Board 8 > Hearthstone Topic #5: The Generated By Meta

(+) Yeah! (+)

azuarc posted...

So are all the new cards considered part of pirates? Even the cannon and the bird?

Its tough to say since pirates are part of the rotation regardless. I doubt the parrot is, speaking of, its pretty op with Goldrinn. A golden one even works like a Baron, and stacks on top of one too.

Illidans apparently good now just because you get guaranteed parrot buffs

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i've been playing teamfight tactics instead of battlegrounds

it's frustrating as shit the first few times but now that i've gotten the hang of the game it's infinitely better than battlegrounds

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azuarc posted...

After playing 6 or 7 battlegrounds yesterday, I have to say that I was wrong about pirates.

Not only was I very, very wrong, but I think battlegrounds has a pirate problem.


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azuarc posted...

Not only was I very, very wrong, but I think battlegrounds has a pirate problem.

The stats on pirates don't look too amazing right now:

https://old.reddit.com/r/hearthstone/comments/h116ry/hsreplaynet_battlegrounds_compositions_postpirate/

But it's entirely possible that people are playing them wrong, or that they're too heavily contested. Certainly a lot of people are playing pirates right now cause they're new, so you'll see a lot of them.

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I just got knocked out on turn 6, and someone else died at the same time. Like, what the shit?

https://imgur.com/tbobOow
https://imgur.com/UL89RUl

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Looks like a Eudora that just got the nuts on their gold turn turn

its like fighting an AFK that got a Mama Bear off of Zerus /shrug

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Yeah, but like every single game today is going so fast. I was actually enjoying myself last night, but today I swear every game I'm done by turn 10. Even the game I just finished, where I came in third, I got knocked down to 5 almost immediately, got into a deathmatch with another low-health dude and won, took somebody out the following turn, and then lost. Two turns difference between 8th and 3rd. I'm barely even seeing 10 gold half these games.

edit: Okay, right after that, I finally had a good run. Ysera's early dragons into some goldgrubber nonsense let me pull ahead of everyone. Game ended turn 13, first place.

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Yeah, not sure how games being faster is an issue. Battlegrounds games taking 20-30 minutes is awful. I like Battlegrounds but because the games take so long it feels like you are making no progress and losing points after 20+ mins sucks

Games being shorter means that getting the nuts in a start is that much more important. A basic "level on 4, level on 7 with a buy, level on 9 with a buy" will lead to you being dead before you can even start to form a build. There's one common denominator to whether anything in Hearthstone is "unfun," and that is helplessness. I felt completely unable to impact the outcome of these games as I got run over.

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Honestly you either have games go on really quickly as someone spikes a 6 drop that just kills people (boat is so good at it) or theres a couple Saurlisks in lobby and games go on forever

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Man the more I play Battlegrounds the more I'm convinced Macaw would be good even as a 5 or 6 star unit

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I'm amazed they printed macaw. Certainly as a 2-star. The ability to grab those early and trigger deathrattles for free is ridiculous. Of course everyone was going to exploit the hell out of that with spawns and selfless heroes until they can work their way up to Goldrinn. I also think it's comical that the macaw can take lethal damage and then trigger deathrattles that keep it alive.

I've seen several videos from Dog now that show him exploiting the hell out of pirate synergies. Making 5 gold back every time he buys a pirate, with 2 looters on-board, and just cycling as fast as his APM will allow. He had three minions over 100/100, bordering on 200/200.

And this, folks, is your battlegrounds meta right now. Better hope you can rush to poisonous DS murlocs, because nothing else is beating these two.

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honestly pirates are okish, theres no divine shields or tokens and they only have one buff unit (the 5/4 lady) so its basically just raw stats. Hogger combo seems good but you need golden and one extra to profit off pirates money which can be hard to do, plus they dont grow (only the three star Pirate does) If you have a poison taunt or multiple poisons youll be surprised how easy it is to dismantle pirates.

I think the midrange pirate version is probably more consistent if you pivot into it plus you can get a surprise carry from Pagle

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Yeah, I rolled everyone with Patches using 2x Salty Looters, the taunt pirate and 3 of the ones that buff whenever you attack (2 of the lower star ones and one of the high star ones). I kept thinking aa soon as I run into Divine Shields or Poison it's over but it just never materialized. Didn't even utilize the high tier pirates

thanks for proving your point for the 900th time we hadn't realized

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Ulti: So when are you going to take me off ignore?
Also Ulti: See! I lost because of RNG bullshit again! Skill is meaningless in this game!

Granted, I was just saying something similar about battlegrounds two days ago, but I was also biting my tongue that someone would compare me to Ulti afterwards.

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I did the Flurgl dream, won it with him

I didn't even get Megasaur just turns out that constantly playing Primalfins with Brann and getting buffs is all you need

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Is Megasaur the only minion that is in a different minion types bucket? Don't remember seeing anything that showed exactly what was banned with each minion type and Megasaur is the only one I've heard mentioned.

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Zoobot isn't banned when Mechs is banned

Oh, Parrot's banned when beasts are banned btw.

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Parrot has such crossover value though

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So do a lot of beasts (Ghastcoiler, Maexxna, Hydra fit in a ton of builds) they're the most versatile tribe for a reason!

but they're probably the best ban tbh

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VeryInsane posted...

