruiters submitting different candidates. But still, the point is these systems aren't robust enough to stop spam anyway

Rockies posted...

Also, what would even be the endgame of spamming a job application site? If it's to get a job, that's going to hurt you at some point if they find out. And how many different resumes can you really try out on one job?

whats the endgame of prank calls? or just doing dick things that don't gain you anything. some people just love pissing others off. not spamming but a relative of mine has been known to fill out fake applications to a place because she hated her boss.
---

Rockies posted...

ixfd64 posted...

You could set up a LinkedIn profile. I don't know what kind of job you're seeking, but I often get messages from recruiters without having to send out applications.

Eh, I think relying on recruiters finding you, like so much of job searching, is a rich get richer game. By that I mean that they're going to be more inclined to contact people who already have good jobs. They work for hiring companies, not candidates. It's their job to find a great candidate for a job, not a great job for a candidate. I have been contacted by them on LinkedIn before, but it's pretty rare, and even rarer that it's something I'm actually interested in.

More often Linkedin messages seem to take the forms of people trying to sell services, which in my case has taken the form of software packages.

Kislevic posted...

This is all for a minumum wage part time job at a super market btw
Even if u get an interview first it will be a group interview rhen after that a 1 on 1 interview

The job market is terrible atm

If you're doing that, you're better off talking to a manager *before* bothering to fill out anything.

Rockies posted...

I don't even mind doing paperwork on the job that much, even if it's pointless. But the common job application process seems like something that doesn't benefit either side. All I want to do is give someone a resume to read, and I bet that all that most hiring managers want is to look over a resume. Why put a bunch of extra, redundant steps in both of our ways?

It benefits the employer by pre-screening so they can spend less time on the hiring process. Granted, it often weeds out good candidates who aren't savvy when it comes to how things are done now so you aren't necessarily getting the best person for the job, but it can significantly cut down on man hours. Plus it ties into new EOE standards by looking at resumes "blind"

Kislevic posted...

Applying for jobs online is pointless and most companies ask you to apply online and they dont accept resume drop offs

Well, anything other than talking directly to the hiring manager -- preferably through networking -- is going to yield less-than-optimal results. However, that's how they conduct business and often find candidates so...

Rockies posted...

Also, what would even be the endgame of spamming a job application site? If it's to get a job, that's going to hurt you at some point if they find out. And how many different resumes can you really try out on one job?

Edit: Just thought of one possible reason, could come from third party recruiters submitting different candidates. But still, the point is these systems aren't robust enough to stop spam anyway

I *think* there are automation packages which recognize variable information and tailor your content to match, such as editing your resume slightly to reflect you're applying for something else (as opposed to the old way of spamming it then having the wrong title listed)
---

It's hard in my area to actually talk to the hiring manager because everyone says to apply online, so we're all just faceless applicants to these companies and I'm fairly certain I'm not going to win in a credentials battle against 100 other people.

Ultima_Dragoon posted...

It's hard in my area to actually talk to the hiring manager because everyone says to apply online, so we're all just faceless applicants to these companies and I'm fairly certain I'm not going to win in a credentials battle against 100 other people.

well at the very least you can ask if they are currently hiring before applying. I generally try to ask around to see whos hiring first so I can prioritize who I apply to first. i'll eventually apply everywhere I think I got any shot of working. but I start with those currently looking for new workers.
---

Rockies posted...

How does that prevent them from being spammed by bots? They never do any kind of captcha, and I almost never see ones that require you to open a verification email. It's pointless to make an account. I don't care that I can "track" my application, because if it actually goes anywhere they'll just contact me directly.

well I can't speak to any particular case. setting up an account is just how default authentication works. if you're saying the account is useless, then maybe it's useless.

Rockies posted...

They use programs to extract resume data, or at least to search resumes for keywords. Most of them do have some sort of resume extraction tool, although it never seems to put stuff in the right fields (which is why I'm apprehensive about using an autofill tool). But that's really not an excuse, their extraction software just sucks and is out of date. I'm sure modern software could easily extract resume data to the right place.

unless you're filling out a form, an "extraction tool" will never be completely accurate. again, this depends on the case. if you write up a resume from scratch there's no guarantee they can electronically parse it. if you fill out a .pdf or something that they gave you, or follow some particular rules they have about how it's formatted, then maybe they could.

but filling out a web form, they will get entries directly in their database filled in exactly how they want it.

Rockies posted...

Also, what would even be the endgame of spamming a job application site? If it's to get a job, that's going to hurt you at some point if they find out. And how many different resumes can you really try out on one job?

I take it you don't realize how... virulent... the internet is? setting up a public website is just asking to be inundated by spam-bots. there's no motive, this stuff is just everywhere. make something public and vulnerable and it's only a matter of time before something or someone finds it and exploits it.

Rockies posted...

Edit: Just thought of one possible reason, could come from third party recruiters submitting different candidates. But still, the point is these systems aren't robust enough to stop spam anyway

I'd have to see a particular example.
---

Ultima_Dragoon posted...

It's hard in my area to actually talk to the hiring manager because everyone says to apply online, so we're all just faceless applicants to these companies and I'm fairly certain I'm not going to win in a credentials battle against 100 other people.

When people tell you to talk to the hiring manager, they mean that you should do it directly and circumvent the applications entirely. When I first heard that I was like "Damn, I can't believe nobody told me this earlier!" and got all excited to try out a new approach, but it's a much better practice in theory than in reality.

The advice I've read tends to tell you to look for the hiring manager in the company directory, but almost no company has a public-facing directory. You might be lucky to find the top-level management team, but that doesn't help you much. Then failing that, the next biggest thing I see is to look at LinkedIn, but it's virtually impossible to find a hiring manager there. Even if the company has like 50 people you'll probably find four or five people with the same likely job title and no way to tell which is the right one. That's not even accounting for the fact that not everyone uses LinkedIn or keeps it up to date, and that you have to pay for premium to message somebody unless you can get them to connect first.