Current Events > So Trump thinks you should be able to die for this country (unless you're trans)

(+) Yeah! (+)

https://www.npr.org/2018/11/24/670557054/white-house-asks-supreme-court-to-fast-track-ruling-on-transgender-military-ban

Wasnt this deleted?
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zN7VSeja1dw" data-time="

Kazi1212 posted...

Wasnt this deleted?

Modified the wording.

I'm starting to think that maybe he isn't that LGBT friendly
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Honestly curious as to why people would seriously vote yes. Being Trans has zero impact on your ability to do your job. Anyone who feels uncomfortable about it (for whatever irrational reason) should grow up.

fine fine whatever
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So thats it? No yes votes have the balls to defend their position? At least you acknowledge your position isnt based on any sort of logic.

CiIantro posted...

So thats it? No yes votes have the balls to defend their position? At least you acknowledge your position isnt based on any sort of logic.

I don't want them to die for me
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catboy0_0 posted...

CiIantro posted...

So thats it? No yes votes have the balls to defend their position? At least you acknowledge your position isnt based on any sort of logic.

I don't want them to die for me

I can agree with that.

I don't even want to die for me
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slimfizzle2 posted...

catboy0_0 posted...

CiIantro posted...

So thats it? No yes votes have the balls to defend their position? At least you acknowledge your position isnt based on any sort of logic.

I don't want them to die for me

I can agree with that.

I don't even want to die for me

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I don't want transgendered people to feel any sort of obligation nor pressure to join the military. They already have enough to deal with don't propaganda them up to be martyrs.
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Frankly no one should want to die over the current state of the US.
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catboy0_0 posted...

I don't want transgendered people to feel any sort of obligation nor pressure to join the military. They already have enough to deal with don't propaganda them up to be martyrs.

That's not how transgendered people view it, though, especially not the ones who are actively serving and who have contributed a lot to the service and who planned on making a career out of it.
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No.

Hexenherz posted...

catboy0_0 posted...

I don't want transgendered people to feel any sort of obligation nor pressure to join the military. They already have enough to deal with don't propaganda them up to be martyrs.

That's not how transgendered people view it, though, especially not the ones who are actively serving and who have contributed a lot to the service and who planned on making a career out of it.

if that is true then I think Trump is wrong
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GET OUT THE TRUMPET
TRUMP lS WRONG (AGAIN) ABOUT SOMETHING
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catboy0_0 posted...

GET OUT THE TRUMPET
TRUMP lS WRONG (AGAIN) ABOUT SOMETHING

Extra, extra, read all about it!
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catboy0_0 posted...

Hexenherz posted...

catboy0_0 posted...

I don't want transgendered people to feel any sort of obligation nor pressure to join the military. They already have enough to deal with don't propaganda them up to be martyrs.

That's not how transgendered people view it, though, especially not the ones who are actively serving and who have contributed a lot to the service and who planned on making a career out of it.

if that is true then I think Trump is wrong

Here's the crux of the issue:

Transgenderism was an automatic, unwaiverable disqualifier from military service for the longest time.

President Obama lifted that ban and had the DoD allow openly transgender service members. The policy was to first let currently serving members with gender dysphoria get medical treatment plans and transition when appropriate (as their command/mission allowed), and then later (I believe it was to be one or two years after the enactment of the policy) start allowing new transgender accessions.

As soon as Trump took office he immediately challenged that policy on Twitter, without even consulting the DoD directly, which instantly threw a ton of people into a panic, since generally orders and policy come down through the chain of command, not blasted out over Twitter.

Obama's policy remains in effect for now, and of course many transgender service members have come out and started their treatment and even fully transitioned since it was enacted, but if Trump reverses that policy those service members could easily be kicked out. Which is really disturbing, especially if someone's riding at 18 years in and only needs 2 more to retire.
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Hexenherz posted...

Transgenderism was an automatic, unwaiverable disqualifier from military service for the longest time.

Why? It isnt based on any sort of factual evidence proving them to be inferior. The fact is that they have been in the military for ages, and kicking them out now (after they have come out), is nothing more than a political ploy. He is using them as a punching bag to appease his religious extremist base.

CiIantro posted...

Hexenherz posted...

Transgenderism was an automatic, unwaiverable disqualifier from military service for the longest time.

Why? It isnt based on any sort of factual evidence proving them to be inferior. The fact is that they have been in the military for ages, and kicking them out now (after they have come out), is nothing more than a political ploy. He is using them as a punching bag to appease his religious extremist base.

It was considered a mental disorder, and most mental disorders are automatically disqualifying, especially if they require any sort of ongoing medication or special treatment plans.

edit: It's not necessarily about inferiority or anything like that, it's about mission readiness, and it doesn't necessarily make sense to stop someone's complex treatment plan for the sake of undergoing an arduous training pipeline with the possibility that they wouldn't be able to resume that treatment for a while.
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Hexenherz posted...

It was considered a mental disorder, and most mental disorders are automatically disqualifying, especially if they require any sort of ongoing medication or special treatment plans.

The American Psychological Association no longer considers it a disorder, and plenty of service members are on medications.

CiIantro posted...

Hexenherz posted...

It was considered a mental disorder, and most mental disorders are automatically disqualifying, especially if they require any sort of ongoing medication or special treatment plans.

The American Psychological Association no longer considers it a disorder, and plenty of service members are on medications.

Most service members who are on medications did not join already taking those medications though, and realistically the military isn't necessarily on the verge of following any American Psychological Association findings (look at how long it took DADT to get repealed).
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Hexenherz posted...

CiIantro posted...

Hexenherz posted...

It was considered a mental disorder, and most mental disorders are automatically disqualifying, especially if they require any sort of ongoing medication or special treatment plans.

The American Psychological Association no longer considers it a disorder, and plenty of service members are on medications.

Most service members who are on medications did not join already taking those medications though, and realistically the military isn't necessarily on the verge of following any American Psychological Association findings (look at how long it took DADT to get repealed).

So you acknowledge the transgender ban is based on emotion and not science?

CiIantro posted...

So thats it? No yes votes have the balls to defend their position? At least you acknowledge your position isnt based on any sort of logic.

Lol

Is this your first time making a poll on here? There have been polls asking if rape should be legal and a number of anonymous votes for 'yes'

WhyYouSoSTANK posted...

Is this your first time making a poll on here?

ahahahahahahaha

CiIantro posted...

Hexenherz posted...

CiIantro posted...

Hexenherz posted...

It was considered a mental disorder, and most mental disorders are automatically disqualifying, especially if they require any sort of ongoing medication or special treatment plans.

The American Psychological Association no longer considers it a disorder, and plenty of service members are on medications.

Most service members who are on medications did not join already taking those medications though, and realistically the military isn't necessarily on the verge of following any American Psychological Association findings (look at how long it took DADT to get repealed).

So you acknowledge the transgender ban is based on emotion and not science?

No.

First of all, I don't acknowledge anything, I'm posting my own personal viewpoints of the events in this topic.

Secondly, I'm explaining to you what I think the government's take on the matter is.

You're kind of ignoring things like basic military operations and mission readiness by assuming the military should just allow anyone to join without regard to specific medical needs and requirements. That's not an emotional argument at all.

edit: I'm also not personally trying to say that there should be a ban, but at the same time it's a very complex issue and it's also not right to try to claim that all transgender people should be allowed whenever they try to apply because there are many things to consider there.

Hell, you need a medical waiver to join after using certain types of acne medication.
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