Current Events > Wait, so Fox canceled Brooklyn Nine-Nine but... is it keeping Lucifer?

(+) Yeah! (+)

I mean B99 was kind of dwindling in quality (but as an NBC level comedy it's better than 90% of the shit on TV) but if they decide to keep Lucifer then... well that's actually pretty Fox of them.

I mean I actually watch Lucifer in that "good god this procedural crap is derivative and awful but I'm in too deep now" so I'm just curious what Fox's decision will be.
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Thought I saw that on the canceled list too
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I haven't seen it on the list yet
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Not officially ruled on yet
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I need to just make a TV Production Economics thread at the beginning of May so I can reference it...

Anyway relevant facts time:

Lucifer is a WB produced show in its third season. It's most recent episode scored a 0.7 in the 18-49 demo. It has an average of .83 in the 18-49 for the season. Despite it being it's third season and it being produced by an outside production studio (which normally guarantees a renewal), it's 13 episode first season means a normal length 22 episode season will leave it short of the magic 88 episode number. It's still close though which means WB has incentive to license it to Fox for cheap, increasing it's renewal chances. Furthermore WB has a very strong streaming focus on it's shows and might be willing to take a loss on actual licensing revenue. For reference, WB's own channel, the CW, operates entirely on a loss in service to streaming contracts.

B99 is an NBCU produced show in its fifth season. It's most recent episode scored a 0.7 in the 18-49 demo and it has a season average of .73 in that demo. It will have aired 110 episodes at the end of this season putting it well over the syndication number and thus NBCU does not have an incentive to slash licensing fees. This means Fox would get no real discount for airing the series. When a show gets low ratings and the broadcast channel is neither getting it for cheap or any ownership stake in the series, it is likely to get cancelled. Which B99 did.

As a side-note: Quality of programming is completely irrelevant to a network outside of putting it in a promo. A show could win awards left and right and it'll still get cancelled if it doesn't actually make money.
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Nobody on Lucifer is a particularly big name so I'm sure they're accepting peanuts for a steady gig. And not like any money is going towards writing.

Gheb posted...

I need to just make a TV Production Economics thread at the beginning of May so I can reference it...

you literally should

go in depth about Netflix' increasing willingness to ax shows after only 1 or 2 seasons -- I remember prior to last year nearly all of their originals had run at least 3 seasons, but that definitely isn't the case any more
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Gheb posted...

I need to just make a TV Production Economics thread at the beginning of May so I can reference it...

Anyway relevant facts time:

Lucifer is a WB produced show in its third season. It's most recent episode scored a 0.7 in the 18-49 demo. It has an average of .83 in the 18-49 for the season. Despite it being it's third season and it being produced by an outside production studio (which normally guarantees a renewal), it's 13 episode first season means a normal length 22 episode season will leave it short of the magic 88 episode number. It's still close though which means WB has incentive to license it to Fox for cheap, increasing it's renewal chances. Furthermore WB has a very strong streaming focus on it's shows and might be willing to take a loss on actual licensing revenue. For reference, WB's own channel, the CW, operates entirely on a loss in service to streaming contracts.

B99 is an NBCU produced show in its fifth season. It's most recent episode scored a 0.7 in the 18-49 demo and it has a season average of .73 in that demo. It will have aired 110 episodes at the end of this season putting it well over the syndication number and thus NBCU does not have an incentive to slash licensing fees. This means Fox would get no real discount for airing the series. When a show gets low ratings and the broadcast channel is neither getting it for cheap or any ownership stake in the series, it is likely to get cancelled. Which B99 did.

As a side-note: Quality of programming is completely irrelevant to a network outside of putting it in a promo. A show could win rewards left and right and it'll still get cancelled if it doesn't actually make money.

You mean awards possibly? Also quality has never really been a guarantee for success, as can be seen with Firefly and Arrested Development. In fact it's just the opposite, as can be seen with... christ, too numerous to name.
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Balrog0 posted...

Gheb posted...

