Current Events > Why is Africa so poor of a continent?

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s0nicfan 08/28/18 12:31:25 PM #101:	AmericaTheBrave posted... s0nicfan posted... AmericaTheBrave posted... @s0nicfan, @Anarchy_Juiblex do you deny Europeans had a hand in Africa's problems? Of course they had a hand. The question is to what degree. Are you arguing that, completely absent European intervention, that Africa (sans Egypt) would have formed the kind of empires that Europe or China created? That even though there was no indication that they were developing technologically anywhere close to the rate of europe, or the middle east, or east asia, that they would have suddenly decided to modernize? What's to say they wouldn't have been like native americans and stuck to their current tribal lifestyles? Do you really think Egypt is Africa's only civilization? What about Ethiopia? Nubia? Mali, Songhai, Ghana, Great Zimbabwe, Swahili city-states, Kongo etc. Remember Timbuktu? One of the richest cities and great repository of knowledge? That was in West Africa. Not every African society was tribal. What would you consider the greatest among them, and where were they technologically prior to any form of colonialism relative to the other empires of the world? --- "History Is Much Like An Endless Waltz. The Three Beats Of War, Peace And Revolution Continue On Forever." - Gundam Wing: Endless Waltz <cite>s0nicfan posted [p:907690311] in Why is Afr... [t:76942539]...</cite> <quote><cite>AmericaTheBrave posted...</cite> <quote><cite>s0nicfan posted...</cite> <quote><cite>AmericaTheBrave posted...</cite> <quote>@s0nicfan, @Anarchy_Juiblex do you deny Europeans had a hand in Africa's problems?</quote> Of course they had a hand. The question is to what degree. Are you arguing that, completely absent European intervention, that Africa (sans Egypt) would have formed the kind of empires that Europe or China created? That even though there was no indication that they were developing technologically anywhere close to the rate of europe, or the middle east, or east asia, that they would have suddenly decided to modernize? What's to say they wouldn't have been like native americans and stuck to their current tribal lifestyles?</quote> Do you really think Egypt is Africa's only civilization? What about Ethiopia? Nubia? Mali, Songhai, Ghana, Great Zimbabwe, Swahili city-states, Kongo etc. Remember Timbuktu? One of the richest cities and great repository of knowledge? That was in West Africa. Not every African society was tribal.</quote> What would you consider the greatest among them, and where were they technologically prior to any form of colonialism relative to the other empires of the world?</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
AmericaTheBrave 08/28/18 12:33:27 PM #102:	AmpV3 posted... What's to say they wouldn't have been like native americans and stuck to their current tribal lifestyles? And to expand on that, what if they did? Are there problems due to having a tribal lifestyle or the politics and upending on their continent by imperialism? Like with Native Americans, if they had no contact with Europeans, and stayed tribal, at least they would have maintained continuity of the cultures and civilizations and could have progressed into something their own down the line, even if they never became a China. --- https://imgur.com/loj3Iz4 <cite>AmericaTheBrave posted [p:907690422] in Why is Afr... [t:76942539]...</cite> <quote><cite>AmpV3 posted...</cite> <quote> What's to say they wouldn't have been like native americans and stuck to their current tribal lifestyles?</quote> And to expand on that, what if they did? Are there problems due to having a tribal lifestyle or the politics and upending on their continent by imperialism? Like with Native Americans, if they had no contact with Europeans, and stayed tribal, at least they would have maintained continuity of the cultures and civilizations and could have progressed into something their own down the line, even if they never became a China.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
TheMikh 08/28/18 12:34:00 PM #103:	Reasons that don't involve treading into neoreactionary talking points: 1. Free foreign aid kills the incentive for people to participate in local markets. Nobody buys what farmers produce, so they close up shop and just collect aid as well. There is little incentive for economic development from the bottom up. 2. In spite of many African countries having somewhat uniform languages at the national/official level (English, French, Arabic, German, Dutch, etc.), there are thousands of local tribal/ethnic languages and dialects that people speak at home and in their communities. That is to say, there isn't organic large-scale unity, and to the contrary there's a lot of fine-grained ethnic division. 3. Corrupt leadership exploits the resources of the countries they rule, often selling access to multinationals, and running the nations into massive amounts of debt to line the pockets of the ruling class. After they leave power, the debt and economic damage remains. Never mind the fact that they also hurt local economies with kleptocratic practices. 4. Education can be pretty awful. 5. If there is a case to be made that a lack of opportunity for women hurts economies as a whole, certain traditional values really exacerbate this problem. 6. Religious superstition has a tendency to triumph over empiricism. 7. Political and economic instability makes even the most capable reluctant to operate with a long-term timeframe in mind. 8. With all of this taken into consideration, the most capable, wealthy, and educated tend to migrate to other continents for better opportunities if they have the means. Asia, Europe, North America. 9. Among many groups, cultural values impede pragmatics. Money is spent as it is earned, while private and property and contracts may not be thoroughly respected, never mind the property of employers, hurting investment prospects both at home and from abroad. 10. Infrastructure - both with respect to transportation and communications - is underdeveloped, and that which already exists is often poorly maintained. --- https://imgur.com/A0TAfek <cite>TheMikh posted [p:907690461] in Why is Afr... [t:76942539]...</cite> <quote>Reasons that don't involve treading into neoreactionary talking points: 1. Free foreign aid kills the incentive for people to participate in local markets. Nobody buys what farmers produce, so they close up shop and just collect aid as well. There is little incentive for economic development from the bottom up. 2. In spite of many African countries having somewhat uniform languages at the national/official level (English, French, Arabic, German, Dutch, etc.), there are thousands of local tribal/ethnic languages and dialects that people speak at home and in their communities. That is to say, there isn't organic large-scale unity, and to the contrary there's a lot of fine-grained ethnic division. 3. Corrupt leadership exploits the resources of the countries they rule, often selling access to multinationals, and running the nations into massive amounts of debt to line the pockets of the ruling class. After they leave power, the debt and economic damage remains. Never mind the fact that they also hurt local economies with kleptocratic practices. 4. Education can be pretty awful. 5. If there is a case to be made that a lack of opportunity for women hurts economies as a whole, certain traditional values really exacerbate this problem. 6. Religious superstition has a tendency to triumph over empiricism. 7. Political and economic instability makes even the most capable reluctant to operate with a long-term timeframe in mind. 8. With all of this taken into consideration, the most capable, wealthy, and educated tend to migrate to other continents for better opportunities if they have the means. Asia, Europe, North America. 9. Among many groups, cultural values impede pragmatics. Money is spent as it is earned, while private and property and contracts may not be thoroughly respected, never mind the property of employers, hurting investment prospects both at home and from abroad. 10. Infrastructure - both with respect to transportation and communications - is underdeveloped, and that which already exists is often poorly maintained.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
AmpV3 08/28/18 12:37:08 PM #104:	s0nicfan posted... AmpV3 posted... Alphamon posted... s0nicfan posted... AmericaTheBrave posted... @s0nicfan, @Anarchy_Juiblex do you deny Europeans had a hand in Africa's problems? Of course they had a hand. The question is to what degree. Are you arguing that, completely absent European intervention, that Africa (sans Egypt) would have formed the kind of empires that Europe or China created? That even though there was no indication that they were developing technologically anywhere close to the rate of europe, or the middle east, or east asia, that they would have suddenly decided to modernize? What's to say they wouldn't have been like native americans and stuck to their current tribal lifestyles? uh oh Lol, even when trying to sound like he knows what he is talking about, sonic fails miserably. He literally thinks Africa is all like The Gods Must Be Crazy. What a fail. We're talking about pre-colonialism, which would have been the early 1800s (at the latest) and the era of Shaka Zulu, not current day. Backpedaling! Move the goalposts! Oh, so that's what you meant by the continents "current tribal lifestyle", lol. Pre-colonialism! He just accidentally said "current"! Haha, you fucked up again. This will be more funny than the no go zones thing, though. --- MH4U / MHWorld: Jacques Arc MHGen / GenU: XTRMNTR <cite>AmpV3 posted [p:907690644] in Why is Afr... [t:76942539]...</cite> <quote><cite>s0nicfan posted...</cite> <quote><cite>AmpV3 posted...</cite> <quote><cite>Alphamon posted...</cite> <quote><cite>s0nicfan posted...</cite> <quote><cite>AmericaTheBrave posted...</cite> <quote>@s0nicfan, @Anarchy_Juiblex do you deny Europeans had a hand in Africa's problems?</quote> Of course they had a hand. The question is to what degree. Are you arguing that, completely absent European intervention, that Africa (sans Egypt) would have formed the kind of empires that Europe or China created? That even though there was no indication that they were developing technologically anywhere close to the rate of europe, or the middle east, or east asia, that they would have suddenly decided to modernize? What's to say they wouldn't have been like native americans and stuck to their current tribal lifestyles?</quote> uh oh</quote> Lol, even when trying to sound like he knows what he is talking about, sonic fails miserably. He literally thinks Africa is all like The Gods Must Be Crazy. What a fail.</quote> We're talking about pre-colonialism, which would have been the early 1800s (at the latest) and the era of Shaka Zulu, not current day.</quote> Backpedaling! Move the goalposts! Oh, so that's what you meant by the continents "current tribal lifestyle", lol. Pre-colonialism! He just accidentally said "current"! Haha, you fucked up again. This will be more funny than the no go zones thing, though.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
