Current Events > every person joker kills is on batman becauae he refuses to kill the psycho

(+) Yeah! (+)

its batman's fault. he's playing with people's lives. he's not a hero.

---

No its on the Joker.

But yeah, he should kill the joker, as doing so would save more lives.

---

it would be illegal to kill the joker

---

If Bruce Wayne just went to therapy Gotham would be a safer place.
---

Batman is also the creator of a good chunk of his rouge gallery, he is on the cutting edge for create your own villain.

---

Batman's whole argument of "if we kill the killer then we become just like them" is dumb. I like Damien's "not if you kill 10 killers" approach.

---

I would say Warden Sharpe would be more at fault. Or whoever the warden for Arkham is.

---

What a great insight, wonder why no one has explored this before

---

No its on the shitty justice system not keeping him locked up

---

All superheroes suffer from being massive hypocrites, because the nature of never-ending, serialized storytelling means those villains need to be alive to make money for the publisher, and the heroes have to make convoluted moral justifications for *not* killing them, that no sane person in their position would ever adhere to. But Batman's character definitely suffers the most from it, imo.

At the absolute bare minimum, killing the Joker while he's in the middle of attempted murder is most likely justified, even in whatever bullshit made up legal environment Gotham has. Or the countless times he's assaulted the Bat-family directly, killing him is outright self-defense.

---

Joker and the rest of Arkham wouldn't kill so many people if Gotham didn't have such a fucked up sense of what "legally insane" means.

---

Batman IS THE BOSS VILLAIN
---

Its the writers' fault for giving him such a ridiculous body count and not being able to come up with something different instead of relying on the Joker so much.

---

Southernfatman posted...

Its the writers' fault for giving him such a ridiculous body count and not being able to come up with something different instead of relying on the Joker so much.

I kninda feel they did that with joker cause Batman is considered a op character despite no super powers. Joker has no powers either so to br batmans main rival it helps I guess to have a leg up on many super powered villains in some accomplishment or another

---

RiKuToTheMiGhtY posted...

Batman is also the creator of a good chunk of his rouge gallery, he is on the cutting edge for create your own villain.

Nah. Most of them would have done evil shit anyway.

---

mooreandrew58 posted...

I kninda feel they did that with joker cause Batman is considered a op character despite no super powers. Joker has no powers either so to br batmans main rival it helps I guess to have a leg up on many super powered villains in some accomplishment or another

Yeah most likely. Batgod is another problem.

---

Were all those super villains already in Gotham? Or did batman attract them to the city?

---

Who bats the batman

Why not just cripple them instead?

He could just break their necks and force them to be bed ridden for their entire lives


---

The whole "if you kill him you'll become just like him" trope has never made any sense to me. There is a rather big moral gap between taking lives to save others and taking lives just because you're a dick.

When you know letting someone go is going to cause the deaths of countless others and you keep doing it anyway, there comes a point where part of the responsibility is on you.

As long as you guys also support the death penalty IRL ill agree with this topic.

Flauros posted...

Why not just cripple them instead?

He could just break their necks and force them to be bed ridden for their entire lives

That's just how you get a supervillain in a magic wheelchair.

---

Flauros posted...

Why not just cripple them instead?

He could just break their necks and force them to be bed ridden for their entire lives

Batman: The Dark Knight Returns spoilers: He did that at the end of Part 2, but Joker twisted his own neck further to kill himself all while taunting Batman that he won by finally getting Batman to lose control.

Interestingly enough, the premise of this topic is brought up in the same film:
Batman: No more! All the people I've murdered...by letting you live.
Joker: I never kept count.
Batman: I did.
Joker: I know. And I love you for it.

---

Its on the courts for not giving the joker the death penalty.

---

Yeah Frank Miller was the only dude to apply common sense and cynicism into Batman's undefinable moral code for TDKR.

---

Every person dead from COVID is on Trump's hands because he refuses to do anything about it

---

I would still be 100% against the death penalty even if The Joker was real, and I would certainly still be against extrajudicial application of the death penalty.

Tenlaar posted...

I would still be 100% against the death penalty even if The Joker was real, and I would certainly still be against extrajudicial application of the death penalty.

What about that time Joker destroyed the entire world? Certainly that's grounds for death?

---

Dragooncancer_ posted...

Were all those super villains already in Gotham? Or did batman attract them to the city?

I can only think of Bane as coming to Gotham specifically for Batman. Most of the others just came because Gotham's a ****hole.

---

I don't agree with that. Not killing him does not make him responsible. However Batman has literally saved the joker over and over. So yeah he is responsible since he did that.

---

Jagr_68 posted...

What about that time Joker destroyed the entire world? Certainly that's grounds for death?

