Poll of the Day > If elves are protectors of the plants/forest, shouldn't they be carnivores?

(+) Yeah! (+)

I was reading a manwha (korean comic/webtoon) the other day with a pretty unique take on elves.

They're the protectors of the forest they live in and revere plants so much that they developed the ability to jump across treetops without harming leaves (think Tolkien elven snow walking but with leaves), wear hides and leather clothing, use metal bows and arrows, are disgusted by the way humans use wood for fences and buildings, and only eat meat.

Now I'm wondering if there are any other depictions of elves in other series that follow that same train of thought, since it seems like that would be logical endpoint for a society of plant worshippers.

Are there other games/books/comics that y'all know of with this take on elves?

It's never depicted in the games to my knowledge, but Wood Elves in Elder Scrolls lore are exclusively carnivores and practice cannibalism.

in the isekai light novel/manga Apocalypse Bringer Mynoghra, some dark elves end up liking the taste of human flesh after being turned evil early on (though most are still extremely hesitant about it, since they had to resort to cannibalism to survive before the start of the story)

That kind of gets into the whole "who gets to decide that a cow's life is worth more than a tomato's?" argument against vegetarianism that people like to break out occasionally. The simple answer is trophic levels: to grow 100 calories of herbivore meat, you have to feed them ~1000 calories of plant matter. The simple mathematical reality of the matter is that carnivory kills more plants than herbivory does.

While "I'm going to eat meat instead of plants because I respect the woods too much" seems reasonable on a first pass, in practice it's a pretty short-sighted mentality, which is generally at odds with the whole "wise and immortal" trope that's usually applied to elves.

Cruddy_horse posted...

It's never depicted in the games to my knowledge, but Wood Elves in Elder Scrolls lore are exclusively carnivores and practice cannibalism.

Never played any Elder Scrolls games before, but I did think that if any series would have it, it would be ES.

agesboy posted...

in the isekai light novel/manga Apocalypse Bringer Mynoghra, some dark elves end up liking the taste of human flesh after being turned evil early on (though most are still extremely hesitant about it, since they had to resort to cannibalism to survive before the start of the story)

I'm reading that too, but the dark elves were never shown to be explicitly plant loving. They were sorta just like generic forest dwellers.

Cruddy_horse posted...

It's never depicted in the games to my knowledge, but Wood Elves in Elder Scrolls lore are exclusively carnivores and practice cannibalism.

Spriggans seem to eat a lot of bees.

adjl posted...

That kind of gets into the whole "who gets to decide that a cow's life is worth more than a tomato's?" argument against vegetarianism that people like to break out occasionally. The simple answer is trophic levels: to grow 100 calories of herbivore meat, you have to feed them ~1000 calories of plant matter. The simple mathematical reality of the matter is that carnivory kills more plants than herbivory does.

While "I'm going to eat meat instead of plants because I respect the woods too much" seems reasonable on a first pass, in practice it's a pretty short-sighted mentality, which is generally at odds with the whole "wise and immortal" trope that's usually applied to elves.

The elves in the mawha were mostly hunters though, and they operate more on a "let nature do its own thing, we'll just eat animals since we like plants too much" approach.

Also, since it's a not-that-serious manwha the author made another trope reversal and made the elves somewhat meatheads, and let the MC bribe them with steak, so they don't really have that "old and wise angle" going for them either.

There was some gross manga I read a couple chapters of that had elves raising humans for food.

I prefer vegan elves to that personally.

T0ffee posted...

The elves in the mawha were mostly hunters though, and they operate more on a "let nature do its own thing, we'll just eat animals since we like plants too much" approach.

In that case, it kind of depends how long they've been there. If they've been established as a predator for a long time, then the ecological impact is minimal because the ecosystem has adjusted to them. If they've arrived in the area more recently and decided to become predators, though, that's going to have more ecological impact and probably result in more total dead plants than foraging would.

T0ffee posted...

Also, since it's a not-that-serious manwha the author made another trope reversal and made the elves somewhat meatheads, and let the MC bribe them with steak, so they don't really have that "old and wise angle" going for them either.

That also works.

The manwha is called "The Greatest Estate Developer" if you guys wanna read it.

And like I said, it's a not that serious manwha about a guy with a master's degree in civil engineering that gets isekai'd as the delinquent son of a debt-ridden noble, and tries to use his knowledge to get himself out of debt and live a cushy life.

Generic premise yes, but it's surprisingly well paced, the characters have hidden depth, leans more into comedy but has fantastic actions scenes as well.

Nah, not at all.

Elves would naturally eat fruits and distribute the seeds like the plants intend.

That is of course the entire purpose of the trees and plants/bushes creating them in the first place.

Even trees etc could be used, just not chopped/down killed, but in many realities, elves can control how they grow, allowing them to homes within/around them.

Of course it also depends on the type of elves and the myths they are from, if you are talking about the fey for instance, elves exist and I believe are usually considered dark fey (they are most certainly not attuned to plants and are primarily carnivores.). The elves from books like tolkien etc are more aimed towards light fey, or summer fey, and would be less likely to kill/eat living creatures, but they are still fey, and still do.

Only a very few books/series have elves be against consuming plants at all, or consuming meat at all and vegetarians. In general they eat food much like humans, although sometimes, especially more recently, they focus on nuts and other forms of non-meat based foods (mushrooms/nuts/fruits etc).

I don't know about their diet, but I do know that the Elves in Divinity Original Sin 2 can view people's memories (most of the time their thoughts before their death) by consuming their flesh. So they practice cannibalism. I would say that they're pretty close to your description.

wolfy42 posted...

Elves would naturally eat fruits and distribute the seeds like the plants intend.

That is of course the entire purpose of the trees and plants/bushes creating them in the first place.

This is also true. Fruit-bearing plants benefit from having the fruits be eaten. Even with grains and other seeds, the plants produce vastly more seeds than they actually expect to germinate, so if people eat most of the seeds but deliberately cultivate the remaining minority to ensure they survive, the plant is still see(d)ing a net benefit (this actually applies even when the seed-eating animals don't deliberately plant the seeds, since some inevitably get dropped or otherwise distributed). It's really just vegetables that don't benefit the plant for being eaten.

Maybe try looking into actual mythology.