s0nicfan 08/28/18 12:37:46 PM #105:	AmericaTheBrave posted... AmpV3 posted... What's to say they wouldn't have been like native americans and stuck to their current tribal lifestyles? And to expand on that, what if they did? Are there problems due to having a tribal lifestyle or the politics and upending on their continent by imperialism? Like with Native Americans, if they had no contact with Europeans, and stayed tribal, at least they would have maintained continuity of the cultures and civilizations and could have progressed into something their own down the line, even if they never became a China. That's a fair point, but then it depends on how you measure the current suffering that africa faces. Is it food shortages? Is it risk of invasion? Is it warlords? Would those things have not been problems absent colonialism? If we're going to make the case that colonialism "ruined" Africa then you'd need to make the case that it would have been completely fine left to its own devices against the things it currently struggles against. It gained positives from colonialism as well, after all. Things like modern farming techniques, cures to deadly diseases, access to the world's scientific knowledge. That's not nothing. --- "History Is Much Like An Endless Waltz. The Three Beats Of War, Peace And Revolution Continue On Forever." - Gundam Wing: Endless Waltz <cite>s0nicfan posted [p:907690688] in Why is Afr... [t:76942539]...</cite> <quote><cite>AmericaTheBrave posted...</cite> <quote><cite>AmpV3 posted...</cite> <quote> What's to say they wouldn't have been like native americans and stuck to their current tribal lifestyles?</quote> And to expand on that, what if they did? Are there problems due to having a tribal lifestyle or the politics and upending on their continent by imperialism? Like with Native Americans, if they had no contact with Europeans, and stayed tribal, at least they would have maintained continuity of the cultures and civilizations and could have progressed into something their own down the line, even if they never became a China.</quote> That's a fair point, but then it depends on how you measure the current suffering that africa faces. Is it food shortages? Is it risk of invasion? Is it warlords? Would those things have not been problems absent colonialism? If we're going to make the case that colonialism "ruined" Africa then you'd need to make the case that it would have been completely fine left to its own devices against the things it currently struggles against. It gained positives from colonialism as well, after all. Things like modern farming techniques, cures to deadly diseases, access to the world's scientific knowledge. That's not nothing.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
AmpV3 08/28/18 12:38:19 PM #106:	AmericaTheBrave posted... AmpV3 posted... What's to say they wouldn't have been like native americans and stuck to their current tribal lifestyles? And to expand on that, what if they did? Are there problems due to having a tribal lifestyle or the politics and upending on their continent by imperialism? Like with Native Americans, if they had no contact with Europeans, and stayed tribal, at least they would have maintained continuity of the cultures and civilizations and could have progressed into something their own down the line, even if they never became a China. Why did you quote me as saying this stereotyping garbage? It was Sonicfan, of course. --- MH4U / MHWorld: Jacques Arc MHGen / GenU: XTRMNTR <cite>AmpV3 posted [p:907690722] in Why is Afr... [t:76942539]...</cite> <quote><cite>AmericaTheBrave posted...</cite> <quote><cite>AmpV3 posted...</cite> <quote> What's to say they wouldn't have been like native americans and stuck to their current tribal lifestyles?</quote> And to expand on that, what if they did? Are there problems due to having a tribal lifestyle or the politics and upending on their continent by imperialism? Like with Native Americans, if they had no contact with Europeans, and stayed tribal, at least they would have maintained continuity of the cultures and civilizations and could have progressed into something their own down the line, even if they never became a China.</quote> Why did you quote me as saying this stereotyping garbage? It was Sonicfan, of course.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Darkman124 08/28/18 12:38:51 PM #107:	TheMikh posted... 8. With all of this taken into consideration, the most capable, wealthy, and educated tend to migrate to other continents for better opportunities if they have the means. Asia, Europe, North America. This plays a major element in a global economy. With the unparalleled mobility of the modern world there is far less incentive for the talented to stay and fix what is broken rather than go somewhere operational and focus on making their own success. --- And when the hourglass has run out, eternity asks you about only one thing: whether you have lived in despair or not. <cite>Darkman124 posted [p:907690754] in Why is Afr... [t:76942539]...</cite> <quote><cite>TheMikh posted...</cite> <quote>8. With all of this taken into consideration, the most capable, wealthy, and educated tend to migrate to other continents for better opportunities if they have the means. Asia, Europe, North America. </quote> This plays a major element in a global economy. With the unparalleled mobility of the modern world there is far less incentive for the talented to stay and fix what is broken rather than go somewhere operational and focus on making their own success.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
AmericaTheBrave 08/28/18 12:39:49 PM #108:	s0nicfan posted... AmericaTheBrave posted... s0nicfan posted... AmericaTheBrave posted... @s0nicfan, @Anarchy_Juiblex do you deny Europeans had a hand in Africa's problems? Of course they had a hand. The question is to what degree. Are you arguing that, completely absent European intervention, that Africa (sans Egypt) would have formed the kind of empires that Europe or China created? That even though there was no indication that they were developing technologically anywhere close to the rate of europe, or the middle east, or east asia, that they would have suddenly decided to modernize? What's to say they wouldn't have been like native americans and stuck to their current tribal lifestyles? Do you really think Egypt is Africa's only civilization? What about Ethiopia? Nubia? Mali, Songhai, Ghana, Great Zimbabwe, Swahili city-states, Kongo etc. Remember Timbuktu? One of the richest cities and great repository of knowledge? That was in West Africa. Not every African society was tribal. What would you consider the greatest among them, and where were they technologically prior to any form of colonialism relative to the other empires of the world? Ethiopia is probably the most internationally relevant, having had contact with Ancient Rome, Ancient India, and Ancient Egypt. It's also one of the earliest Christian countries in the world (second after Armenia iirc). Mali was a center of Islamic learning. The Swahili coast was a major hub of the Indian Ocean trade network, a trade network that had been going on peacefully for hundreds of years before the Portuguese discovered it and disrupted it. Also interesting fact about Nubia (current day Sudan), it has far more pyramids than Egypt does. --- https://imgur.com/loj3Iz4 <cite>AmericaTheBrave posted [p:907690808] in Why is Afr... [t:76942539]...</cite> <quote><cite>s0nicfan posted...</cite> <quote><cite>AmericaTheBrave posted...</cite> <quote><cite>s0nicfan posted...</cite> <quote><cite>AmericaTheBrave posted...</cite> <quote>@s0nicfan, @Anarchy_Juiblex do you deny Europeans had a hand in Africa's problems?</quote> Of course they had a hand. The question is to what degree. Are you arguing that, completely absent European intervention, that Africa (sans Egypt) would have formed the kind of empires that Europe or China created? That even though there was no indication that they were developing technologically anywhere close to the rate of europe, or the middle east, or east asia, that they would have suddenly decided to modernize? What's to say they wouldn't have been like native americans and stuck to their current tribal lifestyles?</quote> Do you really think Egypt is Africa's only civilization? What about Ethiopia? Nubia? Mali, Songhai, Ghana, Great Zimbabwe, Swahili city-states, Kongo etc. Remember Timbuktu? One of the richest cities and great repository of knowledge? That was in West Africa. Not every African society was tribal.</quote> What would you consider the greatest among them, and where were they technologically prior to any form of colonialism relative to the other empires of the world?