Board 8 > Star Wars The Last Jedi discussion (SPOILERS)

(+) Yeah! (+)

MoogleKupo141 posted...

what

Well it's not the worst ranking possible but it's close
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Something I noticed which would've been cool is Rey was training with the lightsaber in a backhand grip so that could've been her style... but she ended up using it normally
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I liked TLJ overall but I felt that it was more meandering than TFA and half the time I wasn't sure either what it was trying to lead towards, or what its conclusion was. All the Luke/Rey stuff was great but also sort of confusing - I guess it was confusing for Luke too but I found it hard to draw a conclusion what the main takeaway from all of their interactions was. The rest of the stuff kinda felt like they were throwing stuff at the wall to see what stuck. It felt a little like RotJ in that way.

4 > 5 > 7 > 6 > 8 > RO > 2 > 3 > 1 for now but I might change my mind on a rewatch. It's probably closer to sliding under RO than it is to surpassing 6? Still far better than the prequels obviously.

Saw it last nigh. Middle dragged. Still a really great movie, 8/10
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Reading some of the complaints

1. I also thought space Leila was kind of dumb, but it went over quick and wasnt super plot relevant so whatever.
2. The mirror scene was kind of weird but could be a swrup.
3. I actually liked Finns arc, because it was a spectacular failure. It wasnt pointless, it made everything worse. I thought it added suspense to later parts of the film by showing that this is a movie where good guys can lose.
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Whiskey_Nick posted...

Star Wars fans are Jedi's all arrogant and acting like they own Star Wars.

Imagine arguing someone can't express their opinion on something or they have some personal flaw. C'mon, Nick. That is dumb arguing.
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Saw it yesterday. Really enjoyed the movie. Has some flaws of course (I wasn't big fan of Casino World), but pretty much any time any of Rey, Kylo, or Luke was on screen it was electric.
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Oh I didn't realize they already announced Leia isn't in IX.
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See I didn't mind Casino world at all but towards the end when it started to feel bloated - even though what was happening on the screen was great - I feel like that's the first thing I would have cut to prevent that.
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Nanis23 posted...

MoogleKupo141 posted...

what

Well it's not the worst ranking possible but it's close

Jeff Zero and I know a guy who claims Attack of the Clones is the best movie.
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Leonhart4 posted...

Nanis23 posted...

MoogleKupo141 posted...

what

Well it's not the worst ranking possible but it's close

Jeff Zero and I know a guy who claims Attack of the Clones is the best movie.

Hey man if you really like Jedi and lightsabers...
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then revenge of the sith is for you!
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transcience posted...

then revenge of the sith is for you!

There's less Jedi and Lightsabers in that one!
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hold on, surely RotS is the movie you don't watch if you like Jedi
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especially the younglings
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Reminder:

AotC features Kit Fisto doing things.
RotS features Kit Fisto dying.

So lets reeeeeeeeeeeeally think about which is the better movie.
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kit fisto sounds like the name of a sex toy
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15-year-old me made that same joke FFD come on
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some jokes are timeless
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Kit fisto is kylo ren's porn name
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Bane_Of_Despair posted...

Kit fisto is kylo ren's porn name

Kylo Ren actually turned because the other students kept altering his name to Kylo Penis.
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I think you mean Penis Solo.
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XIII_rocks posted...

15-year-old me made that same joke FFD come on

It not any less true now than it was then!
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TheRock1525 posted...

Bane_Of_Despair posted...

Kit fisto is kylo ren's porn name

Kylo Ren actually turned because the other students kept altering his name to Kylo Penis.

The Knights of Penis didn't have as good of a ring to it.
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Ben

Remove the foundation, the bottom of the b

Ren

George has done it again
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I was really hoping Rey was going to be gray or just a balanced force user and I feel like the movie was kind of leading that way, but then at the end, they were all nope! She's light side and she's gonna bring back the Jedi even after everything Luke was going on about.
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I think that should be "especially" after everything Luke was going on about because she absolutely refused to listen to anything he had to say
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Waluigi1 posted...

