Current Events > Was it right to (mostly) remove Apu from The Simpsons?

(+) Yeah! (+)

According to Google he occasionally shows up in crowd scenes still in modern episodes but it has become less frequent and he does not get voiced roles.

I don't really think it's my place to say tbh but I don't think Apu was a bad representation of an Indian character after all of character building over the years. Dude had some of the best episodes too.

It's absolutely ridiculous. Any fan of the show knows much of its humor focuses on satire and is not meant for much younger audiences. Plus, it's not like anyone had a problem with other stereotypes, like the Italian, Latino, Jewish, or LGBTQ+ characters.

its fine. asaria didn't wanna continue an they didn't wanna replace him. it be like that

I never liked him as a character anyway, so i dont care.

They could have at least recast him though.

I think it's the writer's retaliation against the protest. "You don't like how this character portrayed? Fine we'll remove him and we have nothing to lose. On the other hand a group lose their representation, and it's your fault."

It was like one Indian comedian complaining that in High School white kids called him Apu so it's only right that The Simpsons makes Hank Azaria stop doing the voice of Apu. The only thing vaguely over the top about Apu was that he's cheap, like selling expired food on purpose.

I heard most Indians liked him

I like how you can always tell who didn't watch the documentary in these discussions.

Or who just fundamentally doesn't understand The Simpsons.

Wow.

No. And honestly I still think its pretty dumb that they recast a bunch of characters too (but thats more just me hating recasts of any kind in general lol).

At least in Family Guy they got someone who sounds damn near exactly like Mike Henry to voice Cleveland.

They need to bring Apu back.

Yes. I think it's fine for Azaria to basically say that he originally thought it was funny for everybody, but now he sees that that is not the case, and since he doesn't know how to solve that, he's not going to perform it anymore. I give him a lot of credit for deciding that his mission is maximizing entertainment, not proving a point. Oh, and the fact that he's paid a ton probably helped him decide.

As an Indian man. The only time I objected to something about Apu, (and this was years later when I rewatched this episode as an adult) was in Homer and Apu. But I see why Apu is problematic for some.

For me Apu was some representation and it's The Simpsons, it's satirical. It's not there to be taken entirely seriously and as a reflection of the real world.

Hank Azaria stepping aside is fine, this is an opportunity to get actors of South Asian descent work on a high profile show. But casting aside the character feels sweep under the rug and thats equally not ideal for different reasons.

I would like better representation of Indian characters in western media, I can't think of that many solid examples.

And that's what's bothered me about The Simpsons response, there's an opportunity to give a culture better/fairer representation in the context of the show but opted for none.

Zikten posted...

I heard most Indians liked him

SpeedyGonzales.jpg

No. It was stupid to begin with.

Honestly liked apu especially the banana bread scene still makes me laugh

"Celebrate your country's independence by blowing up a piece of it!"

Who needs a Kwik E Mart?

I dooooooooooo

no it was stupid to get rid of him

"By the end, I felt that I was a hummingbird of some kind."

I understand Hank stepping aside and I think it's a fine opportunity to get someone who actually is South Asian instead of just delivering a caricatured voice. The best part would be the ranting neckbeards screaming "but he doesn't sound Indian anymore!"

No and it accomplished nothing. Might as well remove a whole bunch of characters for being caricatures if they actually cared.

wanderingshade posted...

It was like one Indian comedian complaining that in High School white kids called him Apu so it's only right that The Simpsons makes Hank Azaria stop doing the voice of Apu. The only thing vaguely over the top about Apu was that he's cheap, like selling expired food on purpose.

If it's the same person I'm thinking of, he even went around and asked people if they thought the voice actor for Apu was Indian, and everyone said they thought he was, which only means that Hank Azaria did such a good job that no one could tell the difference or that everyone thought that's how all Indians sound.

voldothegr8 posted...

"Celebrate your country's independence by blowing up a piece of it!"

Funny thing is it wasn't Apu who said this.

It was a stock replacement character with slight variation in a different convenience store because the Simpsons were traveling in that episode (Summer of 4 Ft. 2). A pretty common joke for them to run when the Simpsons were on the road.