</quote> Ethiopia is probably the most internationally relevant, having had contact with Ancient Rome, Ancient India, and Ancient Egypt. It's also one of the earliest Christian countries in the world (second after Armenia iirc). Mali was a center of Islamic learning. The Swahili coast was a major hub of the Indian Ocean trade network, a trade network that had been going on peacefully for hundreds of years before the Portuguese discovered it and disrupted it. Also interesting fact about Nubia (current day Sudan), it has far more pyramids than Egypt does.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Anarchy_Juiblex 08/28/18 12:40:57 PM #109:	AmericaTheBrave posted... @s0nicfan, @Anarchy_Juiblex do you deny Europeans had a hand in Africa's problems? Everything is the totality of cause and effect from the start of the universe. But that's useless. The buck has to stop somewhere and at some point in history, Africa is the responsibility of Africans. And I believe we're at that point in history. No longer can responsibility be passed off, you can't just keep blaming whites for the tribalism, corruption, the superstition, the crimes and genocide, the failed economic and agricultural policies, etc. till the end of time. We have to look at what's current. --- "Tolerance of intolerance is cowardice." ~ Ayaan Hirsi Ali <cite>Anarchy_Juiblex posted [p:907690880] in Why is Afr... [t:76942539]...</cite> <quote><cite>AmericaTheBrave posted...</cite> <quote>@s0nicfan, @Anarchy_Juiblex do you deny Europeans had a hand in Africa's problems?</quote> Everything is the totality of cause and effect from the start of the universe. But that's useless. The buck has to stop somewhere and at some point in history, Africa is the responsibility of Africans. And I believe we're at that point in history. No longer can responsibility be passed off, you can't just keep blaming whites for the tribalism, corruption, the superstition, the crimes and genocide, the failed economic and agricultural policies, etc. till the end of time. We have to look at what's current.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
PowerfulSageIRL 08/28/18 12:43:27 PM #110:	TheMikh posted... Reasons that don't involve treading into neoreactionary talking points: 1. Free foreign aid kills the incentive for people to participate in local markets. Nobody buys what farmers produce, so they close up shop and just collect aid as well. There is little incentive for economic development from the bottom up. 2. In spite of many African countries having somewhat uniform languages at the national/official level (English, French, Arabic, German, Dutch, etc.), there are thousands of local tribal/ethnic languages and dialects that people speak at home and in their communities. That is to say, there isn't organic large-scale unity, and to the contrary there's a lot of fine-grained ethnic division. 3. Corrupt leadership exploits the resources of the countries they rule, often selling access to multinationals, and running the nations into massive amounts of debt to line the pockets of the ruling class. After they leave power, the debt and economic damage remains. Never mind the fact that they also hurt local economies with kleptocratic practices. 4. Education can be pretty awful. 5. If there is a case to be made that a lack of opportunity for women hurts economies as a whole, certain traditional values really exacerbate this problem. 6. Religious superstition has a tendency to triumph over empiricism. 7. Political and economic instability makes even the most capable reluctant to operate with a long-term timeframe in mind. 8. With all of this taken into consideration, the most capable, wealthy, and educated tend to migrate to other continents for better opportunities if they have the means. Asia, Europe, North America. 9. Among many groups, cultural values impede pragmatics. Money is spent as it is earned, while private and property and contracts may not be thoroughly respected, never mind the property of employers, hurting investment prospects both at home and from abroad. 10. Infrastructure - both with respect to transportation and communications - is underdeveloped, and that which already exists is often poorly maintained. 1, 3, 4, 6, 7, 8, 9, and 10 are all largely due to colonialism and the slave trade 5 is arguably due to colonialism and the slave trade, and is also not true in many countries in africa (I believe it's nigeria where ~65% of its elected officials are women) and as for 2: there are also tons of pidgins and creoles, so that's not a major concern <cite>PowerfulSageIRL posted [p:907691017] in Why is Afr... [t:76942539]...</cite> <quote><cite>TheMikh posted...</cite> <quote>Reasons that don't involve treading into neoreactionary talking points: 1. Free foreign aid kills the incentive for people to participate in local markets. Nobody buys what farmers produce, so they close up shop and just collect aid as well. There is little incentive for economic development from the bottom up. 2. In spite of many African countries having somewhat uniform languages at the national/official level (English, French, Arabic, German, Dutch, etc.), there are thousands of local tribal/ethnic languages and dialects that people speak at home and in their communities. That is to say, there isn't organic large-scale unity, and to the contrary there's a lot of fine-grained ethnic division. 3. Corrupt leadership exploits the resources of the countries they rule, often selling access to multinationals, and running the nations into massive amounts of debt to line the pockets of the ruling class. After they leave power, the debt and economic damage remains. Never mind the fact that they also hurt local economies with kleptocratic practices. 4. Education can be pretty awful. 5. If there is a case to be made that a lack of opportunity for women hurts economies as a whole, certain traditional values really exacerbate this problem. 6. Religious superstition has a tendency to triumph over empiricism. 7. Political and economic instability makes even the most capable reluctant to operate with a long-term timeframe in mind. 8. With all of this taken into consideration, the most capable, wealthy, and educated tend to migrate to other continents for better opportunities if they have the means. Asia, Europe, North America. 9. Among many groups, cultural values impede pragmatics. Money is spent as it is earned, while private and property and contracts may not be thoroughly respected, never mind the property of employers, hurting investment prospects both at home and from abroad. 10. Infrastructure - both with respect to transportation and communications - is underdeveloped, and that which already exists is often poorly maintained.</quote> 1, 3, 4, 6, 7, 8, 9, and 10 are all largely due to colonialism and the slave trade 5 is arguably due to colonialism and the slave trade, and is also not true in many countries in africa (I believe it's nigeria where ~65% of its elected officials are women) and as for 2: there are also tons of pidgins and creoles, so that's not a major concern</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Abyssea 08/28/18 12:46:15 PM #111:	what I don't get is if all life originated in Africa, why isn't it the most advanced place in the world? wouldn't they have had the most time to develop it? --- https://imgur.com/RrnQVUg <cite>Abyssea posted [p:907691188] in Why is Afr... [t:76942539]...</cite> <quote>what I don't get is if all life originated in Africa, why isn't it the most advanced place in the world? wouldn't they have had the most time to develop it?</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Anarchy_Juiblex 08/28/18 12:47:46 PM #112:	PowerfulSageIRL posted... 1, 3, 4, 6, 7, 8, 9, and 10 are all largely due to colonialism and the slave trade Poor education is because of the slave trade . . . Jesus fucking Christ why are even bothering pissing away billions in aid then. This is the exact type of ridiculous shit I'm talking about. They got high speed internet and smartphones over there. This isn't on whites or the west anymore. The excuses for Africa's problems till the end of time will be, "fucking white people" --- "Tolerance of intolerance is cowardice." ~ Ayaan Hirsi Ali <cite>Anarchy_Juiblex posted [p:907691269] in Why is Afr... [t:76942539]...</cite> <quote><cite>PowerfulSageIRL posted...</cite> <quote>1, 3, 4, 6, 7, 8, 9, and 10 are all largely due to colonialism and the slave trade </quote> Poor education is because of the slave trade . . . Jesus fucking Christ why are even bothering pissing away billions in aid then. This is the exact type of ridiculous shit I'm talking about. They got high speed internet and smartphones over there. This isn't on whites or the west anymore. The excuses for Africa's problems till the end of time will be, "fucking white people"</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Questionmarktarius 08/28/18 12:51:19 PM #113:	Abyssea posted... what I don't get is if all life originated in Africa, why isn't it the most advanced place in the world? wouldn't they have had the most time to develop it? If humans started in africa, they'd be as evolved as they needed to be for africa. It's when we began migrating elsewhere that environmental pressures created bottlenecks that effectively created 'breeds' of humans. Africa has shittons of genetic diversity. Everyone else is just grossly inbred for 'desirable traits' specific to survival in some niche locale. <cite>Questionmarktarius posted [p:907691473] in Why is Afr... [t:76942539]...</cite> <quote><cite>Abyssea posted...</cite> <quote>what I don't get is if all life originated in Africa, why isn't it the most advanced place in the world? wouldn't they have had the most time to develop it?</quote> If humans started in africa, they'd be as evolved as they needed to be for africa. It's when we began migrating elsewhere that environmental pressures created bottlenecks that effectively created 'breeds' of humans. Africa has shittons of genetic diversity. Everyone else is just grossly inbred for 'desirable traits' specific to survival in some niche locale.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
