Current Events > Can someone explain where this belief that white people are victims of racism...

(+) Yeah! (+)

Guide posted...

RoboLaserGandhi posted...

Guide posted...

RoboLaserGandhi posted...

Well the fact that common perception these days is very anti-white in any circle that isn't old/conservative/traditional is where the majority of white persecution comes from. There's this pervasive idea that anything predominantly white is tangentially associated with racism, isolationism, ignorance, and selfishness. This colors the opinions of many young people and so they attempt to stray away from whiteness and eschew anything that isn't multicultural or of another culture. In more blunt terms, white guilt. People don't want to be associated with the "upperdog" because an accusation of racism can destroy your social standing.

This is not a conclusion you could come to from interaction with human beings.

What kind of circumstances would cause you to just flatly deny this entire thing? Curious.

Interacting with a wide variety of people and this not being a thing. Not in a church, or a mosque, or college, or on vacation, or at work.

I've only ever seen the kind of thing you're saying on fringe right wing sites or people who quote those sites on forums and twitter.

Where, in your life, does this happen exactly?

I feel like you're either lying, unobservant, or you vastly overestimate the breadth of experiences you have.

Regardless, your counter-argument is based on an anecdote.

Pretty ignorant to act like if it doesn't happen to you it couldn't happen to anyone else. I'm white but I'm also a minority both where I live and where I work and have experienced both casual racism and racism that isn't so casual.
---

RoboLaserGandhi posted...

Guide posted...

RoboLaserGandhi posted...

Guide posted...

RoboLaserGandhi posted...

Well the fact that common perception these days is very anti-white in any circle that isn't old/conservative/traditional is where the majority of white persecution comes from. There's this pervasive idea that anything predominantly white is tangentially associated with racism, isolationism, ignorance, and selfishness. This colors the opinions of many young people and so they attempt to stray away from whiteness and eschew anything that isn't multicultural or of another culture. In more blunt terms, white guilt. People don't want to be associated with the "upperdog" because an accusation of racism can destroy your social standing.

This is not a conclusion you could come to from interaction with human beings.

What kind of circumstances would cause you to just flatly deny this entire thing? Curious.

Interacting with a wide variety of people and this not being a thing. Not in a church, or a mosque, or college, or on vacation, or at work.

I've only ever seen the kind of thing you're saying on fringe right wing sites or people who quote those sites on forums and twitter.

Where, in your life, does this happen exactly?

I feel like you're either lying, unobservant, or you vastly overestimate the breadth of experiences you have.

Regardless, your counter-argument is based on an anecdote.

It's not a counter argument because you never had one to counter. You made a statement without anything to back it up, and I made a statement against yours, so an anecdote is fine. What's telling is that you're not answering my question.

YourDrunkFather posted...

Pretty ignorant to act like if it doesn't happen to you it couldn't happen to anyone else. I'm white but I'm also a minority both where I live and where I work and have experienced both casual racism and racism that isn't so casual.

As has been stated more than once in this topic already, there's a difference between personal and systemic. I don't doubt your experiences and that doesn't actually have to do with what the other guy said.
---

I love the idea that it shouldn't even be acknowledged, but it's even better because that shit comes from people who spend hours on here arguing about how harmful racism is. I don't think it's an epidemic or any of that shit, but goddamn, at least acknowledge it and say it shouldn't happen, instead of downplaying it or flat out denying its existence.

And then the only people who will acknowledge it and speak out against it in any meaningful capacity are alt-right loons, so you can point and say "look, only racists care about this".
---

That isn't even true in this very topic.
---

Because the US is the entire world, right?

RoboLaserGandhi posted...

First off, there is no white privilege. That's just a way for disadvantaged minorities to frame the situation in such a way that they can be angry at white people. To claim that normal living conditions are a privilege and that the true normal state is being unfairly discriminated against is false, and implies that white people need to be discriminated against.

Wow, you sure convinced me
---

scar the 1 posted...

RoboLaserGandhi posted...

First off, there is no white privilege. That's just a way for disadvantaged minorities to frame the situation in such a way that they can be angry at white people. To claim that normal living conditions are a privilege and that the true normal state is being unfairly discriminated against is false, and implies that white people need to be discriminated against.

Wow, you sure convinced me

---

Guide posted...

It's not a counter argument because you never had one to counter. You made a statement without anything to back it up, and I made a statement against yours, so an anecdote is fine. What's telling is that you're not answering my question.