My criticism of the situation is more of a criticism of the stagnation of the Simpsons as a whole. Oh sure, Homer has a smartphone now, but the entire series is built on the characters themselves remaining who they are in their Flanderized states.

Apu was merely a product of that. An example of early 90s comedy sense of "immigrant doing their best to fit in but also being a fish out of water, working a job no one else wants to do". I'm of the team that yeah, it's a pretty tired joke at this point and it's better that they move on from it, but also, it's one among SO MANY tired jokes that the Simpsons can't help but keep coming back to.

The sad part is that the Simpsons have come up with some truly interesting episodes in the last ten or so years, but they've been so rare among the middling gruel that I just feel that these plots were wasted and would have been better served (and remembered) in newer shows.

Like I just saw a clip of Ned Flanders and Marge discussing his grief and coping mechanisms over losing Maude and then Edna and it was pretty heartfelt but also real difficult to get around the fact that neither Shearer or Kavner have the capability to carry the roles anymore.

It's a stupid controversy.

Almost all of the Simpson's characters are a caricature of some sort, Apu wasn't particularly special in that regard.

The other part of the argument is equally silly. Forcing every character to only be portrayed by an actor of the same race is just stupid, doubly so if it's only voice-acting. We'd have never got Samuel L Jackson as Nick Fury following that logic.

It was the wrong choice

Tanthalas posted...

It's a stupid controversy.

Almost all of the Simpson's characters are a caricature of some sort, Apu wasn't particularly special in that regard.

The other part of the argument is equally silly. Forcing every character to only be portrayed by an actor of the same race is just stupid, doubly so if it's only voice-acting. We'd have never got Samuel L Jackson as Nick Fury following that logic.

Honestly the voice acting thing doesn't bother me and actually I think that was the right choice. And your comment about Nick Fury makes no sense as that's something very different. That's an alternate reality version of the character.

Zikten posted...

I heard most Indians liked him

I did. It's always white people who get offended on other people's behalf when nobody asked them to.

LeCh0nk posted...

I did. It's always white people who get offended on other people's behalf when nobody asked them to.

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/a/forum/d/d76b9d13.jpg

I can sympathize with Indian folks getting "Thank you come again" and other ignorant crap thrown at them for a long time, but there are so many different cultural caricatures on that show. Southerners have Cletus and his family, Italians have Fat Tony and Luigi, Latinos have Bumblebee Man, Scots have Willie, and so on. Apu was even one of the more grounded and well done characters, relatively speaking. He wasn't as stupid as most of Springfield.

I feel the VA changes in TS and other shows are an over correction. Basically removing Apu is an even bigger one.

Bullies will always find something about you to bully, but Apu didn't help, let's not pretend to be confused about that. It's like "the donga needa food" from 16 Candles, not really that fun for any asian person to be made fun of for that.

Their "solution" was whatever though, almost comparable to streaming companies removing community and its always sunny episodes. Eye-rolling at best.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ohBFZ2g5wM

if you arent gonna watch the documentary, i highly recommend watching the RealJims episode on this

this topic is pretty grossly ignorant, im not sure why so many of you are so comfortably confident posting about things u dont kno

Nah, wish he was still in it.

It's one thing to agree that Apu was problematic, it's another thing whether you agree with Simpsons' "solution" being to remove its one Indian family from the show and move on.

Like if you think they had an obligation to correct for past mistakes, wouldn't that obligation extend beyond "taking your ball and going home"? They could've tried to improve their representation and that would've been welcome in a modern climate that's seen a significant uptick in anti-Indian racism in the US and Canada.

deff. what they chose to do addressed nothing and pleased no one

its been 6 years since they were like "we'll get to it"

The "solution" is about as bad as the problem they were trying to fix.

Imagine this in any other scenario,
Director: So you think I treat my black actors worst than my white actors, fine I have the perfect solution... I won't hire black actors.

Just removing Apu was a silent admission "Yeah we just don't know how to not be super racist, so we're not even going to try."