AmericaTheBrave 08/28/18 12:54:09 PM #114:	s0nicfan posted... AmericaTheBrave posted... AmpV3 posted... What's to say they wouldn't have been like native americans and stuck to their current tribal lifestyles? And to expand on that, what if they did? Are there problems due to having a tribal lifestyle or the politics and upending on their continent by imperialism? Like with Native Americans, if they had no contact with Europeans, and stayed tribal, at least they would have maintained continuity of the cultures and civilizations and could have progressed into something their own down the line, even if they never became a China. That's a fair point, but then it depends on how you measure the current suffering that africa faces. Is it food shortages? Is it risk of invasion? Is it warlords? Would those things have not been problems absent colonialism? If we're going to make the case that colonialism "ruined" Africa then you'd need to make the case that it would have been completely fine left to its own devices against the things it currently struggles against. It gained positives from colonialism as well, after all. Things like modern farming techniques, cures to deadly diseases, access to the world's scientific knowledge. That's not nothing. Food shortages and famines would be problems absent of colonialism. In fact, it's probably why Ethiopia never got bigger than it did because it's such a drought-prone region. Invasion and Warlords would have been more "organic" if it didn't follow colonialism. After all, every continent had problems with invasions and warlords. And a lot of those positives of colonialism don't necessarily need colonialism to have been implemented. Regular exchange of knowledge could have happened (and often did prior to it). Abyssea posted... what I don't get is if all life originated in Africa, why isn't it the most advanced place in the world? wouldn't they have had the most time to develop it? Because real life isn't a game of Civilization. History is made of rises and falls. --- https://imgur.com/loj3Iz4 <cite>AmericaTheBrave posted [p:907691648] in Why is Afr... [t:76942539]...</cite> <quote><cite>s0nicfan posted...</cite> <quote><cite>AmericaTheBrave posted...</cite> <quote><cite>AmpV3 posted...</cite> <quote> What's to say they wouldn't have been like native americans and stuck to their current tribal lifestyles?</quote> And to expand on that, what if they did? Are there problems due to having a tribal lifestyle or the politics and upending on their continent by imperialism? Like with Native Americans, if they had no contact with Europeans, and stayed tribal, at least they would have maintained continuity of the cultures and civilizations and could have progressed into something their own down the line, even if they never became a China.</quote> That's a fair point, but then it depends on how you measure the current suffering that africa faces. Is it food shortages? Is it risk of invasion? Is it warlords? Would those things have not been problems absent colonialism? If we're going to make the case that colonialism "ruined" Africa then you'd need to make the case that it would have been completely fine left to its own devices against the things it currently struggles against. It gained positives from colonialism as well, after all. Things like modern farming techniques, cures to deadly diseases, access to the world's scientific knowledge. That's not nothing.</quote> Food shortages and famines would be problems absent of colonialism. In fact, it's probably why Ethiopia never got bigger than it did because it's such a drought-prone region. Invasion and Warlords would have been more "organic" if it didn't follow colonialism. After all, every continent had problems with invasions and warlords. And a lot of those positives of colonialism don't necessarily need colonialism to have been implemented. Regular exchange of knowledge could have happened (and often did prior to it). <cite>Abyssea posted...</cite> <quote>what I don't get is if all life originated in Africa, why isn't it the most advanced place in the world? wouldn't they have had the most time to develop it?</quote> Because real life isn't a game of Civilization. History is made of rises and falls.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Anarchy_Juiblex 08/28/18 12:54:28 PM #115:	Questionmarktarius posted... Everyone else is just grossly inbred for desirable traits. Actually non-Africans had bred with Neanderthals so we share some of their DNA. As for calling it "grossly inbred", not even close. --- "Tolerance of intolerance is cowardice." ~ Ayaan Hirsi Ali <cite>Anarchy_Juiblex posted [p:907691657] in Why is Afr... [t:76942539]...</cite> <quote><cite>Questionmarktarius posted...</cite> <quote>Everyone else is just grossly inbred for desirable traits.</quote> Actually non-Africans had bred with Neanderthals so we share some of their DNA. As for calling it "grossly inbred", not even close.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Questionmarktarius 08/28/18 12:55:31 PM #116:	Anarchy_Juiblex posted... Questionmarktarius posted... Everyone else is just grossly inbred for desirable traits. Actually non-Africans had bred with Neanderthals so we share some of their DNA. As for calling it "grossly inbred", not even close. The neanderthals had just migrated out of africa and began inbreeding sooner. <cite>Questionmarktarius posted [p:907691709] in Why is Afr... [t:76942539]...</cite> <quote><cite>Anarchy_Juiblex posted...</cite> <quote><cite>Questionmarktarius posted...</cite> <quote>Everyone else is just grossly inbred for desirable traits.</quote> Actually non-Africans had bred with Neanderthals so we share some of their DNA. As for calling it "grossly inbred", not even close.</quote> The neanderthals had just migrated out of africa and began inbreeding sooner.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
mario2000 08/28/18 12:57:57 PM #117:	s0nicfan posted... mario2000 posted... s0nicfan posted... Because "white people" Anarchy_Juiblex posted... It's the continent of 10,001 excuses. All of which secretly boil down to "let's blame whites" love posts like this like bruh why you gettin defensive, no one's blaming you personally Fair enough. Do you believe in reparations? I don't see any real reason against them. I don't believe that reparations by themselves will solve the issue, though. Existing power structures need to be eliminated. --- Arrrr the SS Goku, Mighty fine boat... -fatmatt Hope Frieza doesn't chuck an Iceberg at the Goku, otherwise it's all over. -Nekoslash <cite>mario2000 posted [p:907691877] in Why is Afr... [t:76942539]...</cite> <quote><cite>s0nicfan posted...</cite> <quote><cite>mario2000 posted...</cite> <quote><cite>s0nicfan posted...</cite> <quote>Because "white people"</quote> <cite>Anarchy_Juiblex posted...</cite> <quote>It's the continent of 10,001 excuses. All of which secretly boil down to "let's blame whites"</quote> love posts like this like bruh why you gettin defensive, no one's blaming you personally</quote> Fair enough. Do you believe in reparations?</quote> I don't see any real reason against them. I don't believe that reparations by themselves will solve the issue, though. Existing power structures need to be eliminated.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
s0nicfan 08/28/18 12:58:39 PM #118:	AmericaTheBrave posted... Food shortages and famines would be problems absent of colonialism. In fact, it's probably why Ethiopia never got bigger than it did because it's such a drought-prone region. Invasion and Warlords would have been more "organic" if it didn't follow colonialism. After all, every continent had problems with invasions and warlords. And a lot of those positives of colonialism don't necessarily need colonialism to have been implemented. Regular exchange of knowledge could have happened (and often did prior to it). So if we assume that many of the issues plaguing them now would have occurred one way or another anyway (but been more organic)... then what issues specifically are exclusively the result of colonialism? --- "History Is Much Like An Endless Waltz. The Three Beats Of War, Peace And Revolution Continue On Forever." - Gundam Wing: Endless Waltz <cite>s0nicfan posted [p:907691912] in Why is Afr... [t:76942539]...</cite> <quote><cite>AmericaTheBrave posted...</cite> <quote>Food shortages and famines would be problems absent of colonialism. In fact, it's probably why Ethiopia never got bigger than it did because it's such a drought-prone region. Invasion and Warlords would have been more "organic" if it didn't follow colonialism. After all, every continent had problems with invasions and warlords. And a lot of those positives of colonialism don't necessarily need colonialism to have been implemented. Regular exchange of knowledge could have happened (and often did prior to it).</quote> So if we assume that many of the issues plaguing them now would have occurred one way or another anyway (but been more organic)... then what issues specifically are exclusively the result of colonialism?</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Questionmarktarius 08/28/18 1:00:17 PM #119:	mario2000 posted... s0nicfan posted... mario2000 posted... s0nicfan posted... Because "white people" Anarchy_Juiblex posted... It's the continent of 10,001 excuses. All of which secretly boil down to "let's blame whites" love posts like this like bruh why you gettin defensive, no one's blaming you personally Fair enough. Do you believe in reparations? I don't see any real reason against them. I don't believe that reparations by themselves will solve the issue, though. Existing power structures need to be eliminated. Meet the new boss. Same as the old boss. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SHhrZgojY1Q" data-time=" <cite>Questionmarktarius posted [p:907692011] in Why is Afr... [t:76942539]...</cite> <quote><cite>mario2000 posted...</cite> <quote><cite>s0nicfan posted...</cite> <quote><cite>mario2000 posted...</cite> <quote><cite>s0nicfan posted...</cite> <quote>Because "white people"</quote> <cite>Anarchy_Juiblex posted...