Current Events > can someone explain to me how my pick up advice is creepy?

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No_U_L7
06/24/19 7:24:32 AM
#51:


Jerry_Hellyeah posted...
Somewhere else? The fuck is turning someone on in Burger King?


therein lies the problem, people are so conditioned to stay in their comfort zones and avoid anything with even a modicum of possible awkwardness they'd rather be passive than actually try.

it's like i'm galileo telling everyone the earth is round but yall are insisting it's flat
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Jerry_Hellyeah
06/24/19 7:24:57 AM
#52:


YookaLaylee posted...
Jerry_Hellyeah posted...
Shablagoo posted...
Joelypoely posted...
Chicken posted...
The only thing creeper than a pickup artist is a guy who pretends to be a pickup artist on a video game forum full of complete strangers.


Got em. But honestly this gimmick is very entertaining.

But honestly is that advice creepy for someone who is looking to get to know a Burger King cashier? What is a less creepy way to approach her?


Somewhere else? The fuck is turning someone on in Burger King?

All that meat. And how can you not get moist when you see those buns?


Im not gonna lie, their onion rings arent the worst. If I got a nice warm one that was plump and juicy enough....I might try some "pickup" and follow it to its car.
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randomdude360
06/24/19 7:28:30 AM
#53:


I can't see the fuss either. I've read over a lot of pretty awful pickup artist techniques and TC only appears to be offering basic but sound advice about opportune time/place. Its not like he's trying to teach you how to manipulate women with subliminal body language or using dumb psychology tricks like some of the worst examples I've seen.

And its not creepy to hit on people at work unless you're being creepy about it.
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A_A_Battery
06/24/19 7:28:40 AM
#54:


No_U_L7 posted...
when i'm talking to a girl, i lie maybe only about 2% of the time and even then it's only small lies ("my friends just went home" to explain why i'm at the bar by myself)


It is manipulative though because in the end you just want what you want. To that end you will use calculated tactics and manipulation.

The fact that you would lie about why you are alone or whatever is itself an indicator that something is wrong. Lying in general is not something to be used outside of emergency situations, and so when you catch yourself having to use a little lie here, then another one there, etc just for the sake of picking this girl up, it's manipulation. It is made even worse when the culture you are in specifically revolves around these methods.

Moreover there is a narcissistic aspect to it where the pick up artist believes they are desirable for whatever reason and are entitled to go after what "you want" without regard for the means. When you're in that game, you're lying and you're manipulating. You are absolutely not "being yourself", as it is far too easy to resort to dropping one "small" lie after another, feigning interest in whatever this girl has going on in her life even if you couldn't care less, and "adjusting your inputs" regardless of whether or not those inputs are grounded in reality. You say you do not do this in so many words, but in other places it is indicated that you do some of it. Moreover there is no reason for me to believe everything you say about yourself here when you already state that you make small lies here and there for the sake of The Game. Pick up artists do not lie only "2%" of the time, that is so skewed. You can't expect us to just take a pick up artist's word for something like that when again, the entire nature of the game revolves around lying and manipulation. There is nothing natural about it.
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Shablagoo
06/24/19 7:37:50 AM
#55:


randomdude360 posted...
I can't see the fuss either. I've read over a lot of pretty awful pickup artist techniques and TC only appears to be offering basic but sound advice about opportune time/place. Its not like he's trying to teach you how to manipulate women with subliminal body language or using dumb psychology tricks like some of the worst examples I've seen.

And its not creepy to hit on people at work unless you're being creepy about it.

Agreed. Ive seen people give creepy advice about how to (supposedly) manipulate women. This isnt that at all.
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No_U_L7
06/24/19 7:40:07 AM
#56:


A_A_Battery posted...
No_U_L7 posted...
when i'm talking to a girl, i lie maybe only about 2% of the time and even then it's only small lies ("my friends just went home" to explain why i'm at the bar by myself)


It is manipulative though because in the end you just want what you want. To that end you will use calculated tactics and manipulation.

The fact that you would lie about why you are alone or whatever is itself an indicator that something is wrong. Lying in general is not something to be used outside of emergency situations, and so when you catch yourself having to use a little lie here, then another one there, etc just for the sake of picking this girl up, it's manipulation. It is made even worse when the culture you are in specifically revolves around these methods.

