Current Events > Do you believe some races are naturally more intelligent than others?

(+) Yeah! (+)

nt

No. I believe culture on the other hand can effect it.

Not necessarily that it makes one culture smarter, but a culture can focus more on an activity that leads to that culture being the best at that activity and related things (that is statistically their children are the best)

Race as in biology though? Nah
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No, wtf.

Certain people that have been brought up with more advantages may BE more intelligent, but there's nothing stopping anyone from gaining knowledge.
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I hope a third of you are just trolling and not actually that dumb.
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On average, yes. It's a mathematical certainty.
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Yeah, races like gnomes and some sub races of elves usually start with a higher int. Int is highly overrated though, I'd rather have a ton of Cha and cast spells through sheer Chadness then be some wizard incel dweeb.
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I don't know.

We obviously had groups of humans breeding separately in different environments long enough to significantly effect some parts of their biology through sexual, natural selection. Skin, hair, and eye color being the obvious ones. For example, Europeans seem to have a greater range of possible hair and eye colors than, say, Asians or Africans.

I don't see any reason why other attributes w
couldn't have been effected on some scale. That, of course, doesn't mean every individual of race X would be more or less intelligent than race Y. Could just mean more tend to fall a little higher or lower on the scale.

Regardless, hypothetically speaking, if members of one race did tend to be, on average, more or less intelligent than another doesn't mean we ought to treat them any differently under the law.
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Yes. Humans, Elves, Dwarves, all naturally smarter than Orcs.
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As an average, certain races are better at certain things. Yes.
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Of course
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Yes. For example humans are way smarter than chimpanzees

No, it is a culture thing, since it is logical a large portion of a race would be grouped together because of the culture and simply originating from place y, it may seem like it is a race thing but it is not.
Complete_Idi0t posted...

Yes. For example humans are way smarter than chimpanzees

User name
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in Everquest, Erudites I think start with the highest intelligence stats of any race

Looks like most of CE is racist. Color me surprised.

Were_Wyrm posted...

Yes. Humans, Elves, Dwarves, all naturally smarter than Orcs.

That's just Alliance propaganda.
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CIA_Agent posted...

On average, yes. It's a mathematical certainty.

Madfoot, everyone

if you vote yes, please offer a rendition of your racial intellect hierarchy
tiers are acceptable
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CIA_Agent posted...

On average, yes. It's a mathematical certainty.

Please explain.
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ImTheMacheteGuy posted...

CIA_Agent posted...

On average, yes. It's a mathematical certainty.

Please explain.

That's madfoot. He's an actual white supremacist and constantly loses accounts for being racist trash

For sure TC, it's not racist either but just look at America and look at the rest of the world.

There's a reason why China is #1 right now.
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Squall28 posted...

As an average, certain races are better at certain things. Yes.

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BWLurker posted...

ImTheMacheteGuy posted...

CIA_Agent posted...

On average, yes. It's a mathematical certainty.

Please explain.

That's madfoot. He's an actual white supremacist and constantly loses accounts for being racist trash

Just the same, I would prefer to see his opinions on the matter in his words... for... purposes.
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Circuit races are definitely more intelligent than tri-oval races.

Yes. People who run marathons tend to be more intelligent than those who only do 100m sprints.
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Yes. Its basically mathematically impossible for that not to be the case. Though I will note that that is referring to average intelligence of each race rather than something like the peak intelligence of each race.
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BWLurker posted...

ImTheMacheteGuy posted...

CIA_Agent posted...

On average, yes. It's a mathematical certainty.

Please explain.

That's madfoot. He's an actual white supremacist and constantly loses accounts for being racist trash

Wrong.

ImTheMacheteGuy posted...

CIA_Agent posted...

On average, yes. It's a mathematical certainty.

Please explain.

All research on the subject indicates that there is a genetic component to IQ which differs between races.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Bell_Curve#Race_and_intelligence
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This is one of those topics that's volatile because the people that are wrong are going to be very assured they're actually right to the point that they'll spend all their energy trying to argue their point rather than trying to figure out the actual, objective truth. And it'll probably get heated quickly so they'll be too proud to admit they're wrong even if they do somehow come to that (correct) conclusion.
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I see a lot of Indian doctors.
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DarkTransient posted...

Yes. People who run marathons tend to be more intelligent than those who only do 100m sprints.

