Poll of the Day > Why the fuck are people defending scalpers?

(+) Yeah! (+)

Defending objectively bad people is a form of virtue signalling

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Lokarin posted...

I mean, like, if a product is $400 and a scalper is flipping them for $500... the store shoulda been $550'in that shit

no, the right price is not "the highest price possible that someone somewhere will still pay". there's actually a 'sweet spot' in the middle somewhere where things average out.

(and a step further, if you want to get at the people that ARE willing to pay more, that's why you have collector's editions and things like that; options for the people who want to pay more for the best possible option. and then maybe, cheaper options with less features, for those who can't afford or don't want to pay more than the minimal possible amount.)

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Sahuagin posted...

no, the right price is not "the highest price possible that someone somewhere will still pay". there's actually a 'sweet spot' in the middle somewhere where things average out.

oh? How does that work?

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Lokarin posted...

I mean, like, if a product is $400 and a scalper is flipping them for $500... the store shoulda been $550'in that shit

That doesnt help at all, Lok. If the stores were selling them for $550, then the scalpers would sell them for more
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LinkPizza posted...

That doesnt help at all, Lok. If the stores were selling them for $550, then the scalpers would sell them for more

Keep going up!

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Lokarin posted...

Keep going up!

what are you smoking right now and can i have some?

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Nade Duck posted...

what are you smoking right now and can i have some?

Idk...

My impression if economics is there's always a known 'desirable price'... and until you are as high as that price you are undervaluing your product

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you're completely ignoring the consumer, but okay.

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Nade Duck posted...

what are you smoking right now and can i have some?

No matter how high you go, scalpers with the intent of selling it for more. There is no high amount to stop at

Nade Duck posted...

you're completely ignoring the consumer, but okay.

Exactly!
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Kotenks posted...

People will defend anything online.

It's like how world of warcraft went from black listing ninjas in classic to "You can't ninja in this game, it's not yours until it is in your bag" (I imagine that said in the most annoying nasally voice possible) by Wrath

BlackScythe0 posted...

But you were the one who was morally wrong.

I dont agree

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Clench281 posted...

I don't think anyone is arguing they make it easier for EVERYBODY to get them.

They make it easier for people who are willing to pay a premium (to be first to access something in high demand) do so. The alternative being a crapshoot for all.

a premium? what the fuck is that suppose to mean?

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does that premium come with turtle wax

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Lokarin posted...

oh? How does that work?

at the lowest-but-still-positive profitable price, the most number of people buy one, but you make almost no profit.

at the highest-price-that-some-people-will-still-pay, you make a ton of profit on each sale, but sell too few of them to be profitable overall.

somewhere in the middle this is optimized such that your profit-per-item-sold and number-of-sales combine into maximum profit.

(I suppose you could say that since demand is maximized and 100% of items are being sold regardless of price, then the price should be higher. but the strategy would apply to final sales totals, not short-term, and demand is only maxed out temporarily.)

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Sahuagin posted...

(I suppose you could say that since demand is maximized and 100% of items are being sold regardless of price, then the price should be higher. but the strategy would apply to final sales totals, not short-term, and demand is only maxed out temporarily.)

That's what he's getting at: If 100% of your stock is selling, that generally means you can increase the price without losing sales. You'll eventually hit a point where less than 100% sells, at which point you've overpriced it, but until that point is reached, you can go higher.

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adjl posted...

That's what he's getting at: If 100% of your stock is selling, that generally means you can increase the price without losing sales. You'll eventually hit a point where less than 100% sells, at which point you've overpriced it, but until that point is reached, you can go higher.

Although, its pretty late now. If they raise the price at this point, some people may get mad and not buy it out of spite. Some will still buy. But they may also help some scalpers who sell their for more than the paid for it, but less than the retail price
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ArvTheGreat posted...

a premium? what the fuck is that suppose to mean?

sometimes people want something bad enough that they are willing to pay extra for the convenience of obtaining it immediately

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BlackScythe0 posted...

Almost never.

The Wii.
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adjl posted...