Moreover there is a narcissistic aspect to it where the pick up artist believes they are desirable for whatever reason and are entitled to go after what "you want" without regard for the means. When you're in that game, you're lying and you're manipulating. You are absolutely not "being yourself", as it is far too easy to resort to dropping one "small" lie after another, feigning interest in whatever this girl has going on in her life even if you couldn't care less, and "adjusting your inputs" regardless of whether or not those inputs are grounded in reality. You say you do not do this in so many words, but in other places it is indicated that you do some of it. Moreover there is no reason for me to believe everything you say about yourself here when you already state that you make small lies here and there for the sake of The Game. Pick up artists do not lie only "2%" of the time, that is so skewed. You can't expect us to just take a pick up artist's word for something like that when again, the entire nature of the game revolves around lying and manipulation. There is nothing natural about it.


1. it isn't just what i want. it takes 2 people to hang out and it takes 2 people to have sex. girls like good company. all i'm doing is helping them realize why i'm a good choice and a good partner.
2. i would (and have previously) explained to girls why i'm out alone (i like to meet new people, push my boundaries, etc). it takes too much effort to explain, some girls don't understand it, some girls love it, and some girls think it's creepy. it doesn't help me enough that i want to spend the time it takes to have that conversation. there's much more important stuff i want to talk to the girl about. i'm not hiding anything, rather i just want to avoid having a conversation that is ultimately useless.
3. idk what to tell you...everybody lies. by realizing when i do it and why, i'm fine with it. i lie way less than anyone else out to meet girls, so i'm fine with it. i usually don't lie...because i don't need to. i'm a great guy and i don't need to lie about why.
4. that said, of course i play up certain things more. i travel maybe 6 weeks out of the year....but because i focus on it so much, it dominates more than it should. but literally everyone does this. it's what people do in job interviews. it's what people do on dates. none of it is a lie, it just conveys a slightly more exciting lifestyle than it actually is.
5. you're also projecting a lot about pick up artists and how you want to look down on them. i've spent a lot of time with pick up artists. the vast majority of them are not the way you describe. they are just guys with little experience with girls trying to gain more experience and meet a girl they can marry.
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A_A_Battery
06/24/19 8:02:47 AM
#57:


No_U_L7 posted...
1. it isn't just what i want. it takes 2 people to hang out and it takes 2 people to have sex. girls like good company. all i'm doing is helping them realize why i'm a good choice and a good partner.
2. i would (and have previously) explained to girls why i'm out alone (i like to meet new people, push my boundaries, etc). it takes too much effort to explain, some girls don't understand it, some girls love it, and some girls think it's creepy. it doesn't help me enough that i want to spend the time it takes to have that conversation. there's much more important stuff i want to talk to the girl about. i'm not hiding anything, rather i just want to avoid having a conversation that is ultimately useless.
3. idk what to tell you...everybody lies. by realizing when i do it and why, i'm fine with it. i lie way less than anyone else out to meet girls, so i'm fine with it. i usually don't lie...because i don't need to. i'm a great guy and i don't need to lie about why.
4. that said, of course i play up certain things more. i travel maybe 6 weeks out of the year....but because i focus on it so much, it dominates more than it should. but literally everyone does this. it's what people do in job interviews. it's what people do on dates. none of it is a lie, it just conveys a slightly more exciting lifestyle than it actually is.
5. you're also projecting a lot about pick up artists and how you want to look down on them. i've spent a lot of time with pick up artists. the vast majority of them are not the way you describe. they are just guys with little experience with girls trying to gain more experience and meet a girl they can marry.


Yeah but your post is full of contradictions. So point no. 1, we see sex is mentioned first thing along with "yeah I'm pretty awesome". Okay, noted. But at point no. 5, they ultimately want to marry the girl, in which case it should absolutely not be all about sex. Again, we see the true nature of it peek out at us here and there. The "white lies" and manipulation is ultimately for sex.

Not only that, but if truly marriage was the goal, then a potential marriage partner should absolutely have an accurate picture, not one that is overly embellished.

Next, "everybody lies", but you do it way less than anyone else out to meet girls (boy am I lucky to be talking to that one guy. who lies less than all the others...), yet at the same time "pick up artists don't use manipulation... they just want a girl they can marry."
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No_U_L7
06/24/19 8:07:38 AM
#58:


A_A_Battery posted...
Yeah but your post is full of contradictions. So point no. 1, we see sex is mentioned first thing along with "yeah I'm pretty awesome". Okay, noted. But at point no. 5, they ultimately want to marry the girl, in which case it should absolutely not be all about sex. Again, we see the true nature of it peek out at us here and there. The "white lies" and manipulation is ultimately for sex.

