Current Events > It baffles me how Halo CE is so celebrated

(+) Yeah! (+)

Literally the worst level design in any FPS EVER. But hey, I guess the controls worked reasonably well on a gamepad so best game ever, mirite? Oh and the multiplayer, of course. I'll concede the multiplayer is the tits

---

It's really because everything else was so good that they more than made up for the level design.

---

It was inferior to PlanetSide in every aspect
---

How is the level design bad? I recently replayed it and enjoyed it all the way through, didnt notice anything particularly bad about the level design

brotrrwinner posted...

Literally the worst level design in any FPS EVER.

I'm guessing you haven't played many FPS games from the late 90s and early 2000s

---

Master chief and sergeant johnson were cool. The flood were scary as fuck and the covenant were cool.

---

Darmik posted...

I'm guessing you haven't played many FPS games from the late 90s and early 2000s

I've played several and none are as bad as the building interiors in Halo

---

brotrrwinner posted...

I've played several and none are as bad as the building interiors in Halo

Most games back then were 'just' building interiors and corridors.

---

Halo Current Events

---

It was the next big evolutionary leap for the genre after Goldeneye. Even I know that and I detest Microsoft.
---

How is it even "Halo CE" you can't even play as Man Fan.
---

JlM posted...

How is it even "Halo CE" you can't even play as Man Fan.

right?

---

It came out in a time when FPS games where garbage so it looked good in comparison.

---

First half of the game or so was fine, but the second half was a slog of backtracking through previous areas and twice as many enemies. Hated it.

---

Level design was pretty consistent with what other games were doing at the time. I always felt it was a pretty overrated game, but it got by on presentation and the strength of its MP

---

It baffles me how you're so wrong

I wont say its good but it was just fine for mindless fps.

---

The level design isnt bad at all, in fact I would argue that the game has some of the best multiplayer maps in FPS history. As for the campaign, its a bit lazy that the second half of the game is just backtracking through the same environments, but those environments certainly didnt look poorly designed.

---

i mean it was the first FPS to have such a large campaign and invented the dual analogue system that literally every single shooter uses today

Cool characters, music, setting. Decent story. Great multiplayer.

ZeldaNPC271x5 posted...

i mean it was the first FPS to have such a large campaign and invented the dual analogue system that literally every single shooter uses today

It was not the first one to have a large campaign what

But you're right about that. It's also responsible for making vehicles, single button grenades, and regenerating health a major thing in the genre, though it wasn't the first for any of those.

I think the thing with Halo is that there's no individual thing that it does that's new. But the way it combines different elements and things into a specific blend is what made it feel very new and original. Which really is what the far majority of innovative and influential games are.

The scale of something like Halo, Silent Cartographer and Assault on the Control Room felt so epic in scope compared to other games from the time. Hell even now I find those levels rather impressive and memorable.

---

Darmik posted...

I think the thing with Halo is that there's no individual thing that it does that's new. But the way it combines different elements and things into a specific blend is what made it feel very new and original. Which really is what the far majority of innovative and influential games are.

The scale of something like Halo, Silent Cartographer and Assault on the Control Room felt so epic in scope compared to other games from the time. Hell even now I find those levels rather impressive and memorable.

Yup. Being new does not make you revolutionary, that takes quality design inspiring change in the genre.

Although how it did regenerating health was pretty unique and it's a shame other games don't do the same.

DavidZ2844 posted...

How is the level design bad? I recently replayed it and enjoyed it all the way through, didnt notice anything particularly bad about the level design

Nothing cripplingly bad about it but it's obvious they copy-pasted rooms and corridors. The later games show much more variety in it's corridors and rooms in terms of layout and visuals.

Halo set the standard for fps as a genre. The 2 weapons, handful of grenades, regen shields + non regen health, melee without shield = death, etc.

Shooters were on some wild west shit back in the day kind of. Everybody did their own thing really. Can't tell you any of their names because I don't remember them but I absolutely remember the days of cycling through like half a dozen weapons which I was apparently hauling around every single level.

---

ZeldaNPC271x5 posted...

i mean it was the first FPS to have such a large campaign and invented the dual analogue system that literally every single shooter uses today

Alien Resurrection on PS1 was the first console FPS to use dual analogue control. And definitely no to the large campaign.

---

RadiantAdolin posted...

