Current Events > Atheists proudly erect 'God Graveyard' to show theists how many Gods have died.

(+) Yeah! (+)

UnfairRepresent posted...

KeeperOfShadows posted...

Colorahdo posted...

I'm an atheist and I cringe at people who identify as "Atheists"

So you don't believe -- go on with your life. Why are you trying to convince others? Let them believe in Santa it doesn't affect you

Lol. Way too logical an answer for this board.

Not really.

"it doesn't affect you " when it does or at least affects others is a very immensely illogical answer

People believing in a God doesn't effect others. People using their belief system to justify hurting others does. Fun fact, many religions actually promote acceptance over hatred, even in regards to those the belief considers sinful.

Take away religion and people would just seek out a different way to justify their hatred. Religion by itself isn't the problem there.
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Colorahdo posted...

I'm an atheist and I cringe at people who identify as "Atheists"

If you are investing significant time or effort into being an atheist, you are doing it wrong.

KeeperOfShadows posted...

People believing in a God doesn't effect others. People using their belief system to justify hurting others does. Fun fact, many religions actually promote acceptance over hatred, even in regards to those the belief considers sinful.

Take away religion and people would just seek out a different way to justify their hatred. Religion by itself isn't the problem there.

Unfortunately we don't live in a perfect world where believing in a god never led to anyone using their belief to justify hurting others. And religion hasn't been- nor will it ever be "taken away" to possibly be replaced by a new form of control, so looking for a reason to just not care won't really cut it, here.

I think religion at its worst is dangerous enough to make it problematic forever, even compared to the majority of people who practice peacefully. The people in power can use religion as a whip, a rod, and a sabre. Even just one person like that makes a bigger impact than 1,000 normal people who don't hurt anyone, because that person can turn 1,000 people into someone who will hurt people. Whether it's because of belief in a god or because the god-fearing government told you to.

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oh ew, i used the british spelling...

saber*

e: who am i kidding, sabre's cooler

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@viewmaster_pi Im familiar with some of the gnostic gospels. One of my favorite ideas from them is that when Jesus was little he didnt fully understand who or what he was yet so hed be doing things that he assumed were normal and people were awed by them but he didnt know.

And, idk if this is the same story as the one you referenced but I think theres one where he accidentally kills a kid that was a friend of his, either by being clumsy or in a fit of rage or something and its part of what helps him realize oh shit I have crazy powers I gotta be more careful.
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viewmaster_pi posted...

oh ew, i used the british spelling...

saber*

ew, sabre is much cooler. Same with theatre although idk if thats a UK/US thing.
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KeeperOfShadows posted...

People believing in a God doesn't effect others.

Except it does
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UnfairRepresent posted...

KeeperOfShadows posted...

People believing in a God doesn't effect others.

Except it does

Not in and of itself, no.
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Shablagoo posted...

ew, sabre is much cooler. Same with theatre although idk if thats a UK/US thing.

lol, look at my post again

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viewmaster_pi posted...

Shablagoo posted...

ew, sabre is much cooler. Same with theatre although idk if thats a UK/US thing.

lol, look at my post again

nice lol
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Shablagoo posted...

UnfairRepresent posted...

KeeperOfShadows posted...

People believing in a God doesn't effect others.

Except it does

Not in and of itself, no.

except it is

Historically and today

This is an argument you can't win.
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As someone who was raised by devout Catholics, I can assure you that this stunt will have the opposite of the intended effect. Christians will see all the abandoned deities and just see it as proof that theirs must be real, since it outlasted the others. It's like telling someone that their preferred presidential candidate is likely to fail because of all the candidates that have already dropped out of the race.

I can only assume this idea was thought up by atheists who were never raised in a religious environment. They always have these clever approaches that fail to grasp the religious mindset.

I pray to Joe Pesci.
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Whatever. They're doing nothing that is outright violent or disrespectful to people.
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Kind of nice that we can discuss these things here without it turning into a shit flinging contest.
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defauIt posted...

How many scientific theories have been proven wrong?

How many gods have been proven right?

Fallibility is a pillar of science anyway
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Wetterdew posted...

Damn_Underscore posted...

When non-religion becomes a religion.

It's not a religion, atheists don't believe in a higher power. It's just a silly display poking fun at religion that you people are taking way too seriously.

they are just trying to force their beliefs on others (which is something they criticize from religions )

want their own monuments and even their own version of churches
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UnfairRepresent posted...

except it is

Historically and today

This is an argument you can't win.

Only if you skip the parts where someone has to go from merely believing in something to acting on it in a way that affects others.

Step 1: Christian believes in God.
Step 2: Christian becomes convinced his faith requires the removal of Atheist's arm, and decides to act on it.
Step 3: Christian gets a sword and cuts off Atheist's arm.
Step 4: Atheist shouts "argh, my arm has been cut off!"

This scenario looks pretty funny when you just ignore the middle two steps.
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The Sun god still lives I see
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hockeybub89 posted...

defauIt posted...

How many scientific theories have been proven wrong?

How many gods have been proven right?

Fallibility is a pillar of science anyway

sounds like science is built to never seem to fail

it still makes the most sense though
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hockeybub89 posted...

defauIt posted...