Not only that, but if truly marriage was the goal, then a potential marriage partner should absolutely have an accurate picture, not one that is overly embellished.

Next, "everybody lies", but you do it way less than anyone else out to meet girls (boy am I lucky to be talking to that one guy. who lies less than all the others...), yet at the same time "pick up artists don't use manipulation... they just want a girl they can marry."


everyone wants different things. i said a lot of pick up artists do want to get married. i, personally do not. but i make that clearly known from the start. i try not assume any sort of a relationship...i meet a cool girl, get to know her, maybe hook up, maybe hang out more. or maybe we'll just hate each other. the entire point is to get to know each other better at the start. i just don't view sex as a big deal and it just part of getting to know each other better. i adjust as the relationship progresses...just like anyone else does. on a long enough timeline girls get to know me better...just like in any relationship. sounds like you just have issues with how relationships work
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karlpilkington4
06/24/19 8:14:05 AM
#59:


Explaining basic social and pickup skills to people who never even leave their house, is a losing battle TC. Specifically on CE. People hate what they don't understand. Their ego won't let them understand.
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No_U_L7
06/24/19 8:15:04 AM
#60:


karlpilkington4 posted...
Explaining basic social and pickup skills to people who never even leave their house, is a losing battle TC. Specifically on CE. People hate what they don't understand. Their ego won't let them understand.


p much lol...
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hockeybub89
06/24/19 8:38:35 AM
#61:


Would someone good with the ladies need to flirt with fast food cashiers to try and get some?

Are they good with the ladies if they're never keeping a lady?

Being a successful PUA is like proudly saying quitting cigarettes is easy because you do it all the time.
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A_A_Battery
06/24/19 8:43:33 AM
#62:


No_U_L7 posted...
everyone wants different things. i said a lot of pick up artists do want to get married. i, personally do not. but i make that clearly known from the start. i try not assume any sort of a relationship...i meet a cool girl, get to know her, maybe hook up, maybe hang out more. or maybe we'll just hate each other. the entire point is to get to know each other better at the start. i just don't view sex as a big deal and it just part of getting to know each other better. i adjust as the relationship progresses...just like anyone else does. on a long enough timeline girls get to know me better...just like in any relationship. sounds like you just have issues with how relationships work


You asked in the topic why some would view it as creepy or manipulative, I gave the reasons I have.
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karlpilkington4
06/24/19 8:49:56 AM
#63:


hockeybub89 posted...
Would someone good with the ladies need to flirt with fast food cashiers to try and get some?

Are they good with the ladies if they're never keeping a lady?

Being a successful PUA is like proudly saying quitting cigarettes is easy because you do it all the time.


Long term monogamy and settling, is why the divorce rate is over 50%. It barely works. So no, your analogy is inaccurate to say the least.
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No_U_L7
06/24/19 8:55:02 AM
#64:


hockeybub89 posted...
Would someone good with the ladies need to flirt with fast food cashiers to try and get some?

Are they good with the ladies if they're never keeping a lady?

Being a successful PUA is like proudly saying quitting cigarettes is easy because you do it all the time.


1. are you looking down at girls because they work at BK?
2. who said anything about never keeping a lady? regardless, everyone wants different things...i prefer much more casual relationships and that's the direction i steer all my relationships. do you have a problem with my preferences?
3. that analogy probably sounded better in your head. one is a positive correlation and the other is a negative correlation, you can't compare them. being a good pick up artist means you understand seduction. being good at quitting cigarettes means you'll stop doing something, ie not need to quit more than once
4. everyone wants different things...id prefer you didn't attempt to shame me for my desires in life. i have never foisted my views on marriage to others...but yes, i personally view marriage as an antiquated trap. not all pick up artists think that way. but i grew up in an abusive home and i'm emotionally unavailable and massively introverted. so once again, i reiterate that everyone wants different things.
5. i have NEVER claimed to be a relationship expert
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#65
Post #65 was unavailable or deleted.
karlpilkington4
06/24/19 9:02:54 AM
#66:


Nall posted...
Guys, you realize TC is a gimmick, right? Why are you all taking him so seriously?