</cite> <quote>It's the continent of 10,001 excuses. All of which secretly boil down to "let's blame whites"</quote> love posts like this like bruh why you gettin defensive, no one's blaming you personally</quote> Fair enough. Do you believe in reparations?</quote> I don't see any real reason against them. I don't believe that reparations by themselves will solve the issue, though. Existing power structures need to be eliminated.</quote> Meet the new boss. Same as the old boss. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SHhrZgojY1Q" data-time="</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Anarchy_Juiblex 08/28/18 1:02:10 PM #120:	mario2000 posted... Existing power structures need to be eliminated. Wtf does this even mean exactly? --- "Tolerance of intolerance is cowardice." ~ Ayaan Hirsi Ali <cite>Anarchy_Juiblex posted [p:907692118] in Why is Afr... [t:76942539]...</cite> <quote><cite>mario2000 posted...</cite> <quote>Existing power structures need to be eliminated.</quote> Wtf does this even mean exactly?</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Abyssea 08/28/18 1:02:58 PM #121:	AmericaTheBrave posted... Because real life isn't a game of Civilization. History is made of rises and falls. but when did Africa ever rise? :v hasn't their culture been pretty much the same up till like, 1000 years ago? --- https://imgur.com/RrnQVUg <cite>Abyssea posted [p:907692173] in Why is Afr... [t:76942539]...</cite> <quote><cite>AmericaTheBrave posted...</cite> <quote>Because real life isn't a game of Civilization. History is made of rises and falls.</quote> but when did Africa ever rise? :v hasn't their culture been pretty much the same up till like, 1000 years ago?</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Questionmarktarius 08/28/18 1:03:54 PM #122:	Anarchy_Juiblex posted... mario2000 posted... Existing power structures need to be eliminated. Wtf does this even mean exactly? Revolution and upheaval, with the hope that the next tyrant to emerge from the rubble is on your side. <cite>Questionmarktarius posted [p:907692250] in Why is Afr... [t:76942539]...</cite> <quote><cite>Anarchy_Juiblex posted...</cite> <quote><cite>mario2000 posted...</cite> <quote>Existing power structures need to be eliminated.</quote> Wtf does this even mean exactly?</quote> Revolution and upheaval, with the hope that the next tyrant to emerge from the rubble is on your side.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
electricbugs2 08/28/18 1:04:52 PM #123:	The only successful African nations are majority Muslim or Hindu. So colonials do fine (Maritius, Seychelles, Morocco, Egypt) but the actual "locals" have always struggled. --- Is sticking your tongue on a 9-volt battery a masculine gesture?-Questionmarktarius <cite>electricbugs2 posted [p:907692307] in Why is Afr... [t:76942539]...</cite> <quote>The only successful African nations are majority Muslim or Hindu. So colonials do fine (Maritius, Seychelles, Morocco, Egypt) but the actual "locals" have always struggled.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
KamenRiderBlade 08/28/18 1:04:55 PM #124:	Anarchy_Juiblex posted... PowerfulSageIRL posted... 1, 3, 4, 6, 7, 8, 9, and 10 are all largely due to colonialism and the slave trade Poor education is because of the slave trade . . . Jesus fucking Christ why are even bothering pissing away billions in aid then. This is the exact type of ridiculous shit I'm talking about. They got high speed internet and smartphones over there. This isn't on whites or the west anymore. The excuses for Africa's problems till the end of time will be, "fucking white people" Yup, blame everybody but themselves. A typical human problem. Lack of Introspection & Self Reflection https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decolonisation_of_Africa A large majority of the Decolonisation & Independence of Africa happened in the 1950's - 1970's There were a few countries that became independent earlier than that time range. But the vast majority happened in that time span. --- Are you a MexiCAN or a MexiCAN'T - Johnny Depp '*Once Upon A Time in Mexico*' <cite>KamenRiderBlade posted [p:907692309] in Why is Afr... [t:76942539]...</cite> <quote><cite>Anarchy_Juiblex posted...</cite> <quote><cite>PowerfulSageIRL posted...</cite> <quote>1, 3, 4, 6, 7, 8, 9, and 10 are all largely due to colonialism and the slave trade </quote> Poor education is because of the slave trade . . . Jesus fucking Christ why are even bothering pissing away billions in aid then. This is the exact type of ridiculous shit I'm talking about. They got high speed internet and smartphones over there. This isn't on whites or the west anymore. The excuses for Africa's problems till the end of time will be, "fucking white people"</quote>Yup, blame everybody but themselves. A typical human problem. Lack of Introspection & Self Reflection https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decolonisation_of_Africa A large majority of the Decolonisation & Independence of Africa happened in the 1950's - 1970's There were a few countries that became independent earlier than that time range. But the vast majority happened in that time span.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Anarchy_Juiblex 08/28/18 1:11:49 PM #126:	CloneTheHero posted... i suggest yall read jared diamonds book. he explains it Did you actually read Guns Germs and Steel or just watch CGP Grey's videos? --- "Tolerance of intolerance is cowardice." ~ Ayaan Hirsi Ali <cite>Anarchy_Juiblex posted [p:907692685] in Why is Afr... [t:76942539]...</cite> <quote><cite>CloneTheHero posted...</cite> <quote>i suggest yall read jared diamonds book. he explains it</quote> Did you actually read Guns Germs and Steel or just watch CGP Grey's videos?</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
KamenRiderBlade 08/28/18 1:12:33 PM #127:	PowerfulSageIRL posted... TheMikh posted... Reasons that don't involve treading into neoreactionary talking points: 1. Free foreign aid kills the incentive for people to participate in local markets. Nobody buys what farmers produce, so they close up shop and just collect aid as well. There is little incentive for economic development from the bottom up. 2. In spite of many African countries having somewhat uniform languages at the national/official level (English, French, Arabic, German, Dutch, etc.), there are thousands of local tribal/ethnic languages and dialects that people speak at home and in their communities. That is to say, there isn't organic large-scale unity, and to the contrary there's a lot of fine-grained ethnic division. 3. Corrupt leadership exploits the resources of the countries they rule, often selling access to multinationals, and running the nations into massive amounts of debt to line the pockets of the ruling class. After they leave power, the debt and economic damage remains. Never mind the fact that they also hurt local economies with kleptocratic practices. 4. Education can be pretty awful. 5. If there is a case to be made that a lack of opportunity for women hurts economies as a whole, certain traditional values really exacerbate this problem. 6. Religious superstition has a tendency to triumph over empiricism. 7. Political and economic instability makes even the most capable reluctant to operate with a long-term timeframe in mind. 8. With all of this taken into consideration, the most capable, wealthy, and educated tend to migrate to other continents for better opportunities if they have the means. Asia, Europe, North America. 9. Among many groups, cultural values impede pragmatics. Money is spent as it is earned, while private and property and contracts may not be thoroughly respected, never mind the property of employers, hurting investment prospects both at home and from abroad. 10. Infrastructure - both with respect to transportation and communications - is underdeveloped, and that which already exists is often poorly maintained. 1, 3, 4, 6, 7, 8, 9, and 10 are all largely due to colonialism and the slave trade 5 is arguably due to colonialism and the slave trade, and is also not true in many countries in africa (I believe it's nigeria where ~65% of its elected officials are women) and as for 2: there are also tons of pidgins and creoles, so that's not a major concern 1) Foreign Aid needs to just stop, it's causing more problems then it's solving, that's on the Western Powers 2) Unified Pan-African Language is a local issue 3) Corrupt Leadership is a internal issue, locals have had the opportunities to throw out corrupt leadership in many cases and have done so before. 4) That's because their local Governments don't put a focus on that 5) Traditional Values from old times still linger and is a problem, but that's not a External Influence issue 6) That's a local values / education problem. People have tried to show them the value of Science and Empricism, not everybody takes to those ideals 7) That falls back to internal issues due to government / leadership 8) Well, people who migrate out chooses better opportunities for themselves / others. Can you blame them for wanting to leave? 9) Again, a local cultural issue. Many parts of the world don't have this issue. 10) That goes back to local issues with maintenance --- Are you a MexiCAN or a MexiCAN'T - Johnny Depp '*Once Upon A Time in Mexico*' <cite>KamenRiderBlade posted [p:907692732] in Why is Afr... [t:76942539]...</cite> <quote><cite>PowerfulSageIRL posted...</cite> <quote><cite>TheMikh posted...</cite> <quote>Reasons that don't involve treading into neoreactionary talking points: 1. Free foreign aid kills the incentive for people to participate in local markets. Nobody buys what farmers produce, so they close up shop and just collect aid as well. There is little incentive for economic development from the bottom up. 2. In spite of many African countries having somewhat uniform languages at the national/official level (English, French, Arabic, German, Dutch, etc.), there are thousands of local tribal/ethnic languages and dialects that people speak at home and in their communities. That is to say, there isn't organic large-scale unity, and to the contrary there's a lot of fine-grained ethnic division. 