Current Events > Do you truly believe da Alt Right and Antifa are EQUALLY as bad?

(+) Yeah! (+)

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gunplagirl posted...

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gunplagirl posted...

So you completely missed the BANNED IN EUROPE part and how we still pursue the former leaders with world courts?

Yeah, I disagree with censorship or persecuting political dissidents, sorry bud.

So you're okay with radical islamists showing up to your city and holding a rally calling for your death?

And it's only persecution of political dissidents if you are giving them the benefit of referring to their belief system as a valid political view. It really isn't in any sense. Incidentally, by allowing them to espouse their views without push back, you get situations like Charlottesville.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2843539/UC-Berkeley-students-ignore-Fox-commentator-waving-ISIS-flag-ATTACK-waves-Israeli-flag.html

=/

More than 1,000 people were at Charlottesville, do they all deserve to go to jail or be killed for exercising First Amendment rights?

Free speech protects left, right, and everyone.

Just the ones who were doing Nazis salutes, chanting blood or soil or otherwise beating black people to a pulp.

Speaking of which, I am sure you know exactly why those attackers never got charged.
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Ammonitida posted...

Newhopes posted...

gunplagirl posted...

CarlGrimes posted...

Commies and nazis are different sides of the same coin.

Communism: support everyone in society and provide for them
Nazis: create a white ethnostate that won't provide for the poor whites who are not murdered

For other totally asinine statements, see also
Tacos and skyscrapers are different sides of the same coin

Correction.

Communism: everybody starves togethor or at least the normal people.

Nazis=Fascist and despite your racist beliefs isn't confined to whites.

Unlike Nazism, there's nothing inherently evil about Communism.

Communists mass butchered Nationalists and Clergymen during the Spanish Civil War.

It's disgusting if you're going to be like, "well, they deserved it for being nationalists".

That's not because of Communist ideology, it's because of the power hungry/paranoid leaders.

Thing is, the alt right is mostly a fabrication made by the left to excuse their violence.

Restrain posted...

Ammonitida posted...

Newhopes posted...

gunplagirl posted...

CarlGrimes posted...

Commies and nazis are different sides of the same coin.

Communism: support everyone in society and provide for them
Nazis: create a white ethnostate that won't provide for the poor whites who are not murdered

For other totally asinine statements, see also
Tacos and skyscrapers are different sides of the same coin

Correction.

Communism: everybody starves togethor or at least the normal people.

Nazis=Fascist and despite your racist beliefs isn't confined to whites.

Unlike Nazism, there's nothing inherently evil about Communism.

Communists mass butchered Nationalists and Clergymen during the Spanish Civil War.

It's disgusting if you're going to be like, "well, they deserved it for being nationalists".

So here's the thing about " inherently"

I've never seen any communist how to text that actually states "kill the clergy and kill nationalists"

While communists may have done such things, it isn't INHERENT to the concept of communist thought.
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KazumaKiryu posted...

Thing is, the alt right is mostly a fabrication made by the left to excuse their violence.

You sound like the kind who worries about chemtrails if you believe this
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gunplagirl posted...

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gunplagirl posted...

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gunplagirl posted...

So you completely missed the BANNED IN EUROPE part and how we still pursue the former leaders with world courts?

Yeah, I disagree with censorship or persecuting political dissidents, sorry bud.

So you're okay with radical islamists showing up to your city and holding a rally calling for your death?

And it's only persecution of political dissidents if you are giving them the benefit of referring to their belief system as a valid political view. It really isn't in any sense. Incidentally, by allowing them to espouse their views without push back, you get situations like Charlottesville.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2843539/UC-Berkeley-students-ignore-Fox-commentator-waving-ISIS-flag-ATTACK-waves-Israeli-flag.html

=/

More than 1,000 people were at Charlottesville, do they all deserve to go to jail or be killed for exercising First Amendment rights?

Free speech protects left, right, and everyone.

Just the ones who were doing Nazis salutes, chanting blood or soil or otherwise beating black people to a pulp.

Speaking of which, I am sure you know exactly why those attackers never got charged.

They in fact all got charged (one white guy, one Hispanic, one black), including the black victim who actually landed the first blows.

gunplagirl posted...

Restrain posted...

Ammonitida posted...

Newhopes posted...

gunplagirl posted...

CarlGrimes posted...

Commies and nazis are different sides of the same coin.

Communism: support everyone in society and provide for them
Nazis: create a white ethnostate that won't provide for the poor whites who are not murdered

For other totally asinine statements, see also
Tacos and skyscrapers are different sides of the same coin

Correction.