How many scientific theories have been proven wrong?

How many gods have been proven right?

Fallibility is a pillar of science anyway

Fair enough, just attacking the idea of the number of religions that went away being important

This is the type of shit I refer to when I talk about religious atheists. They practice the idea of atheism to the extent of a religion.

When you're to the point of having atheist paraphernalia (quotes, stickers, notable people, frequent atheist forums) plastered all over your life, it becomes your god. A god doesn't have to be a deity.

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Sphyx posted...

UnfairRepresent posted...

except it is

Historically and today

This is an argument you can't win.

Only if you skip the parts where someone has to go from merely believing in something to acting on it in a way that affects others.

Step 1: Christian believes in God.
Step 2: Christian becomes convinced his faith requires the removal of Atheist's arm, and decides to act on it.
Step 3: Christian gets a sword and cuts off Atheist's arm.
Step 4: Atheist shouts "argh, my arm has been cut off!"

This scenario looks pretty funny when you just ignore the middle two steps.

Well if I couldnt win the argument you certainly could and did.
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Skye Reynolds posted...

They can reserve a spot for the God of Christianity if they like. It'll go unfilled indefinitely.

yep.

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In a mythology class, a fundie student (we called em Jesus freaks back then) asked me why I referred to the deities in the myths in the present tense (for example, I said things like Zeus is the king of the Olympian gods instead of saying was). My reply was that all deities are neither more nor less real and existing now than they were in ancient times. It took him a while, though, to figure out that I had just dismissed his deity as an ancient myth. A number of others in the class, though, including the teacher, caught it right away and had a nice smile at the freaks expense.

Without a doubt, there was a fedora tipped at some point during this exchange
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Beliefs inform your actions, inform the values you hope for the society you live in, and inform who you want in charge. What you believe in the privacy of your own home will, in some way or another, spill over to the outside.

Last time I checked, no one has proved Zeus is dead.
Show me the body, CE.
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DyingPancake posted...

In a mythology class, a fundie student (we called em Jesus freaks back then) asked me why I referred to the deities in the myths in the present tense (for example, I said things like Zeus is the king of the Olympian gods instead of saying was). My reply was that all deities are neither more nor less real and existing now than they were in ancient times. It took him a while, though, to figure out that I had just dismissed his deity as an ancient myth. A number of others in the class, though, including the teacher, caught it right away and had a nice smile at the freaks expense.

Without a doubt, there was a fedora tipped at some point during this exchange

I'm guessing the teacher rolled his eyes. The same thing that happens whenever an arrogant kid spouts off in class.
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Dragonblade01 posted...

Beliefs inform your actions, inform the values you hope for the society you live in, and inform who you want in charge. What you believe in the privacy of your own home will, in some way or another, spill over to the outside.

Doesnt matter, you never know what their actual beliefs are solely from them saying I believe in God.

Yeah, if they believe God wants them to volunteer at soup kitchens or, alternatively, to fight to keep gay marriage illegal, then yes their belief in God is affecting others (positively and negatively, respectively).

But just believing in God doesnt affect others.
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Shablagoo posted...

Dragonblade01 posted...

Beliefs inform your actions, inform the values you hope for the society you live in, and inform who you want in charge. What you believe in the privacy of your own home will, in some way or another, spill over to the outside.

Doesnt matter, you never know what their actual beliefs are solely from them saying I believe in God.

Yeah, if they believe God wants them to volunteer at soup kitchens or, alternatively, to fight to keep gay marriage illegal, then yes their belief in God is affecting others (positively and negatively, respectively).

But just believing in God doesnt affect others.

Nobody has to know what someone's specific beliefs are in order to know that people act based on beliefs. All beliefs affect others. The scale of the impact varies based on how widespread the belief is, as well as the status of the individuals/groups within the community, but the fundamental connection between belief and impact remains unbroken.

So we agree that believing in God doesnt necessarily hurt anyone, right?
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shockthemonkey posted...

Shablagoo posted...

So we agree that believing in God doesnt necessarily hurt anyone, right?

I thought you were arguing that it doesnt effect anyone

*affect

The way it was framed connoted negative effects, my bad.
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Kinda low effort with those props...
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Shablagoo posted...

So we agree that believing in God doesnt necessarily hurt anyone, right?

Necessarily hurt? No. Inform the actions of the believers which then impact their surroundings to some degree or another? Yes. And that impact can, has, and still does hurt others, sometimes extremely so. And that's a lot of risk for what in any rational context is an untenable position.

Not even a religious guy but imagine being so damn insecure about yourself about a religion you don't even follow that you do something like this.
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Dragonblade01 posted...

Shablagoo posted...

So we agree that believing in God doesnt necessarily hurt anyone, right?

Necessarily hurt? No. Inform the actions of the believers which then impact their surroundings to some degree or another? Yes. And that impact can, has, and still does hurt others, sometimes extremely so. And that's a lot of risk for what in any rational context is an untenable position.

I just see religion not as a cause of the worlds problems but as a symptom of them.

