Board 8 > Most Evil Fictional Character: Lex Luthor vs. Dahlia Hawthorne

(+) Yeah! (+)

Welcome to the 2023 edition of Most Evil Fictional Character, a single-elimination tournament to determine the most evil fictional character of all time!

Here's the bracket:

https://www.bracketmaker.com/tmenu.cfm?tid=477621&tclass=

And here's the discussion topic:

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/8-gamefaqs-contests/80568652

And here are the rules:

-First and foremost, YOU MUST BOLD YOUR VOTE FOR IT TO COUNT. The reason for this is that these topics encourage a lot of discussion and debate, and it helps me to distinguish a vote from simple discussion if all votes are bolded. So, I state again, ALL VOTES MUST BE BOLDED FOR THEM TO COUNT. I reserve the right to be lenient in early topics if people just aren't getting it, but for the most part, IF YOUR VOTE ISN'T BOLDED, IT WON'T COUNT.

-You must vote for which of the two characters you honestly believe to be the more evil of the two. You can determine this via any method you like, use your own morals and judgement, read all the arguments made to determine your choice, or however you choose to make your pick, but you must only vote for the one you truly believe is the most evil. This isn't a death battle, or a popularity contest. You're voting ONLY for the most evil character out of the two choices presented.

-While on that subject, remember that because this isn't a death battle or a fighting tournament, do your absolute best to consider the two characters as if their power levels were equal (either the weaker character brought up to the level of the strongest, or vice versa, or both if you want to consider both possibilities). Therefore, just because, for example, one of the characters blew up a planet and the other one merely kicked a puppy, doesn't necessarily mean the planet killer is more evil than the puppy kicker. Consider the characters as if they have the exact same capabilities and what they might do in that scenario.

-You can make any arguments, debates, etc. you want in this topic. Discussion is STRONGLY encouraged, a fun debate about which of the two characters is most evil is exactly what these topics are for. Just don't make it personal, no insults or flaming, keep things civil even if you disagree. Also, no vote rallying, if you want to encourage people to vote for your character you need to at least make some semblance of an argument as to why, even if it's just "Character X did (really dastardly thing), I can't believe no one's voting for them!"

-Voting will continue for exactly 24 hours after the post is made. If there's a tie, there will be a new 24 hour topic. This will continue indefinitely until a winner is determined.

-YOU MUST BOLD YOUR VOTE FOR IT TO COUNT.

-

The following write-ups will contain untagged SPOILERS for Superman and DC Comics media and the Ace Attorney series.

LEX LUTHOR

Lex Luthor is a major villain in the DC Comics universe and Superman's arch enemy.

Lex Luthor was depicted as a narcissistic and egotistical mad scientist from the 1960s to the mid-1980s. Since the mid-late 1980s, he has more often been portrayed as the power-mad CEO of LexCorp. He wishes to rid the world of Superman, ostensibly because he views Superman as a threat to humanity, but in reality envies Superman's popularity and influence. Whether he is a mad scientist, corrupt businessman, or both, Luthor's ego is a defining trait in all his incarnations; he believes he is entitled to both popularity and power. While each incarnation initially wants the adoration of others and control over either Smallville or Metropolis, the goal eventually rises to control over Earth and possibly universal domination. Luthor's other defining trait is his obsession to destroy Superman and humiliate the alien hero, either by displaying his own superiority by achieving victory without the benefit of superpowers or to prove the Man of Steel is motivated by selfish desire rather than altruism. When Superman was out of sight for a year. Luthor used the time to create the "Everyman" project intending to create new superheroes to replace the Kryptonian, then later attacks Metropolis with a long-buried Kryptonian warship. Returning to action, Superman points out that Luthor had a year to prove his old argument that he could help others and improve Earth if Superman didn't interfere with his life, but instead of curing disease or making technological breakthroughs, all he did was focus on increasing his power and finding "a big destructive machine so he could break things." In the 2006 2007 series 52, Luthor pursues a new agenda. He creates the Luthoran Church and becomes spokesman for the Everyman Project, which offers superpowers to ordinary citizens through artificial metagene treatment. With several Everyman volunteers, Luthor forms his own team of superheroes, the new Infinity Inc. When the team battles the villain Blockbuster (whom Luthor empowered as well), Lex demonstrates he can 'shut off' the powers of any of his Everyman agents; this results in the death of his speedster, Trajectory. At the stroke of midnight on New Year's Eve, Luthor sets in motion a calculated plot to discredit Supernova, a new hero defending Metropolis in Superman's absence. Luthor triggers a mass-shutdown of the powers of everyone who has undertaken the Everyman program, except for the members of Infinity Inc, causing widespread death, injury, and millions of dollars worth of damage.

vs.

DAHLIA HAWTHORNE

Dahlia Hawthorne is a major antagonist in the Ace Attorney series.