Communism: everybody starves togethor or at least the normal people.

Nazis=Fascist and despite your racist beliefs isn't confined to whites.

Unlike Nazism, there's nothing inherently evil about Communism.

Communists mass butchered Nationalists and Clergymen during the Spanish Civil War.

It's disgusting if you're going to be like, "well, they deserved it for being nationalists".

So here's the thing about " inherently"

I've never seen any communist how to text that actually states "kill the clergy and kill nationalists"

While communists may have done such things, it isn't INHERENT to the concept of communist thought.

That's a poor excuse. Ideas don't kill people, people do.

You don't get to make excuses to absolve your side of all responsibility for their actions, you simply have to own up to them and promise to do better. But antifa acts similarly to all the bad communists in the past, they're nothing like Zizek or Chomsky.

TC is a confirmed troll. Literally portrays a muslim woman killed by an illegal from El Salvador as an alt-right murder.

http://edition.cnn.com/2017/06/19/us/muslim-teen-killed-trnd/index.html

Why is this topic not moderated yet?
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Terrorist style car attack > Some asshole being beat with a bikelock (Seriously snowflakes love this story)

The right declared a full blown crusade against a bikelock
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gunplagirl posted...

Restrain posted...

Ammonitida posted...

Newhopes posted...

gunplagirl posted...

CarlGrimes posted...

Commies and nazis are different sides of the same coin.

Communism: support everyone in society and provide for them
Nazis: create a white ethnostate that won't provide for the poor whites who are not murdered

For other totally asinine statements, see also
Tacos and skyscrapers are different sides of the same coin

Correction.

Communism: everybody starves togethor or at least the normal people.

Nazis=Fascist and despite your racist beliefs isn't confined to whites.

Unlike Nazism, there's nothing inherently evil about Communism.

Communists mass butchered Nationalists and Clergymen during the Spanish Civil War.

It's disgusting if you're going to be like, "well, they deserved it for being nationalists".

So here's the thing about " inherently"

I've never seen any communist how to text that actually states "kill the clergy and kill nationalists"

While communists may have done such things, it isn't INHERENT to the concept of communist thought.

That's a poor excuse. Ideas don't kill people, people do.

You don't get to make excuses to absolve your side of all responsibility for their actions, you simply have to own up to them and promise to do better. But antifa acts similarly to all the bad communists in the past, they're nothing like Zizek or Chomsky.

And those people are motivated by those ideals. Without those ideas to push them, most would never kill or want to kill others. But go on doing what you just did. Defending Nazism by downplaying it.
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gunplagirl posted...

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gunplagirl posted...

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Ammonitida posted...

Unlike Nazism, there's nothing inherently evil about Communism.

Communists mass butchered Nationalists and Clergymen during the Spanish Civil War.

It's disgusting if you're going to be like, "well, they deserved it for being nationalists".

So here's the thing about " inherently"

I've never seen any communist how to text that actually states "kill the clergy and kill nationalists"

While communists may have done such things, it isn't INHERENT to the concept of communist thought.

That's a poor excuse. Ideas don't kill people, people do.

You don't get to make excuses to absolve your side of all responsibility for their actions, you simply have to own up to them and promise to do better. But antifa acts similarly to all the bad communists in the past, they're nothing like Zizek or Chomsky.

And those people are motivated by those ideals. Without those ideas to push them, most would never kill or want to kill others. But go on doing what you just did. Defending Nazism by downplaying it.

I'm not downplaying anything. Violence, hatred, and censorship are bad regardless of what side it comes. You should be able to divorce yourself from your political biases (to whatever extent possible, since we all have biases) and judge all factions as an impartial observer.

Restrain posted...

I'm not downplaying anything. Violence, hatred, and censorship are bad regardless of what side it comes. You should be able to divorce yourself from your political biases (to whatever extent possible, since we all have biases) and judge all factions as an impartial observer.

If only you could do that

Anyway, I take issue with a lot of what Antifa does and how they behave, but they are nowhere near as bad as the alt-right.

Anyone who tries to pretend otherwise is deluding themselves.
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1. What does alt-right mean? Who are you talking about?
2. Antifa is a start up of an old communist party in Germany, so i know what they are about.

Where's the option of: this is a stupid poll without right answers.
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spincr posted...

1. What does alt-right mean? Who are you talking about?
2. Antifa is a start up of an old communist party in Germany, so i know what they are about.

I like how what you're leading into with #1 is that the alt-right is a vague nebulous term for a large group of people, yet with #2 are implying that the current modern incarnation of Antifa that's been growing since the election last year, is the same as this old communist party from the Weimar Republic

spincr posted...