This is not something I just came up with on the spot. This is something you can observe from simply consuming media. I just put it into words.

Admittedly, yes, you don't see this kind of sentiment as often face to face (unless you're on a college campus), but it underlies the actions and attitudes of many young people. It has tangible effects as well, notably in business. Take a look at any major company's diversity initiatives, especially those in silicon valley.

shnangyboos posted...

I love the idea that it shouldn't even be acknowledged, but it's even better because that shit comes from people who spend hours on here arguing about how harmful racism is. I don't think it's an epidemic or any of that shit, but goddamn, at least acknowledge it and say it shouldn't happen, instead of downplaying it or flat out denying its existence.

And then the only people who will acknowledge it and speak out against it in any meaningful capacity are alt-right loons, so you can point and say "look, only racists care about this".

It's because the community here has a very hard time accepting things that aren't simplistically categorized absolutes. Logical fallacies like "either white people or minorities are 'the victim'. You can't have both."

See what I mean? What media are you consuming that you have the "young people" all figured out? How far have you gone to actually verify it?

Was I right about your fringe right wing news sources, or is this coming from fox news?
---

Guide posted...

See what I mean? What media are you consuming that you have the "young people" all figured out? How far have you gone to actually verify it?

Probably just Jordan Peterson YouTube lectures lol

FursonaNonGrata posted...

RoboLaserGandhi posted...

Well the fact that common perception these days is very anti-white in any circle that isn't old/conservative/traditional is where the majority of white persecution comes from. There's this pervasive idea that anything predominantly white is tangentially associated with racism, isolationism, ignorance, and selfishness. This colors the opinions of many young people and so they attempt to stray away from whiteness and eschew anything that isn't multicultural or of another culture. In more blunt terms, white guilt. People don't want to be associated with the "upperdog" because an accusation of racism can destroy your social standing.

Sounds like youre projecting your (racist) beliefs onto others in an attempt to logically justify your own racism. Most of this new wave feaux intellectual alt-right bullshit is just thinly veiled projection.

Lol. Case in point. He says something discussing whites in a non-negative manner, you assume hes a racist.

Just lol. Reading comprehension, not even once.
---

If you have a race, you can experience racism. Seems obvious.

EdgeMaster posted...

FursonaNonGrata posted...

RoboLaserGandhi posted...

Well the fact that common perception these days is very anti-white in any circle that isn't old/conservative/traditional is where the majority of white persecution comes from. There's this pervasive idea that anything predominantly white is tangentially associated with racism, isolationism, ignorance, and selfishness. This colors the opinions of many young people and so they attempt to stray away from whiteness and eschew anything that isn't multicultural or of another culture. In more blunt terms, white guilt. People don't want to be associated with the "upperdog" because an accusation of racism can destroy your social standing.

Sounds like youre projecting your (racist) beliefs onto others in an attempt to logically justify your own racism. Most of this new wave feaux intellectual alt-right bullshit is just thinly veiled projection.

Lol. Case in point. He says something discussing whites in a non-negative manner, you assume hes a racist.

Just lol. Reading comprehension, not even once.

The irony is astounding.
---

Guide posted...

See what I mean? What media are you consuming that you have the "young people" all figured out? How far have you gone to actually verify it?

Was I right about your fringe right wing news sources, or is this coming from fox news?

See all I had to do was throw the word "media" in there and you jumped immediately to the assumption that this is an alt-right argument.

By the way, this is an observation of left-wing and "apolitical" media, not second-hand right-wing narratives of such media, which are always extremely transparent.

If you have any shred of social contextual awareness you can pick up on the attitudes of society's (admittedly varied) views on white people.

Guide posted...

EdgeMaster posted...

FursonaNonGrata posted...

RoboLaserGandhi posted...

Well the fact that common perception these days is very anti-white in any circle that isn't old/conservative/traditional is where the majority of white persecution comes from. There's this pervasive idea that anything predominantly white is tangentially associated with racism, isolationism, ignorance, and selfishness. This colors the opinions of many young people and so they attempt to stray away from whiteness and eschew anything that isn't multicultural or of another culture. In more blunt terms, white guilt. People don't want to be associated with the "upperdog" because an accusation of racism can destroy your social standing.