I was really hoping Rey was going to be gray or just a balanced force user and I feel like the movie was kind of leading that way, but then at the end, they were all nope! She's light side and she's gonna bring back the Jedi even after everything Luke was going on about.

kinda mirrors Luke in Empire, yeah?
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A perfect Star Wars film would feature Kit Fisto putting together a stealth-based team including Han Solo, Kir Kanos, and Cad Bane as they go up against Admiral Thrawn and a the full force of a galaxy united. It would also involve crashing a Death Star into a planet, someone taking a lightsaber down the throat, and thermal detonators exploding toilets.
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I still think it's kinda dumb that Luke was like 'yeah I guess I WON'T be the last jedi lol' after his point basically being that Rey can be a force user without being a jedi like ok way to backtrack on that

well he had to complete the "Every single thing in that sentence was wrong" joke

I guess he could've said "and you're not going to kill me" and that would've been a lot cooler
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but then he would've ruined that by dying
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but Kylo didn't kill him so it was still true!
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also I guess they wanted Luke to do a cool title drop and naming Episode VIII "You're Not Going to Kill Me" would've been weird and confusing to say the least
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LeonhartFour posted...

also I guess they wanted Luke to do a cool title drop and naming Episode VIII "You're Not Going to Kill Me" would've been weird and confusing to say the least

...they could have still title dropped by having him say he WOULD be the last jedi

but then that would've ruined the joke!

Luke is dedicated to his craft even if it means he has to lie a little to make it work
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They didn't have to have Kylo Ren say that Luke would be the last jedi in his speech

but then he couldn't do a title drop

it's a vicious cycle

(Seriously though, I get why Luke implies Rey will be a Jedi. It's easier to continue calling lightsaber good guys "Jedi" than to come up with a new name for them because it's probably the invented word associated most with Star Wars)

(plus I think the talk with Yoda changed his thinking a little bit too)
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I guess the idea is that Rey is following the ideals of being a jedi even if she's not literally part of a religious order or something but I dunno it's kind of confusing what the takeaway was supposed to be there

Yea I took it that his talk with Yoda was the turning point for him and he has renewed faith in Rey being a suitable followup for a Jedi
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Well, I think Luke getting upset when Yoda blew up the area with the books kinda revealed that he didn't hate the Jedi as much as he claimed, and Yoda called him on it, too.
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Also, Luke is angry with himself for failing Leia and Ben, and he conflates his failure with the entire Jedi Order and thinks that the Jedi Order just doesn't work because all they do is fail. Then Yoda says that failure isn't always the end and it isn't always a bad thing, and you can tell that kinda clicks for him.
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Well, I've forgotten much of the movie this weekend (there was a lot to digest).

I've completely forgotten why the First Order had to very slowly chase the Resistance fleet and fuel-starve them over the course of 18 hours. There was a line about the Resistance ships being "just far enough out of range for cannon fire to be effective"... but then why not just close the range? Why not send 50 TIE fighters to take down the main ship during such an exhaustingly long chase? I'm sure this was addressed but I can't remember it.

I'm not sure what to make of Snoke in all this. I love that he was killed in an early plot twist, but I'm disappointed that we learned nothing about the guy - how he came to power, what he was doing during the last 30 years, and how he got so damn strong. Like Palpatine, he was killed by his own arrogance, but the Snoke/Ren/Rey story wasn't built up nearly as much as Palpatine/Vader/Luke, so it wasn't nearly as powerful a moment.

I might be the only person who hated the post-Snoke fight. The drama there is between the central three characters - throwing the surviving two into an immediate fight with grunts robs that scene of its drama. I tend to care way more about characters and buildup than I do action scenes, so maybe that scene just wasn't for me. The audience all went "OH!" when Kylo killed that last guard with a lightsaber through the skull, but I was thinking "they just killed the fucking supreme leader, who cares."

I also hated Finn's duel against Phasma. She beat his ass, and he only won because he was knocked off-screen (onto a slowly ascending platform or something) and blindsided Phasma when she looked the other way. Couldn't they just make the poor guy win one impressively? He's gotten his ass kicked in both films. Seriously, in two movies, I think he's gotten knocked out like five times.