It was not the first one to have a large campaign what

But you're right about that. It's also responsible for making vehicles, single button grenades, and regenerating health a major thing in the genre, though it wasn't the first for any of those.

compare the size of its levels versus any FPS at the time

theres no comparison

For campaign specifically, the AI is really impressive. The weapon sandbox is also above average I would say, which is something most future Halo games didn't quite get right. Most weapons are either good or at least have their uses. And then there's the Needler, which I personally think is the worst weapon in CE. However, it's such an interesting and unique gun that it sort of makes up for the fact that it's not very good.

---

GeneralKenobi85 posted...

For campaign specifically, the AI is really impressive. The weapon sandbox is also above average I would say, which is something most future Halo games didn't quite get right. Most weapons are either good or at least have their uses. And then there's the Needler, which I personally think is the worst weapon in CE. However, it's such an interesting and unique gun that it sort of makes up for the fact that it's not very good.

The needler is ridiculously powerful lol. Just useless against elites from a distance. But damn did I love using that gun against hunters.

---

I replayed it a month ago with a friend. The first half of the campaign was good, the second half was below average. The levels were repetitive and boring.

massive jump in visual clarity
awesome multiplayer

---

ZeldaNPC271x5 posted...

compare the size of its levels versus any FPS at the time

theres no comparison

What, like Half-Life, Unreal, Call of Duty, etc etc? Game levels had been expansive for awhile.

There was nothing else like it at the time and I'd be surprised if there still is. Open-world FPS in a trippy sci-fi setting + split-screen co-op. Reason I say that first sentence is because split-screen is such a rare feature nowadays. Even the PC Halo isn't the same.

Never owned an Xbox and I have no desire to, btw, but I have been looking for an FPS since 2001 that fills the Halo niche when I have friends over and haven't found one since. Before Halo the best console shooters were Quake on Dreamcast and Timesplitters on PS2. Both great, but very different from Halo's huge exploratory levels.

Whenever I bring up this point people inevitably say that split-screen sucks. Cool opinion but it doesn't.

---

brotrrwinner posted...

I've played several and none are as bad as the building interiors in Halo

Name one

chairforceone posted...

Name one

No One Lives Forever

---

brotrrwinner posted...

No One Lives Forever

looks like par for the course 2000 interiors to me

chairforceone posted...

looks like par for the course 2000 interiors to me

Are you high? I said Halo interiors were bad compared to other games, not the other way around

---

And youre wrong lol. Pretty much everyone in this thread can agree. Its cute that you like NOLM but its not that special

chairforceone posted...

And youre wrong lol. Pretty much everyone in this thread can agree. Its cute that you like NOLM but its not that special

NOLF 1 and 2 are considered among the best fps games of all time.

RadiantAdolin posted...

NOLF 1 and 2 are considered among the best fps games of all time.

Don't bother, he thinks Halo's level design is good

---

brotrrwinner posted...

Don't bother, he thinks Halo's level design is good

He's right.

Why the fuck was Halo 1 called Halo CE? Always throws me off, like it's a spinoff like Reach or some shit.
---

The 1st 6 level are great even to this day

Pillar of Autumn - Tutorial, Indoor Combat, Literally only 2 types of enemies but the #s, formation and area make everything interesting

Halo - Beautiful, Open Worldish area with vehicle combat, and a choice to tackle later objectives in a order you like

Truth and Reconciliation - Raid/Stealth mission + indoor combat, both super close and open

The Silent Cartographer - Doomsday-esqe Beach Raid + Vehicle combat, choice between stealth and guns blazing

The Assault in the Control Room - Everything listed above in some indoor ice facility. Has damn near every feature in the game, easily one of the best levels in fps history.

343 Guilty Spark - Major Turning point in story, setup to reveal of new zombie like enemies is great, beginning of AI infighting

Honestly it's so good

I still like the Library and beyond but it's not on the same tier of the 1st 6. Two Betrayals and The Maw are close

Makeveli_lives posted...

The needler is ridiculously powerful lol. Just useless against elites from a distance. But damn did I love using that gun against hunters.

I mean almost anything works against Hunters since they're so weak in CE. The Needler projectiles are just too slow for me.

---

The Needler is fine on Normal and maybe Heroic on specific ambushes but it's pretty useless on Legendary due to how squishy you are.

---