Current Events > Yet another major study which dictates spanking children is wrong

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https://psychnews.psychiatryonline.org/doi/10.1176/appi.pn.2021.5.13

Spanking has effects on early childhood behavior similar to those of adverse childhood experiences (ACEs) such as physical or emotional abuse or neglect, parental mental illness, parental substance use, and others, a study in the Journal of Pediatrics has found. Childrens exposure to spanking and ACEs when they were age 3 had statistically indistinguishable associations with externalizing behaviors at age 5, such as destroying their own belongings, being mean to others, or physically attacking others.

The results strongly suggest that spanking should be considered an ACE, lead author Julie Ma, Ph.D., M.S.W., told Psychiatric News.

With spanking, you are showing kids that it is OK to hit people if you would like them to stop what they are doing. Kids learn that this is an appropriate behavior, and it prompts them to become more aggressive, Ma said. If more [mental health] programs thought of spanking as an adverse childhood experience, we could then talk about adjusting social norms and attitudes and parental behavior.

Ma and colleagues analyzed responses from 2,380 families in the Fragile Families and Child Wellbeing Study (FFCWS), which included children born between 1998 and 2000 in 20 U.S. cities and their mothers. Mothers in the FFCWS were interviewed in person shortly after giving birth and interviewed again by phone when their children were 1, 3, 5, 9, and 15 years old. Ma and colleagues drew their study sample from the interviews when the children were 3 years old, which assessed ACEs and spanking, and the interviews when the children were 5 years old, which assessed behavioral problems.

The researchers found that at age 3, 58% of the children had experienced one or more ACE, and 55% of the children had been spanked by their mother in the past month. Not only did spanking and ACEs have a similar association with externalizing behaviors in children at age 5, mothers who spanked were more likely to report externalizing behaviors in their children than mothers who did not spank.

Stop beating your kids folks.
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bait.

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Yet another study that is wrong.

DuckButter posted...

Yet another study that is wrong.

Except it's correct. Can't wait until corporal punishment is illegal.

Yeah it's awful. Makes me sick they can still paddle kids in school here

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voldothegr8 posted...

With spanking, you are showing kids that it is OK to hit people if you would like them to stop what they are doing. Kids learn that this is an appropriate behavior, and it prompts them to become more aggressive,

Literally everyone who isn't oblivious of basic cause and effect has always known this.

Me: Hey Jr you stop this right now and go to your room!

Jr:. Fuck you bitch!

Me: Oh what am I gonna do with you

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This is bullshit
I was [anecdotal evidence] and I turned out [anecdotal evidence].

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TheOtherMike posted...

Literally everyone who isn't oblivious of basic cause and effect has always known this.

It IS okay to hit someone if you want them to stop what they're doing. Ever been bullied? Were you able to convince your bully to stop with a well thought out intellectual plea? No? Me neither. I have convinced bullies to stop by throwing reckless haymakers at their faces though.

https://i.imgur.com/uCuoF4n.png

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DuckButter posted...

It IS okay to hit someone if you want them to stop what they're doing. Ever been bullied? Were you able to convince your bully to stop with a well thought out intellectual plea? No? Me neither. I have convinced bullies to stop by throwing reckless haymakers at their faces though.

Do you understand the difference between hitting back in self-defense and hitting first because one of your siblings/friends/classmates was annoying you or playing with a toy you wanted?

TheOtherMike posted...

Do you understand the difference between hitting back in self-defense and hitting first because one of your siblings/friends/classmates was annoying you or playing with a toy you wanted?

Yes. Do you? The blanket statement I replied to made no concession for bullying.

treat children like rational people and then they will learn in time how to be well-behaved rational people.

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TheOtherMike posted...

Do you understand the difference between hitting back in self-defense and hitting first because one of your siblings/friends/classmates was annoying you or playing with a toy you wanted?

He doesn't, but it isn't his fault. He was hit as a child and it created bad coping mechanisms

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I have a lot of friends with children. There is a clear difference in behavior between the kids that get spanked and the ones that don't.

And no surprise that the ones that get spanked are better behaving, and all around less bratty.

And its not like the ones that get spanked have low self esteem or anything negative like that.

krazychao5 posted...

treat children like rational people and then they will learn in time how to be well-behaved rational people.

