Current Events > Super Mario RPG > Paper Mario series and Mario/Luigi Series

(+) Yeah! (+)

There I said it

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Not a wrong opinion, but I dont agree with it

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yep

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Its great, but its still not ttyd

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No. No. No. I played RPG and couldn't finish it. Honestly I thought it sucked. Just made me want to play Paper Mario or Pokemon.

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My unibrow furrowed at how wrong this opinion is.

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Nostalgia factor definitely puts it at the top for me regardless. I think it still holds up artistically and technically due to its style. It is super easy, but so are all the Mario RPGs.

This is actually the most common opinion, due to nostalgia bias

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Truth. Super Mario RPG is the best game ever made >_>

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NeonOctopus posted...

Super Mario RPG is the best game ever made >_>

Let's not get ahead of ourselves now.

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Absolutely wrong

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Super Mario RPG had better world-building and mechanics.

The game gets criticized because it "doesn't feel like Mario," but I tend to think of it as "Mario as Mario should be." I prefer the slightly subdued color scheme, the gloomy castles, rickety ships, and fiery volcanoes to the overly bright and cutesy world where every character, cloud, and tree has a smiley face. It's still bright and cartoonish, but it doesn't overdo it. And it can be dramatic when it needs to be.

Mario was inspired by Popeye the Sailor and an animated version of Journey to the West. That's where I feel the tone of the series should lie; somewhere between the cartoonish and the adventurous. Instead, it's like My Little Pony if the characters were all human. But then I don't know. Maybe being overly cutesy is what motivates them. If Super Mario World never put goggles on aquatic life, maybe we wouldn't have gotten the dolphin level. If they never put eyes on trees, maybe they'd never put eyes on fireballs.

I still say that, thematically, Super Mario RPG is the best Mario game.

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It hasnt aged well. Its brain dead easy and short. Super Mario RPG is mediocre and extremely unbalanced.

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I mean calling SMRPG brain dead easy isn't an insult because literally almost all the RPGs around that time were similarly easy.

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Veggeta_MAX posted...

I mean calling SMRPG brain dead easy isn't an insult because literally almost all the RPGs around that time were similarly easy.

So, it hasnt aged well.


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Tiduslaugh.gif

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Lairen posted...

So, it hasnt aged well.

That's like saying FF6, Lufia 2 and Chrono Trigger hasn't aged well and we all know these games are some of the greatest RPGs in the world.

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I don't agree with you.

I will go so far to say Origami King is a better game, whole-package wise.

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Veggeta_MAX posted...

That's like saying FF6, Lufia 2 and Chrono Trigger hasn't aged well

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*nod nod*

I love all those games and have fond memories of them, but I won't stack them above actual improved attempts on the genre.

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FortuneCookie posted...

Super Mario RPG had better world-building and mechanics.

The game gets criticized because it "doesn't feel like Mario," but I tend to think of it as "Mario as Mario should be." I prefer the slightly subdued color scheme, the gloomy castles, rickety ships, and fiery volcanoes to the overly bright and cutesy world where every character, cloud, and tree has a smiley face. It's still bright and cartoonish, but it doesn't overdo it. And it can be dramatic when it needs to be.

Mario was inspired by Popeye the Sailor and an animated version of Journey to the West. That's where I feel the tone of the series should lie; somewhere between the cartoonish and the adventurous. Instead, it's like My Little Pony if the characters were all human. But then I don't know. Maybe being overly cutesy is what motivates them. If Super Mario World never put goggles on aquatic life, maybe we wouldn't have gotten the dolphin level. If they never put eyes on trees, maybe they'd never put eyes on fireballs.

I still say that, thematically, Super Mario RPG is the best Mario game.

There's plenty of variation in the different areas of the paper mario games, and tonally they're closer to the smw games than smrpg is.

The issue with smrpg is that most of the cast has no grounding in mario lore. Imo it ends up feeling like a dumbed down square game with some mario pasted in rather than a Mario rpg.

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Veggeta_MAX posted...

That's like saying FF6, Lufia 2 and Chrono Trigger hasn't aged well and we all know these games are some of the greatest RPGs in the world.

They havnt aged well. Theyre not some of the greatest in the world.

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Balrog0 posted...

There's plenty of variation in the different areas of the paper mario games, and tonally they're closer to the smw games than smrpg is.

The issue with smrpg is that most of the cast has no grounding in mario lore. Imo it ends up feeling like a dumbed down square game with some mario pasted in rather than a Mario rpg.

Mallow, Croco, Valentina, and Jonathan Jones all feel like characters who could have been mainstays of the Mario universe had they not been caught in legal limbo. And Booster is just Wario with a beard.

Smithy and his cronies feel out of place for a Mario game, but it's accounted for in-story. They literally come from another dimension. Geno is technically from the same dimension as Mario, but comes from another plane of existence within that world.

The towns, the forests, the sewers, the volcano, and the sunken ship all feel like Mario.

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Lairen posted...

They havnt aged well. Theyre not some of the greatest in the world.

https://imgur.com/5SY1Rj0

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Super Mario rpg is bad because it's fuck ugly

FortuneCookie posted...