Sounds like youre projecting your (racist) beliefs onto others in an attempt to logically justify your own racism. Most of this new wave feaux intellectual alt-right bullshit is just thinly veiled projection.

Lol. Case in point. He says something discussing whites in a non-negative manner, you assume hes a racist.

Just lol. Reading comprehension, not even once.

The irony is astounding.

I dont think you know what that word means.
---

FursonaNonGrata posted...

RoboLaserGandhi posted...

Well the fact that common perception these days is very anti-white in any circle that isn't old/conservative/traditional is where the majority of white persecution comes from. There's this pervasive idea that anything predominantly white is tangentially associated with racism, isolationism, ignorance, and selfishness. This colors the opinions of many young people and so they attempt to stray away from whiteness and eschew anything that isn't multicultural or of another culture. In more blunt terms, white guilt. People don't want to be associated with the "upperdog" because an accusation of racism can destroy your social standing.

Sounds like youre projecting your (racist) beliefs onto others in an attempt to logically justify your own racism. Most of this new wave feaux intellectual alt-right bullshit is just thinly veiled projection.

Using "you're projecting" as an argument is literally a faux-intellectual way of saying "no you".

White privilege just means that when controlled for all other variables, society will be more helpful to a white person than a non-white person. Its been proven repeatedly in criminal sentencing, employment, and housing.
---

P4wn4g3 posted...

MrPeppers posted...

Doom_Art posted...

...comes from?

I'm white (and how!) and I can't say I've ever felt discriminated against in any meaningful way

Work in a predominantly Hispanic area then tell me how you feel.

I live in NM... here at lunch in the fast food place 7 out of 8 of the people in view are Hispanic and having Spanish conversations. I feel at ease. Maybe they just hate you because you're blatantly racist.

That's either some intense projection or a gross misunderstanding of my post. Most of it is benign and stereotyping, but it's very existent. I've been actually discriminated against once or twice, but I honestly don't care enough. I live on the Texas-Mexico border.
---

White people definitely can be victims of racism.

Institutionalized racism is something different, however. That's what you get into when you're talking about a white mass murderer being taken into custody peacefully vs. a black guy running away from a cop being shot in the back for instance.
---

MrPeppers posted...

P4wn4g3 posted...

MrPeppers posted...

Doom_Art posted...

...comes from?

I'm white (and how!) and I can't say I've ever felt discriminated against in any meaningful way

Work in a predominantly Hispanic area then tell me how you feel.

I live in NM... here at lunch in the fast food place 7 out of 8 of the people in view are Hispanic and having Spanish conversations. I feel at ease. Maybe they just hate you because you're blatantly racist.

That's either some intense projection or a gross misunderstanding of my post. Most of it is benign and stereotyping, but it's very existent. I've been actually discriminated against once or twice, but I honestly don't care enough. I live on the Texas-Mexico border.

Given your username and area, are you a fellow chilihead or is it a Brian Peppers reference?

I'm white and I've been followed by cops, followed by authority, pulled over while driving many times, singled out in groups of other people, all types of racist shit has happened to me. Hopefully one day the racism towards white people will end.
---

RoboLaserGandhi posted...

FursonaNonGrata posted...

RoboLaserGandhi posted...

Well the fact that common perception these days is very anti-white in any circle that isn't old/conservative/traditional is where the majority of white persecution comes from. There's this pervasive idea that anything predominantly white is tangentially associated with racism, isolationism, ignorance, and selfishness. This colors the opinions of many young people and so they attempt to stray away from whiteness and eschew anything that isn't multicultural or of another culture. In more blunt terms, white guilt. People don't want to be associated with the "upperdog" because an accusation of racism can destroy your social standing.

Sounds like youre projecting your (racist) beliefs onto others in an attempt to logically justify your own racism. Most of this new wave feaux intellectual alt-right bullshit is just thinly veiled projection.

Using "you're projecting" as an argument is literally a faux-intellectual way of saying "no you".

Still a more legitimate argument than all the crap youve been spewing ITT. Youre literally just passing off your own incoherent racist ramblings as commentary on how society works.

How isn't it coherent? Do you observe the world around you and how things have become over the past few years?

SaithSayer posted...

MrPeppers posted...

P4wn4g3 posted...

MrPeppers posted...

Doom_Art posted...

...comes from?

I'm white (and how!) and I can't say I've ever felt discriminated against in any meaningful way

Work in a predominantly Hispanic area then tell me how you feel.

