Board 8 > Survivor: Winners at War Topic 2: Kill It With Fire (Tokens)

(+) Yeah! (+)

I was rooting for Tony and Michele coming into the season.

Things are going great!

---

SavageInTheBox posted...

I was rooting for Tony and Michele coming into the season.

Things are going great!

I was rooting for Ethan going in but I hopped onto this train once he was gone.

---

I'm still upset all the old school winners went early.

---

Six episodes into TAR23.

It's so tragic... the route is good, the challenges are good, there's even transportation drama reminiscent of old school seasons... but good Lord this cast is terrible.

---

i think it speaks volumes about how awful tar23 was that i was actually rooting for leo and jamal at the end.
and that my favorite team of the season finished in 8th place.

---

Naye745 posted...

and that my favorite team of the season finished in 8th place.

They were my favorite team when I first watched it too but there is a team that goes far that I am enjoying this time around (and not the one that starts out okay and becomes awful later... I'm well aware of what happens to them)

---

one world sucked (obviously) but this is very cute

https://twitter.com/SpradlinKim/status/1254225335241060355

---

Underleveled posted...

They were my favorite team when I first watched it too but there is a team that goes far that I am enjoying this time around (and not the one that starts out okay and becomes awful later... I'm well aware of what happens to them)

i honestly forget who even came in 5th and 6th somehow. once the 7th/8th teams went out back-to-back i basically checked out mentally for the rest of the season.
in the finale i was actually rooting for the antagonist team because they were at least funny sometimes.
the winners are among my least favorite in the show's entire history.

---

i looked at a wiki and while i do remember ally and ashley (got way farther than they should have, but were generally pleasant and likeable) i have absolutely no recollection of the 6th place team whatsoever

---

Naye745 posted...

the winners are among my least favorite in the show's entire history.

Heh, the winners live like 5 minutes away from me. Or at least they did while they were on the show.

And that one world shot is cute. Somebody's missing. I didn't look too hard but at a glance I think it's Nina? I'm surprised they got Kourtney. I thought she was one of those who stormed off and swore off ever mentioning Survivor again.

And OMG is that Kat above Jay?! Jesus Christ she's changed.

And if I'm being totally honest, the further out we get from One World, the less I hate it. Especially since last season finally gave us a winner more boring than Kim and someone more vile than Colton.

---

I think Leif is the only one missing, but in the comments there's another pic with him in the zoom chat so he was just not there at the time of Kim's screenshot

---

Hmm... if S40 had been Heroes vs. Villains for 21-39?



---

Domenick is seen as a villain?
---

If Abi-Maria is coming back I'll watch Survivor again.

---

After watching Kim again this season, I say it's a wash between her and Tommy for who is more boring. The only difference is we had to suffer through Tommy being the confessional leader last season despite there being so many more interesting characters, while Kim is rightly near the bottom in confessionals.

---

kellyn as a villain seems like a bigger stretch than danielle di lorenzo

also kim rules get the heck out of here

---

http://brantsteele.net/survivor/heroesvsvillains/r.php?c=QBOOwlCp

Here's the link to one I just did, because the result feels...pretty in line with how modern Survivor works.

---

christian/davie/gabby on one tribe is very parv/cirie/amanda to me

not enough tony casting archetypes in the villains tribe

---

I don't get Chris as a villain. He doesn't feel like he belongs on either tribe to me. Neither does Kim. She belongs on a third neutral tribe, to be honest.
---

Mewtwo59 posted...

I don't get Chris as a villain. He doesn't feel like he belongs on either tribe to me. Neither does Kim. She belongs on a third neutral tribe, to be honest.

With Kim, I needed another younger woman for the heroes. I had Janet/Elaine/Lauren R. all on the tribe originally, which would never fly with true casting. Plus, I didn't want to have just Tony (Natalie was another replacement for the above) as a winner. And then when I had Tony/Kim/Natalie, I wanted to have a fourth winner, preferably a male villain. But then I looked at the options and you either have Rob (would be a five-timer, which ew), Tyson (4-timer, which was a no in my casting choices), or a bunch of toneless people (leaning positive, because we have to like/respect every winner nowadays). Chris wound up being the "villain" because he beat fan favorite Rick Devens. Kinda like Danielle achieving villain-hood for betraying Terry.

---

jenn as a hero gross

---

I think Wendell could've fit, even not taking this season into account. He was Dom's partner in crime for the whole season, and Dom is there on the villains.

Also, Lauren R. is only a year older than Kim. I think she'd be 37 at the time the show was filmed.
---

Mewtwo59 posted...

I think Wendell could've fit, even not taking this season into account. He was Dom's partner in crime for the whole season, and Dom is there on the villains.

Also, Lauren R. is only a year older than Kim. I think she'd be 37 at the time the show was filmed.

Dom being on the villains is why I wrote Wendell off. I felt like there were too many instances of original season allies as is, without putting the dominant pair that ran GI together.

---

I just finished the second season. Man, Bryant Gumbel is annoying on the reunion specials.

---

CBS considers Natalie A a villain. A few years ago they did a best heroes and villains tournament on the website and she was in the villains bracket. And yes, I consider Twinnies villains for TAR (prior to 24 I was banking on Heroes vs. Villains as the theme for 25 and had them in there as villains), but on Survivor maybe not so much.