I did the Flurgl dream, won it with him

I didn't even get Megasaur just turns out that constantly playing Primalfins with Brann and getting buffs is all you need

I had a Flurgl win today, too. No Brann, despite getting to 5 early and playing to round 15. One megasaur that gave divine shield, and I had to build the rest with loose cards. At least the Primalfins were generous.

Too bad the rest of my day was net negative. I had some brutal beatdowns today, which more than wiped away that win and two 2nd places.

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No.

Your position is that skill has never and will never amount to anything in a game of hearhstone.

literally nobody shares your position.

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"Hearthstone was more skill based before"
"Hearthstone is less skill based in it's current form"

These are arguments that you can make a case for and many people would probably agree with.

"Hearthstone is not skill based"

Is a flaming piece of troll garbage argument.

I hope you understand the distinction.

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Instead of salty tweet I thought I would explain calmly why I think HS has become less skill intensive

This is from the tweet you linked. Do you understand how that doesn't say the same thing you are saying?

He is saying skill matters less than it used to.

He is saying that after enough cards have been generated the game reaches a point where "using your world class skill to predict your opponents best plays and play against them" matter less and so you have to revert to the next spot down the pyramid which is "using your skill to play your own cards optimally because you can't realistically play around all your opponents outs".

It still takes skill to get to the point where you are correctly playing your own cards optimally without consideration for your opponents strategy. It's just the skill of being able to play around your opponents possibilities matters less.

Whereas your stance is an incredibly radical "Skill has absolutely 100% no effect on hearthstone".

Yes many cards have a lot of RNG effects, but you can still misplay those cards due to a lack of skill. There will be situations where you think "I can generate a lack which might give me shoot lackey or rush lacky and i'll live" or "I can generate a spell which might give me X or Y and I might live" and you still have to think critically about what your best play is, even if aspects of your play will have randomly generated effects. That's part of being skilled.

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To get involved in half a conversation, that Ulti will never see because he blocked me:

If you mulligan into Zephrys, you can play that card on every turn, what cards it offers you will change every turn, creating a myriad of different hypothetical gamestates, but that still doesn't mean jamming it on turn 2 is the same as jamming it on turn 15 and has no effect on who wins the game.

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Good point, you can also spend mana before playing zephyrs on a turn to try and generate a specific result based upon your remaining mana!

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I'm glad you added that try in there, Zephrys has been testing my patience lately.

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UltimaterializerX posted...

The extreme vast minority of people thinks this game is skill based. Almost everyone that has ever played Hearthstone has my position.

I have yet, in over two years of your trolling, to see one person legitimately, unconditionally agree with you. It's a really tired shtick. I'd pick apart your sentiments and try to show you why you're wrong, but there's no point. You've convinced of this, and nobody can get through to you.

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man I looked at the battlegrounds team thing and I was like "Trump still plays?"

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Spotting a complicated lethal is a skill.
You can lose after missing lethal.
Therefor there are Hearthstone games decided by skill.
Q.E.D.

After 4 years Im kinda tired of this discussion so I rank the Battleground heroes

Busted
Hooktusk

Excellent
Rafaam
Noz
Deryl
Kaelthas

Very Good
Eudora
Yogg
Edwin
Pyramad
Lich Baz (underrated despite rankings imo)

Good
Elise
Rat King
Deathwing
Illidan
Curator
Toki

Ok but fun
Patches
Alex
Millhouse
Kragg
Shudderwock
Reno
Akazam

Ok but boring
New girl I think
AFK
Malygos
Sindragosa
Bartendo
Vashj
Patchwerk
Ysera

A step down but winnable and rewarding
Lich King
George
Flurgl

Terrible all around
Millificent
Nef (used to be good but with mechs declining and more comps not really using divine shields hes kinda lost)
Wogg
Galakrond
Maeiv
Jaraxxus

Huh that was tougher than expected, and I might flip on some. I think Alex and Flurgl can be more consistent in certain metas, for example.


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https://playhearthstone.com/en-us/news/23442723/17-4-1-patch-notes

Oh hey, some buffs for some of those bad heroes

Jaraxxus is now 1 mana hero power, Millificent is back to old self, Maeiv no longer keeps the dormant minion from occupying a slot, Reno is 2 mana.

They also swapped Hyena and Saurolisk and gave it 1 health, and Macaw is tier 3.

For constructed, they nerfed twin slice and gave it 1 mana give +2 attack.

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Twin slice being a free 6 damage card with Altruis on board was pretty silly. 10 damage for 2 mana isn't much better but I think that nerf will help to slow down DH early game.

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Which version of Millificent is actually better? I mean, neither are good but I think I'd rather have the +2 attack over the +1/+1.

Also, I completely forgot about the solo adventure stuff coming out. Something to do while I wait for the new battlegrounds heroes to become available for me.

Edit: Ah shit, there's a daily quest line and I didn't clear my quests.

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The +1/+1 used to be op but I think that was just a different meta with more divine shield mechs and amalgams. I think it's better just because, for example, a 2/3 Micro Machine is better than a 3/2 micro machine. Trades better and doesn't die to cannon.

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bobcatpyrak#1518

someone get on so i can give them 80g


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