That's what he's getting at: If 100% of your stock is selling, that generally means you can increase the price without losing sales. You'll eventually hit a point where less than 100% sells, at which point you've overpriced it, but until that point is reached, you can go higher.

yeah. that's a dangerous game to play though, especially with something like a console where it's not just about the sale of the console, but the sale of games down the road. there is more reason than a normal product to increase the number of sales and not just profit from sales.

(maybe even more than just sale of games; the whole "life" of the console depends directly on number of purchases; online experience, demand for new games, etc. (may even be contributing to the overall problem; not sure of the actual cost of a console but it is likely already being sold at low or even negative profit margins, hence the huge demand))

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Revelation34 posted...

The Wii.

Weirdly, this didnt happen in my town or something. The Wii was pretty good. Most of my friends were able to easily get them. The Target store I worked at got 64 when I got one, for example. Where both Playstation 3 and Xbox 360 only got less than 20 each. I think it was just that so many people wanted it. They made a bunch, but it just sold well, from why I can tell Unless youre saying that all three companies were holding back. And if that was the case, Nintendo was still releasing probably as many as they could
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LinkPizza posted...

Weirdly, this didnt happen in my town or something. The Wii was pretty good. Most of my friends were able to easily get them. The Target store I worked at got 64 when I got one, for example. Where both Playstation 3 and Xbox 360 only got less than 20 each. I think it was just that so many people wanted it. They made a bunch, but it just sold well, from why I can tell Unless youre saying that all three companies were holding back. And if that was the case, Nintendo was still releasing probably as many as they could

yeah I don't recall a shortage of Wiis, in fact my family liked it so much we ended up buying at least three of them all at once.

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If you didnt experts shortage of Wiis then you werent trying to get one that first holiday season in a populated area

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I mean we its over looked because housing has varying value.

But Housing scalping is one of the worst forms of scalping that probably will never stop.

People across the country and in other countries outbid everyone else and buy up low income housing and charge a premium to rent it out.

I think this is far worse then not being able to buy your GPUs or Gaming Consoles at retail price.


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It's like dealing drugs, isn't it? Except it seems kind of necessary. Why not attack the ones who make the situation possible, by that same token? They're the ones who are actually responsible.
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Lokarin posted...

but if anyone else bought from the scalper at an inflated price they're the ones being dumb

Thing is, people with disposable income just want the thing. They don't care how much it costs since it's ts a drop in the bucket to them. It sucks, but it's the reality of scalping.

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Literally interfering in free market economies for shit that doesnt even matter

id understand govt stepping in to stop scalpers reselling food water or other essentials

but people charging an arm and a leg for a PS5? Come on grow up guys. Theres way more important things to worry about, if you dont wanna pay 100% markup then just wait for the console to get cheaper

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I paid $50 over the MSRP to get a PS5

totally worth it imo

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SaltyAndSweet posted...

If you didnt experts shortage of Wiis then you werent trying to get one that first holiday season in a populated area

Dont know. Cant really say how populated my town was. Seemed like a bunch of people. We all just went and got it first day

deoxxys posted...

People across the country and in other countries outbid everyone else and buy up low income housing and charge a premium to rent it out.

This is bad, too And should honestly be illegal

FatalAccident posted...

if you dont wanna pay 100% markup then just wait for the console to get cheaper

The thing is, I dont mind paying the asking price of the system. I dont want to help scummy scalpers by paying them 2 or 3 times the price (or more) for the scummy behavior, though They shitty people who dont deserve it
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LinkPizza posted...

The thing is, I dont mind paying the asking price of the system. I dont want to help scummy scalpers by paying them 2 or 3 times the price (or more) for the scummy behavior, though They shitty people who dont deserve it

Larry-David-Then-You-Wait.gif

The number of scalpers is nothing compared to the number of people wanting to buy the console. Scalpers aren't really making it harder for you to find one; the high demand is making it hard to find one, made up of people just like you wanting to buy it. Scalped consoles are highly visible because they're being advertised, but for every scalped console you have hundreds of legitimate purchases who got theirs and don't try to resell.

There's scalpers because there's a shortage of supply. The shortage of supply isn't because of scalpers.


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Clench281 posted...