I need to just make a TV Production Economics thread at the beginning of May so I can reference it...

you literally should

go in depth about Netflix' increasing willingness to ax shows after only 1 or 2 seasons -- I remember prior to last year nearly all of their originals had run at least 3 seasons, but that definitely isn't the case any more

What of their shows have been canceled? Or rather I should say unjustly canceled.
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this show made me lol hard

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zRsIdsu07OY" data-time="

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AOz77lOs7Qg" data-time="
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HBOSS posted...

this show made me lol hard

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zRsIdsu07OY" data-time="

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AOz77lOs7Qg" data-time="

holy crap i didnt even realize that was a callback
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saspa posted...

What of their shows have been canceled? Or rather I should say unjustly canceled.

idk about unjust

Everything Sucks!, Lady Dynamite, Haters Back Off, and Disjointed all got cancelled this year, though iirc
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Balrog0 posted...

Gheb posted...

I need to just make a TV Production Economics thread at the beginning of May so I can reference it...

you literally should

go in depth about Netflix' increasing willingness to ax shows after only 1 or 2 seasons -- I remember prior to last year nearly all of their originals had run at least 3 seasons, but that definitely isn't the case any more

Nobody really understands Netflix's operations since they don't release viewership numbers, which makes prediction extraordinary difficult. But the big change you noted goes back to about a year ago when Netflix publicly announced they were going to actually start cancelling shows. Before then Netflix seemingly just threw money at their original content regardless of viewership (as far as we can tell given that they don't disclose viewership). But with their now entirely gung-ho focus on Netflix originals (I think 80% of their program spending now goes to original content), Netflix now can be choosy and has a financial need to do so.

As for what gets cancelled and why, that's hard to say. The first first major cancellations Marco Polo, Sense8 and The Get Down made sense. Those shows each had about a $9+ million per episode cost. The viewership would have to be insane to make those profitable. In lieu of viewership numbers, you can look at media buzz in which those shows had little. On the flip side the Crown also has outrageous $130m budget but not a lot of media buzz around it but it chugging along just fine. Though it is worth noting that it is a critical darling and does well in the award shows. Unlike broadcast channels, Netflix does care about those because the image of Streaming TV being just as good as premium television is important to Netflix.
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Balrog0 posted...

saspa posted...

What of their shows have been canceled? Or rather I should say unjustly canceled.

idk about unjust

Everything Sucks!, Lady Dynamite, Haters Back Off, and Disjointed all got cancelled this year, though iirc

aw was looking foward to everything sucks season2
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Balrog0 posted...

saspa posted...

What of their shows have been canceled? Or rather I should say unjustly canceled.

idk about unjust

Everything Sucks!, Lady Dynamite, Haters Back Off, and Disjointed all got cancelled this year, though iirc

I would say that Unbreakable Kimmy Schmidt ending with it's fourth season is Netflix's biggest cancellation of the year. It was their first real hit when it came to comedy and actually caries media buzz and get award considerations. That said, nobody knows if it is ending because Fey and co. wants it to end or ending because Netflix cancelled it. We probably won't know until after all of season 4 ends because it isn't in Netflix or show's interest to have that press surrounding it beforehand.
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Gheb posted...

Balrog0 posted...

saspa posted...

What of their shows have been canceled? Or rather I should say unjustly canceled.

idk about unjust

Everything Sucks!, Lady Dynamite, Haters Back Off, and Disjointed all got cancelled this year, though iirc

I would say that Unbreakable Kimmy Schmidt ending with it's fourth season is Netflix's biggest cancellation of the year. It was their first real hit when it came to comedy and actually caries media buzz and get award considerations. That said, nobody knows if it is ending because Fey and co. wants it to end or ending because Netflix cancelled it. We probably won't know until after all of season 4 ends because it isn't in Netflix or show's interest to have that press surrounding it beforehand.