I don't have a problem with self defense, and there have been many situations where Batman would have been justified, but I got the impression that this thread is talking about Batman going after Joker with a conscious intent to kill in the name of preventing future crimes rather than stop and capture.

Batman has arrested the Joker plenty of times, it's the judiciary system that is the problem.

Either they give him the death penalty or they actually manage to keep him locked up.

Jagr_68 posted...

Yeah Frank Miller was the only dude to apply common sense and cynicism into Batman's undefinable moral code for TDKR.

In the killing joke its implied batman kills him. More noticable in thr animated movie with subtitles. As it shows batman teaching up to brace himself on joker the camera pans away and subs say "joker quits laughing" or something while batman still is laughing

---

Batman has an absolute moral code. Meaning he will absolutely torture, main, disable, paralyse and humiliate any minor felony thugster, but he will absolutely never kill the joker.

---

pinky0926 posted...

Batman has an absolute moral code. Meaning he will absolutely torture, main, disable, paralyse and humiliate any minor felony thugster, but he will absolutely never kill the joker.

Its just no killing and no guns really. He doesn't even like traumatic injury provided he thinks the person can be "persuaded" to cough up some info. He chewed out one of the robins over that. But if he has no reason to believe they have or will give up info sure break all the bones.

It's kinda why I liked injustice 2 more than 1. It started leaning towards the idea both where just extreme opposites and neither was all that good. Ultimately they still played bats as the good guy but they at least started to lean towards that notion.

---

Its a trolley problem really, like the pushing a fat man in front of the tracks to save five other people version.

Months later and Im still seeing trolley problems everywhere after that great topic on CE..

---

It only really gets stupid when he goes out of his way to save Joker.

I prefer Batman Begins take on the rule.
https://youtu.be/EPNI4D2HyX4

Collat posted...

It only really gets stupid when he goes out of his way to save Joker.

I prefer Batman Begins take on the rule.

Batman murders a whole lot of people in that movie. Remember he blow up a temple with a ton of people inside and even some people who were locked up.


---

Collat posted...

It only really gets stupid when he goes out of his way to save Joker.

I prefer Batman Begins take on the rule.
https://youtu.be/EPNI4D2HyX4

Yes I wanted to bring that up but forgot. Wish that would be regular batman. Just make the joker someone who's insanely (no pun intended) good at surviving even the slimmest of odds. Which would make him more the perfect batman villain plot armor out the ass as well

---

Batman says it's up to the justice system to take care of him; and that's correct, he has no right to play judge, jury, and executioner. But the court system that keeps saying "Nah, we can reform him!" Are to blame.

I'm sure the same judges keep making the same choice to put him in Arkham, and they should be able to step back and realize exactly what we realize: it's not possible: kill him.

As for the comment about paralysing him; I'm pretty sure Batman has broken every bone in his body in the past, and Joker still came back from it.

---

Isn't vigilantism a criminal act in the first place? I don't see why legality should be s concern here.

---

Why does Batman catch hate for not liking Joker, but not Flash or Superman for not killing their respective villains?

---

He has no moral duty to kill him. Its generally just that his justification for not doing so is extremely weak.

The legal system that refuses to kill him is definitely at fault.

**Under the red hood spoilers**

https://youtu.be/kgW7pBKcU4k

What makes him so sure he would go on a killing spree after? Joker needs to die just based off logic. Even if you aren't comparing his body count to others, he's not coming back. Now that i'm older he's just preaching selfish ideals here from my perspective. There is nothing to gain to joker being alive beyond feeding his ego.

It's not just antiquated - it's a fallacy.

---

Killmonger posted...

Why does Batman catch hate for not liking Joker, but not Flash or Superman for not killing their respective villains?

Nobody cares about those guys.
And Barry did kill Professor Zoom once, there was a trial and everything

Nolan's Batman was such drivel.

"Ifyou kill a killer there's still a killer in the world" GTFO with that lol. Sure, but let's not pretend killing someone with a body count the size of a small town has the same weight

---

Interesting theory.

Before I put anything on Batman:
1) The judicial system of Gotham needs to learn what legal insanity is.
2) Arkham Asylum needs to be shut down and a new mental health facility put in it's place. One that isn't both hopelessly corrupt and incredibly insecure
3) Blackgate Prison probably also needs to be completely renovated and have a complete change in leadership

Batman has served Joker to the justice department more times than anyone can count. The fact that they are unable to keep Joker (or any of Batman's rogues) under control is a failing on them, not Batman.

---

any prison housing super powers is going to get fucked sooner or later. this is on the capes not the humans.

---

If he kills him then he becomes the batman dat laffs

---