In 2000, Norad had 67 Intercepts, 100% accuracy. On 9/11 they failed 4 times in 1 day. In 2015 over 162 000 refugee's entered Sweden, 494 of them got a job.

oh wait your sig explains everything i need to know about you lol
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Doom_Art posted...

Restrain posted...

I'm not downplaying anything. Violence, hatred, and censorship are bad regardless of what side it comes. You should be able to divorce yourself from your political biases (to whatever extent possible, since we all have biases) and judge all factions as an impartial observer.

If only you could do that

Anyway, I take issue with a lot of what Antifa does and how they behave, but they are nowhere near as bad as the alt-right.

Anyone who tries to pretend otherwise is deluding themselves.

The alt-right isn't considered a terrorist movement, though.

http://www.politico.com/story/2017/09/01/antifa-charlottesville-violence-fbi-242235

The argument "they do worse stuff but for a less bad cause" doesn't really resonate me, cause I focus on actions, not ideas, and however much you may disagree with the right, they don't wear masks and organize to wreak violence upon their political enemies.

Like, the Tea Party was able to protest the Obama Administration without victimizing the other side, and the establishment called them a lot of worse things than they call antifa. You never had Don Lemon on CNN go "yeah some of the Tea Party's tactics may be mistaken, but it's for a good cause".

gunplagirl posted...

KazumaKiryu posted...

Thing is, the alt right is mostly a fabrication made by the left to excuse their violence.

You sound like the kind who worries about chemtrails if you believe this

Ha yeah and your first post here is talking about people getting punched for being Nazis. Who decides that they're Nazis though? Oh, you do! Everyone who is not on your side can be labeled as a Nazi and then you feel you have the right to punch them! What a wonderful racket you have going.

Restrain posted...

The alt-right isn't considered a terrorist movement, though.

That's nice?

Take a look at who's in office right now and where their support comes from lol.

Which group has killed people, again? I don't recall Antifa ramming a car into a crowd or firing guns at groups of people.

Hmmm

Restrain posted...

The argument "they do worse stuff but for a less bad cause"

the argument is they do not.

Drop your bias for a moment and look at this rationally yo

Restrain posted...

nd however much you may disagree with the right, they don't wear masks and organize to wreak violence upon their political enemies.

i mean I'm not sure how the alt-right marching with torches, chanting "blood and soil", damaging property, and committing terror attacks against counter protesters is much of an improvement.

Even if their faces aren't covered :P
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Doom_Art posted...

Take a look at who's in office right now and where their support comes from lol.

...

It's kind of silly to say "they just throw a few punches" or that "they haven't killed anyone" as if it's due to Antifa having some sort of morals.

They did bash that guy in the head with bike lock, they've thrown bricks and rocks at people and they have beaten people. Fortunately, no one has died from them yet in the U.S., but it's certainly not due them being unwilling to use potentially lethal levels of violence.
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What? You think Trump or the administration he leads is going to condemn their base or (rightfully) mark them as a terror group (which after the last several attacks is more than justified)?
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Doom_Art posted...

condemn their base

You want him to call Republican voters Nazis?

Lolwut?

DifferentialEquation posted...

It's kind of silly to say "they just throw a few punches" or that "they haven't killed anyone" as if it's due to Antifa having some sort of morals.

They did bash that guy in the head with bike lock, they've thrown bricks and rocks at people and they have beaten people. Fortunately, no one has died from them yet in the U.S., but it's certainly not due them being unwilling to use potentially lethal levels of violence.

I mean if you put "dorky teenager wailing on someone with a bike lock" next to "guy driving car into crowd of people" or "guys firing guns into a crowd" I know which one I'd think is worse
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Restrain posted...

You want him to call Republican voters Nazis?

where did I say that
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Doom_Art posted...

DifferentialEquation posted...

It's kind of silly to say "they just throw a few punches" or that "they haven't killed anyone" as if it's due to Antifa having some sort of morals.

They did bash that guy in the head with bike lock, they've thrown bricks and rocks at people and they have beaten people. Fortunately, no one has died from them yet in the U.S., but it's certainly not due them being unwilling to use potentially lethal levels of violence.

I mean if you put "dorky teenager wailing on someone with a bike lock" next to "guy driving car into crowd of people" or "guys firing guns into a crowd" I know which one I'd think is worse

Replace dorky teenager with dude in an institutional position of power to spread his ideas to hundreds of dorky young adults, and you got it, dude.

Doom_Art posted...

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You want him to call Republican voters Nazis?

where did I say that

Doom_Art posted...