My friend tried this. He thought he could reason with his four year old. It failed big time, kid can be a huge brat and takes advantage of the beta parenting.

DuckButter posted...

Yes. Do you? The blanket statement I replied made no concession for bullying.

Oh, so you're trolling. Nevermind.

TheOtherMike posted...

Oh, so you're trolling. Nevermind.

This is how you bow out when you lose an argument? Not very classy, but you do you. Later dude.

Yoshii69 posted...

I have a lot of friends with children. There is a clear difference in behavior between the kids that get spanked and the ones that don't.

And no surprise that the ones that get spanked are better behaving, and all around less bratty.

And its not like the ones that get spanked have low self esteem or anything negative like that.

weird, my kid never gets spanked and he is better behaved then my neighbours kid who is always into trouble for hitting people destroying his and other peoples belongings and he gets spanked all the time.

i put my kid in time out, they yell scream and spank their child.

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Barber102 posted...

weird, my kid never gets spanked and he is better behaved then my neighbours kid who is always into trouble for hitting people destroying his and other peoples belongings and he gets spanked all the time.

i put my kid in time out, they yell scream and spank their child.

Sounds like your neighnbor's kid deserves more spankings, and yours does not.

Spanking does not involving constantly beating your kid.

DuckButter posted...

This is how you bow out when you lose an argument? Not very classy, but you do you. Later dude.

So you're not trolling? That's even more embarrassing, if you actually think you made a point. The "blanket generalization" you misinterpreted is referring to baseline aggression. Responding to bullies has nothing to do with aggression in any other context. Bottom line is kids who get spanked are more aggressive than kids who don't, and equally as aggressive as kids who get outright abused.

Jiek_Fafn posted...

This is bullshit
I was [anecdotal evidence] and I turned out [anecdotal evidence].

"Let me tell you why multiple decade+ comprehensive studies are wrong"
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Not spanking your kids can lead to posting bait on 18 year old accounts on gfaqs. Just look at tc.

DuckButter posted...

Yet another study that is wrong.

"My unsubstantiated ignorance is as valid as your research!"

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Artemis86 posted...

Not spanking your kids can lead to posting bait on 18 year old accounts on gfaqs. Just look at tc.

No my parents beat the fuck out of me, all it did was make me a better liar.
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Not sure why people are so attached to the practice of beating the shit out of kids
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Let me go dig up my dad and tell him he fucked up.

Isn't it ok to hit people to stop them doing what they are doing?

Smashingpmkns posted...

Not sure why people are so attached to the practice of beating the shit out of kids

Lousy parents don't like facing the fact that they're lousy parents
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Smashingpmkns posted...

Not sure why people are so attached to the practice of beating the shit out of kids

It shows the kid what their future could hold.

Break the rules and you could end up locked in a room for a time with no tv and a very sore butt.

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TheOtherMike posted...

So you're not trolling? That's even more embarrassing, if you actually think you made a point. The "blanket generalization" you misinterpreted is referring to baseline aggression. Responding to bullies has nothing to do with aggression in any other context. Bottom line is kids who get spanked are more aggressive than kids who don't, and equally as aggressive as kids who get outright abused.

My bad, I didn't read the article (like everyone else on the internet who reads a thread title and jumps straight to the comments) - I was responding to the blanket statement in general. I don't know if I'd agree that the two issues aren't related in some way though.

Say that kid A (who was spanked) is a bully. He bullies kid B (who was not spanked). Does the bullying by kid A not just stand in for the spankings that kid B didn't get, thus, in a sense, creating kid A again despite mom and dad's best efforts? At what age does being the recipient of violence not perpetuate that violence?

And it's all a case-by-case thing anyway. Some people are able to break those cycles. Abuse, addiction, you name it. I know this for a fact.

My contribution to this topic is that every time I've scrolled past it in the topic list, I've read it as "speaking to children" and had to do a double take
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Yoshii69 posted...

My friend tried this. He thought he could reason with his four year old. It failed big time, kid can be a huge brat and takes advantage of the beta parenting.

i mean, if you stop teaching them at 4 years old they gonna have a difficult time adjusting in life. start teaching them actions and consequences at at younger age and they will pick up more advanced concepts earlier than their peers. but basing it off of one 4 year old child is asinine

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DuckButter posted...

