Board 8 > Chrono Cross Mafia Topic 1 - Good Morning, Serge!

(+) Yeah! (+)

pjbasis posted...

It's always funny when everyone is content with letting me be inactive most of the time until I win a scum game.

And then it takes a few mislynches before I'm allowed to be a bit inactive again.

Ok pj what are your thoughts on the three "other millers"?
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benjamin3740 posted...

What's considered an "enemy" in Chrono Cross? Because whatisurname said after that that he wasnt talking about Dragoons. But Riddel is a dragoon's daughter right?

Dragoons are the main antagonist for the first 40% of the game or so. Never really portrayed as evil though and they become good guys later.
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VeryInsane posted...

Yeah I agree with you, would definitely peg IGCD as the scummier of the two. Demeanor at the beginning was a bit too tryhard and has done little since

(Though he promised more content at the end of 16 hours and it's close to 16 hours later?)

This is par for his course.
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VeryInsane posted...

pjbasis posted...

It's always funny when everyone is content with letting me be inactive most of the time until I win a scum game.

And then it takes a few mislynches before I'm allowed to be a bit inactive again.

Ok pj what are your thoughts on the three "other millers"?

Corrik claiming anything is like me claiming miller, Ulti and MZero probably both are serious claims. MZero being the first one makes him the most likely to be fake.
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Hey Nana since you are CE and most likely Town what do you think of

Terra
IGCD

... oh I guess it's just those two since sheep hasn't posted and everyone else isn't CE
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MZero barely blinked at Ulti's counter. Almost too oddly, but very hard to make a case from that. I'll say it's more likely that they're both true.
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pjbasis posted...

MZero barely blinked at Ulti's counter. Almost too oddly, but very hard to make a case from that. I'll say it's more likely that they're both true.

I've been thinking this myself, though definitely less sure on MZero
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VeryInsane posted...

Hey Nana since you are CE and most likely Town what do you think of

Terra
IGCD

... oh I guess it's just those two since sheep hasn't posted and everyone else isn't CE

Ambivalent
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benjamin3740 posted...

whatisurnameplz posted...

I'm pretty well knowledged, I'm sure a few others are as well. If you have any questions we can answer them.

Cool! Now hey, somebody who's mafia - fake claim so i can test out my new flavor adviser plz :D

I'm Town Mill...

Never mind, reading further forward I think that joke died quite quickly... I sadly know nothing about the flavour so I'll be no use in that regard. I've skimmed through the topic already and am now going through some of my thoughts. I'll likely repeat some things that have already been said but please bear with.

UltimaterializerX posted...

MZero11 posted...

I'm Glenn, Miller

hello everyone

*I'm* Riddel, miller, and we're not doing this dumb bullshit where blatant scum gets to claim miller on day one and cruise to endgame.

Oh, so this looks fun already. Quick counterclaim, possibly to catch him off guard from Ulti? How much does Ulti know about the flavour to allow him to claim this? It's unlikely that Ulti is fakeclaiming his character at least, and if it works with the flavour as is mentioned by some people in later posts, it'd be even more unlikely imo. I'm definitely more inclined to believe Ulti is Town based on these interactions, while MZero doesn't exactly look great. I don't believe PJ's Miller claim at all for some reason though... I'd also suggest not basing on votes on which character seems to be "more appropriate" for the role. A lot of good hosts throw in red herrings and put roles on the safelist which may match more than the flavour for an actual role. Any archives of any games the host has previously put on?
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The role/flavor meta here is too deep to be useful.

UltimaterializerX posted...

MZero11 posted...

benjamin3740 posted...

I favor Ulti because he's doing some scumhunting by countering Mzero, while Mzero has only accepted Ulti and says he thinks they're both Millers.

Ulti literally has another player on ignore. and what scum hunting has he actually done? all he did was counter-claim me and bitch about Corrik

Also my vote is on actual scum whatisurnameplz

Well the host asked me to unblock him, so hey.

Praise eaedwards
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benjamin3740 posted...

(I feel so useless in games when i dont know the flavor -.-;;)

Pretty sure that meta isn't the only way to scumhunt bud...

Oh hey, Corrik exists and claimed a 4th miller which I missed on my first skim through. Possibly because my brain instantly disregards any claim from him with no proof.

Oddity posted...

I caught up. Not really willing to sort out the 3 miller claims right now. I have to go to work like 5 mins ago. I kind of want to lynch VI for trying to make this a Corrik/Ulti day.

