Current Events > Hot Take: Boss battles are a bad video game mechanic.

(+) Yeah! (+)

Theyre pretty much never fun to play and often have bullshit logic (or lack thereof) that doesnt apply to the rest of the game.

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In platformers, yes. In RPGs, no.

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Imagine a civilization game with bosses.

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PtRyhtdjACk
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This giant lumbering thing absorbs most attacks, is clunky and awkward to try and avoid, doesnt react to anything I do until the scripted moments that matter and can kill me in one hit. How fun!

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ArianaGrandSlam posted...

This isnt a hot take, this is just fucking stupid

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Challenging situations using the usual game functions/enemies are better tests of skill and more fun to play.

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You're a bad video game mechanic.

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ArianaGrandSlam posted...

This isnt a hot take

So many people agree? Good.

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Xbox player? Just curious

Absolute zero take: this take is shit

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pogo_rabid posted...

Imagine a civilization game with bosses.

It would totally be Gandhi as the final boss.



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Depends on the game but I generally agree that boss battles are the lowlights of many games.
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This is just dumb. There are plenty of good games that are basically just about the boss fights.

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NMH's would be a piece of junk game without them.

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I'm trying to give you the benefit of the doubt here.

What's a few concrete examples of games you feel are dragged down by boss battles?

Everything thing that's coming to mind off the top of my head are combat games where bosses are a little bit harder and longer combat, or even for platformers good bosses tend to use the platforming mechanics you just learned in the level.

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I'm gonna agree and disagree and I think it depends on how much effort the developers put into the bosses. Usually I love an awesome boss fight but I can see where you're coming from, there's many games that just make them overly cheap bullet-sponges, or if they have an easy pattern to recognize they can be kind of a joke. But if a game is just fighting easy mobs all game without that additional big baddie that really challenges you, then a game can get pretty dull.

Boss fights have been my favorite thing about games since the OG Kingdom Hearts opened my eyes to how they push your knowledge of game mechanics back when I was a kid in 2002

Before that game, I'd say the hardest non 2D side scroller boss fight I had done was HAG-1 in Banjo-Tooie 2 years prior lol

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ArianaGrandSlam posted...

This isnt a hot take, this is just fucking stupid

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i can agree with that. i remember in deus ex uh, whichever came out in 2011 or whatever, you could go through the whole game stealth and never upgrade your fighting ability, and then BAM, boss fight where you had to shoot and kill the boss but you were just too weak and you were basically FUCKED

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EffectAndCause posted...

This giant lumbering thing absorbs most attacks, is clunky and awkward to try and avoid, doesnt react to anything I do until the scripted moments that matter and can kill me in one hit. How fun!

Sounds like the only game TC has ever played is Gears of War

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Garioshi posted...

In platformers, yes. In RPGs, no.

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Depends on the game and how it handles the boss fights.

Generally bosses are supposed to be skill checks. They're supposed to be a culmination of everything you learned up to this point to see if you can get past it. For Zelda, they're usually supposed to be the ultimate test to see if you fully grasped the concept of how the dungeon's item and puzzles work. For an RPG, they're supposed to be gates to see if you're strong enough to proceed.

If a boss throws in some random element that you were never given time to be accustomed to beforehand or is a bunch of trial and error as a result, then that would be considered bad boss design.

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MixedRaceBaby posted...

i can agree with that. i remember in deus ex uh, whichever came out in 2011 or whatever, you could go through the whole game stealth and never upgrade your fighting ability, and then BAM, boss fight where you had to shoot and kill the boss but you were just too weak and you were basically FUCKED

Human revolution. The boss battles were notoriously awful in that, directors cut had to change it lol

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Bosses are usually my favorite parts.

MGS Bosses (until PW) were all amazing
Zelda Bosses are generally fun
GoW bosses are badass
Megaman Bosses are cool
Metroid Bosses are usually awesome

The only time I hate a boss fights is in a fighting game where they're cheap AF.

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Lokison posted...

Bosses are usually my favorite parts.

MGS Bosses (until PW) were all amazing
Zelda Bosses are generally fun
GoW bosses are badass
Megaman Bosses are cool
Metroid Bosses are usually awesome

The only time I hate a boss fights is in a fighting game where they're cheap AF.

Didn't like peace walker, eh? It's definitely an odd game, like hideo Kojima decided to mix monster hunter and mgs. Some of those huge boss fights were infuriating, particularly peace walker itself.

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Shadow of the Colossus

nuff said

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I can't hear you ever this totally rad boss theme.

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Boss fights, like good one on one fights in movies, are the best part of the action.

EffectAndCause posted...

This giant lumbering thing absorbs most attacks, is clunky and awkward to try and avoid, doesnt react to anything I do until the scripted moments that matter and can kill me in one hit. How fun!

That's just shitty dog garbage boss battles from cinematic stupid badgames, though. Try something like Yakuza, those (Zero, anyway) have great boss fights. Literally just a tougher and cooler enemy

You can apply your cherrypicking to normal enemy encounters in mediocre games. "These identical cannon fodder enemies that I've killed 3000 of already that die in one hit are coming at me again for the fifth time in 5 minutes. How fun!"

