Board 8 > All-Purpose Wrestling Topic 458: WWE going under.

(+) Yeah! (+)

50yo men running around telling folk to suck it... Is this WHAT the Industry has become?

*shakes head*

Confession: I still own a DX football Jersey from the height of their popularity, though purchased it post-DX.
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"Listen Jericho, I've got no problem with you. You just stay on your boat, playing your dad rock, and we'll be alright." - Zack Sabre Jr.

please give me this

A bit random, but I just watched it

Last weeks episode of the Mae Young Classic has a strong case for being the best non-Takeover WWE show of the year

Honestly its between that and a couple 205 Tournament episodes
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"Becky loses title on disqualification"

Oh gee. Way to telegraph the finish.
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8 p.m. 2.53 million viewers
9 p.m. 2.39 million viewers
10 p.m. 2.20 million viewers

This is what counts as a post-PPV ratings boost these days
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It's mind boggling that Ronda/Nikki are going to main event Evolution over Becky/Charlotte (likely no DQ/no Countout). Ronda has heavily scripted matches still, and Nikki is Nikki. Meanwhile, two of the best women in the business are taking a backseat to them. Just plain wrong.

I'd love to know what Becky and Charlotte are talking about there while acting unconscious.
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Ronda and Nikki drive the most business. Its fine
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I think Charlotte wrecked her arm there. It was either bleeding or heavily scratched/bruised.
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Is it really the first Last Woman Standing Match in WWE? It seemed like they ran through all the match stipulations already.
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Jakyl25 posted...

Ronda and Nikki drive the most business. Its fine

I disagree that its fine. They might drive more business, but the buildup and match itself isnt going to come anywhere near what Becky and Charlotte can do. This is a special event, and neither of those two have earned that spot over Charlotte or Becky, and the match they put on isnt going to compare, even if its completely scripted.

It looked pretty bad while they showed her arm, and they cut away from things pretty fast. Hope its nothing more than stitches.
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Best promo in a long time?

I'd like anyone to beat that. They hit everything they needed to, mixed humor with drive and determination, and Miz brought it at the end...Damn.

Hey WWE? Could you let people off the leash more often?
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Daniel Bryan came off as such a tool on commentary good lord
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hot
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RaidenGarai posted...

I disagree that its fine. They might drive more business, but the buildup and match itself isnt going to come anywhere near what Becky and Charlotte can do. This is a special event, and neither of those two have earned that spot over Charlotte or Becky, and the match they put on isnt going to compare, even if its completely scripted.

ronda has absolutely earned that spot. she's already made the wwe more money than anyone else in their history.

I question that.

What money has she made them exactly? She can't be making them that much money since they're struggling to sell out tickets for the Evolution PPV.
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PrivateBiscuit1 posted...

I question that.

What money has she made them exactly? She can't be making them that much money since they're struggling to sell out tickets for the Evolution PPV.

the new tv deals.

It's difficult to say Ronda is the reason for the new TV deals considering it's mostly their consistent ratings that sold it more than anything else.
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Ronda is a "proven star" in a way no one else they have on the show regularly is unless Cena is around.
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Yes, I know she's a proven star, and she gets publicity, but there is no evidence to prove she is drawing anymore money than anyone else. If she was a drawing money maker, we would have a sold out Evolution PPV or Raw that isn't hitting record lows.
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for what it's worth, i think there's merit in discussing whether she is the most valuable star they've ever had.

i just don't think there's merit in discussing who should be headlining this ppv.

I think Brock is the most valuable star they've had, as there is a noted increase when he's around. This is partially because he is seldom around.

There is no noted increase from Ronda anymore. There was before, but not anymore.

If they had Ronda in a pre-Roman era it might work. But with these ratings she, nor Brock, is a draw anymore.
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Sweet I'm glad we're discussing reasonable things now

Fwiw, I do think there's merit in discussing if she's a draw because that's how everyone felt when she first signed that it would bring a ton of women and viewers into wrestling, but I think once she's here every week it's why it fell off. She has a noted boost until she became just another girl on the roster. But that's because WWE fails to make anyone feel special and they book to make sure nobody gets over except a dude who nobody really likes.
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The real answer is that no one in WWE is a draw. The brand as a whole is the draw.
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You're wrong.

Stephanie McMahon is a draw, because she is the God, Law, and Ruler of WWE and graces all of us with her benevolence and lady balls to teach us NO ONE is above her and that everything in wrestling was her idea, and that the only person who can be is her husband, the King of Kings, but only because she allows him to be.
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https://twitter.com/WWE/status/1049721721647857664?s=19

Becky is so great tho
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Strife2 posted...

You're wrong.

Stephanie McMahon is a draw, because she is the God, Law, and Ruler of WWE and graces all of us with her benevolence and lady balls to teach us NO ONE is above her and that everything in wrestling was her idea, and that the only person who can be is her husband, the King of Kings, but only because she allows him to be.

I said the brand was the draw. Steph is clearly the brand, duh.
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PrivateBiscuit1 posted...

I think Brock is the most valuable star they've had, as there is a noted increase when he's around. This is partially because he is seldom around.

There is no noted increase from Ronda anymore. There was before, but not anymore.

If they had Ronda in a pre-Roman era it might work. But with these ratings she, nor Brock, is a draw anymore.

True but what does putting championships on a man who doesn't NEED one at this stage in his career?

Brock achieved everything he could before 27.
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Owens needs knee surgery, hope is that it's not serious. Won't know until they get in there.

Dammit.
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Maybe he shouldnt have been falling off of ladders and cages to put Braun over as a face when he was just gonna turn heel
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NBIceman posted...