You think Trump or the administration he leads is going to condemn their base

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Replace dorky teenager with dude in an institutional position of power to spread his ideas to hundreds of dorky young adults, and you got it, dude.

I'm sure you think this is a nice clever "gotcha" line, but I'm a bit confused as to how you arrived here, and what this is supposed to change.
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Doom_Art posted...

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You want him to call Republican voters Nazis?

where did I say that

Doom_Art posted...

You think Trump or the administration he leads is going to condemn their base

alt-right =/= republicans

grow a brain, yo
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Doom_Art posted...

Restrain posted...

Replace dorky teenager with dude in an institutional position of power to spread his ideas to hundreds of dorky young adults, and you got it, dude.

I'm sure you think this is a nice clever "gotcha" line, but I'm a bit confused as to how you arrived here, and what this is supposed to change.

What do you think the word professor means

Okay so the person in question was a professor? That's interesting, and we could've arrived here quicker had you just said so instead of trying to be clever with it.

Anyway, that's fucking shit yo. Well below the standard for a professor.

But I fail to see how this is equatable with ramming or firing into a crowd
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Extremists who resort to violence over words or hate people because of their identities are bad people regardless of what their political affiliation is.
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Doom_Art posted...

Okay so the person in question was a professor? That's interesting, and we could've arrived here quicker had you just said so instead of trying to be clever with it.

Anyway, that's fucking shit yo. Well below the standard for a professor.

But I fail to see how this is equatable with ramming or firing into a crowd

No one said it is. But the car accident was genuinely an isolated incident while antifa has a pattern of organized violence and has support from people in positions of power, from educators to celebrities and pundits.

Channels that make Antifa propaganda such as Vox or TYT are still monetized on YouTube despite it being pretty much impossible to get ads on political content these days.

Even John McCain and Mitt Romney supported Antifa.

Restrain posted...

But the car accident was genuinely an isolated incident

and the vandalism, harassment, assaults, and the gunshots?

it's not an isolated incident, yo. The alt-right is violent.
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KazumaKiryu posted...

gunplagirl posted...

KazumaKiryu posted...

Thing is, the alt right is mostly a fabrication made by the left to excuse their violence.

You sound like the kind who worries about chemtrails if you believe this

Ha yeah and your first post here is talking about people getting punched for being Nazis. Who decides that they're Nazis though? Oh, you do! Everyone who is not on your side can be labeled as a Nazi and then you feel you have the right to punch them! What a wonderful racket you have going.

If they're waving swastikas and heiling Hitler I'm 100% sure they're a Nazi. And if they are just joking then they have a terrible sense of humor.
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gunplagirl posted...

If they're waving swastikas and heiling Hitler I'm 100% sure they're a Nazi. And if they are just joking then they have a terrible sense of humor.

"I was there but I wasn't a Nazi"

if you're part of a group that starts chanting "blood and soil" and wearing nazi/fascist heraldry, and you don't walk away...

...guess what that makes you? :o

I was shocked that some people actually used that excuse.
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Most groups can have any connotation the speaker chooses so long as terms are kept vague enough.

And vague terminology has only been increasing in this reactionary age of social media and news ratings.
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-Gavirulax- posted...

Siaperaz posted...

TC is a confirmed troll. Literally portrays a muslim woman killed by an illegal from El Salvador as an alt-right murder.

http://edition.cnn.com/2017/06/19/us/muslim-teen-killed-trnd/index.html

Why is this topic not moderated yet?

I have no idea if Vegy actually made that image (if he did then shame on him) or if he just reposted it because he thought it was a gotcha/witty image.

But I suspected as much, interesting.

I already pointed this out. And the two white men were killed by a Bernie supporter who was anti-organized religion.

Doom_Art posted...

Restrain posted...

But the car accident was genuinely an isolated incident

and the vandalism, harassment, assaults, and the gunshots?

it's not an isolated incident, yo. The alt-right is violent.

But do they dress like ISIS and invade left-wing events for the express purpose of silencing free speech and beating the shit out of socialists and minorities?

I'm not defending them or pretending they're not violent. But you specifically said they're worse, which implies a symmetry of violent actions plus then some. It's only Antifa that specifically had their activities designated as domestic terrorism by government agencies, and that was under the Obama Administration.

Doom_Art posted...

gunplagirl posted...

If they're waving swastikas and heiling Hitler I'm 100% sure they're a Nazi. And if they are just joking then they have a terrible sense of humor.

"I was there but I wasn't a Nazi"

if you're part of a group that starts chanting "blood and soil" and wearing nazi/fascist heraldry, and you don't walk away...

