Current Events > What are like the oldest currently existing countries?

(+) Yeah! (+)

Like some countries' current incarnations are rather young. Russia for instance is younger than most folks on CE. Japan is from after WW2. Tried googling it, but that doesn't give anything useful. Too often all the various incarnations are treated as the same thing, when I'm treating them as distinct entities.

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Google tells me San Marino, but I really don't know much about it.

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India and Vietnam have been states in some form since like 1000BC

and the obvious Egypt and Persia

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China (2200 years)
Greece (3000 years)
Egypt (5000~ years)

some of the oldest.

Iran is like 50 years old (used to be Persia).

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mobilebloechel posted...

Iran & Egypt

This is the sort of useless answer I can get from Google. Egypt is not the same country that existed thousands of years ago. There's been a bunch of distinct Egypts that all just get bundled together.

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San Marino has been in continuous existence for 1700 years
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Guide posted...

San Marino

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Guide posted...

Google tells me San Marino, but I really don't know much about it.

San Marino was founded 1720 years ago, and the borders haven't changed since 1463.

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Is the kingdom in Berserk based off of San Marino?

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Guide posted...

Google tells me San Marino, but I really don't know much about it.

This one actually looks promising as a candidate.

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"Current incarnation" of a country seems like a tricky qualifier. Do we go by the latest constitution? The most recent change in territory?

For example, do we consider France to be only as old as the establishment of the Fifth Republic (1958), or perhaps the First Republic (1792), or some other benchmark?

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It really depends on how you define country. If you base it on the continuation of the current form of government, the United States is funnily enough one of the oldest countries since it has had the same constitution since 1789.

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Id imagine mongolia is up there

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Mearcstapa posted...

"Current incarnation" of a country seems like a tricky qualifier. Do we go by the latest constitution? The most recent change in territory?

For example, do we consider France to be only as old as the establishment of the Fifth Republic (1958), or perhaps the First Republic (1792), or some other benchmark?

Definitely not 1st since you had two empires of France and the bourbon restoration since then. I'd probably consider it to start with the 5th, though I'd be willing to entertain arguments that it should start with the 3rd.


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SauI_Goodman posted...

Id imagine mongolia is up there

1992

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By these standards Vatican City is the oldest.

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Robot2600 posted...

By these standards Vatican City is the oldest.

Vatican City isn't even 100 years old.

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Robot2600 posted...

By these standards Vatican City is the oldest.

1929

Even if you trace it back to the beginning of the Papal States, it's 756. San Marino still beats it.

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The poles

countries =/= governments or constitutions, tc

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What about the Nordic countries?

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The problem is that polities tend to be unstable, of course. Russia went through 4 separate governments within the span of the 20th-century: Tsarist autocracy, Provisional Republic, Soviet Republic, Modern "Republic"*. Hell, you could even break out the Soviet Union, for example, into distinct periods wherein governing philosophy fluctuated, sometimes drastically(Stalin's the big break point here: no Soviet premier before or after him was ever so powerful nor ruled so long).

*You could break that in two: pre-Putin and Putin's dictatorship. Not that it was ever particularly democratic: the transition was bad enough Yeltsin had to bend and break finance laws to secure victory over the Communists. In 1996*.
Then he resigned in '99 and Putin took over and gradually transformed Russia into the thriving mob autocracy it is today.

*There was also straight-up election fraud, though confirmed instances do not constitute enough to alter the result. Of course, given the widespread international disdain for the Russian Communist Party and the fact that the Yeltsin administration would have run domestic investigations, it's possible everyone had a tacit agreement to not look very hard into it. Spoilered this because it's nothing more than speculation. The fact there was such significant support for the Communists speaks to how insanely painful and mismanaged Russia's transition was.

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Feline_Heart posted...

What about the Nordic countries?

Sweden and Norway only have existed in their current forms since 1905 when the United Kingdoms of Sweden and Norway broke up.

Denmark has only existed in their current forms since 1814 when the Danish-Norwegian Union was split up after Sweden took possession of Norway at the end of the Napoleonic Wars.

Iceland only achieved full independence from Denmark in 1918, meanwhile Finland achieved independence from Russia in 1917.

TheMikh posted...

countries =/= governments or constitutions, tc

Entirely possible I am using the wrong word here. If there is a more correct word to refer to distinct entities that have shared the same or similar name, I would be glad to know it.

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geno_16 posted...

Sweden and Norway only have existed in their current forms since 1905 when the United Kingdoms of Sweden and Norway broke up.

Denmark has only existed in their current forms since 1814 when the Danish-Norwegian Union was split up after Sweden took possession of Norway at the end of the Napoleonic Wars.

Iceland only achieved full independence from Denmark in 1918, meanwhile Finland achieved independence from Russia in 1917.

This is most correct. But it also depends on how the question is framed

Since another viewpoint makes Sweden very old. Our line of monarchs:

https://www.kungahuset.se/monarkinhovstaterna/monarkinisverige/sverigesregenter.4.7c4768101a4e888378000948.html

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oldest nation =/= oldest nation state. you mean the latter but some people misinterpret it as the former and then we get people talking about egypt etc

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