Because we were all wanting you to come in here and post this. It all made our day! AAA post. Very original.
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Tmaster148
06/24/19 9:17:22 AM
#67:


Imagine needing to be explained why hitting on a girl working in the service industry is creepy.
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TheKingOf-Kings
06/24/19 9:18:41 AM
#68:


Tmaster148 posted...
Imagine needing to be explained why hitting on a girl working in the service industry is creepy.

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No_U_L7
06/24/19 9:20:24 AM
#69:


Tmaster148 posted...
Imagine needing to be explained why hitting on a girl working in the service industry is creepy.


imagine needing to explain why talking to girls is ok
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karlpilkington4
06/24/19 9:26:37 AM
#70:


Tmaster148 posted...
Imagine needing to be explained why hitting on a girl working in the service industry is creepy.


Yea she seems very creeped out/ohwaitnoshedoesnt

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UN6sq9QQTfU" data-time="

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Tupacrulez
06/24/19 9:28:07 AM
#71:


Reminder that TC said he'd fuck a 13 year old if he found her attractive and it was legal.
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Tmaster148
06/24/19 9:46:20 AM
#72:


No_U_L7 posted...
Tmaster148 posted...
Imagine needing to be explained why hitting on a girl working in the service industry is creepy.


imagine needing to explain why talking to girls is ok


Poor thing you don't even know the difference between normally talking to the cashier or waitress and being a creep.
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No_U_L7
06/24/19 9:53:28 AM
#73:


Tmaster148 posted...
Poor thing you don't even know the difference between normally talking to the cashier or waitress and being a creep.


Poor thing, you don't even know the difference between smoothly flirting with the cashier and being a creep.
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Tmaster148
06/24/19 9:57:55 AM
#74:


No_U_L7 posted...
Tmaster148 posted...
Poor thing you don't even know the difference between normally talking to the cashier or waitress and being a creep.


Poor thing, you don't even know the difference between smoothly flirting with the cashier and being a creep.


No one is smoothly flirting with a person being paid to deal with it against their own will.
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karlpilkington4
06/24/19 9:59:33 AM
#75:


Acknowledging Tmaster for more than 4 seconds is not advised.
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No_U_L7
06/24/19 10:00:47 AM
#76:


Tmaster148 posted...
No one is smoothly flirting with a person being paid to deal with it against their own will.


Enjoy living your life in your box
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No_U_L7
06/24/19 10:01:06 AM
#77:


karlpilkington4 posted...
Acknowledging Tmaster for more than 4 seconds is not advised.


you're probably right
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Tmaster148
06/24/19 10:02:32 AM
#78:


No_U_L7 posted...
Tmaster148 posted...
No one is smoothly flirting with a person being paid to deal with it against their own will.


Enjoy living your life in your box


If that's the best you can come up with you must also really be a bad PUA.
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No_U_L7
06/24/19 10:03:49 AM
#79:


Tmaster148 posted...
No_U_L7 posted...
Tmaster148 posted...
No one is smoothly flirting with a person being paid to deal with it against their own will.


Enjoy living your life in your box


If that's the best you can come up with you must also really be a bad PUA.


i guess @karlpilkington4 was right lol
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-Cipher-
06/24/19 10:03:52 AM
#80:


Being a male is creepy

How dare you ask a woman out
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Tmaster148
06/24/19 10:06:46 AM
#81:


-Cipher- posted...
Being a male is creepy

How dare you ask a woman out


It's creepy to hit on a women who are forced to deal with and can't leave because they are currently working. Not because you are a guy.
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No_U_L7
06/24/19 10:08:41 AM
#82:


Tmaster148 posted...
It's creepy to hit on a women who are forced to deal with and can't leave because they are currently working. Not because you are a guy.


why is it that in every scenario, the guy is going straight into forceful flirting and the girl is hating it? start talking and feel it out...adjust appropriately
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Tmaster148
06/24/19 10:10:30 AM
#83:


No_U_L7 posted...
Tmaster148 posted...
It's creepy to hit on a women who are forced to deal with and can't leave because they are currently working. Not because you are a guy.


why is it that in every scenario, the guy is going straight into forceful flirting and the girl is hating it? start talking and feel it out...adjust appropriately


Just don't flirt people who are just trying to work.