Dahlia knew that her beauty and innocent appearance threw others off her true nature and took full advantage of it. She had the ability to make herself appear serene and innocent; she would even occasionally have small butterflies flock about her and flutter gently. However, this aura of innocence was a faade, and when pressed into a corner, her demeanor could immediately change to a terrifying, almost demonic visage, which even caused the aforementioned butterflies to burst into flames in some cases. In truth, Dahlia looked after and cared about nobody but herself, and even went as far as to state that this had always been the case for her.
Many who have seen Dahlia's true nature, such as Phoenix Wright and Mia Fey, have described her as a demon, and even the judge has suggested that she never be channeled again. Indeed, all of Dahlia's murders and attempted murders were committed to cover up a previous crime or to exact revenge on Mia Fey. She displayed absolutely no remorse or regret for any of the crimes she had committed, and had no qualms about murdering completely innocent people in the interest of self-preservation or revenge. Of all the people Phoenix Wright has encountered, Dahlia was among the most dangerous: she was personally involved in seven incidents that resulted in the death or near-death of an individual. Two people were personally murdered by Dahlia herself (Valerie Hawthorne and Doug Swallow), one person was manipulated into committing suicide in her name (Terry Fawles), two people were almost murdered by her in order to conceal her crimes (Phoenix Wright and Diego Armando), one person was almost murdered in an act of revenge against another (Maya Fey in order to get revenge against Mia Fey) and one person was murdered while they were channeling Dahlia (Misty Fey).

When no one was looking, Lex Luthor took forty cakes. He took 40 cakes. That's as many as four tens. And that's terrible.

But seriously, Lex is kind of similar to Cartman in regards to evil. He has done good in different stories (which is kind of a trend in DC and Marvel comics at least somewhere)

but good lord, generally when Superman enters the picture he goes off the rails because he is just that bitchy about him. Like one time he attained absolute cosmic power where he could fix all problems ever and be above everyone (Superman included) with the only condition being that he just had to leave Superman alone. Superman was begging him to take it and genuinely telling him how Lex was better than him and whatever he wanted...And Lex ended up throwing it away because he was that crazy about Superman.

There was also that time he cured his sister's illness just to prove he could and then reverted it immediately after because fuck Superman lmao

He also didnt wash his hands after using the bathroom! Oh wait, technically that was Flash...but still!

I think one of the best examples of Lex being evil is the time he killed his martial arts instructor just for embarrassing him by beating him in a sparring match and then framed some random janitor for the murder.

Dahlia Hawthorne

Lex Luthor is just too inconsistent imo. Sometimes he actually has good intentions (though not always). Dahlia doesn't really have any redeeming qualities, or good intentions. Dahlia treats everyone as if they're tools, able to be discarded whenever she so desires. And she puts on a sweet demeanor while doing it. Even in death, she does some truly heinous things.

lex luthor, though props to dahlia for being that much more "personal" of a villain. if we are going by sheer unlikeable energy, she'd be the winner for sure. god, just fuck that woman.
Pirateking2000 posted...

When no one was looking, Lex Luthor took forty cakes. He took 40 cakes. That's as many as four tens. And that's terrible.

hard for me to hate lex for giving us this beautiful meme.

Dahlia

Luthor as mentioned has a consistency problem. I dont think you can just shrug it off as well it was over a long time with a lot of different writers either as Davros has 50 years of stories with loads of different writers yet is still pure evil.

Dahlia but tbh neither are on the level of the last few matches we've had

Dahlia

Both of them seem pretty small time compared to some we've seen yeah.

Not voting because I don't know enough about Dahlia, but once Luthor became an all-powerful God except he couldn't use his omnipotent power to hurt Superman. In the moment Superman even apologized to Lex, as Lex had the power to make the universe a utopia, and tried everything he could to convince Lex to make the right decision.

Luthor gave up the power.

Dahlia
Girl literally commanded someone to suicide to prove his love for her
She is so filled with hate that she wanted to exact her revenge from beyond the grave

As for Lex...
I only know him from the Batman vs Superman movie. And he was one of the most pathetic villains I have ever seen in any super hero movie ever. The fuck was that

Nanis23 posted...

Girl literally commanded someone to suicide to prove his love for her

To add to this, it's heavily implied from his animations and dialogue that the man she does this to has some sort of learning disability. Dahlia

While Lex is usually a heartless bastard, as was mentioned he has a consistency problem, with some writers showing positive complexities of his character. Meanwhile Dahlia is thoroughly, irredeemably evil, and there's no glimpse of anything good in her character. The stories Phoenix told were (MAJOR MAJOR AA:T&T spoilers) all about the "good twin" Iris, who refused to allow her sister to kill again, but Dahlia won out in the end... nearly. Since we're looking for who's more evil, I gotta go with...

Dahlia

They're both horrible, manipulative sociopaths that use people to get what they want. Maybe Dahlia has the edge because her acts seem more petty, whereas at least you could argue that Luthor tries to benefit humanity sometimes? So I guess that's a vote for Dahlia.