Larry-David-Then-You-Wait.gif

The number of scalpers is nothing compared to the number of people wanting to buy the console. Scalpers aren't really making it harder for you to find one; the high demand is making it hard to find one, made up of people just like you wanting to buy it. Scalped consoles are highly visible because they're being advertised, but for every scalped console you have hundreds of legitimate purchases who got theirs and don't try to resell.

There's scalpers because there's a shortage of supply. The shortage of supply isn't because of scalpers.

Thats literally what Im doing. I said that when the PS5 came out. I dont mind waiting. That said, scalpers are fucking that up, as well If the only people I had to worry about were gamers, Id be closer to having one. Since like it was said earlier, once a gamer buys the system, they usually stop looking and the competition becomes smaller. Where when a scalper buys them, they just re-enter themselves into the competition to get more

So scalpers are helping the high demands become even higher as they are trying to buy as many as they can, which is usually multiple systems. Where many people are only trying to buy one, and then they are done. Sometimes, people buy one for a friend or family member. But even then, they stop after getting enough. Where scalpers arent stopping until they run out of money that they are willing to spend buying the systems just to sell them And for the people that arent trying my to pay a premium for a non-service (or service that makes things more difficult), or arent trying to enable shorty practices, they are effectively off the market for them And there could be many who are having some trouble selling. Which could also cause more of a shortage if scalper just have a bunch, and they arent selling well for them

So, scalpers are definitely helping the shortage
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Scalping is cool because it can save someone from having a bad hair day!

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If scalpers are making money by selling consoles at inflated prices, then they aren't making the shortage worse. Demand would have to already greatly exceed supply.

I'm not saying scalpers are good guys, but I'd wager they're not a primary reason you can't find a console. Maybe 10% of the reason. You only perceive it to be entirely on scalpers because you see news and topics and listings of scalped consoles, but not typical sales to end users.

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In fact, if somehow society was completely unaware of how to scalp consoles or or were illegal (and 100% enforced), the problem would still exist.

People with money who want the console now would just put out bounties for other people to fulfill. "I'll pay you $200 if you find me a PS5" type of deal, with the same end result.

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If they can sell them, which I mentioned earlier, I think. And if they sell all of them

And the primary reason I cant find one in because Im not looking right now. I mentioned earlier that I was waiting. And Im still waiting. I havent tried because I dont really have the patience for it right now. I was trying to wait for it to die down some Its just taking longer for it to do so And the news or whatever doesnt make me think its scalpers. The listings help, but I already knew there would be scalpers because there always are

I wish scalper was illegal. I think it would still be hard to get system, but the amount of people trying to get one would be lower, this slightly (even if not by much) easier to get one
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Its frustrating that scalpers are selling stuff thats hard to get but they really do make up a very small amount of consumers. Most retailers limit the number of popular items that are scarce that can be sold to an individual, so they are limited to the number that they can reasonably obtain.

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SaltyAndSweet posted...

Its frustrating that scalpers are selling stuff thats hard to get but they really do make up a very small amount of consumers. Most retailers limit the number of popular items that are scarce that can be sold to an individual, so they are limited to the number that they can reasonably obtain.

Yeah. Though, many of them go to multiple places to get them. They apparently dont seem to mind for whatever reason Or get people to help them get around the 1 per person limit
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LinkPizza posted...

Yeah. Though, many of them go to multiple places to get them. They apparently dont seem to mind for whatever reason Or get people to help them get around the 1 per person limit

Theyre free to do that. I mean if the item is hard to find then they are doing the work to seek out which ones they can get just like any other consumers. And if they have people waiting in line to help them then why shouldnt they each be able to get one?

The alternative is passing actual laws the limit what people can and cant buy, which I think is a bad idea for many reasons.

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SaltyAndSweet posted...

Theyre free to do that. I mean if the item is hard to find then they are doing the work to seek out which ones they can get just like any other consumers. And if they have people waiting in line to help them then why shouldnt they each be able to get one?

The alternative is passing actual laws the limit what people can and cant buy, which I think is a bad idea for many reasons.

Id rather have laws against scalping
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LinkPizza posted...

Id rather have laws against scalping

what would laws like that look like?