3. Corrupt leadership exploits the resources of the countries they rule, often selling access to multinationals, and running the nations into massive amounts of debt to line the pockets of the ruling class. After they leave power, the debt and economic damage remains. Never mind the fact that they also hurt local economies with kleptocratic practices. 4. Education can be pretty awful. 5. If there is a case to be made that a lack of opportunity for women hurts economies as a whole, certain traditional values really exacerbate this problem. 6. Religious superstition has a tendency to triumph over empiricism. 7. Political and economic instability makes even the most capable reluctant to operate with a long-term timeframe in mind. 8. With all of this taken into consideration, the most capable, wealthy, and educated tend to migrate to other continents for better opportunities if they have the means. Asia, Europe, North America. 9. Among many groups, cultural values impede pragmatics. Money is spent as it is earned, while private and property and contracts may not be thoroughly respected, never mind the property of employers, hurting investment prospects both at home and from abroad. 10. Infrastructure - both with respect to transportation and communications - is underdeveloped, and that which already exists is often poorly maintained.</quote> 1, 3, 4, 6, 7, 8, 9, and 10 are all largely due to colonialism and the slave trade 5 is arguably due to colonialism and the slave trade, and is also not true in many countries in africa (I believe it's nigeria where ~65% of its elected officials are women) and as for 2: there are also tons of pidgins and creoles, so that's not a major concern</quote> 1) Foreign Aid needs to just stop, it's causing more problems then it's solving, that's on the Western Powers 2) Unified Pan-African Language is a local issue 3) Corrupt Leadership is a internal issue, locals have had the opportunities to throw out corrupt leadership in many cases and have done so before. 4) That's because their local Governments don't put a focus on that 5) Traditional Values from old times still linger and is a problem, but that's not a External Influence issue 6) That's a local values / education problem. People have tried to show them the value of Science and Empricism, not everybody takes to those ideals 7) That falls back to internal issues due to government / leadership 8) Well, people who migrate out chooses better opportunities for themselves / others. Can you blame them for wanting to leave? 9) Again, a local cultural issue. Many parts of the world don't have this issue. 10) That goes back to local issues with maintenance</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
mario2000 08/28/18 1:15:12 PM #128:	Anarchy_Juiblex posted... mario2000 posted... Existing power structures need to be eliminated. Wtf does this even mean exactly? You have a lot to read up on. --- Arrrr the SS Goku, Mighty fine boat... -fatmatt Hope Frieza doesn't chuck an Iceberg at the Goku, otherwise it's all over. -Nekoslash <cite>mario2000 posted [p:907692883] in Why is Afr... [t:76942539]...</cite> <quote><cite>Anarchy_Juiblex posted...</cite> <quote><cite>mario2000 posted...</cite> <quote>Existing power structures need to be eliminated.</quote> Wtf does this even mean exactly?</quote> You have a lot to read up on.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Anarchy_Juiblex 08/28/18 1:17:45 PM #129:	So it meant nothing more than a "fuck the west" dog whistle, figured as much. --- "Tolerance of intolerance is cowardice." ~ Ayaan Hirsi Ali <cite>Anarchy_Juiblex posted [p:907693024] in Why is Afr... [t:76942539]...</cite> <quote>So it meant nothing more than a "fuck the west" dog whistle, figured as much.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
mario2000 08/28/18 1:20:21 PM #130:	Anarchy_Juiblex posted... So it meant nothing more than a "fuck the west" dog whistle, figured as much. If you're the willfully ignorant, hyper-defensive insecure type, yes. --- Arrrr the SS Goku, Mighty fine boat... -fatmatt Hope Frieza doesn't chuck an Iceberg at the Goku, otherwise it's all over. -Nekoslash <cite>mario2000 posted [p:907693175] in Why is Afr... [t:76942539]...</cite> <quote><cite>Anarchy_Juiblex posted...</cite> <quote>So it meant nothing more than a "fuck the west" dog whistle, figured as much.</quote> If you're the willfully ignorant, hyper-defensive insecure type, yes.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Anarchy_Juiblex 08/28/18 1:21:59 PM #131:	How about answer the question if you're intellectually able to. --- "Tolerance of intolerance is cowardice." ~ Ayaan Hirsi Ali <cite>Anarchy_Juiblex posted [p:907693252] in Why is Afr... [t:76942539]...</cite> <quote>How about answer the question if you're intellectually able to.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
mario2000 08/28/18 1:23:52 PM #132:	Anarchy_Juiblex posted... How about answer the question if you're intellectually able to. You seem like you've already made up your mind on what you want the answer to be. --- Arrrr the SS Goku, Mighty fine boat... -fatmatt Hope Frieza doesn't chuck an Iceberg at the Goku, otherwise it's all over. -Nekoslash <cite>mario2000 posted [p:907693369] in Why is Afr... [t:76942539]...</cite> <quote><cite>Anarchy_Juiblex posted...</cite> <quote>How about answer the question if you're intellectually able to.</quote> You seem like you've already made up your mind on what you want the answer to be.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
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FLUFFYGERM 08/29/18 1:51:07 PM #134:	A lot of people mentioned a bunch of reasons already, but one thing people don't realize is how superstitious Africa is as a continent. Each country within has its own different, often times clashing, superstitions. And that can severely hold back entire populations from progressing technologically and culturally. Here's an example: http://www.cnn.com/2009/WORLD/africa/10/05/malawi.wind.boy/index.html amkwamba was kicked out of school when he couldn't pay $80 in school fees, and he spent his days at the library, where a book with photographs of windmills caught his eye. "I thought, this thing exists in this book, it means someone else managed to build this machine," he said. Armed with the book, the then-14-year-old taught himself to build windmills. He scoured through junkyards for items, including bicycle parts, plastic pipes, tractor fans and car batteries. For the tower, he collected wood from blue-gum trees. "Everyone laughed at me when I told them I was building a windmill. They thought I was crazy," he said. "Then I started telling them I was just playing with the parts. That sounded more normal." That was 2002. Now, he has five windmills, the tallest at 37 feet. He built one at an area school that he used to teach classes on windmill-building. The windmills generate electricity and pump water in his hometown, north of the capital, Lilongwe. Neighbors regularly trek across the dusty footpaths to his house to charge their cellphones. Others stop by to listen to Malawian reggae music blaring from a radio. When he started building the first windmill in 2002, word that he was "crazy" spread all over his village. Some people said he was bewitched -- a common description for people with perplexing behavior in some African cultures. "All of us, even my mother, thought that he had gone mad," said his sister Doris Kamkwamba. Villagers would surround him to snicker and point, Kamkwamba said. Ignoring them, he would quietly bolt pieces using a screwdriver made of a heated nail attached to a corncob. The heat -- from both the crowd and the melted, flattened pipes he used as blades -- did not deter him. --- Do good. Eat communists. <cite>FLUFFYGERM posted [p:907757870] in Why is Afr... [t:76942539]...</cite> <quote>A lot of people mentioned a bunch of reasons already, but one thing people don't realize is how superstitious Africa is as a continent. Each country within has its own different, often times clashing, superstitions. And that can severely hold back entire populations from progressing technologically and culturally. Here's an example: http://www.cnn.com/2009/WORLD/africa/10/05/malawi.wind.boy/index.html amkwamba was kicked out of school when he couldn't pay $80 in school fees, and he spent his days at the library, where a book with photographs of windmills caught his eye. "I thought, this thing exists in this book, it means someone else managed to build this machine," he said. Armed with the book, the then-14-year-old taught himself to build windmills. He scoured through junkyards for items, including bicycle parts, plastic pipes, tractor fans and car batteries. For the tower, he collected wood from blue-gum trees. "Everyone laughed at me when I told them I was building a windmill. They thought I was crazy," he said. "Then I started telling them I was just playing with the parts. That sounded more normal." That was 2002. Now, he has five windmills, the tallest at 37 feet. He built one at an area school that he used to teach classes on windmill-building. The windmills generate electricity and pump water in his hometown, north of the capital, Lilongwe. Neighbors regularly trek across the dusty footpaths to his house to charge their cellphones. Others stop by to listen to Malawian reggae music blaring from a radio. When he started building the first windmill in 2002, word that he was "crazy" spread all over his village. Some people said he was bewitched -- a common description for people with perplexing behavior in some African cultures. "All of us, even my mother, thought that he had gone mad," said his sister Doris Kamkwamba. Villagers would surround him to snicker and point, Kamkwamba said. Ignoring them, he would quietly bolt pieces using a screwdriver made of a heated nail attached to a corncob. The heat -- from both the crowd and the melted, flattened pipes he used as blades -- did not deter him.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
#135	Post #135 was unavailable or deleted.