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steveoSEK posted...

Didn't like peace walker, eh? It's definitely an odd game, like hideo Kojima decided to mix monster hunter and mgs. Some of those huge boss fights were infuriating, particularly peace walker itself.

I actually really liked PW, but most of the boss fights were just vehicles. The big Mechs were pretty fun, especially The Caccoon. The Monster fights were also entertaining, if not unnecessary.

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cocoon & the Pods

I liked

Imagine GoW without bosses. Imagine Souls without bosses. Imagine Final Fantasy where you never actually fight the big important guys.

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I generally agree. I can't think of any single boss that had some kind of revolutionary positive effect on my gaming life. There's some good ones out there but most of them are just "whack the dude until he dies", hit the glowing weak point for MASSIVE DAMAGE", or "here's some specific mechanic for this boss that is not relevant to the rest of the game". They almost never test your ability to control the games mechanics, just being able to do something while avoiding being hit by some giant rat fuck bastard.

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Some games the normal enemies are way way funner to fight than the bosses.

Like Resident Evil, Doom 2016+, or Dead Space, I dread the boss fights, but the normal enemy layouts are really fun. Give me a challenging fight that's essentially a puzzle, vs a boring boss that all you do is unload in him over and over all day and learn his pattern.

Other games the normal enemies are OK, but the boss fights are amazing. Like FFVIIR(Hard Mode), and Dragon Quest 11(Hard Monsters). These bosses actually make you think, are strategic and a puzzle in their own right. Cant wait till my next boss fights in these games.

I guess some games the normal enemies are a puzzle, whereas other games the boss fights are the puzzle. Just make me solve a puzzle and Im having fun.

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pogo_rabid posted...

Shadow of the Colossus
nuff said

This. Phalanx is one of the best boss fights ever.

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Monster Hunter and Souls games are now gone.

Good job

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Shotgunnova posted...

This. Phalanx is one of the best boss fights ever.

Yeah man

ManaYuka posted...

Like Resident Evil, Doom 2016+, or Dead Space, I dread the boss fights, but the normal enemy layouts are really fun.

....the boss fights are literally the whole build up in RE games. I can't imagine how big of a slap in the face it would be to start off a game with introducing the big villians, just to never actually confront them in the gameplay. Especially the modern ones. Each area is just all build up for the boss fight. It's good build up and enjoyable itself, but the whe time you know why you're doing what you're doing. It's insane you'd want to just skip the climax of each area. If they killed the bosses off in cutscenes it would make it the stupidest most pointless fuckin game on the planet. The bosses are the core of RE games. Everything else is basically built around them at this point.

Also, learning boss patterns to avoid them IS a form of a puzzle. Boss fights that aren't puzzles are ones where you just have to make your character strong enough to go hit for hit. Needing strategy in RE fights is basically them putting pieces in front of you and you figuring out what works and what doesn't.

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EffectAndCause posted...

This giant lumbering thing absorbs most attacks, is clunky and awkward to try and avoid, doesnt react to anything I do until the scripted moments that matter and can kill me in one hit. How fun!

Go fight Vergil.

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For me some games are defined by the boss fights. Metal gear rising for me personally. Mega man series to me woulf suck without the bosses even if I could do without the gauntlet at the end of the games

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ViewtifulGrave posted...

Go fight Vergil.

Funny thing is in DMCV you could argue he is a giant lumbering asshat who just absorbs damage like a sponge.

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Theres a reason why I said Vergil and not Urizen.

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Lost_All_Senses posted...

....the boss fights are literally the whole build up in RE games. I can't imagine how big of a slap in the face it would be to start off a game with introducing the big villians, just to never actually confront them in the gameplay. Especially the modern ones. Each area is just all build up for the boss fight. It's good build up and enjoyable itself, but the whe time you know why you're doing what you're doing. It's insane you'd want to just skip the climax of each area. If they killed the bosses off in cutscenes it would make it the stupidest most pointless fuckin game on the planet. The bosses are the core of RE games. Everything else is basically built around them at this point.

Also, learning boss patterns to avoid them IS a form of a puzzle. Boss fights that aren't puzzles are ones where you just have to make your character strong enough to go hit for hit. Needing strategy in RE fights is basically them putting pieces in front of you and you figuring out what works and what doesn't.

I was just pointing out some games I like the bosses, some games I dislike them. I was not advocating to get rid of bosses like the TC.

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EffectAndCause posted...

This giant lumbering thing absorbs most attacks, is clunky and awkward to try and avoid, doesnt react to anything I do until the scripted moments that matter and can kill me in one hit. How fun!

git gud

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Lost_All_Senses posted...

Imagine GoW without bosses. Imagine Souls without bosses. Imagine Final Fantasy where you never actually fight the big important guys.

Souls without bosses would be a far superior game
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