Yes it can be used to subjugate and stifle social progress but its not inherently any religions fault. Rich people would look to take advantage of others either way, sometimes brutally so, in order to benefit themselves.
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Dragonblade01 posted...

Shablagoo posted...

So we agree that believing in God doesnt necessarily hurt anyone, right?

Necessarily hurt? No. Inform the actions of the believers which then impact their surroundings to some degree or another? Yes. And that impact can, has, and still does hurt others, sometimes extremely so.

This is a pretty narrow view which fails to take into account the positive benefits of religion. For thousands of years religion has been used to keep societies in order. Societies that would have probably fallen into absolute chaos without something holding it together. In any given community I'd still say the positives of a local religion probably out weigh the negatives.
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HylianFox posted...

DarkChozoGhost posted...

Damn_Underscore posted...

but I think most people generally believe "be a good person and you'll be fine".

Nope. That's a very small percentage.

Really, 99% of Christians believe that if you don't say the exact magic words and really really mean it, you'll go to Hell no matter what

Considering how few Christians regularly go to Church, this is not true. And here is an actual source to back up what I'm saying:

https://churchleaders.com/pastors/pastor-articles/139575-7-startling-facts-an-up-close-look-at-church-attendance-in-america.html

Even thinking generally, for most people in America at least, religion isn't the forefront their lives. Tone down on the euphoric atheism.
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How dare people want to believe in god and a faith so it can comfort them.

Its easier to grow old and die believing your post life will have purpose

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Shablagoo posted...

I just see religion not as a cause of the worlds problems but as a symptom of them.

Yes it can be used to subjugate and stifle social progress but its not inherently any religions fault. Rich people would look to take advantage of others either way, sometimes brutally so, in order to benefit themselves.

Religion has caused many things, and not all of them bad. It has also been used for many things, not all of them bad. But it's also not reasonable and isn't necessary for any of its benefits.

BeyondWalls posted...

This is a pretty narrow view which fails to take into account the positive benefits of religion. For thousands of years religion has been used to keep societies in order. Societies that would have probably fallen into absolute chaos without something holding it together. In any given community I'd still say the positives of a local religion probably out weigh the negatives.

Correct, religion was most likely one of the primary reasons that humans were able to form larger societies, which then allowed them to eventually progress to the state we are in today. But since religion was used as civilization-binding glue, we've gained other forms of said glue and no longer need to rely on religious belief.

And I need to be clear: Getting rid of religion won't get rid of atrocity, suffering, prejudice, anything like that. Nobody should ever expect it to. But we also don't need it; and personally, I would prefer to get rid of things that can have negative effects, and that's positive effects can be gained from something else.

That's the one thing theists and atheists have in common, there are plenty of hoity-toity blowhards on all sides who just can't resist being nasty to others who don't follow their beliefs. You believe in religion? Great. Don't be an asshole to others. You don't believe in religion? Great. Don't be an asshole to others.
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Dragonblade01 posted...

Religion has caused many things, and not all of them bad. It has also been used for many things, not all of them bad. But it's also not reasonable and isn't necessary for any of its benefits.

I said it was a symptom of the worlds problems, idk why youd interpret that to mean I think its necessary lol

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Shablagoo posted...

Dragonblade01 posted...

Religion has caused many things, and not all of them bad. It has also been used for many things, not all of them bad. But it's also not reasonable and isn't necessary for any of its benefits.

I said it was a symptom of the worlds problems, idk why youd interpret that to mean I think its necessary lol

I wasn't saying that you did. I was just saying what I thought about religion's place in the world.

Shablagoo posted...

Dragonblade01 posted...

Religion has caused many things, and not all of them bad. It has also been used for many things, not all of them bad. But it's also not reasonable and isn't necessary for any of its benefits.

I said it was a symptom of the worlds problems, idk why youd interpret that to mean I think its necessary lol

Its not that religion is at fault. Its people. People fuck up everything.
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Dragonblade01 posted...

Shablagoo posted...

Dragonblade01 posted...

Religion has caused many things, and not all of them bad. It has also been used for many things, not all of them bad. But it's also not reasonable and isn't necessary for any of its benefits.

I said it was a symptom of the worlds problems, idk why youd interpret that to mean I think its necessary lol

I wasn't saying that you did. I was just saying what I thought about religion's place in the world.

Ah, gotcha. My bad.
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DisneyFan462 posted...

Kinda low effort with those props...

They ain't gonna fork out big bucks on this
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shockthemonkey posted...

This is such a silly perspective thats meant to completely undermine what atheism is and I dont get why people always bring it up.

Youre just talking about an organization existing. Every organization is not a god.

If you're not like the type I'm referring to, then I'm not talking about you. I'm not talking about the causal happy go lucky atheist. I'm more referring to the type that go out of their way to unbless a road. Yes, a group of atheists actually did that. Again, a god could be anything. It could be a person, an idea, money. Anything that you worship and adore. Christianity refers to these as Idols. The golden cafe.

I'm an agnostic atheist myself. That is to say, I don't believe in a god/gods, but also do not know for certain that they do not exist. Just based on my experience, I have not seen one. With that said, I'm not taking a torch to atheism as a whole, just the extremist types.

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