-Matches will last exactly 24 hours. Votes after that much time has elapsed will not be counted, even if a new topic hasn't gone up yet. -This is a contest to determine which character is the most *powerful*. Vote only for the character you think would win in a fight, not the one who's funnier, cooler, or sexier. If you don't do that I can't count your vote. -BOLD YOUR VOTE. Unbolded votes will NOT be counted. -Rallying is allowed. Alts are not. -Fights will take place in a neutral terrain. This does not necessarily mean a *featureless* terrain: assume that both characters will have a chance to use all of their skills to the fullest here, barring setting-specific abilities and anything that requires the presence of multiple enemies (but see below). -Characters start the fight alone. They don't bring allies with them, like Kerrigan and the Zerg Swarm for instance. Summons are allowed though, provided they're brought once combat has started. -Fighters retain their usual personalities. They won't fight to kill unless that's their MO, and won't spam their best attacks to win unless, again, that's how they act in their original media. -Similarly, fighters are unaware of their opponents capabilities at the start of the fight unless their powers facilitate them information (like knowing all there is to know in the universe - this would include who the opponent is and what he can do, as well as weaknesses) -You don't have to justify your vote, but it helps. If you feel like you can add something to the debate, go right ahead! -Seriously, BOLD THE VOTE. So important it bears repeating. -Bracket Link, for viewing past results and future matches: http://www.bracketmaker.com/tmenu.cfm?&tid=408528&tclass=
Past Results: Ryu Hayabusa's speed and range advantage proved enough to easily overcome Mordekaiser. The ninja moves on to Round 2! Votals: 4-12.
(4) Anti Spiral The final villain of Tengen Toppa Gurren Lagann, the Anti Spiral is a universal threat. Riding a colossal mecha, it is large enough to manipulate galaxies, mashing two of them together to produce a big bang. He is also capable of manifesting incredibly detailed illusions, intended to fool those it targets into believing they are leading their perfect lives, as well as read the minds of sentient beings. It can channel Anti Spiral Energy, which, much like the Spiral Energy harnessed by its chief opposition, is capable of warping reality to suit the whims of a determined enough user.
vs.
(6) Yoko Kurama From YuYu Hakusho, Yoko Kurama is the demon form of the human Kurama, which appears under certain circumstances. Kurama eventually learns to tap into Yoko's power without overtly transforming into the demon. Kurama is usually calm and analytical, though cutthroat in battle.
Kurama uses a variety of plant-themed attacks in battle, the most prominent of which is Rose Whip, a whip-like attack that can cut through steel. Other attacks include Rose Whiplash (swift slashing of the Whip in several directions), Seed of the Death Plant (plants a seed in the target's body, which can kill them), various poisonous and acidic plants, and Sinning Tree, which traps its target in a neverending loop of their past transgressions.
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Currently playing: League of Legends, Chrono Cross. Current Projects: Fool's Overture, CYOA: http://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/8-gamefaqs-contests/60143513
You can tell how this match would go just by looking at the pics. Anti Spiral crushes this in a blowout only slightly smaller than the one Sarda hit the Masked Man with. Kurama was a casualty of the stacked bracket.
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Currently playing: League of Legends, Chrono Cross. Current Projects: Fool's Overture, CYOA: http://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/8-gamefaqs-contests/60143513
Too bad for Kurama, he's had a string of awesome matches in recent MPFCs. Too bad that streak has to end like this!
Anti Spiral
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From his looks Magus is Macho Man Randy Savage as an anime zombie. The black wind howls, and one of you will snap into a Slim Jim ooh yeeeah! -sonicblastpunch
Yeah, some you win, some you lose. Someone was getting fed to the warpers and Kurama happened to be the one who had to deal with that misfortune for the Trapped division.
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Currently playing: League of Legends, Chrono Cross. Current Projects: Fool's Overture, CYOA: http://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/8-gamefaqs-contests/60143513
...actually isn't as much of a blowout as is being stated due to AS's personality and the fact that Kurama's style isn't necessarily killing but finding some way to disable the opponent. AS wouldn't ever go so much as the size of a skyscraper against Kurama. not his style. Kurama'd likely figure out the enemy's toying with him and has shown a heavy resistance to mental attacks. Simon 'n friends pretty much outmuscled the guy because that's the only thing they knew how to do. Kurama mainly knows how to analyze his enemy quickly and look for a strategy to win. and AS would absolutely let him do that.
so no, not really a stomp there because AS is that much of a moron and Kurama's that much of a smart guy.
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The future must protect the clone's past. "Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.
All I really have to say regarding the Kurama side... is pick one...
Kurama doesn't like using Yoko, yet we speak of them both being the same person, they aren't... by tactical-ness, Normal Kurama wouldn't be strong enough, but smart enough to fight AS...
And if AS decided to fight on the same level as normal Kurama, then he'd get smart enough to go Yoko by the end who is far better, which would show AS as a weakling...
And if AS decided to fight on the same level as normal Kurama, then he'd get smart enough to go Yoko by the end who is far better, which would show AS as a weakling...
AS: hmm k then <puts himself on the level as Yoko then proceeds to beast him> (DESPAIIIIIR)
seriously no matter what strat AS goes with he beasts with no effort.