To me it sounds like a mutual decision since they're also doing a movie after season 4. edit - that's mainly why I didn't list it, at least, in addition to the fact it has run a bit longer
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Last Man on Earth was canceled. and that ended on a major cliffhanger
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the actor who plays lucifer is fantastic
also its cool that the series has a bisexual male lead (yes an episode confirms lucifer swings both ways)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XWT8XaQsn08" data-time="
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Balrog0 posted...

Gheb posted...

Balrog0 posted...

saspa posted...

What of their shows have been canceled? Or rather I should say unjustly canceled.

idk about unjust

Everything Sucks!, Lady Dynamite, Haters Back Off, and Disjointed all got cancelled this year, though iirc

I would say that Unbreakable Kimmy Schmidt ending with it's fourth season is Netflix's biggest cancellation of the year. It was their first real hit when it came to comedy and actually caries media buzz and get award considerations. That said, nobody knows if it is ending because Fey and co. wants it to end or ending because Netflix cancelled it. We probably won't know until after all of season 4 ends because it isn't in Netflix or show's interest to have that press surrounding it beforehand.

To me it sounds like a mutual decision since they're also doing a movie after season 4. edit - that's mainly why I didn't list it, at least, in addition to the fact it has run a bit longer

That's also my guess. It's also reasonably cheap as well and I would imagine Netflix wouldn't want to sour relationships with someone as important in the sitcom business as Fey/Carlock. Of course if you look at the other cancellations, it does look like Netflix just might not be feeling the sitcom vibe. Which makes some sense as a sitcoms rely considerably more on cultural references and language quirks which make them less lucrative internationally.
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tag
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Did it need confirming though when it's rather obviously stated? He's the devil, and he's not bisexual, he's pansexual. I don't think non-humans even enter into the sexuality spectrum.

But yeah I started watching the show because I actually found the actor surprisingly charming during the pilot, and continued watching for the shits and giggles of it all. But his antics wore thin by like, the second episode so...
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saspa posted...

Did it need confirming though when it's rather obviously stated? He's the devil, and he's not bisexual, he's pansexual. I don't think non-humans even enter into the sexuality spectrum.

pansexual is bisexual for the pretentious
and lucifer isnt pretentious he is just british
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Fox: We cancel what's popular, so we can keep churning out Simpsons episodes.
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I'm seeing mixed things about it, is it being saved or nah
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I heard NBC saved Brooklyn 99.
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it made me sad that the get down got cancelled
it was fucking awesome
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It kind of annoys me that Lucifer is at all popular tbh.
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@Ving_Rhames posted...

I'm seeing mixed things about it, is it being saved or nah

https://twitter.com/thelonelyisland/status/995151709709025280
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pegusus123456 posted...

It kind of annoys me that Lucifer is at all popular tbh.

Lucifer is actually canceled now

Oh thank god. Now to watch the finale and end this
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im sad about lucifer being cancelled
no more hot british lucifer occasionally making out with superman :(
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pegusus123456 posted...

It kind of annoys me that Lucifer is at all popular tbh.

I never did ask, why is that?
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Because I liked the Lucifer comic book. It is extremely good. Fox bought the rights to it and then absolutely and utterly destroyed the entire fucking storyline. From what I understand, the only thing they kept is that Lucifer quit Hell and now owns a night club with a loyal demon follower named Mazikeen. For instance, I see Mazikeen usually looks like a beautiful woman in the show. In the comic, she ends up as a beautiful woman too....and she's absolutely furious about it because she prefers being half-rotted.
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Oh I thought you meant because it's an awful show, not just because it doesn't follow the comics. Even if it wasn't like the comic but actually good and not horrible, would you have liked it?

Also with the cancellation it kinda proved it wasn't that popular though huh? I think there was just christian controversy when it came out due to the whole devil/lucifer thing. But it's not like it was pulling large amount of views; I don't think so at least.
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saspa posted...

Oh I thought you meant because it's an awful show, not just because it doesn't follow the comics. Even if it wasn't like the comic but actually good and not horrible, would you have liked it?

Maaaaybe, but I'm pretty set against it.
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