Interesting point. I read VI's post again and "Either you or Corrik have to go" looks to me like trying to play it up. I don't know much about the internal politics of B8 Mafia and most of the player's history, so I'm a little wary of putting too much on this as it's quite circumstantial. However, the counterpoints to this from VI and Ben are both interesting and it seems more like a "how to win" debate than "how to lynch Scum".

Nanahara715 posted...

I mean, just random numbers tells us that there's a 58% chance at least one of Ulti & Corrik are mafia, 42% that they are both town, and an 9% chance they are both mafia.

About a 1.7% chance this is a scum gamble by VI/Corrik/Ulti.

I forgot that Nana loves statistics a little too much... The somewhat misleading bit at the bottom is new though.
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Leafeon13N posted...

The role/flavor meta here is too deep to be useful.

Yeah, it feels like the only thing some people talk about and it's hardly a riveting way to draw everyone into the game. Like I mentioned before, a lot of good hosts try and make it uncertain (hence why I asked for anything about this host's previous games)
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Votals
[2] sceptile - Shadow, IGCD
[2] MZero - Ulti, whatisurnameplz
[2] VI - (IGCD),Corrik, Oddity
[2] whatisurnameplz - MZero, Terra,
[1] PJ - nana
[1] Lulu - Sceptile

Day ends in less than 29 hours and 40 minutes (Wednesday 10PM EST) it takes 9 to lynch.
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VeryInsane posted...

Nana is Town

Ben I think swings Town too

Sceptile is another user I lean Town on!

Decent core, if Ulti unignores Corrik and full communication is possible this game is definitely gonna be a Town victory

Reasons or just gut? I don't disagree with you, at least with Nana. He's exactly as I remember him as Town (bullish is perhaps the word I would use), although he may have improved his Scum game recently (yes I know half my quotes are from him but he's probably the player here I know best, along with Terra. I'd like to get a firm read on at least one of them so I know where I'm standing and potentially bounce ideas off him). I get a good gut feel from Sceptile too. Pretty neutral on Ben.

Nanahara715 posted...

Part of me wants to believe that this is not host confirmed Ulti town but I don't see it. Having someone on ignore is detrimental to town, not scum, so for Ulti to not be "playing to win" makes me think he's town and host is calling him out for actions severely detrimental to his team (ie town).

Allegedly this implies Corrik town, but not as strongly, because a town player ignoring scum isn't a big deal.

This also modconfirms Corrik/Ulti not both scum, or this would be a scum gambit that host is either a) intentionally ignoring or b) purposefully misleading town.

This should have been a PM, not a mod post

I agree it should have been a PM, but hosts should say this regardless. I think you're going a bit deep in the whole "scum gambit" bit though.

Nanahara715 posted...

Rather, your second post implies you hadn't read the game at the time of you right first post.

5:30 later, or 330 seconds, to read 150+ posts, or reading 1 post every 2.2 seconds.

Seems fast. Makes me feel like the second post is wildly disengenuous. Either a straight lie, or you're just skimming and not really looking for content. I don't like either of those situations.

More fun with maths ...I think you're just reading a bit deep again and it's a joke. You know, like the Miller claim 5 minutes before. Not honest, sure, but I wouldn't take it seriously. I don't like it, but it doesn't mean he's Scum, like all the weird things God and Corrik have done before. I agree with your later post saying he shouldn't be allowed to skate by, however. He's more arguing about why he shouldn't be lynched for doing nothing than actually attempting to contribute to scumhunting as well. I mean, why join if you aren't trying?
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Ok exams are done,time to catch up and talk about what's been going on so far. I'll comment as I catch up.

MZero11 posted...

##Vote: whatisurnameplz

very opportunistic vote on me. Smelled blood and went all in trying to secure a Day 1 mislynch. Scummy move

I feel ok with Ulti right now just because that would be a ballsy move as scum. He's the self proclaimed "easiest guy to read" so if he's scum it will be obvious soon enough anyway

I don't trust that there are two millers in this game. Doesn't make any sense to me. One of you or Ulti is lying, and I trust you less at the moment.

*sees corrik's claim*

Three millers? Neofio's a weird flavor for that. Now I don't know what to think. I wanna say Corrik is town because I doubt scum would claim miller like that without catching up first, it'd be too risky for them...but if he's scum and made that claim anyway he's benefitting from the chaos.

Ulti the rules say metagaming is discouraged. it doesn't matter what corrik did in the past; not listening to what he has to say by ignoring him is anti-town.

I don't like oddity's vote on VI, and based on VI's response he seems town to me.