It feels like Leia was meant to have a big role in IX, as she was featured more prominently this time around, and we were finally shown her Force abilities in one of the movie's most insane scenes. Apart from Chewie and the droids, she was also the last link to the OT who survived this movie (unless they bring Lando back next time).

Overall... it's hard to even come up with overall thoughts. I appreciated the risks the movie took, but so much of the backstory (and I don't mean Rey and Kylo Ren, but Snoke and the entire damn First Order) is still a total mystery that I don't think we should just be expected to gloss over. Also, with Carrie Fisher gone and Luke killed off, there is almost no link to the OT left, and no "wise" characters remaining. Luke, Han, and Leia, and even Snoke are all gone. The main players (Rey, Kylo Ren, Finn, Poe, Hux, Rose) are all in their 20s. It kinda worries me that EpIX will devolve into a weird teen drama with no mature characters there to guide and influence the younger ones.
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CaptainOfCrush posted...

I've completely forgotten why the First Order had to very slowly chase the Resistance fleet and fuel-starve them over the course of 18 hours. There was a line about the Resistance ships being "just far enough out of range for cannon fire to be effective"... but then why not just close the range? Why not send 50 TIE fighters to take down the main ship during such an exhaustingly long chase? I'm sure this was addressed but I can't remember it.

They basically said that fighters sent into range while being outside of the operating zone of the flagship would get torn to shreds. I don't remember anything about why they can't close the distance, but I can't imagine these ships are built for manual travel since hyperspace travel exists. There's a lot of handwaving of how space combat works in general.

CaptainOfCrush posted...

I might be the only person who hated the post-Snoke fight. The drama there is between the central three characters - throwing the surviving two into an immediate fight with grunts robs that scene of its drama. I tend to care way more about characters and buildup than I do action scenes, so maybe that scene just wasn't for me. The audience all went "OH!" when Kylo killed that last guard with a lightsaber through the skull, but I was thinking "they just killed the fucking supreme leader, who cares."

This is just a cool scene to show Rey and Kylo actually working together instead of Kylo saving Rey and going "join me" and she goes "no." It lets Rey make the decision to save Kylo just like he saved her, because they both think they can turn the other. It's basically a really cool looking character moment.
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Luke is dead but that doesn't mean he is gone. I think most people expect him to show up in Episode IX anyways.
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I mean Yoda just showed him how easy it is to blow shit up while you are dead, so I assume he took that as a lightbulb moment
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Luke promised three lessons and gave only two. He's absolutely coming back in Episode IX to give a final, much-needed lesson for Rey to turn some bad situation around.
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Also feeling the need to be strapped down to OT things is dangerous, because then it has the chance of crossing the line to feeling forced in just to have it. This movie has started, and I hope they continue, the notion that this new trilogy can absolutely be its own thing.

And yea I totally agree Luke will be back in ghost form for IX
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While we don't know much about Snoke's backstory, we didn't know anything about the Emperor's backstory either in the OT.
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CaptainOfCrush posted...

It feels like Leia was meant to have a big role in IX

Yeah, the idea was for each of the three major OT heroes to be a central character in each movie, and then they'd disappear off the scene. It was meant to be a passing of the torch from the old generation to the new. Leia was supposed to be last, so now they'll have to figure out how to work around Carrie Fisher's passing. Force Ghost Luke will probably have a bigger role now than originally intended.

CaptainOfCrush posted...

There was a line about the Resistance ships being "just far enough out of range for cannon fire to be effective"... but then why not just close the range? Why not send 50 TIE fighters to take down the main ship during such an exhaustingly long chase? I'm sure this was addressed but I can't remember it.

The main ship can breach the shields if it's close enough, but it's slower than the Resistance ship because it's heavier. The TIE Fighters aren't strong enough to breach the shields on their own. I think that's the gist of the explanation they gave at any rate.

CaptainOfCrush posted...

Seriously, in two movies, I think he's gotten knocked out like five times.

I mean the dude's a former Storm Trooper so he's effectively a mook with a face turn

if he were still a bad guy he'd definitely be dead at this point
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