Mallow, Croco, Valentina, and Jonathan Jones all feel like characters who could have been mainstays of the Mario universe had they not been caught in legal limbo. And Booster is just Wario with a beard.

Smithy and his cronies feel out of place for a Mario game, but it's accounted for in-story. They literally come from another dimension. Geno is technically from the same dimension as Mario, but comes from another plane of existence within that world.

The towns, the forests, the sewers, the volcano, and the sunken ship all feel like Mario.

What about Jinx, Belome, Boshi and Frogfucius?

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I get the entire point of the topic is to argue and, well, im taking the bait but still. Very old piss easy rpgs havnt aged well is a basic counter and fact for them being considered the best in the world.

I mean they were, the best, literally decades ago.

Hence, you had no rebuttal.

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There's no arguing here. Just opinions being tossed around here freely.

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Veggeta_MAX posted...

There's no arguing here. Just opinions being tossed around here freely.

Fine: You going to pull that card? Its just my opinion that snes rpgs, being limited by hardware, did not age well and are only good, beginner/introduction to the genre rpgs today.

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Veggeta_MAX posted...

What about Jinx, Belome, Boshi and Frogfucius?

I feel like there's a fifth character you might've mentioned. Hmm. Guess he wasn't famous enough. :v

But, sure, I'll go down the list and answer your question bullet-points style:

• Boshi absolutely feels like a character in a Yoshi game or a Mario game featuring Yoshi.
• Frogfucius feels conditional. Like, if Mario ever had a scenario which called for a wise old man or a martial arts trainer the likes of a Mr. Miyagi, Frogfucius would fit. As a mainstay, no, I can't see him being a figure in every other Mario game.
• Jinx's character design doesn't feel Mario-like. The concept of a bird who's a fraction of the size of the player character being an intense martial arts trainer seems in-line with the Mario universe's sense of humor though.
• And, yes, I'll admit that Belome -- in the sewers, Be-low me! Get it? -- is wildly un-Mario-like in his design. It never bothered me because it is a neat design, and the concept of a hungry bad guy who wants to eat the hero is very Mario-like, but he is kind of a "what am I looking at?" type of character. Essentially a cat head on two legs.

So, yeah, there are some characters that might be a touch out of place. But maybe that's only because we were never able to get a followup. Had Nintendo 64 been a disc-based system, Square would've undoubtedly put out a Super Mario RPG 64 and we would've had more of those kinds of characters and creatures. Unless Nintendo decided to put a creative kibosh on it.

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Lairen posted...

Fine: You going to pull that card? Its just my opinion that snes rpgs, being limited by hardware, did not age well and are only good, beginner/introduction to the genre rpgs today.

It's not card. That's what everyone has been doing. Some agreed, some people disagreed with me in this topic which are all fine.

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FortuneCookie posted...

I feel like there's a fifth character you might've mentioned. Hmm. Guess he wasn't famous enough. :v

But, sure, I'll go down the list and answer your question bullet-points style:

* Boshi absolutely feels like a character in a Yoshi game or a Mario game featuring Yoshi.
* Frogfucius feels conditional. Like, if Mario ever had a scenario which called for a wise old man or a martial arts trainer the likes of a Mr. Miyagi, Frogfucius would fit. As a mainstay, no, I can't see him being a figure in every other Mario game.
* Jinx's character design doesn't feel Mario-like. The concept of a bird who's a fraction of the size of the player character being an intense martial arts trainer seems in-line with the Mario universe's sense of humor though.
* And, yes, I'll admit that Belome -- in the sewers, Be-low me! Get it? -- is wildly un-Mario-like in his design. It never bothered me because it is a neat design, and the concept of a hungry bad guy who wants to eat the hero is very Mario-like, but he is kind of a "what am I looking at?" type of character. Essentially a cat head on two legs.

So, yeah, there are some characters that might be a touch out of place. But maybe that's only because we were never able to get a followup. Had Nintendo 64 been a disc-based system, Square would've undoubtedly put out a Super Mario RPG 64 and we would've had more of those kinds of characters and creatures. Unless Nintendo decided to put a creative kibosh on it.

There's the Mole people which IMO feels more like they'd fit in a Donkey Kong world than Mario.

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Veggeta_MAX posted...

There's the Mole people which IMO feels more like they'd fit in a Donkey Kong world than Mario.

You mean the mole people that debuted in super Mario world?

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Veggeta_MAX posted...

There's the Mole people which IMO feels more like they'd fit in a Donkey Kong world than Mario.

I agree now that you mention it, but I think of it as a 90% fit for Donkey Kong and 80% fit for Mario.

The Mario universe isn't overrun with anthropomorphic animals, but we do see them here and there. Maybe it would've been more fitting if their design had been more like the Monty Mole/Mega Mole design, but I still think they fit the Mario universe on the whole.


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I wouldn't exactly put it above PM64 and TTYD. I just put all 3 in the top tier and throw all other Mario RPGs beneath them.

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SSJKirby posted...

You mean the mole people that debuted in super Mario world?

They look completely different which is why the smrpg ones fit better with dk

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I always preferred Paper Mario 64 and TTYD out of all of them.
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paper mario 64 and superstar saga are the best mario RPG's

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