Nana on thinking my reasoning doesn't make sense, think of it this way. When the Town Cop scans a miller, they come up guilty despite being innocent. For the purposes of this game, I'm assuming town is anybody that's aligned with Serge in Chrono Cross that Serge never has to fight. In game, you never are given a reason to think Glenn is an enemy, you never fight him, he's always friendly. Riddel at least associates with the Dragoons, who do fight against Serge at some point so they could potentially be scum then, a lot, she's Viper's daughter for crying out loud. But she never actually plots against Serge and company. That's why I think Riddel is the better miller claim.

pj's trolling with that claim, and I don't like it one bit. No flavor either.

Terra I wasn't hiding under the radar, i was studying for a very important final. I said I would catch up again once my finals were over.
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This is rough right now because it feels like for most of the day 80% of the content was dragoons.
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VeryInsane posted...

Hey Nana since you are CE and most likely Town what do you think of

Terra
IGCD

... oh I guess it's just those two since sheep hasn't posted and everyone else isn't CE

I know I'm not Nana but I only realised Terra was in this game cause his name is highlighted for me. He's done less than I remember, but this is more active than our usual games and I've also not played with him for a long time. Still not been up for 24 hours yet either so I'm sure we'll see more.
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UltimaterializerX posted...

Corrik and PJ are clearly joking around with their claims. MZero was trying to copy Scare's strategy and got caught. There is no doubt in my mind that Glenn is not a freaking town miller claim.

Comedy Option: MZero isn't Glenn and is some town power role and Glenn is on the mafia safelist, ala Monster Mafia 1.
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Lots of defense for PJ not coming from PJ himself.

PJs fourth and fifth posts seem forced, almost as though someone said "PJ you have to post or you're going to get lynched for inactivity."
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whatisurnameplz posted...

Ok exams are done,time to catch up and talk about what's been going on so far. I'll comment as I catch up.

MZero11 posted...

##Vote: whatisurnameplz

very opportunistic vote on me. Smelled blood and went all in trying to secure a Day 1 mislynch. Scummy move

I feel ok with Ulti right now just because that would be a ballsy move as scum. He's the self proclaimed "easiest guy to read" so if he's scum it will be obvious soon enough anyway

I don't trust that there are two millers in this game. Doesn't make any sense to me. One of you or Ulti is lying, and I trust you less at the moment.

*sees corrik's claim*

Three millers? Neofio's a weird flavor for that. Now I don't know what to think. I wanna say Corrik is town because I doubt scum would claim miller like that without catching up first, it'd be too risky for them...but if he's scum and made that claim anyway he's benefitting from the chaos.

Ulti the rules say metagaming is discouraged. it doesn't matter what corrik did in the past; not listening to what he has to say by ignoring him is anti-town.

I don't like oddity's vote on VI, and based on VI's response he seems town to me.

Nana on thinking my reasoning doesn't make sense, think of it this way. When the Town Cop scans a miller, they come up guilty despite being innocent. For the purposes of this game, I'm assuming town is anybody that's aligned with Serge in Chrono Cross that Serge never has to fight. In game, you never are given a reason to think Glenn is an enemy, you never fight him, he's always friendly. Riddel at least associates with the Dragoons, who do fight against Serge at some point so they could potentially be scum then, a lot, she's Viper's daughter for crying out loud. But she never actually plots against Serge and company. That's why I think Riddel is the better miller claim.

pj's trolling with that claim, and I don't like it one bit. No flavor either.

Terra I wasn't hiding under the radar, i was studying for a very important final. I said I would catch up again once my finals were over.

Fuck this noise. You don't get to call me out for saying that you never mentioned Dragoons, then come back and clarify here that you were talking about the Dragoons and that I was right contextually.
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whatisurnameplz posted...

Nanahara715 posted...

whatisurnameplz posted...

Ok I'll bold it to make it clear

##Vote: MZero

Glenn's being a miller doesn't make sense because you never are given a reason to consider him an enemy during the game. You never fight him, you first see him in the game watching over someone's grave (i think, it could be a memorial), heck he's even named after Frog from CT, a character who's all about good and justice. There's far better choices for one. With Riddel, I don't think you ever fight here either but in the game you see here spending a lot more time with the enemy; it's a lot more clear she's alligned with them.

1) Nothing suggests Dragoons as mafia team.

2) Your argument here is that MZero picked a character that doesn't make sense as a miller to claim?

If he were the only miller, maybe I'd accept it. But I highly doubt we have two millers in one game.

Also, I never mentioned the Dragoons once there.

whatisurnameplz posted...

Ok exams are done,time to catch up and talk about what's been going on so far. I'll comment as I catch up.

MZero11 posted...