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XBL GT: Demon Ninja X2 "There comes a time in every man's or woman's life where they have to make **** up to cover their ass." - Hazama
...considering he got his main mind trick busted out by dudes who haven't shown any innate mental resistance, but just understood it wasn't the right thing, i'll sooner go with pretty much completely blocking the older Toguro brother's mind hax and fooling said hax to the point where the thoughts being shown were only those he wanted to show, including the ones the enemy wanted to see (of, coincidently, him in despair).
AS can be a pretty high level brawler if he fights high level brawlers who only know how to beat things to death, but that's definitely not Kurama, and that's pretty much the only times he'd do it. AS is more likely to play a word game with the guy than he is to punching him in the face.
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The future must protect the clone's past. "Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.
From what I remember of past matches, Kurama might just be the best tactician and smartest fighter in the history of MPFC. Isn't it possible that he could figure out a way to break free if AS tried that?
To be honest I seriously doubt it. For one as I said the trap is basically god tier. Second, it seems getting out of the trap is more of a "willpower" deal then anything else.
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XBL GT: Demon Ninja X2 "There comes a time in every man's or woman's life where they have to make **** up to cover their ass." - Hazama
From: WickIebee | #013 All I really have to say regarding the Kurama side... is pick one...
Kurama doesn't like using Yoko, yet we speak of them both being the same person, they aren't... by tactical-ness, Normal Kurama wouldn't be strong enough, but smart enough to fight AS...
And if AS decided to fight on the same level as normal Kurama, then he'd get smart enough to go Yoko by the end who is far better, which would show AS as a weakling...
Your choice... I don't know AS so well...
Yoko Kurama is absolutely not on AS's highest level. At his best Anti Spiral can make universes and chuck galaxies at people like it ain't no thang. That's enough to kill every last character in the YYHverse with one attack.
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Currently playing: League of Legends, Chrono Cross. Current Projects: Fool's Overture, CYOA: http://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/8-gamefaqs-contests/60143513
I have to say that I don't think Anti-Spiral would summon Grand Zamboa against a person-sized opponent, but he's still got reality-warping powers. Anti-Spiral wins easily.
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"As the size of an explosion increases, the number of social situations it is incapable of solving approaches zero." -Vaarsuvius, Order of the Stick
Actually, Anti-Spiral's basically got an inverse version of the Sinning Tree, so that's a bit interesting. I'm curious, how susceptible would Kurama be to that labyrinth?
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"As the size of an explosion increases, the number of social situations it is incapable of solving approaches zero." -Vaarsuvius, Order of the Stick
Also, refresh my memory: Simon and friends got freed from the mind-maze thing due to the "spirit of Kamina," right? What exactly happened there? Was it actually Kamina's soul?
not entirely explained, but the general way the whole thing ran down was simon understanding that things were wrong. after he broke out, everyone else gradually broke out too as they resonated with each other/ALSO understood that things just weren't right. it honestly sucks for a mental trick, and he doesn't even DO anything while you're in it but stand around and gloat going 'OH HO HO LOOK AT YOU TRAAAPPPED' instead of, y'know, killing the guys. 'cause he's mostly a dick that likes to be just that 0.1% better than you.
At his best Anti Spiral
would never show up here because he doesn't work that way. AS likes to fight at his opponent's level. that's his MO through the entire series, and he even states that much. AS is literally the character for every '___ finds a way!' character because that's really how you get to beating him. not through raw power, but by outsmarting him. and he can be pretty goddamn dumb. to beat him you do not need to be that high on the power chain.
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The future must protect the clone's past. "Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.
I'm debating it because I don't remember how Anti-Spiral fights. He's got a lot of tricks at his disposal, and he uses a bunch of them during his fight in TTGL, but I don't know which one he's most likely to bust out first. Did he opt for the large-scale galaxy chucking super mecha fight against TTGL because he wanted to match their abilities, or is that just how he operates? If the latter, then yeah, Kurama's boned, but if the former, then we have a more interesting scenario.
ah ok
Anti Spiral basically works like this
First off he probably wouldn't bother to get involved he will just sit back in his home area and send mugann at the enemy first.
AS: Oh they took those mugann out? Mmmk time to up them up a notch (sends bigger mugann)
AS: They managed to beat them? Hmmk (ups them again to higher tier)
AS: **** really? Now they are making their way to me? Ok (sends casual planet throwing mugann at them)
AS: Oh FFS (sends one more higher tier)
AS: Ok thats it (pops in) Reality warp hax mother ****er (whips out the trap)
AS: .....seriously I MEAN SERIOUSLY ok now I am getting involved. Im putting myself on your level just to ****ing inflict total despair on your ass cause you are losing to someone on YOUR LEVEL literally.
Thats AS thing he wants to inflict total and utter despair on the opponent. General hopelessness etc. Thats his strat and way.
