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Current Events > Defence argues it's not sex assault if the victim is dead

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refmon
08/12/21 7:12:31 PM
#1:


https://www.thestar.com/news/gta/2021/08/11/at-east-york-murder-trial-defence-argues-its-not-sex-assault-if-the-victim-is-dead.html

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brotrrwinner
08/12/21 7:14:07 PM
#2:


They're right. It's necrophilia

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DrizztLink
08/12/21 7:15:06 PM
#3:


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LordFarquad1312
08/12/21 7:16:50 PM
#4:


brotrrwinner posted...
They're right. It's necrophilia


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RickyTheBAWSE
08/12/21 7:18:27 PM
#5:


so we just gonna ignore the falling silverware, flying books and cracking mirrors? clearly the spirit is restless and not giving consent.
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NoxObscuras
08/12/21 7:18:32 PM
#6:


brotrrwinner posted...
They're right. It's necrophilia
Yep, that's what they're going for.

Beaks lawyer Greg Leslie argued that his client should be acquitted on both counts because he was not involved in killing Estrada at all and because, legally, a sexual assault cannot be committed on a person who is dead.

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Unite
08/12/21 7:19:44 PM
#7:


If she was dead when it happened then they would be correct it would fall under a different charge.
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GiftedACIII
08/13/21 9:04:11 PM
#8:


They're also going for the "they were drunk so they weren't in the right state of mind" defense.
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NeonOctopus
08/13/21 9:07:47 PM
#9:


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ScazarMeltex
08/14/21 2:27:15 PM
#11:


GiftedACIII posted...
They're also going for the "they were drunk so they weren't in the right state of mind" defense.
That defense is always so sketchy to me. If that can get you off from this sort of thing why can't it get you off from DWI?

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harley2280
08/14/21 2:27:37 PM
#12:


I'm not super familiar with UK laws, but in the US if someone dies during commission if a felony it's automatically first degree murder. Even if you're not the person who killed them.
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DeadBankerDream
08/14/21 2:29:25 PM
#13:


If you "find" a dead body and have sex with it, I agree. If you rape someone during your murder of them, I'm not sure I'd agree.

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SSJPurple
08/14/21 2:35:35 PM
#14:


Dead or not sticking your wiener in someone without permission is messed up.

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SSJPurple
08/14/21 2:36:38 PM
#15:


DeadBankerDream posted...
If you "find" a dead body and have sex with it,

DudeThats still abhorrent lol

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DeadBankerDream
08/14/21 2:37:26 PM
#16:


SSJPurple posted...
DudeThats still abhorrent lol
No offense, but that's a really stupid post.

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WesternMedia
08/16/21 12:46:13 AM
#17:


harley2280 posted...
I'm not super familiar with UK laws, but in the US if someone dies during commission if a felony it's automatically first degree murder. Even if you're not the person who killed them.

Was going to say this exact thing but yeah, if it's the UK they have a record of being lenient on stuff like this.

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#18
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LordFarquad1312
08/17/21 4:31:05 PM
#19:


SSJPurple posted...
DudeThats still abhorrent lol
But it's not rape.

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Barber102
08/17/21 4:44:37 PM
#20:


WesternMedia posted...
Was going to say this exact thing but yeah, if it's the UK they have a record of being lenient on stuff like this.

harley2280 posted...
I'm not super familiar with UK laws, but in the US if someone dies during commission if a felony it's automatically first degree murder. Even if you're not the person who killed them.

pretty sure this happened in canada

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harley2280
08/17/21 7:59:09 PM
#21:


Barber102 posted...
WesternMedia posted...
Was going to say this exact thing but yeah, if it's the UK they have a record of being lenient on stuff like this.

harley2280 posted...
I'm not super familiar with UK laws, but in the US if someone dies during commission if a felony it's automatically first degree murder. Even if you're not the person who killed them.

pretty sure this happened in canada

My mistake. Still not familiar with Canadian law.
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#22
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Bass_X0
08/21/21 10:43:50 AM
#23:


_

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The Trent
08/21/21 10:44:44 AM
#24:


i feel like this was argued like 40 years ago in the courts

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monkmith
08/21/21 10:45:56 AM
#25:


DrizztLink posted...
this, though i doubt a jury would appreciate the fact...

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Kim_Seong-a
08/21/21 10:46:02 AM
#26:


Expected Florida, got New York.



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CobraGT
08/21/21 10:57:23 AM
#27:


They were sober when they acquired the drugs and the crowbar would be my counter argument.

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Tyranthraxus
08/21/21 11:05:15 AM
#28:


ScazarMeltex posted...
That defense is always so sketchy to me. If that can get you off from this sort of thing why can't it get you off from DWI?
Mens Rea.

You made the decision to get drunk while sober.

If someone spiked your drink with a different drug without your knowledge that could be a defense but would be pretty hard to prove. "I never drink and drive but this asshole slipped MDMA into my drink and fucked everything up."

Might work might not. Depends on the lawyer, jury, and what you actually did.

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AmericaTheBrave
08/21/21 11:12:26 AM
#29:


LordFarquad1312 posted...
But it's not rape.