##Vote: whatisurnameplz

very opportunistic vote on me. Smelled blood and went all in trying to secure a Day 1 mislynch. Scummy move

I feel ok with Ulti right now just because that would be a ballsy move as scum. He's the self proclaimed "easiest guy to read" so if he's scum it will be obvious soon enough anyway

I don't trust that there are two millers in this game. Doesn't make any sense to me. One of you or Ulti is lying, and I trust you less at the moment.

*sees corrik's claim*

Three millers? Neofio's a weird flavor for that. Now I don't know what to think. I wanna say Corrik is town because I doubt scum would claim miller like that without catching up first, it'd be too risky for them...but if he's scum and made that claim anyway he's benefitting from the chaos.

Ulti the rules say metagaming is discouraged. it doesn't matter what corrik did in the past; not listening to what he has to say by ignoring him is anti-town.

I don't like oddity's vote on VI, and based on VI's response he seems town to me.

Nana on thinking my reasoning doesn't make sense, think of it this way. When the Town Cop scans a miller, they come up guilty despite being innocent. For the purposes of this game, I'm assuming town is anybody that's aligned with Serge in Chrono Cross that Serge never has to fight. In game, you never are given a reason to think Glenn is an enemy, you never fight him, he's always friendly. Riddel at least associates with the Dragoons, who do fight against Serge at some point so they could potentially be scum then, a lot, she's Viper's daughter for crying out loud. But she never actually plots against Serge and company. That's why I think Riddel is the better miller claim.

pj's trolling with that claim, and I don't like it one bit. No flavor either.

Terra I wasn't hiding under the radar, i was studying for a very important final. I said I would catch up again once my finals were over.

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Who was the first person who came to the conclusion that Dragoons are mafia?

And whatisurname, who did you pick up the info from?
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MZero11 posted...

whatisurnameplz posted...

Glenn as a miller? I don't understand that. I'd expect it to be Lynx.

What's your flavor?

i'm a member of the Dragoons and will scan as such despite being aligned with town

Something about not wanting to be overshadowed by my brother and wanting to save the general.

For the record I have never played Chrono Cross

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Whatisurname-

PJ - do you lean town or scum?
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whatisurnameplz posted...

For the purposes of this game, I'm assuming town is anybody that's aligned with Serge in Chrono Cross that Serge never has to fight. In game, you never are given a reason to think Glenn is an enemy, you never fight him, he's always friendly. Riddel at least associates with the Dragoons, who do fight against Serge at some point so they could potentially be scum then, a lot, she's Viper's daughter for crying out loud. But she never actually plots against Serge and company. That's why I think Riddel is the better miller claim.

She associates with the dragoons? Glenn is ACTUALLY a dragoon! So how do the Dragoons make sense as scum, and Glenn make sense as Town, but Glenn doesn't make sense as a miller?

How is this so hard to understand
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You're probably right about him not being Glenn at least.
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I said enemy in general in the first post on the assumption that scum is represented by characters in-game that at some point in the game are fighting against Serge. I wrote that post under the assumption dragoons could be scum, though we don't know for certain at the moment. And the in the second post I'm saying that Riddel makes more sense as miller because Serge never sees Glenn as somebody against him. Ever. the whole point of millers is they're townies that scan guilty/look bad in the eyes of the cop scanning them.
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To answer Sheep, my reasoning is that Nana was basically completely dead weight when he played scum IIRC and he clearly isn't here so
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You explained yourself how Glenn makes sense as Town and why he doesn't make sense as scum

You also explained how the Dragoons make sense as scum

Glenn = Dragoon (scum) who is friendly with Serge and friends (Town)

This is literally a perfect fit for a miller claim and I don't understand how you can think it doesn't make sense
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MZero11 posted...

You explained yourself how Glenn makes sense as Town and why he doesn't make sense as scum

You also explained how the Dragoons make sense as scum

Glenn = Dragoon (scum) who is friendly with Serge and friends (Town)

This is literally a perfect fit for a miller claim and I don't understand how you can think it doesn't make sense

I'm sorry, a miller what?
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Nanahara715 posted...

MZero11 posted...

You explained yourself how Glenn makes sense as Town and why he doesn't make sense as scum

You also explained how the Dragoons make sense as scum

Glenn = Dragoon (scum) who is friendly with Serge and friends (Town)

This is literally a perfect fit for a miller claim and I don't understand how you can think it doesn't make sense

I'm sorry, a miller what?

Lol my phone must have auto completed that in there. That's not a good look
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MZero11 posted...

You explained yourself how Glenn makes sense as Town and why he doesn't make sense as scum

You also explained how the Dragoons make sense as scum

Glenn = Dragoon (scum) who is friendly with Serge and friends (Town)

This is literally a perfect fit for a miller claim and I don't understand how you can think it doesn't make sense

How do you know how much sense he makes?
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VeryInsane posted...