I live in NM... here at lunch in the fast food place 7 out of 8 of the people in view are Hispanic and having Spanish conversations. I feel at ease. Maybe they just hate you because you're blatantly racist.

That's either some intense projection or a gross misunderstanding of my post. Most of it is benign and stereotyping, but it's very existent. I've been actually discriminated against once or twice, but I honestly don't care enough. I live on the Texas-Mexico border.

Given your username and area, are you a fellow chilihead or is it a Brian Peppers reference?

Man I love me some peppers but it's actually a play on my name.
---

DiScOrD tHe LuNaTiC posted...

White people definitely can be victims of racism.

Institutionalized racism is something different, however. That's what you get into when you're talking about a white mass murderer being taken into custody peacefully vs. a black guy running away from a cop being shot in the back for instance.

Lol you cant shoot fleeing felons. Nice try though.

FursonaNonGrata posted...

RoboLaserGandhi posted...

FursonaNonGrata posted...

RoboLaserGandhi posted...

Well the fact that common perception these days is very anti-white in any circle that isn't old/conservative/traditional is where the majority of white persecution comes from. There's this pervasive idea that anything predominantly white is tangentially associated with racism, isolationism, ignorance, and selfishness. This colors the opinions of many young people and so they attempt to stray away from whiteness and eschew anything that isn't multicultural or of another culture. In more blunt terms, white guilt. People don't want to be associated with the "upperdog" because an accusation of racism can destroy your social standing.

Sounds like youre projecting your (racist) beliefs onto others in an attempt to logically justify your own racism. Most of this new wave feaux intellectual alt-right bullshit is just thinly veiled projection.

Using "you're projecting" as an argument is literally a faux-intellectual way of saying "no you".

Still a more legitimate argument than all the crap youve been spewing ITT. Youre literally just passing off your own incoherent racist ramblings as commentary on how society works.

And yet you have no actual argument. Just feeble attempts at calling him racist because he said something you didnt like.
---

MrPeppers posted...

SaithSayer posted...

MrPeppers posted...

P4wn4g3 posted...

MrPeppers posted...

Doom_Art posted...

...comes from?

I'm white (and how!) and I can't say I've ever felt discriminated against in any meaningful way

Work in a predominantly Hispanic area then tell me how you feel.

I live in NM... here at lunch in the fast food place 7 out of 8 of the people in view are Hispanic and having Spanish conversations. I feel at ease. Maybe they just hate you because you're blatantly racist.

That's either some intense projection or a gross misunderstanding of my post. Most of it is benign and stereotyping, but it's very existent. I've been actually discriminated against once or twice, but I honestly don't care enough. I live on the Texas-Mexico border.

Given your username and area, are you a fellow chilihead or is it a Brian Peppers reference?

Man I love me some peppers but it's actually a play on my name.

Do you grow them? Most people don't expand their horizons on this nearly as much as one can. Hundreds of peppers in most every heat range.

SaithSayer posted...

MrPeppers posted...

SaithSayer posted...

MrPeppers posted...

P4wn4g3 posted...

MrPeppers posted...

Doom_Art posted...

...comes from?

I'm white (and how!) and I can't say I've ever felt discriminated against in any meaningful way

Work in a predominantly Hispanic area then tell me how you feel.

I live in NM... here at lunch in the fast food place 7 out of 8 of the people in view are Hispanic and having Spanish conversations. I feel at ease. Maybe they just hate you because you're blatantly racist.

That's either some intense projection or a gross misunderstanding of my post. Most of it is benign and stereotyping, but it's very existent. I've been actually discriminated against once or twice, but I honestly don't care enough. I live on the Texas-Mexico border.

Given your username and area, are you a fellow chilihead or is it a Brian Peppers reference?

Man I love me some peppers but it's actually a play on my name.

Do you grow them? Most people don't expand their horizons on this nearly as much as one can. Hundreds of peppers in most every heat range.

No, but that's actually something I could get into. I just have to find the time. I have this morning off so maybe I'll do a little bit of researching to see how feasible it'd be. Any recommended reading?
---

www.thehotpepper.com has tons of reading and isn't dull.

www.peppersbymail.com is a good seed source.

RoboLaserGandhi posted...

Guide posted...

See what I mean? What media are you consuming that you have the "young people" all figured out? How far have you gone to actually verify it?