...guess what that makes you? :o

I was shocked that some people actually used that excuse.

I was shocked that not only CNN but even Republican politicians used the same excuse, except in reverse, to defend the Communist agitators.

Restrain posted...

But do they dress like ISIS

what does this have to do with anything

Restrain posted...

and invade left-wing events for the express purpose of silencing free speech and beating the shit out of socialists and minorities?

yes? that's literally exactly what they do to people who protest them

Restrain posted...

I'm not defending them or pretending they're not violent

that's exactly what you're doing
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No

The alt right is racist, white supremacist, xenophobic, nativist, evil.

Antifa is a reactionary movement that intends to combat the above. It's shades of gray.

Malcolm_McGuffi posted...

No

The alt right is racist, white supremacist, xenophobic, nativist, evil.

Antifa is a reactionary movement that intends to combat the above. It's shades of gray.

What about the 'cuck-brigade' and 'alt-left' though ROD?
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Doom_Art posted...

what does this have to do with anything

It's how they blend into a group and protect their comrades from facing consequences for their violent crimes. It's called aiding & abetting.

Doom_Art posted...

yes? that's literally exactly what they do to people who protest them

No, defending yourself from people who crashed your event for the express purpose of committing violence isn't the same as invading another group's event and punching people or attacking them with weapons.

Obviously, some people on the right will throw the first punch, and that's not okay, but you're downplaying the fact that antifa for over a year has deliberately targeted Trump supporters, conservatives, Christians, right-wing libertarians, and nationalists at their rallies, and has even committed hate crimes against people simply based on race.

Throwing rocks at people, throwing acid in their faces or spraying them with bear mace, attacking them with biological weapons (human waste) is not peaceful protest, and if you're going to claim that conservatives have to live with guilt by association when a crazy guy with a nazi flag shows up with their rallies, then the peaceful protesters who align themselves with violent terrorists are also making a mistake by those standards.

You can't name an example of the right acting the way antifa does in recent times, since it simply hasn't happened (yet, thank God).

Restrain posted...

I was shocked that not only CNN but even Republican politicians used the same excuse, except in reverse, to defend the Communist agitators.

It's harder to use that excuse for the alt-right and nazis, because as someone above pointed out, Antifa (while it definitely skews left) is mostly a reactionary movement. It's not based off a political ideal in the same sense that the alt-right is.

Hence why you calling them "communists" falls flat.
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Doom_Art posted...

is mostly a reactionary movement.

Both of them are. They're reacting to each other.

Antifa are merely radicalized SJWs.

Restrain posted...

ou can't name an example of the right acting the way antifa does in recent times, since it simply hasn't happened

i've literally done that several times in this topic

drop your bias for a moment and take a look at this, yo
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Doom_Art posted...

Restrain posted...

ou can't name an example of the right acting the way antifa does in recent times, since it simply hasn't happened

i've literally done that several times in this topic

drop your bias for a moment and take a look at this, yo

I'll settle for one specific example.

KazumaKiryu posted...

gunplagirl posted...

KazumaKiryu posted...

Thing is, the alt right is mostly a fabrication made by the left to excuse their violence.

You sound like the kind who worries about chemtrails if you believe this

Ha yeah and your first post here is talking about people getting punched for being Nazis. Who decides that they're Nazis though? Oh, you do! Everyone who is not on your side can be labeled as a Nazi and then you feel you have the right to punch them! What a wonderful racket you have going.

The Nazis labeled themselves. The alt-right being associated with nazis isn't a mere accident, they called themselves that to disguise their identity.
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Driving that car into that crowd was p damn violent

imo of course
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Doom_Art posted...

DifferentialEquation posted...

It's kind of silly to say "they just throw a few punches" or that "they haven't killed anyone" as if it's due to Antifa having some sort of morals.

They did bash that guy in the head with bike lock, they've thrown bricks and rocks at people and they have beaten people. Fortunately, no one has died from them yet in the U.S., but it's certainly not due them being unwilling to use potentially lethal levels of violence.

I mean if you put "dorky teenager wailing on someone with a bike lock" next to "guy driving car into crowd of people" or "guys firing guns into a crowd" I know which one I'd think is worse

Where did I mention the neo nazis or the alt right anywhere? You don't need to convince me how horrible it is for someone to drive their car into a crowd of people or to shoot at random people. But apparently you do need to be convinced that it's horrible to assault people with unconventional deadly weapons like bricks and bike locks. If you want to be consistent, then you should pretty much never criticize anyone again because apparently clearing the bar of being "not as bad as Nazis" (which is bar that pretty much everyone does clear) is enough for you to rush to their defense.
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