---

We're less than a month out from the finale, right? I want to get the CBS all access trial for the finale, but I don't want to get it too early and have it run out beforehand.
---

We're two weeks and change out.

Next week is a double episode.

---

Now watching the F5 episode of TAR23

Oh my God this episode, and 4/5 of the teams left, is PAINFUL.

---

i blocked out tar23 so hard that i literally cant distinguish leo and jamal in 23 from 24 in my head

like you could have me guess which events regarding them happened in which season and i'd go 0-for-10

---

The consensus is that Leo & Jamal were tolerable in 24, which is what I remember as well.

---

Honestly, I think Leo & Jamal had a worse cast around them in 24 than they did in 23.

---

Leo & Jamal are one of those teams that start out tolerable, when the cast is stuffed, because they're funny and charming enough to separate themselves from the larger field. But then, as the numbers whittle down, they get annoying. This has been my opinion of them in all three seasons they've appeared. They're only especially good in TAR24 because Dave & Connor are perhaps one of the most self-righteous and unpleasant teams I've ever had the misfortune of watching. And even there, Leo & Jamal still piggybacked onto the self-righteous train towards the end.

---

Inviso posted...

And even there, Leo & Jamal still piggybacked onto the self-righteous train towards the end.

To be fair, they abandoned the "get Brenchel out" train when it became against their best interest.

---

But of 23's final four, three of them start out likable enough and then get progressively worse, and then Tim & Marie have surprised me by being a borderline all-time top 10 team.

---

Tim & Marie are amazing. I liked Leo & Jamal, personally. Jason & Amy are just boring, and Nicole & Travis suck.

---

Underleveled posted...

To be fair, they abandoned the "get Brenchel out" train when it became against their best interest.

Yeah, I think their involvement in it was so they wouldn't get U-Turned a fourth time, so I don't really begrudge them for being part of that alliance.

---

Tim & Marie ARE amazing.

Travis & Nicole, meanwhile...once they started their decline into being bad at racing...they became extremely uncomfortable to watch. Maybe I'm seeing things, but it felt like there was genuine fear in Nicole whenever she failed, while Travis simmered with rage. Really nasty stuff.

---

tim & marie definitely grew on me, but i wouldn't say i actively liked them so much as preferred them to all the alternatives

and yeah travis got super unpleasant and uncomfortable by the end, i don't think that take is too strong inviso, it was doing the rounds at the time of airing too

---

Yeah that's how I felt about Travis when it aired, and felt it again this time.

Anyway, it's done, and as bad as this one was I know the next one is even worse.

After I rewatch 24, 26, and 28, and 32 airs, I'll post my overall rankings for the series.

---

i definitely prefer 24 to 23, though 24 sucks too

i don't hate [winners] nearly as much as you and viso, though

---

I don't even remember if I hated 24's winners so much on my initial watch or if the overwhelming hatred they've received in the years since have influenced my opinion.

But of my two favorite teams going in, one got fucked in the first five minutes, and the other became awful, petty, self-righteous you-know-whats. Brenchel and Jessica/John were huge improvements over their previous seasons though.

---

brenchel were their most tolerable in s24, though that's likely due to the folks around them being awful

rachel is still trash

---

Boy is Big Brother is lucky Aaryn was afraid of Amanda. I feel like if Aaryn puts up Amanda instead of Spencer. She could have easily been in a larger alliance with herself, Elissa, Helen, and GM. Not to mention I think Andy floats back to that alliance. She would have had the votes. Now granted these are thoughts as I do a first watch so it could change drastically but that's my thoughts in the moment.

Having rooting interest in this season is hard because every time I feel like I start to like someone they say something that rubs me the wrong way. Like when Amanda started calling Candace Shaniqua. Or like Aaryn is damn good at the comps but you know, according to the show she's clearly racist lol. I've been plowing through this but this season has been very fun strategically but the characters just meh.

EDIT: I'm at Helen's eviction but had to stop the episode after she got voted out so I don't know who gets back in yet. I do know the famous "Helen was pushed though" so I know it isn't her.

---

Aaryn basically got character assassinated that season. She wasn't an angel, but those around her were way worse and she got targeted as the main perpetrator because she was the stereotypical pretty Southern belle. She was literally dating a black person at the time, but people just saw her as the white girl Emmett Till whistled at.

---

T swift

---

new Amazing Race season delayed to the fall, which I expected to see, the networks are going to have some trouble then... still thinking that AR season might take Survivor's timeslot if they can't resume filming in time?

More time for darkx to rewatch the rest of the seasons, lol

They should just get the rights to air Australian Survivor here for next year or something.

---

MartinFF7 posted...

new Amazing Race season delayed to the fall, which I expected to see, the networks are going to have some trouble then... still thinking that AR season might take Survivor's timeslot if they can't resume filming in time?

More time for darkx to rewatch the rest of the seasons, lol

Ugh. This was literally the biggest thing getting me through the rest of this Survivor season.

And yay, more time to rewatch two bad seasons and a passable one.

---

more time for everyone to watch the genius instead

---

which of 26 and 28 is the bad and the passable? lol

---