FLUFFYGERM 08/29/18 2:10:08 PM #136:	CloneTheHero posted... @FLUFFYGERM that is a non issue. every cutlure in the world has ridiculous superstitions. europe had one of the worst bouts with superstitions during the dark ages. a period of over 900 years where science was blasphemy and considered devils work. and Europe eventually overcame that thanks to the Renaissance, the Enlightenment, the Scientific Revolution, etc. The countries that adopted those western values flourished and still flourish. Ultimately Africa will undergo (and is already undergoing) the same transformation and will become a superpower. Just like how India is leapfrogging old electricity distribution systems in favor of a grid relying heavily on solar panels, which will pay enormous dividends for centuries. every continent/nation/population develops at a different pace, and there are still a lot of places in Africa where superstition has held back progress in technology/science for the last several hundred years. take a gander at this horse shit for example https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C9SiRNibD14" data-time=" --- Do good. Eat communists. <cite>FLUFFYGERM posted [p:907758913] in Why is Afr... [t:76942539]...</cite> <quote><cite>CloneTheHero posted...</cite> <quote>@FLUFFYGERM that is a non issue. every cutlure in the world has ridiculous superstitions. europe had one of the worst bouts with superstitions during the dark ages. a period of over 900 years where science was blasphemy and considered devils work.</quote> and Europe eventually overcame that thanks to the Renaissance, the Enlightenment, the Scientific Revolution, etc. The countries that adopted those western values flourished and still flourish. Ultimately Africa will undergo (and is already undergoing) the same transformation and will become a superpower. Just like how India is leapfrogging old electricity distribution systems in favor of a grid relying heavily on solar panels, which will pay enormous dividends for centuries. every continent/nation/population develops at a different pace, and there are still a lot of places in Africa where superstition has held back progress in technology/science for the last several hundred years. take a gander at this horse shit for example https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C9SiRNibD14" data-time="</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Sativa_Rose 08/29/18 6:00:18 PM #137:	AmericaTheBrave posted... The Swahili coast was a major hub of the Indian Ocean trade network, a trade network that had been going on peacefully for hundreds of years before the Portuguese discovered it and disrupted it. Those damn Portuguese interfering with Omani imperialism! Oh wait. --- I may not go down in history, but I will go down on your sister. <cite>Sativa_Rose posted [p:907771167] in Why is Afr... [t:76942539]...</cite> <quote><cite>AmericaTheBrave posted...</cite> <quote>The Swahili coast was a major hub of the Indian Ocean trade network, a trade network that had been going on peacefully for hundreds of years before the Portuguese discovered it and disrupted it.</quote> Those damn Portuguese interfering with Omani imperialism! Oh wait.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
RoboLaserGandhi 08/29/18 6:03:32 PM #138:	uwnim posted... It was completely and utterly fucked by colonialism which didn't end until the mid 1900s. Some of the aid given to the countries there is counterproductive and hurts industrialization. I mean, it was indeed fucked by colonialism But they weren't exactly on the brink of change beforehand. Its not like the Europeans stifled their progress when they were never making any to begin with. <cite>RoboLaserGandhi posted [p:907771341] in Why is Afr... [t:76942539]...</cite> <quote><cite>uwnim posted...</cite> <quote>It was completely and utterly fucked by colonialism which didn't end until the mid 1900s. Some of the aid given to the countries there is counterproductive and hurts industrialization.</quote> I mean, it was indeed fucked by colonialism But they weren't exactly on the brink of change beforehand. Its not like the Europeans stifled their progress when they were never making any to begin with.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Zikten 08/29/18 6:07:32 PM #139:	Because they haven't located the Vibranium yet <cite>Zikten posted [p:907771548] in Why is Afr... [t:76942539]...</cite> <quote>Because they haven't located the Vibranium yet</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
PowerfulSageIRL 08/29/18 6:09:19 PM #140:	RoboLaserGandhi posted... uwnim posted... It was completely and utterly fucked by colonialism which didn't end until the mid 1900s. Some of the aid given to the countries there is counterproductive and hurts industrialization. I mean, it was indeed fucked by colonialism But they weren't exactly on the brink of change beforehand. Its not like the Europeans stifled their progress when they were never making any to begin with. actually, it's exactly like the europeans stifled their progress. stealing natural resources, devastating their homes, taking tons of people as slaves. do you really think that wouldn't set a culture back? <cite>PowerfulSageIRL posted [p:907771644] in Why is Afr... [t:76942539]...</cite> <quote><cite>RoboLaserGandhi posted...</cite> <quote><cite>uwnim posted...</cite> <quote>It was completely and utterly fucked by colonialism which didn't end until the mid 1900s. Some of the aid given to the countries there is counterproductive and hurts industrialization.</quote> I mean, it was indeed fucked by colonialism But they weren't exactly on the brink of change beforehand. Its not like the Europeans stifled their progress when they were never making any to begin with.</quote> actually, it's exactly like the europeans stifled their progress. stealing natural resources, devastating their homes, taking tons of people as slaves. do you really think that wouldn't set a culture back?</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Fuparulez 08/29/18 6:10:38 PM #141:	CloneTheHero posted... @FLUFFYGERM that is a non issue. every cutlure in the world has ridiculous superstitions. europe had one of the worst bouts with superstitions during the dark ages. a period of over 900 years where science was blasphemy and considered devils work. He said a superstitious society hinders technological development, and then you said he was wrong and pointed out a long period where Europe was extremely superstitious and had little technological development. What? --- It's the fat upper kitty area, and if you got one I wanna marry ya! <cite>Fuparulez posted [p:907771704] in Why is Afr... [t:76942539]...</cite> <quote><cite>CloneTheHero posted...</cite> <quote>@FLUFFYGERM that is a non issue. every cutlure in the world has ridiculous superstitions. europe had one of the worst bouts with superstitions during the dark ages. a period of over 900 years where science was blasphemy and considered devils work.</quote> He said a superstitious society hinders technological development, and then you said he was wrong and pointed out a long period where Europe was extremely superstitious and had little technological development. What?</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
RoboLaserGandhi 08/29/18 6:23:35 PM #142:	PowerfulSageIRL posted... RoboLaserGandhi posted... uwnim posted... It was completely and utterly fucked by colonialism which didn't end until the mid 1900s. Some of the aid given to the countries there is counterproductive and hurts industrialization. I mean, it was indeed fucked by colonialism But they weren't exactly on the brink of change beforehand. Its not like the Europeans stifled their progress when they were never making any to begin with. actually, it's exactly like the europeans stifled their progress. stealing natural resources, devastating their homes, taking tons of people as slaves. do you really think that wouldn't set a culture back? They were making literally zero headway for thousands of years. They were in essentially tribal homeostasis. <cite>RoboLaserGandhi posted [p:907772349] in Why is Afr... [t:76942539]...</cite> <quote><cite>PowerfulSageIRL posted...</cite> <quote><cite>RoboLaserGandhi posted...</cite> <quote><cite>uwnim posted...</cite> <quote>It was completely and utterly fucked by colonialism which didn't end until the mid 1900s. Some of the aid given to the countries there is counterproductive and hurts industrialization.</quote> I mean, it was indeed fucked by colonialism But they weren't exactly on the brink of change beforehand. Its not like the Europeans stifled their progress when they were never making any to begin with.</quote> actually, it's exactly like the europeans stifled their progress. stealing natural resources, devastating their homes, taking tons of people as slaves. do you really think that wouldn't set a culture back?</quote> They were making literally zero headway for thousands of years. They were in essentially tribal homeostasis.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Paragon21XX 08/29/18 6:24:32 PM #143:	Questionmarktarius posted... AmpV3 posted... Alphamon posted... s0nicfan posted... AmericaTheBrave posted... @s0nicfan, @Anarchy_Juiblex do you deny Europeans had a hand in Africa's problems? Of course they had a hand. The question is to what degree. Are you arguing that, completely absent European intervention, that Africa (sans Egypt) would have formed the kind of empires that Europe or China created? That even though there was no indication that they were developing technologically anywhere close to the rate of europe, or the middle east, or east asia, that they would have suddenly decided to modernize? What's to say they wouldn't have been like native americans and stuck to their current tribal lifestyles? uh oh Lol, even when trying to sound like he knows what he is talking about, sonic fails miserably. He literally thinks Africa is all like The Gods Must Be Crazy. What a fail. The biggest driver of "civilization" is the need to. It's no coincidence that civilizations tend to start in deserts and tundras, while being largely absent in tropical paradises or areas where seasonal migration is easy. The biggest driver of advanced civilization is alcohol (and later on, bread). Civilizations have sprung up mainly because of the scale of agriculture needed to grow enough grains to make sufficient quantities of beer and bread for the year. Where there is a lack of grain agriculture is generally a lack of advanced civilization. --- Hmm... <cite>Paragon21XX posted [p:907772400] in Why is Afr... [t:76942539]...</cite> <quote><cite>Questionmarktarius posted...</cite> <quote><cite>AmpV3 posted...</cite> <quote><cite>Alphamon posted...</cite> <quote><cite>s0nicfan posted...</cite> <quote><cite>AmericaTheBrave posted...</cite> <quote>@s0nicfan, @Anarchy_Juiblex do you deny Europeans had a hand in Africa's problems?</quote> Of course they had a hand. The question is to what degree. Are you arguing that, completely absent European intervention, that Africa (sans Egypt) would have formed the kind of empires that Europe or China created? That even though there was no indication that they were developing technologically anywhere close to the rate of europe, or the middle east, or east asia, that they would have suddenly decided to modernize? What's to say they wouldn't have been like native americans and stuck to their current tribal lifestyles?</quote> uh oh</quote> Lol, even when trying to sound like he knows what he is talking about, sonic fails miserably. He literally thinks Africa is all like The Gods Must Be Crazy. What a fail.</quote> The biggest driver of "civilization" is the need to. It's no coincidence that civilizations tend to start in deserts and tundras, while being largely absent in tropical paradises or areas where seasonal migration is easy.</quote> The biggest driver of advanced civilization is alcohol (and later on, bread). Civilizations have sprung up mainly because of the scale of agriculture needed to grow enough grains to make sufficient quantities of beer and bread for the year. Where there is a lack of grain agriculture is generally a lack of advanced civilization.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