Was I right about your fringe right wing news sources, or is this coming from fox news?

See all I had to do was throw the word "media" in there and you jumped immediately to the assumption that this is an alt-right argument.

By the way, this is an observation of left-wing and "apolitical" media, not second-hand right-wing narratives of such media, which are always extremely transparent.

If you have any shred of social contextual awareness you can pick up on the attitudes of society's (admittedly varied) views on white people.

I didn't say anything about the alt-right. It's definitely a right wing argument, but the alt right is a specific subgroup, not just any extreme of the right.

The rest of your post isn't really anything of substance.
---

EdgeMaster posted...

DiScOrD tHe LuNaTiC posted...

White people definitely can be victims of racism.

Institutionalized racism is something different, however. That's what you get into when you're talking about a white mass murderer being taken into custody peacefully vs. a black guy running away from a cop being shot in the back for instance.

Lol you cant shoot fleeing felons. Nice try though.

You're not supposed to. It would be incredibly stupid to say that it doesn't happen anyway.
---

King_Hellebuyck posted...

White privilege just means that when controlled for all other variables, society will be more helpful to a white person than a non-white person. Its been proven repeatedly in criminal sentencing, employment, and housing.

Privilege implies that they are treated above and beyond what is expected. In reality, white people are being treated as any majority group in any country would be. Use some common sense. Why would white people be treated specially when they are ~70% of people? "White privilege" dodges the issue of minority discrimination for being different and instead tries to drum up feelings of shame for being white, de-legitimizes white people's life successes, and allows a more socially acceptable outlet for passive aggressive envy of this idealized image of white people. "White privilege" should not ever be taken any more seriously than equivalent hot-take positions on the right, yet it's thrown around in academia as if it weren't.

EdgeMaster posted...

DiScOrD tHe LuNaTiC posted...

White people definitely can be victims of racism.

Institutionalized racism is something different, however. That's what you get into when you're talking about a white mass murderer being taken into custody peacefully vs. a black guy running away from a cop being shot in the back for instance.

Lol you cant shoot fleeing felons. Nice try though.

Look, EdgeLord420 or whatever your name is, Tennessee v. Garner clearly says that law enforcment aren't supposed to use lethal force on a fleeing suspect unless they have probable cause that the suspect is an imminent danger to others.

The two cases I cited were Dylan Roof (murdered 9 people and was taken into custody with no trouble); as opposed to the murder of Walter Scott (shot in the back while fleeing a police officer, who then tried to frame Scott for attempted murder). In the former, you could make the argument that Roof could in fact have been a danger to others, given that he'd killed nine people. In the latter, Scott was pulled over because of a broken tail light. Not exactly Charles Manson.
---

RoboLaserGandhi posted...

King_Hellebuyck posted...

White privilege just means that when controlled for all other variables, society will be more helpful to a white person than a non-white person. Its been proven repeatedly in criminal sentencing, employment, and housing.

Privilege implies that they are treated above and beyond what is expected. In reality, white people are being treated as any majority group in any country would be. Use some common sense. Why would white people be treated specially when they are ~70% of people? "White privilege" dodges the issue of minority discrimination for being different and instead tries to drum up feelings of shame for being white, de-legitimizes white people's life successes, and allows a more socially acceptable outlet for passive aggressive envy of this idealized image of white people. "White privilege" should not ever be taken any more seriously than equivalent hot-take positions on the right, yet it's thrown around in academia as if it weren't.

Youre factually incorrect.
---

King_Hellebuyck posted...

RoboLaserGandhi posted...

King_Hellebuyck posted...

White privilege just means that when controlled for all other variables, society will be more helpful to a white person than a non-white person. Its been proven repeatedly in criminal sentencing, employment, and housing.

Privilege implies that they are treated above and beyond what is expected. In reality, white people are being treated as any majority group in any country would be. Use some common sense. Why would white people be treated specially when they are ~70% of people? "White privilege" dodges the issue of minority discrimination for being different and instead tries to drum up feelings of shame for being white, de-legitimizes white people's life successes, and allows a more socially acceptable outlet for passive aggressive envy of this idealized image of white people. "White privilege" should not ever be taken any more seriously than equivalent hot-take positions on the right, yet it's thrown around in academia as if it weren't.

Youre factually incorrect.

lmao, of course it doesn't exist when he makes up his own definition for it
---