Speaking of 100m sprints, the Olympic event is always won by a West African. They must have a genetic advantage when it comes to sprinting. No one denies that there are genetic differences that give advantages in sports. Why do they deny that genetic differences can give advantages in intelligence?
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nicklebro posted...

This is one of those topics that's volatile because the people that are wrong are going to be very assured they're actually right to the point that they'll spend all their energy trying to argue their point rather than trying to figure out the actual, objective truth. And it'll probably get heated quickly so they'll be too proud to admit they're wrong even if they do somehow come to that (correct) conclusion.

Lol.

nicklebro posted...

Yes. Its basically mathematically impossible for that not to be the case.

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CIA_Agent posted...

Speaking of 100m sprints, the Olympic event is always won by a West African. They must have a genetic advantage when it comes to sprinting. No one denies that there are genetic differences that give advantages in sports. Why do they deny that genetic differences can give advantages in intelligence?

Because its a touchy subject.
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COVxy posted...

nicklebro posted...

This is one of those topics that's volatile because the people that are wrong are going to be very assured they're actually right to the point that they'll spend all their energy trying to argue their point rather than trying to figure out the actual, objective truth. And it'll probably get heated quickly so they'll be too proud to admit they're wrong even if they do somehow come to that (correct) conclusion.

Lol.

nicklebro posted...

Yes. Its basically mathematically impossible for that not to be the case.

I'm all ears if you want to actually make an argument. I'd love to be wrong about this.
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nicklebro posted...

I'm all ears if you want to actually make an argument. I'd love to be wrong about this.

I can't argue against a point not fully made. What do you mean by "mathematically impossible"?
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I knew The Bell Curve would be referenced in this topic sooner or later, and surprise, surprise it's Madfoot that referenced it.
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nicklebro posted...

Yes. Its basically mathematically impossible for that not to be the case. Though I will note that that is referring to average intelligence of each race rather than something like the peak intelligence of each race.

That's a bad way to think about it though, for two reasons. One is that you should really be asking if the latent distribution that people's intelligence is "drawn from" is different between races, not whether the current mean intelligence is different. I mean, otherwise if I flipped a coin 100 times and recorded each ten flips separately and didn't tell you the source that you would conclude that some coins were more weighted towards heads than others.

Secondly, the idea of an objective quantity that measures intelligence is sketchy.
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COVxy posted...

nicklebro posted...

I'm all ears if you want to actually make an argument. I'd love to be wrong about this.

I can't argue against a point not fully made. What do you mean by "mathematically impossible"?

That it would be an absolutely ridiculous coincidence if the average intelligence of every race was the exact same.
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Anteaterking posted...

nicklebro posted...

Yes. Its basically mathematically impossible for that not to be the case. Though I will note that that is referring to average intelligence of each race rather than something like the peak intelligence of each race.

That's a bad way to think about it though, for two reasons. One is that you should really be asking if the latent distribution that people's intelligence is "drawn from" is different between races, not whether the current mean intelligence is different. I mean, otherwise if I flipped a coin 100 times and recorded each ten flips separately and didn't tell you the source that you would conclude that some coins were more weighted towards heads than others.

Secondly, the idea of an objective quantity that measures intelligence is sketchy.

But it still comes down to the same issue, every race's average intelligence being the exact same is an absurd proposition. I mean to the point that it'd make me question if maybe there really is a god. And the second point, I'm judging it by IQ since its, while not perfect, a decent indicator of intelligence.
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CIA_Agent posted...

DarkTransient posted...

Yes. People who run marathons tend to be more intelligent than those who only do 100m sprints.

Speaking of 100m sprints, the Olympic event is always won by a West African. They must have a genetic advantage when it comes to sprinting. No one denies that there are genetic differences that give advantages in sports. Why do they deny that genetic differences can give advantages in intelligence?

acknowledging statistical differences between races automatically makes you a racist according to many of our resident liberals
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My reaction to the poll numbers


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nicklebro posted...

COVxy posted...

nicklebro posted...

I'm all ears if you want to actually make an argument. I'd love to be wrong about this.

I can't argue against a point not fully made. What do you mean by "mathematically impossible"?

That it would be an absolutely ridiculous coincidence if the average intelligence of every race was the exact same.

Which is kinda a silly argument, because the population value of any given parameter is always unlikely to be identical, but this is misleading because the difference on any given parameter isn't likely to be a meaningful difference.
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nicklebro posted...