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SaltyAndSweet posted...

what would laws like that look like?

Probably similar to tickets laws, I would think. But I not fluent in that law. So, it would probably be for people having to sell certain items (like brand new PS5s or new video cards) for no more the MSRP at most
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SaltyAndSweet posted...

If you didnt experts shortage of Wiis then you werent trying to get one that first holiday season in a populated area

It took like 8 months to find a Wii in San Diego after the initial rush.

deoxxys posted...

I mean we its over looked because housing has varying value.

But Housing scalping is one of the worst forms of scalping that probably will never stop.

People across the country and in other countries outbid everyone else and buy up low income housing and charge a premium to rent it out.

I think this is far worse then not being able to buy your GPUs or Gaming Consoles at retail price.

It should be illegal for people in other countries to buy houses in America with two exceptions. If they are a citizen who works in another country or if the foreigner lives and work in America.

SaltyAndSweet posted...

Theyre free to do that. I mean if the item is hard to find then they are doing the work to seek out which ones they can get just like any other consumers. And if they have people waiting in line to help them then why shouldnt they each be able to get one?

The alternative is passing actual laws the limit what people can and cant buy, which I think is a bad idea for many reasons.

There is no bad reason to ban scalping.
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LinkPizza posted...

I wish scalper was illegal. I think it would still be hard to get system, but the amount of people trying to get one would be lower, this slightly (even if not by much) easier to get one

Flawed logic in this case. Scalping does not effect the demand here.

Example:
50 units produced.
100 people want to buy them.
No scalpers buy any, all 50 units are sold to people who want them.
There is still demand for 50 more consoles.

50 units produced.
100 people want to buy them.
Scalpers buy all 50.
Scalpers sell all 50.
There is still demand for 50 more consoles.
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ultra magnus13 posted...

Flawed logic in this case. Scalping does not effect the demand here.

Example:
50 units produced.
100 people want to buy them.
No scalpers buy any, all 50 units are sold to people who want them.
There is still demand for 50 more consoles.

50 units produced.
100 people want to buy them.
Scalpers buy all 50.
Scalpers sell all 50.
There is still demand for 50 more consoles.

Unless scalpers still have them. It could take them time to sell Especially when trying to get the best price. Or cant sell it for whatever reason. Or it they have multiple and are selling them one at a time
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LinkPizza posted...

Unless scalpers still have them. It could take them time to sell Especially when trying to get the best price. Or cant sell it for whatever reason. Or it they have multiple and are selling them one at a time

Except non, or slow turning inventory is a financial liability, so in pretty much all cases they will lower the price until it sells. The reason you are constantly seeing ~$900 units, is because that is what the market is willing to pay for them, if they where not you would be seeing them for less.
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ultra magnus13 posted...

Except non, or slow turning inventory is a financial liability, so in pretty much all cases they will lower the price until it sells. The reason you are constantly seeing ~$900 units, is because that is what the market is willing to pay for them, if they where not you would be seeing them for less.

Yet some could still take time to sell Meaning it could still lower the Amon t out there for some time depending on how long it takes to sell
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LinkPizza posted...

Like why? They say they are offering a service. Sure they are A shitty one that the world can do without But why defend a scalper and say its ok?

Because people think capitalism is okay even when it isnt.

Pure Arts had an 800 piece limited T-800 head, something actual fans of Terminator might want. Well I guess some guy bought it only to post it on eBay at about three times the price. Thats something trash humans do.

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zebatov posted...

Because people think capitalism is okay even when it isnt.

Pure Arts had an 800 piece limited T-800 head, something actual fans might want. Well I guess some guy bought it only to resell it at three times the price. Thats something trash humans do.

I totally agree
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LinkPizza posted...

I totally agree

There should be a minimum amount of time an item has to be released before it can be resold, so these clowns have to decide whether they can sit on the item without the money for that long.

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zebatov posted...

There should be a minimum amount of time an item has to be released before it can be resold, so these clowns have to decide whether they can sit on the item without the money for that long.

I would like that. Or make scalper illegal where they cant sell it over MSRP. Or for more than they bought it for
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