The only reason you would do so is because you know if tried to talk to any other women they would just walk away whereas a women currently working does not have they option.
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No_U_L7
06/24/19 10:13:05 AM
#84:


Tmaster148 posted...
Just don't flirt people who are just trying to work.

The only reason you would do so is because you know if tried to talk to any other women they would just walk away whereas a women currently working does not have they option.


lol i guess karl was right after all....

1. blanket statement unsupported by facts
2. attacking the person instead of the argument

now i know for sure i am right lol
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Tmaster148
06/24/19 10:16:03 AM
#85:


If you want to be a creep who only goes after people who are currently working go ahead.

I feel sad for you because it means instead of trying to improve yourself to be more attractive you only go after people who can't immediately walk away.
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karlpilkington4
06/24/19 10:17:27 AM
#86:


No_U_L7 posted...


lol i guess karl was right after all....



No need to guess. I only post facts
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Guide
06/24/19 10:21:31 AM
#87:


There was an idea that got popular about how all pickup tactics are all creepy all the time, cause some asshole with a furry tophat made a book and introduced "negging" to the public. That guy is a creep and an asshole, but that doesn't mean all pick ups are creepy things for asshole.

Social manipulation is a constant and normal thing all the time, and it is integral to "acting natural" and being yourself. You do things you wouldn't do with other people, and say things you wouldn't say to other people, based on whom you're interacting with, all the time.
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No_U_L7
06/24/19 10:27:06 AM
#88:


Tmaster148 posted...
If you want to be a creep who only goes after people who are currently working go ahead.

I feel sad for you because it means instead of trying to improve yourself to be more attractive you only go after people who can't immediately walk away.


lol doubling down on the blanket statements without supporting facts/attacking the person and not the argument. i give people as much thought as they deserve....you officially deserve none

Guide posted...
There was an idea that got popular about how all pickup tactics are all creepy all the time, cause some asshole with a furry tophat made a book and introduced "negging" to the public. That guy is a creep and an asshole, but that doesn't mean all pick ups are creepy things for asshole.

Social manipulation is a constant and normal thing all the time, and it is integral to "acting natural" and being yourself. You do things you wouldn't do with other people, and say things you wouldn't say to other people, based on whom you're interacting with, all the time.


pretty much. because of that pick up has p much swung in the opposite direction...with people being ridiculously truthful because "you are enough"

being aware of what you are doing is a good thing
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teepan95
06/24/19 10:37:49 AM
#89:


...well then

fkees
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No_U_L7
06/24/19 10:39:19 AM
#90:


teepan95 posted...
...well then

fkees


the advice i'm giving you comes from 10+ years of studying and applying the arts of attraction and seduction. it is the absolute best advice you'll get. even the absolute pros will give you p much the exact same advice.
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RescueBC
06/24/19 11:02:32 AM
#91:


Be yourself...unless youre someone who adjusts to who youre talking to..
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No_U_L7
06/24/19 11:07:12 AM
#92:


RescueBC posted...
Be yourself...unless youre someone who adjusts to who youre talking to..


Did you not read the part where I said you adjust while still being yourself. People are complicated. They have depth. I'm an engineer. I'm a pick up artist. I'm a party boy. I'm a gambler. I'm a mens wear enthusiast. I am all of the above...there's a large range of adjustment before you leap into lying
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Ultima Dragon
06/24/19 11:12:36 AM
#93:


No_U_L7 posted...
Tmaster148 posted...
It's creepy to hit on a women who are forced to deal with and can't leave because they are currently working. Not because you are a guy.


why is it that in every scenario, the guy is going straight into forceful flirting and the girl is hating it? start talking and feel it out...adjust appropriately


Didn't you know? Women aren't real people with agency and the ability to have their own wants and make their own choices. They're incapable of communicating that they're uncomfortable or not interested, and cannot say no to any romantic or sexual advances. They're helpless children and we must protect them at all costs. The average man should avoid all verbal or physical contact with them, even eye contact or being in close proximity, as one would avoid interacting with a child that is not theirs. If you try to initiate contact of any kind you are literally raping them.
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Guide
06/24/19 11:29:36 AM
#94:


RescueBC posted...
Be yourself, youre someone who adjusts to who youre talking to.