NOM 08/29/18 6:24:44 PM #144:	Because George Bush doesn't care about black people. --- I dream broken dreams I make them come true <cite>NOM posted [p:907772407] in Why is Afr... [t:76942539]...</cite> <quote>Because George Bush doesn't care about black people.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
PowerfulSageIRL 08/29/18 6:26:26 PM #145:	RoboLaserGandhi posted... PowerfulSageIRL posted... RoboLaserGandhi posted... uwnim posted... It was completely and utterly fucked by colonialism which didn't end until the mid 1900s. Some of the aid given to the countries there is counterproductive and hurts industrialization. I mean, it was indeed fucked by colonialism But they weren't exactly on the brink of change beforehand. Its not like the Europeans stifled their progress when they were never making any to begin with. actually, it's exactly like the europeans stifled their progress. stealing natural resources, devastating their homes, taking tons of people as slaves. do you really think that wouldn't set a culture back? They were making literally zero headway for thousands of years. They were in essentially tribal homeostasis. sources? <cite>PowerfulSageIRL posted [p:907772486] in Why is Afr... [t:76942539]...</cite> <quote><cite>RoboLaserGandhi posted...</cite> <quote><cite>PowerfulSageIRL posted...</cite> <quote><cite>RoboLaserGandhi posted...</cite> <quote><cite>uwnim posted...</cite> <quote>It was completely and utterly fucked by colonialism which didn't end until the mid 1900s. Some of the aid given to the countries there is counterproductive and hurts industrialization.</quote> I mean, it was indeed fucked by colonialism But they weren't exactly on the brink of change beforehand. Its not like the Europeans stifled their progress when they were never making any to begin with.</quote> actually, it's exactly like the europeans stifled their progress. stealing natural resources, devastating their homes, taking tons of people as slaves. do you really think that wouldn't set a culture back?</quote> They were making literally zero headway for thousands of years. They were in essentially tribal homeostasis.</quote> sources?</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
RoboLaserGandhi 08/29/18 6:27:10 PM #146:	PowerfulSageIRL posted... RoboLaserGandhi posted... PowerfulSageIRL posted... RoboLaserGandhi posted... uwnim posted... It was completely and utterly fucked by colonialism which didn't end until the mid 1900s. Some of the aid given to the countries there is counterproductive and hurts industrialization. I mean, it was indeed fucked by colonialism But they weren't exactly on the brink of change beforehand. Its not like the Europeans stifled their progress when they were never making any to begin with. actually, it's exactly like the europeans stifled their progress. stealing natural resources, devastating their homes, taking tons of people as slaves. do you really think that wouldn't set a culture back? They were making literally zero headway for thousands of years. They were in essentially tribal homeostasis. sources? For general knowledge? lol <cite>RoboLaserGandhi posted [p:907772535] in Why is Afr... [t:76942539]...</cite> <quote><cite>PowerfulSageIRL posted...</cite> <quote><cite>RoboLaserGandhi posted...</cite> <quote><cite>PowerfulSageIRL posted...</cite> <quote><cite>RoboLaserGandhi posted...</cite> <quote><cite>uwnim posted...</cite> <quote>It was completely and utterly fucked by colonialism which didn't end until the mid 1900s. Some of the aid given to the countries there is counterproductive and hurts industrialization.</quote> I mean, it was indeed fucked by colonialism But they weren't exactly on the brink of change beforehand. Its not like the Europeans stifled their progress when they were never making any to begin with.</quote> actually, it's exactly like the europeans stifled their progress. stealing natural resources, devastating their homes, taking tons of people as slaves. do you really think that wouldn't set a culture back?</quote> They were making literally zero headway for thousands of years. They were in essentially tribal homeostasis.</quote> sources?</quote> For general knowledge? lol</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
ManBeast462 08/29/18 6:27:28 PM #147:	The SJWs are in such denial lol --- https://imgur.com/EKKJrY6 <cite>ManBeast462 posted [p:907772558] in Why is Afr... [t:76942539]...</cite> <quote>The SJWs are in such denial lol</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Sativa_Rose 08/29/18 6:28:17 PM #148:	People need to remember that it's not like all Europeans advanced at the same time. Technological innovations that came out of certain areas of Europe (like Britain) would later spread to other parts of the continent over time. Hell, my mother was born in a village in Greece in the early 1960s that still didn't have electricity or indoor plumbing. Did the wealthy in cities like Athens have access to these technologies? I'm sure they did. However, they had not yet become ubiquitous across the country. I'm sure countries like Britain were way ahead in this regard, by many decades probably. So my overall point is to just remind people that there were also huge differences between European nations. The geographic proximity certainly made it easier for technological advancements in one area to spread to others. Parts of the world that were more isolated in terms of their contact with other peoples did not advance nearly as much. --- I may not go down in history, but I will go down on your sister. <cite>Sativa_Rose posted [p:907772609] in Why is Afr... [t:76942539]...</cite> <quote>People need to remember that it's not like all Europeans advanced at the same time. Technological innovations that came out of certain areas of Europe (like Britain) would later spread to other parts of the continent over time. Hell, my mother was born in a village in Greece in the early 1960s that still didn't have electricity or indoor plumbing. Did the wealthy in cities like Athens have access to these technologies? I'm sure they did. However, they had not yet become ubiquitous across the country. I'm sure countries like Britain were way ahead in this regard, by many decades probably. So my overall point is to just remind people that there were also huge differences between European nations. The geographic proximity certainly made it easier for technological advancements in one area to spread to others. Parts of the world that were more isolated in terms of their contact with other peoples did not advance nearly as much.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
FLUFFYGERM 08/29/18 6:30:41 PM #149:	PowerfulSageIRL posted... RoboLaserGandhi posted... uwnim posted... It was completely and utterly fucked by colonialism which didn't end until the mid 1900s. Some of the aid given to the countries there is counterproductive and hurts industrialization. I mean, it was indeed fucked by colonialism But they weren't exactly on the brink of change beforehand. Its not like the Europeans stifled their progress when they were never making any to begin with. actually, it's exactly like the europeans stifled their progress. stealing natural resources, devastating their homes, taking tons of people as slaves. do you really think that wouldn't set a culture back? Different tribes in Africa were engaging in a much larger and longer slave trade with each other and with Arabian nations before the Europeans really got involved. --- Do good. Eat communists. <cite>FLUFFYGERM posted [p:907772752] in Why is Afr... [t:76942539]...</cite> <quote><cite>PowerfulSageIRL posted...</cite> <quote><cite>RoboLaserGandhi posted...</cite> <quote><cite>uwnim posted...</cite> <quote>It was completely and utterly fucked by colonialism which didn't end until the mid 1900s. Some of the aid given to the countries there is counterproductive and hurts industrialization.</quote> I mean, it was indeed fucked by colonialism But they weren't exactly on the brink of change beforehand. Its not like the Europeans stifled their progress when they were never making any to begin with.</quote> actually, it's exactly like the europeans stifled their progress. stealing natural resources, devastating their homes, taking tons of people as slaves. do you really think that wouldn't set a culture back?</quote> Different tribes in Africa were engaging in a much larger and longer slave trade with each other and with Arabian nations before the Europeans really got involved.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
PowerfulSageIRL 08/29/18 6:32:22 PM #150:	RoboLaserGandhi posted... For general knowledge? lol unless you can show a whole lot of good sources for that claim, I'm gonna assume it's based on nothing but ignorance and racism <cite>PowerfulSageIRL posted [p:907772855] in Why is Afr... [t:76942539]...</cite> <quote><cite>RoboLaserGandhi posted...</cite> <quote>For general knowledge? lol</quote> unless you can show a whole lot of good sources for that claim, I'm gonna assume it's based on nothing but ignorance and racism</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Current Events > Why is Africa so poor of a continent? (+) Yeah! (+)

Current Events > Why is Africa so poor of a continent?