Yes it is. A corpse can't consent.

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daynlokki
08/21/21 11:19:22 AM
#30:


AmericaTheBrave posted...
Yes it is. A corpse can't consent.
Well of course not, its a corpse. That said, in the US, you cannot rape a corpse. Of course necrophilia is still legal in several states as well.
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Tyranthraxus
08/21/21 11:23:38 AM
#31:


daynlokki posted...
Well of course not, its a corpse. That said, in the US, you cannot rape a corpse. Of course necrophilia is still legal in several states as well.

The act of necrophilia may be legal but there's enough generic corpse defilement laws that they could throw something at you and make it stick if they had to.

IIRC it's not legal in any state to possess authentic human remains without a license of some kind.

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Ivynn
08/21/21 11:25:39 AM
#32:


daynlokki posted...
Of course necrophilia is still legal in several states as well.

Wait

What

Why

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Tyranthraxus
08/21/21 11:27:40 AM
#33:


Ivynn posted...
Wait

What

Why
One of those "nobody ever thought to make it illegal" things.

Kind like how there's no federal minimum age for marriage and many states don't have one so you can marry 12 year olds in some states legally. Only thing you need is parents permission.

This is a thing that actually happens in America btw. The usual suspects are behind it as well

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Anteaterking
08/21/21 11:58:22 AM
#34:


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harley2280
08/21/21 2:58:46 PM
#35:


Tyranthraxus posted...
Ivynn posted...
Wait

What

Why
One of those "nobody ever thought to make it illegal" things.

Kind like how there's no federal minimum age for marriage and many states don't have one so you can marry 12 year olds in some states legally. Only thing you need is parents permission.

This is a thing that actually happens in America btw. The usual suspects are behind it as well

There's people in NC fighting tooth and nail to keep their ability to marry kids.

It's generally done to protect child molesters. They pay the parents off, and then the victim is stuck married to their abuser with no legal recourse.
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Bass_X0
08/21/21 3:04:25 PM
#36:




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CobraGT
08/21/21 4:17:58 PM
#37:


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CobraGT
08/21/21 5:34:03 PM
#38:


The defense says it is not sexual assault if the target is dead but what the defense is really claiming is that if you kill the target you now have consent.

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Bass_X0
08/21/21 5:41:58 PM
#39:




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Darmik
08/21/21 6:01:14 PM
#40:


Murillo has admitted to beating 41-year-old Estrada to death with a crowbar late on the night of May 25, 2018; Beak has admitted to trying to penetrate her with his penis after, he claimed, she was already dead.

The Crown is expected to argue both men, who are in their 20s, unlawfully confined and sexually assaulted Estrada, and then murdered her.

I would be shocked if every single one of you didnt say I want that guy in prison forever, Murillos lawyer Brian Ross told the jury. Thats not what this is about. I am asking you to consider the evidence in this case and convict him for what he actually did.

Ross argued there is no evidence that Murillo participated in a sexual assault or that he unlawfully confined Estrada either of which the jury would need to find beyond a reasonable doubt to convict him of first-degree murder, rather than second-degree murder.


And to think this was the best defence they could come up with.

"Actually he didn't try to rape her until she was dead! Also the guy that did that didn't beat her to death to begin with!"

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deanshow
08/21/21 6:07:46 PM
#41:


Darmik posted...
And to think this was the best defence they could come up with.

"Actually he didn't try to rape her until she was dead! Also the guy that did that didn't beat her to death to begin with!"
I mean she wouldn't be dead if the jerkoffs didn't beat her to death. I hope they do life for this senseless ass crime.

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Umbreon
08/21/21 6:12:58 PM
#42:


harley2280 posted...
There's people in NC fighting tooth and nail to keep their ability to marry kids.

It's generally done to protect child molesters. They pay the parents off, and then the victim is stuck married to their abuser with no legal recourse.


And that's exactly why the 'sanctity of marriage' has always been bullshit to me. Long as that's still legal.

On topic... I thought "It's not rape if they're dead" was some edgelord humor and not something someone would actually try to argue in a court of law.

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Graycap
08/21/21 6:16:02 PM
#43:


Problem is this creates a loophole where you can just kill someone first then force yourself upon them and not get tagged for rape on top of murder just because they died first. >_>
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WesternMedia
08/24/21 4:52:37 AM
#44:


Kim_Seong-a posted...
Expected Florida, got New York.


On further inspection, this actually seems to be from Canada. Other sources says it's from East York, Toronto, a city in Canada.

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DeadBankerDream
08/24/21 7:47:06 AM
#45:


Graycap posted...
Problem is this creates a loophole where you can just kill someone first then force yourself upon them and not get tagged for rape on top of murder just because they died first. >_>
I don't think you thought this through.

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StarSpangled
08/25/21 7:47:51 PM
#46:


WesternMedia posted...
On further inspection, this actually seems to be from Canada. Other sources says it's from East York, Toronto, a city in Canada.

That sucks.

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deoxxys
08/25/21 7:53:49 PM
#47:


AmericaTheBrave posted...
Yes it is. A corpse can't consent.
I mean a sponge cant consent either

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