Fixed. This is normal for human beings. Not doing so is symptom for certain psychological or physiological conditions. You use different tones of voice, postures, and eye contact, even among different nuclear family members.
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looked
06/24/19 12:40:15 PM
#95:


its not creepy at all. You just have read people. If they are holding a conversation with you, just keep going. But if they dont seem like they really want to be bothered, you back off.

Or you can be so scared of offending people that you never interact with anyone. Im sure most of this board would suggest this.
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A_A_Battery
06/24/19 12:45:34 PM
#96:


Guide posted...
RescueBC posted...
Be yourself, youre someone who adjusts to who youre talking to.


Fixed. This is normal for human beings. Not doing so is symptom for certain psychological or physiological conditions. You use different tones of voice, postures, and eye contact, even among different nuclear family members.


Yeah but I think we all know that's not what goes on in pick up artistry. Yeah I act a certain way with my father as opposed to my wife as opposed to my brother as opposed to my children. Those are all different roles I play and have varying degrees of formality.

Pick up artists project a bunch of stuff about themselves to potential targets for the ultimate goal of getting in bed with them, as a general principle. They are not, by and large, interested in commitment. Women are just one trophy after the next. TC claims otherwise, but that is what the movement is associated with. There have been people, before pickup artists, who learned how to be natural and approach a girl without needing to be manipulative. And while I may have my own personal beliefs as to what is ideal, I do distinguish between a natural encounter with a potential versus a guy who just wants to weasel his way into a (typically temporary) relationship.
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No_U_L7
06/24/19 6:09:02 PM
#97:


A_A_Battery posted...
Guide posted...
RescueBC posted...
Be yourself, youre someone who adjusts to who youre talking to.


Fixed. This is normal for human beings. Not doing so is symptom for certain psychological or physiological conditions. You use different tones of voice, postures, and eye contact, even among different nuclear family members.


Yeah but I think we all know that's not what goes on in pick up artistry. Yeah I act a certain way with my father as opposed to my wife as opposed to my brother as opposed to my children. Those are all different roles I play and have varying degrees of formality.

Pick up artists project a bunch of stuff about themselves to potential targets for the ultimate goal of getting in bed with them, as a general principle. They are not, by and large, interested in commitment. Women are just one trophy after the next. TC claims otherwise, but that is what the movement is associated with. There have been people, before pickup artists, who learned how to be natural and approach a girl without needing to be manipulative. And while I may have my own personal beliefs as to what is ideal, I do distinguish between a natural encounter with a potential versus a guy who just wants to weasel his way into a (typically temporary) relationship.


And you are projecting a lot of things onto pick up artists. As the user mentioned, that was mystery method bullshit. That is not what is done any more
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NaturalPhilos
06/26/19 8:10:21 PM
#98:


hahaha bro keep up the great work. LOL at these guys trying to hate on you and make up bs about **** they don't understand so that they can feel cool.

Now to be fair, there isn't much point in you making this thread. I could predict the h8r's replies from a mile away. I guess you just wanted to spread some knowledge and enlighten anyone on the fence who might be lurking? Or feel 'right' in your specific worldview?

are there any private pickup boards on gamefaqs you can invite me to?

http://www.westindianarchie.com/state-of-the-community/

I recommend checking out Surgical Pickup on FB.

https://forums.playingfire.com/ <- i hear this is pretty good
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No_U_L7
06/26/19 8:11:19 PM
#99:


NaturalPhilos posted...
hahaha bro keep up the great work. LOL at these guys trying to hate on you and make up bs about **** they don't understand so that they can feel cool.

Now to be fair, there isn't much point in you making this thread. I could predict the h8r's replies from a mile away. I guess you just wanted to spread some knowledge and enlighten anyone on the fence who might be lurking? Or feel 'right' in your specific worldview?

are there any private pickup boards on gamefaqs you can invite me to?

http://www.westindianarchie.com/state-of-the-community/

I recommend checking out Surgical Pickup on FB.

https://forums.playingfire.com/ <- i hear this is pretty good


i tried to start a pick up board but it didn't take off, sadly. people here just aren't used to it
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The_Freecs
06/26/19 8:13:06 PM
#100:


YookaLaylee posted...
Being a pick up artists is creepy. Its manipulative and weird because youre treating every encounter like a game or something where you put in a few inputs and everyone is supposed to give you exactly what you want.


Thats flirting in general lol
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