Apu will always be a weird case because ultimately the Simpson's never did anything particularly wrong. They portrayed Apu in a surreal, over-the-top manner like they do all characters in the show. But the difference was that for decades Apu was literally the only regularly appearing Indian character on TV. So the surreal and over-the-top character of Apu ended up being the primary reference point for America when it came to Indians.

Someone like Fat Tony is both more one-note and stereotype-driven than Apu is but that ends up not being so big a deal because as you flip through the channels you'll see all manner of Italian characters on a variety of shows.

Just recast him with a SA actor! They had no problem with Carl or Lou. Dr. Hibbert sounds really off but well adjust. Cmon, Im pretty sure the guy from BBT isnt doing anything.

McMarbles posted...

Im pretty sure the guy from BBT isnt doing anything.

You mean Howard? Because that one time he did a pretty spot on Apu impersonation

My Indian acquaintances who were fans of the Simpsons hated the ABCD guy who criticized Apu.

No. This was a non-issue from the beginning.

Matt Groening was correct. Its a time in our culture where people love to pretend theyre offended.

Dungeater posted...

its fine. asaria didn't wanna continue an they didn't wanna replace him. it be like that

This. You can always watch the old Apu episodes from the golden years since I doubt anyone is watching the new episodes.

I feel like a lot of you are jumping to claim Azaria stepped away from voicing Apu because he's a caricature and then claiming its dumb because everyone in the Simpsons is a caricature, but that's not the full story of what happened.

The biggest thing people found contentious was that a white man was doing an outdated stereotype. All you have to do is picture the Simpsons as a live action show to realize that it would feature Hank Azaria standing behind a convenience counter in brownface doing an accent and that's not really something society finds acceptable anymore outside of direct critiques on brown/blackface like Tropic Thunder.

It's one thing to have a stereotypical Indian character on a show, stereotypes can often be used to great effect in fiction. But it's another thing entirely to create a stereotypical Indian character and then have them be portrayed by someone from a group of people with members that happen to actually believe those stereotypes apply to every Indian

A lot of people just don't accept the idea that voice acting characters of different races is comparable to blackface.

Doe posted...

A lot of people just don't accept the idea that voice acting characters of different races is comparable to blackface.

Phil LaMarr, a black man, voiced Samurai Jack, a Japanese man.

GeminiDeus posted...

Phil LaMarr, a black man, voiced Samurai Jack, a Japanese man.

Ok.

Doe posted...

A lot of people just don't accept the idea that voice acting characters of different races is comparable to blackface.

when those people hear a dub of an Atlus game and next to none of the VAs are Asian
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=tVcq0OyVZ_U

They could have recast him like they did Carl. But at the same time, almost every Indian American man has been called or referred to as Apu, or thought to have worked at a convenience store (which was already a stereotype when the show came out).

I miss the character, and they did a great job in expanding on his heritage, but there is still some contentious things there.

GeminiDeus posted...

Phil LaMarr, a black man, voiced Samurai Jack, a Japanese man.

He also voiced Aquaman.

Cree Summer has also voiced several animated females that aren't black. Elmyra in Tiny Toons, Penny in Inspector Gadget and Hyena in Gargoyles.

GeminiDeus posted...

Phil LaMarr, a black man, voiced Samurai Jack, a Japanese man.

KCJ5062 posted...

He also voiced Aquaman.

Cree Summer has also voiced several animated females that aren't black. Elmyra in Tiny Toons, Penny in Inspector Gadget and Hyena in Gargoyles.

I think it's arguably a bit different in Azaria's case since he wasn't just voicing a character of a different race, he was voicing an over the top comedic stereotype of said race, and it was one of the only examples of a character of said race commonly on TV.

I think their actual overall reaction to just remove Apu almost completely was wrong, but I get why Azaria'd want to step away.

idgaf about anything Simpsons-related made since their movie, or thereabouts, other than finding Ned and his family's story arc sad. Haven't watched a "new" Simpsons episode in well over a decade, so I don't have an opinion on their casting decisions as of late or which characters do or don't get screentime.