MZero11 posted...

whatisurnameplz posted...

Glenn as a miller? I don't understand that. I'd expect it to be Lynx.

What's your flavor?

i'm a member of the Dragoons and will scan as such despite being aligned with town

Something about not wanting to be overshadowed by my brother and wanting to save the general.

For the record I have never played Chrono Cross

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MZero, can you paraphrase your PM?
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MZero it's because I don't believe there's more than one miller, and I trust your claim less.
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benjamin3740 posted...

How do you know how much sense he makes?

My flavor makes it very obvious the Dragoons are scum and I'm a Dragoon but on the side of Town. Also a number of people have said the Dragoons make sense as scum
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Actually that's probably as good as it's gonn get huh

Oh well!

Scratch that question and instead


WHAT DO YOU THINK OF

Corrik
Oddity
pjbasis
IGCD?
Terra?
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MZero11 posted...

Nanahara715 posted...

MZero11 posted...

You explained yourself how Glenn makes sense as Town and why he doesn't make sense as scum

You also explained how the Dragoons make sense as scum

Glenn = Dragoon (scum) who is friendly with Serge and friends (Town)

This is literally a perfect fit for a miller claim and I don't understand how you can think it doesn't make sense

I'm sorry, a miller what?

Lol my phone must have auto completed that in there. That's not a good look

Quote a post by you where you typed "Miller claim" such that your phone would autocorrect.
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VeryInsane posted...

MZero, can you paraphrase your PM?

I'm a dragoon, i have a brother, I think the general isn't quite right and want to save him

I scan as a dragoon despite being town
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Nanahara715 posted...

MZero11 posted...

Nanahara715 posted...

MZero11 posted...

You explained yourself how Glenn makes sense as Town and why he doesn't make sense as scum

You also explained how the Dragoons make sense as scum

Glenn = Dragoon (scum) who is friendly with Serge and friends (Town)

This is literally a perfect fit for a miller claim and I don't understand how you can think it doesn't make sense

I'm sorry, a miller what?

Lol my phone must have auto completed that in there. That's not a good look

Quote a post by you where you typed "Miller claim" such that your phone would autocorrect.

This is the first time I've used my phone this game so it's probably from Mercs 4 mafia
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Given how many times you've typed "Miller" this game, shouldn't you be aware of that?
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Nanahara715 posted...

Given how many times you've typed "Miller" this game, shouldn't you be aware of that?

Scrap this. Misread.

Who has Mercs Mafia archived?
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UltimaterializerX posted...

Nanahara715 posted...

1) Nothing suggests Dragoons as mafia team.

My role PM does. I'm the daughter of the Dragoon general.

Wait, huh? You're daughter of the Dragoon general, but say you're town?

But you're saying the Dragoon flavor is the mafia side? So shouldn't that technically make you mafia??

I'm gonna make a list of players to keep handy as I read from now on since I can't remember any names and I'm on my phone ^_^;;

Ben are you mafia? Just tell us plz. Thx.

I'm feeling pretty good about VI though. He's been scum hunting it seems to me and his posts have given a town vibe.

The first two miller claims are still weird for me. MZero seems Genuine to me, but I guess he could have had that all planned out as mafia when he claimed.

I have no idea about any of this flavor for the game so I'm going off on what you guys said. But I don't exactly like to Lynch off of flavor, or use that as a specific point seeing as I was once lynched over flavor. >__>
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Shadow what do you think about Corrik's claim? Do you think that's genuine?
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whatisurnameplz posted...

Shadow what do you think about Corrik's claim? Do you think that's genuine?

He also claimed miller, correct?

Nah. I don't think he is. I could only see that happening if Mzero and ulti were both mafia claiming and counter claiming to get someone to slide through the game with no issues.

Which I guess could be plausible, but probably unlikely
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So do you think Corrik is scum then?
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Shadow_Goer16 posted...

UltimaterializerX posted...

Nanahara715 posted...

1) Nothing suggests Dragoons as mafia team.

My role PM does. I'm the daughter of the Dragoon general.

Ben are you mafia? Just tell us plz. Thx.

I have no idea about any of this flavor for the game so I'm going off on what you guys said. But I don't exactly like to Lynch off of flavor, or use that as a specific point seeing as I was once lynched over flavor. >__>

Nope, I am not mafia. But i would have loved to be on your team. So who are your buddies hm? Is Mzero one?

But Shadow, Koopa-troopas are bad guys. So you're a bad guy~
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