My bad, I didn't read the article (like everyone else on the internet who reads a thread title and jumps straight to the comments) - I was responding to the blanket statement in general. I don't know if I'd agree that the two issues aren't related in some way though.

Say that kid A (who was spanked) is a bully. He bullies kid B (who was not spanked). Does the bullying by kid A not just stand in for the spankings that kid B didn't get, thus, in a sense, creating kid A again despite mom and dad's best efforts? At what age does being the recipient of violence not perpetuate that violence?

And it's all a case-by-case thing anyway. Some people are able to break those cycles. Abuse, addiction, you name it. I know this for a fact.

Just because your kid is getting physically bullied doesn't mean you should cut out the middle-man and do it yourself. You are just compounding an issue.

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Wow, intelligent posters came pretty quick this time.

You know folks are prepared to argue in poor faith when they start the whole stop beating your kids dogma.

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I mean the dudes knocking out nazis were likely spanked and I think everyone except the nazis liked that.
Godwins law invoked

People have such a weird attachment to wanting to hit their children.

It really makes you wonder some people even have kids since it seems like they are just looking for a reason to beat them up.

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Tmaster148 posted...

People have such a weird attachment to wanting to hit their children.

It really makes you wonder some people even have kids since it seems like they are just looking for a reason to beat them up.

Anyone who gets even the slightest level of enjoyment or satisfaction from spanking their children should definitely never, ever spank them.

DuckButter posted...

Anyone who gets even the slightest level of enjoyment or satisfaction from spanking their children should definitely never, ever spank them.

You should certainly take your own advice and stop pushing for people to beat up their children.

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DuckButter posted...

Anyone who gets even the slightest level of enjoyment or satisfaction from spanking their children should definitely never, ever spank them.

Kids should never ever take physical pain as punishment, period.
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Butt spanking your mom is right.

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Tmaster148 posted...

You should certainly take your own advice and stop pushing for people to beat up their children.

I don't find spanking my children enjoyable. I've also been fortunate in that I've hardly ever found it necessary to do so. My children responded well to it and it wasn't a thing that needed repeating. Some children don't respond well to it, I think, and those kids shouldn't be spanked either.

I don't condone hitting a child at all and they should not be physically hit at all IMO. With that said, are we gonna act like super hand holding and spoiling a child is the way to go?

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DuckButter posted...

I don't find spanking my children enjoyable. I've also been fortunate in that I've hardly ever found it necessary to do so. My children responded well to it and it wasn't a thing that needed repeating. Some children don't respond well to it, I think, and those kids shouldn't be spanked either.

If you didn't find it enjoyable, you wouldn't be so opposed to stopping doing so based on information telling you that it's bad.

Anyone who truly didn't find hitting their children enjoyable would see this information and look for better ways to punish their children.

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Veggeta X posted...

I don't condone hitting a child at all and they should not be physically hit at all IMO. With that said, are we gonna act like super hand holding and spoiling a child is the way to go?

There are ways to raise kids without physical abuse and without spoiling them. It just takes more work and involvement.
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If you gotta resort to violence then you're a failure of a parent. If you seriously can only control your child by smacking them on the ass, you seriously need some help.

Still surprising to see so many people who are for spanking kids. I am curious what the ratio is between these pro-spanking people and the ones who were spanked by their parents. Maybe they don't want to feel like they had shitty parents?

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voldothegr8 posted...

Kids should never ever take physical pain as punishment, period.

I love that for you. You do it your way, and I'll do it my way.

voldothegr8 posted...

There are ways to raise kids without physical abuse and without spoiling them. It just takes more work and involvement.

something so many people refuse to admit and also take the attention and time to create a better solution. best hit the kid cause their parents did and they turned out "okay"

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I've spanked my kids a few times. Only when I deemed it was absolutely necessary. Never in anger, and I hated every second of it. But I think it's okay to do. My kids don't act up much, they're very polite and good in public. I always give them other punishment first and spanking is the last resort. But there's certainly a time for it. Usually not, though.

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