The real answer is that no one in WWE is a draw. The brand as a whole is the draw.

Yeah I used the word "star" on purpose.

No one draws. But she is a tentpole around which WWE can build. A statement which applies to almost no one else on the roster.

Everyone else is generic wrestledudes regardless of talent level.
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RaidenGarai posted...

Owens needs knee surgery, hope is that it's not serious. Won't know until they get in there.

Dammit.

Please say this was the case before raw
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I just watched raw last night

Was disappointed with turning lashley. I was interested in seeing where he was going. Like the stuff with kinder before owen attacked had me wanting to see more. Now its just oh Corbin was right he does have anger issues and lio rush is using his jock friend as a meat shield

Which could still be cool, but I think he had more face life to him before this turn
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that's the worst take on raw i can imagine

turning lashley was the best thing they've done on that show in months

Jakyl25 posted...

Maybe he shouldnt have been falling off of ladders and cages to put Braun over as a face when he was just gonna turn heel

Yuuuup. Don't forget taking bumps in portojohns too. Maybe when he said he quit he was actually supposed to get his surgery then. But then they needed him around for... I dunno that dumb Australia show? I don't see the point in him sticking around after that if he was going to get surgery.
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ScareChan posted...

RaidenGarai posted...

Owens needs knee surgery, hope is that it's not serious. Won't know until they get in there.

Dammit.

Please say this was the case before raw

It was. The Lashley heel turn was the excuse for writing him off TV for a while
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https://twitter.com/thekingnickgage/status/1049831046756409344

god i want to see this

I could've sworn I thought Big Show announced his retirement earlier this year. But then again isn't Mark Henry retired and yet he appeared at Greatest Royal Rumble. Pro wrestling retirements really don't stick
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Big Show 'retired' against Strowman in the cage match iirc
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ffmasterjose posted...

Pro wrestling retirements really don't stick

Really I hadn't noticed

:p
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In news absolutely no one will care about, Mike Kanellis is now on 205 (Not Really) Live.
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That could work
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It gives him screen time, which is more than they can say for his time on Smackdown.
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Strife2 posted...

It gives him screen time, which is more than they can say for his time on Smackdown.

He actually went to Raw in the most recent draft, but I'm not sure more than 10 people noticed.
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Drake Maverick with his own nexus would be interesting
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Oooh aye that was a grand NXT.

THAT'S a fucking Main Event!

Yeah, it seemed like a finisher-spamfest but it delivered, more than either show on the main roster this week.

205 also continues to have great events... Maybe this are the seeds for Cedric to either change up his persona after second-guessing himsekf after BTB losses.
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From a Cena interview:

On Roman Reigns struggling to get over with the WWE Universe: "Roman has it tough. I kind of ruined this for everybody; the content and the format change did. Attitude Era was male 18-35. And our program still draws males 18-35. But we're a PG program. Which means your audience is a six year old. I don't say don't cater to the male 18-35, but your audience starts at six or younger. So you have to give them essentially Shrek or Cars, or the Lego movie. Sometimes 18-35 year old dudes don't want to watch the Lego movie. Don't think there's not a second in my mind that our audience isn't six. Our audience is so mixed that there's never going to be a good guy that appeals to everyone.

"Even if it's someone that the fans endorse and become the guy; it's a thing where the fans are like, 'Okay, you as a company are going with this guy? No you're not because we get to choose!' When Roman was with The Shield, everybody loved him. He didn't really change much. He was soft spoken, his actions spoken for him, he performs incredibly well. Yet there's a giant uprising because a lot of it is, 'You can't tell us what to like.' And that's okay; it's just tough waters to navigate as a company and it is tough to build stars. You have to look at your consumers and the analytics. People really like Roman Reigns. And the numbers are there to prove it."

"Letting Roman know that there is another level to the game. And if you don't step up to that level, you don't have the right to call yourself someone at that level. That's what my job with Roman was supposed to be. The great thing with Roman is that he understood that and was open to it. You want to talk about being vulnerable and letting it all hang out. He got his teeth knocked out verbally and shot back with what I thought was one of his best performances. Over the story arc of five weeks, he did learn. There were slip-ups at the beginning, but by the end it was one of his best emotional investments in a program he's been in."

I shrug.
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I mean, he's not completely wrong. Roman moves merch well.

But that may be the biggest indicator that Lopen has even part of an argument that live audiences differ from TV viewers, because it is a sort of odd case where merch numbers suggest he's popular but the ratings don't. He sells the most of anybody outside of Cena despite having like, half of the merch of people like Styles and Rollins, so there's an argument there that he's certainly popular with someone.

I think Cena actually kinda nailed it. WWE's currently giving us the Lego Movie. Sometimes we like the Lego Movie. But we don't want to watch the Lego Movie all the time. But WWE is stuck on making us watch the Lego Movie because it checks all their boxes and at one time everybody liked the Lego movie. They don't want to accept it's making us all change the channel.
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I would argue that WWE being in it's biggest slump is more of an indicator they should change their top guy.

But pointing to merch numbers to try and say Roman is most popular is a bit disengenuous. If any face got the push Roman got, they would be selling loads of merch too. You force somebody to be your top guy and then he moves more merch than everyone else and it's just like of course?

If they pushed somebody that everyone likes, they'd probably sell a ton more merch.

I see the validity of the Lego Movie comparison. But I think it's the fact that WWE gave us over a decade of Cena at the top followed by what will be a decade of Roman on top and I think that sort of fatigue is a major factor too.
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Chelsea Green was signed by WWE :(
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