Current Events > FF8 - When you don't understand the junction system

(+) Yeah! (+)

So you think the entire combat system revolves around summoning, as it's the only thing that does any damage.

---

The junction system was such a mess anyway

FF8 was so bad compared to its peers

---

UnfairRepresent posted...

The junction system was such a mess anyway

I dunno. I had as much status resistance and all elemental absorption as possible and did 3-4k damage with normal attacks, also healing myself for that same amount due to Drain.
---

I cannot for the life of me be bothered to get it. I don't like the card game either, and the system of enemies scaling with your level.

---

Learn to play the card game. Change cards into magic. Equip the magic.

---

Summon Eden and then go get a drink and use the bathroom

---

Spam limit breaks

---

Garlands_Soul posted...

I cannot for the life of me be bothered to get it. I don't like the card game either, and the system of enemies scaling with your level.

Best way I can describe it is that magic is a usable resource. But you can also attach it to various stats, which raises them depending on which magic you use.

---

I think that it would have been more palatable if they gave you all the basic junction spots quicker: HP, Attack, and Magic.

---

A shitshow. The classic feel of FFIX was such a relief when it came out.

Yep my first play through was nothing but spamming summons. To be fair it worked pretty well for most of the game lol.

Ill replay ffviii. I never want to touch FFIX again....

---

I recently replayed FF8 did everything but Omega

---

That's literally all I did all the way to the 3rd disk. Never finished the game because the repetitiveness of it got boring. But my characters were so weak my physical atks were still in the 2 digits.

---

Summons also give you a shield

I understood junctioning and still spammed summons because fuck grinding for the best shit for hours to justify using literally anything else

---

FF8 is an unfinished mess of a game. The Junction system was fine. Where's all the character development and stuff to do? Why is the world so empty?

---

SpaceBear_ posted...

FF8 is an unfinished mess of a game. The Junction system was fine. Where's all the character development and stuff to do? Why is the world so empty?

I mean, the Junction system is fine: it's just not explained very well and it kind of runs counter to how you would *think* you want to play i.e. you actually just want to stockpile as much of the junctioned spells as possible.
Everything else is a mess though. The level-scaling makes the game miserable, the plot is exceptionally dumb, and the world is dull and empty.

Really, FFVIII is the PSX FF that needs a remake. There's just enough there that's interesting that you can imagine a redo and a fleshing out could put it in the conversation with VII and IX.

NightRender posted...

I think that it would have been more palatable if they gave you all the basic junction spots quicker: HP, Attack, and Magic.

Pretty sure you get all of that pretty quickly.

Just not for every character at once.

I do wish characters had actual stat growth at level up (HP is the only stat that reliably increases).

---

I just wished they wouldn't have had those times where the game removed all your junctions without telling you and you walked into the next battle (possibly a boss fight) with no abilities.
---

ElatedVenusaur posted...

I mean, the Junction system is fine: it's just not explained very well and it kind of runs counter to how you would *think* you want to play i.e. you actually just want to stockpile as much of the junctioned spells as possible.
Everything else is a mess though. The level-scaling makes the game miserable, the plot is exceptionally dumb, and the world is dull and empty.

Really, FFVIII is the PSX FF that needs a remake. There's just enough there that's interesting that you can imagine a redo and a fleshing out could put it in the conversation with VII and IX.

Yeah, it's so threadbare and incomplete. It's absolutely inconceivable that, after all the world building and designs, the plot is just non existent and it's all just a tacked together love story with a character whose whole personality is disinterest.

Needs a remake or a sequel or something.

I don't get the hate for IX but whatever the reasoning at least it's a complete multilayered story with a satisfying ending.



---

SpaceBear_ posted...

Yeah, it's so threadbare and incomplete. It's absolutely inconceivable that, after all the world building and designs, the plot is just non existent and it's all just a tacked together love story with a character whose whole personality is disinterest.

Needs a remake or a sequel or something.

I don't get the hate for IX but whatever the reasoning at least it's a complete multilayered story with a satisfying ending.

9 is so long and slow. And thats with speeding the game up. On psx i got to the last "dungeon" and stopped because i genuinely just didnt want to play anymore.

---

the real issue with junction is it incentivizes you not to use magic at all, you dont want to decrease your overall damage potential after all. i guess if the balancing was better it would force you to either rely on weaker spells for damage while junctioning stronger spells for bonuses, or push you to hyper focus each character so you can rely on some stronger spells, but from what i remember it didn't really hit that level of balance.

---

Musourenka posted...

Pretty sure you get all of that pretty quickly.

Just not for every character at once.

I do wish characters had actual stat growth at level up (HP is the only stat that reliably increases).

Yeah the "not everyone at once" is the problem. It was basically an overly convoluted way of doing a job system at the beginning of the game, but giving everyone everything by the end of the game. The other ways they've tried this, the sphere grid and license board, are also bad, but have a better learning curve at least.