But it still comes down to the same issue, every race's average intelligence being the exact same is an absurd proposition.

I'm saying it's stupid to define average intelligence of a race as (sum of IQs)/(# of members).

Instead you should think of it as a distribution of which we are seeing a sample.
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This entirely depends on the outcome of the study.

If someone were to do study that showed another race to be more intelligent than white people, then you could definitely claim that that particular race is more intelligent than white people.

On the other hand, if someone were to do a study that showed white people to more intelligent, then that's racist and the person should banned from academia and the study would be complete bullshit because liberals don't like the outcome.
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COVxy posted...

Which is kinda a silly argument, because the population value of any given parameter is always unlikely to be identical, but this is misleading because the difference on any given parameter isn't likely to be a meaningful difference.

Its a silly argument that is 100% true tho right? Lol I mean I guess this is obviously the best I can expect from you, I was actually thinking you might try to say I'm wrong, which woulda been great since its so obvious I'm right.

Plus that was just the irrefutable part of my belief. I mean its been shown that some races OA (On Average) score higher on IQ scores than others. And since races differ OA on pretty much every trait that you can think of, why would intelligence be any different? And before someone brings up the fact that culture also plays a part, I'd say that culture played a part in separating the inherent intelligence of different races as well. So you can't totally separate the effects culture and race have on these kinda things.
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nicklebro posted...

Its a silly argument that is 100% true tho right?

Yes, but it is true for everything, so providing it as an argument here is removing all the context of the statistical reasoning. The null hypothesis is always false.

So like, what does it contribute to the substance of this current discussion?
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LedZeppelin posted...

CIA_Agent posted...

DarkTransient posted...

Yes. People who run marathons tend to be more intelligent than those who only do 100m sprints.

Speaking of 100m sprints, the Olympic event is always won by a West African. They must have a genetic advantage when it comes to sprinting. No one denies that there are genetic differences that give advantages in sports. Why do they deny that genetic differences can give advantages in intelligence?

acknowledging statistical differences between races automatically makes you a racist according to many of our resident liberals

West Africans or people of West African descent in the New World (genetically distinct from pure West African populations) = All black people now?
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Anteaterking posted...

I'm saying it's stupid to define average intelligence of a race as (sum of IQs)/(# of members).

Instead you should think of it as a distribution of which we are seeing a sample.

Oh yeah of course, but again, the same principle applies. In fact it just gets worse when we are judging a sample of a race rather than just its average IQ score. Its even less likely for all races to have the same % of their population fall into the same IQ ranges. For example, a race has 20% of its population for IQs 80 and below, 70% 81-110, and 10% 100+. (Mind you these are just numbers I pulled out of my ass as an example, they don't actually matter)
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Taharqa_ posted...

West Africans or people of West African descent in the New World (genetically distinct from pure West African populations) = All black people now?

No, but it shows that ethnic groups have genetic differences. The fact that people generalize those ethnic groups into races is a social construct.
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I don't think intelligence between races is meaningfully different. education and good socioeconomic conditions always seem to increase IQ. plus IQ isn't exactly a true measure of intelligence to begin with
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In saliva, clues to a ghost species of ancient human
http://www.buffalo.edu/news/releases/2017/07/028.html

BUFFALO, N.Y. In saliva, scientists have found hints that a ghost species of archaic humans may have contributed genetic material to ancestors of people living in Sub-Saharan Africa today.

The research adds to a growing body of evidence suggesting that sexual rendezvous between different archaic human species may not have been unusual.

Past studies have concluded that the forebears of modern humans in Asia and Europe interbred with other early hominin species, including Neanderthals and Denisovans. The new research is among more recent genetic analyses indicating that ancient Africans also had trysts with other early hominins.

It seems that interbreeding between different early hominin species is not the exception its the norm, says Omer Gokcumen, PhD, an assistant professor of biological sciences in the University at Buffalo College of Arts and Sciences.

Our research traced the evolution of an important mucin protein called MUC7 that is found in saliva, he says. When we looked at the history of the gene that codes for the protein, we see the signature of archaic admixture in modern day Sub-Saharan African populations.

The research was published on July 21 in the journal Molecular Biology and Evolution. The study was led by Gokcumen and Stefan Ruhl, DDS, PhD, a professor of oral biology in UBs School of Dental Medicine.
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