---

monkmith posted...

the real issue with junction is it incentivizes you not to use magic at all, you dont want to decrease your overall damage potential after all. i guess if the balancing was better it would force you to either rely on weaker spells for damage while junctioning stronger spells for bonuses, or push you to hyper focus each character so you can rely on some stronger spells, but from what i remember it didn't really hit that level of balance.

Magic being a finite resource that you have to find is a thing that shouldn't ever be done, especially in a JRPG.

It's why magic is basically pointless in FFXV

---

DarkRoast posted...

So you think the entire combat system revolves around summoning, as it's the only thing that does any damage.

yep, that was me when i played it

---

Wasn't FF8 a trading card game?
---

monkmith posted...

the real issue with junction is it incentivizes you not to use magic at all, you dont want to decrease your overall damage potential after all. i guess if the balancing was better it would force you to either rely on weaker spells for damage while junctioning stronger spells for bonuses, or push you to hyper focus each character so you can rely on some stronger spells, but from what i remember it didn't really hit that level of balance.

But why would you need to use magic at all when you can spam limit breaks? It's so easily abusable in 8 and is the only fun part of the battle system in that game.

---

Or when you dont understand the junction system and blast the game even though it was awesome.

Payzmaykr posted...

Or when you dont understand the junction system and blast the game even though it was awesome.

OST = Fantastic
Cutscenes = Incredible
Battle system = Absolute shite
Story = wtf is even happening

---

A big reason people resort to summoning GFs is the game is because it pushes you toward using that strategy. Every time a new ability is learned the game defaults your next ability to learn to be a GF ability (boost, GF hp + 10%, etc.) instead of the much more useful refine abilities.

So if someone is overwhelmed by the choices and lets the game choose their level up abilities, they end up with GFs being their most powerful option that they spam all game until they get to Abel and get mini soft locked.

If the game pushed you to get the refine abilities instead I think many first time players experiences would be a lot different. They'd experiment with this ability from the beginning and see you can get spells from enemy loot much more efficiently than drawing endlessly which is another common complaint about the junction system.

Honestly, my biggest complaint with the junction system is that the game feels broken if you don't use it, and the game feels broken if you do use it. Just in opposite directions.

---

DarkRoast posted...

Honestly, my biggest complaint with the junction system is that the game feels broken if you don't use it, and the game feels broken if you do use it. Just in opposite directions.

That's where you fucked up. The game is supposed to be all able the romance between Squall and Rinoa. Caring about anything else is a mistake.

---

DarkRoast posted...

Garlands_Soul posted...

I cannot for the life of me be bothered to get it. I don't like the card game either, and the system of enemies scaling with your level.

Best way I can describe it is that magic is a usable resource. But you can also attach it to various stats, which raises them depending on which magic you use.

That is literally all it is.

I have no idea how people dont get this.
---

A5modeu5 posted...

That is literally all it is.

I have no idea how people dont get this.

The tutorial explains it pretty well I guess people just don't like listening

---

CouldBeAnAlt posted...

The tutorial explains it pretty well I guess people just don't like listening

Imagine reading or even listening to a tutorial lmao. Did you read the GameFAQs ToS too ya nerd?

---

A5modeu5 posted...

That is literally all it is.

I have no idea how people dont get this.

I reckon it's because they use the word junction for multiple things.

• You junction GFs to characters.
• Which allows characters to junction abilities, which include:
• Active abilities like Item and Draw.
• And passive abilities like HP +10%
• And you can also junction magic to certain skills.
• But only if the GF has the ability for it. There they go again using the same word for things that seem different.
• And also you need to have drawn the magic using the draw ability mentioned briefly earlier.

It's actually 3 slightly confusing systems layered on top of each other, that compound in a exponential way.

---

How can you not under stand the junction system enough to not know to equip magic it to your stats and then the stats go up?

I understood the Junction System just fine, it was just poorly implemented.

For comparison's sake, Chrono Cross also had a similar "finite magic" system per battle, stats were even further hard-locked on your first playthough, and you're once again reliant on crafting to keep characters geared. Yet I actually had fun with Chrono Cross whereas it took me years to finish Final Fantasy 8 it was so obnoxious to play.

Ironically, both games also had incredible soundtracks, WTF plots, and literally useless party members. But gameplay kept CC from being a completely agonizing experience for me.
---

At first I used to hate the junction system because I didn't understand it, but then I finally took the 10 minutes to properly understand it and how easy it is to break it and now I love it. I love being overpowered! :D

---

Inferno Dive Dragoon posted...

I understood the Junction System just fine, it was just poorly implemented.

For comparison's sake, Chrono Cross also had a similar "finite magic" system per battle, stats were even further hard-locked on your first playthough, and you're once again reliant on crafting to keep characters geared. Yet I actually had fun with Chrono Cross whereas it took me years to finish Final Fantasy 8 it was so obnoxious to play.

Ironically, both games also had incredible soundtracks, WTF plots, and literally useless party members. But gameplay kept CC from being a completely agonizing experience for me.

To this very day I still do not understand any of the plot to Chrono Cross, and I have played through it literally dozens of times

---