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XBL GT: Demon Ninja X2 "There comes a time in every man's or woman's life where they have to make **** up to cover their ass." - Hazama
Did he opt for the large-scale galaxy chucking super mecha fight against TTGL because he wanted to match their abilities, or is that just how he operates? If the latter, then yeah, Kurama's boned, but if the former, then we have a more interesting scenario.
the former. goes with his whole despair style. he likes it when the opponent thinks they know they can win, which means the opponent needs to be, at some capacity or another, able to win. the catch of course comes in that you can't really go around beating him down because then he'll just power up and you're screwed.
but if you have some way to disable him, like say, Kurama's sinning tree, then it's more interesting. how well that'd work (since it's more of a mental attack than anything else after all) isn't known i think, though his crappier mental attack seems to work just fine on everyone else in the series. at the least the sinning tree manages to fool a telepath completely, which... honestly gives it more credibility than AS' laberynth.
but Kurama'd definitely get a chance to pull it off because AS would want the guy to give up. he's a dick. like i said, he's more prone to playing a word game with someone like Kurama because if you really wanna make the guy give up, you pretty much gotta break his mind.
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The future must protect the clone's past. "Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.
From: todbot1 | #027 What's this "sit back in his home area and spam Muganns" thing? Doesn't leaving the arena count as a loss?
Not if you have ability to return to it. Forceful ejection with no means of return counts as a ringout. Shifting to a different galaxy, quadrant of the universe, or even dimension isn't a problem so long as you can still affect your foe.
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Currently playing: League of Legends, Chrono Cross. Current Projects: Fool's Overture, CYOA: http://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/8-gamefaqs-contests/60143513
not entirely explained, but the general way the whole thing ran down was simon understanding that things were wrong. after he broke out, everyone else gradually broke out too as they resonated with each other/ALSO understood that things just weren't right. it honestly sucks for a mental trick, and he doesn't even DO anything while you're in it but stand around and gloat going 'OH HO HO LOOK AT YOU TRAAAPPPED' instead of, y'know, killing the guys. 'cause he's mostly a dick that likes to be just that 0.1% better than you.
You forget though Anti Spiral did teleport in (since everyone save the mole) were trapped in the reality hax. He was going to finger beam nuke everyone but the mole spiral powered him out. So no AS is not an idiot.
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XBL GT: Demon Ninja X2 "There comes a time in every man's or woman's life where they have to make **** up to cover their ass." - Hazama
KanzarisKelshen posted... From: todbot1 | #027 What's this "sit back in his home area and spam Muganns" thing? Doesn't leaving the arena count as a loss? Not if you have ability to return to it. Forceful ejection with no means of return counts as a ringout. Shifting to a different galaxy, quadrant of the universe, or even dimension isn't a problem so long as you can still affect your foe.
I don't like this rule. This is a stupid rule for teleporters.
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"As the size of an explosion increases, the number of social situations it is incapable of solving approaches zero." -Vaarsuvius, Order of the Stick
the former. goes with his whole despair style. he likes it when the opponent thinks they know they can win, which means the opponent needs to be, at some capacity or another, able to win.
Not really. Its more of hey it looks like you have a chance but really your just gonna get beasted. deal hence the "Despair" deal.
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XBL GT: Demon Ninja X2 "There comes a time in every man's or woman's life where they have to make **** up to cover their ass." - Hazama
From: Sceptilesolarbeam | #031 KanzarisKelshen posted... From: todbot1 | #027 What's this "sit back in his home area and spam Muganns" thing? Doesn't leaving the arena count as a loss? Not if you have ability to return to it. Forceful ejection with no means of return counts as a ringout. Shifting to a different galaxy, quadrant of the universe, or even dimension isn't a problem so long as you can still affect your foe.
I don't like this rule. This is a stupid rule for teleporters.
It's a logical rule. This isn't SSB and there's no "get *this* far away and lose" clause. You only lose to getting chucked elsewhere if it takes you too long to return to the fight. If you can still affect the fight in any meaningful way from far away doing that is allowed. It doesn't make sense to force a character with world-wide teleportation to fight in melee range if he doesn't feel like it, now does it?
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Currently playing: League of Legends, Chrono Cross. Current Projects: Fool's Overture, CYOA: http://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/8-gamefaqs-contests/60143513
it's something that really wouldn't come to play here because 1, AS is fighting, not empty robots that he'd have no reason to send as 2, he'd have no reason to do that since he isn't trying to keep the universe in check.
but for an idea as to how dumb he is, he was perfectly fine with letting his main enemy (those with spiral energy, especially those from earth) still living, he got fooled by their original mechs having anti-anti-spiral technology (and these things were not new), and living underground to stay away from his 'watchful eye' was okay enough to plan and plot whatever you really wanted (or a lab). like even the counter towards when he re-invaded earth was one of the population growing too big.
Not if you have ability to return to it.
disagreed with this. though it doesn't play... at all to this fight really.
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The future must protect the clone's past. "Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.
From: Wanglicious | #034 it's something that really wouldn't come to play here because 1, AS is fighting, not empty robots that he'd have no reason to send as 2, he'd have no reason to do that since he isn't trying to keep the universe in check.
but for an idea as to how dumb he is, he was perfectly fine with letting his main enemy (those with spiral energy, especially those from earth) still living, he got fooled by their original mechs having anti-anti-spiral technology (and these things were not new), and living underground to stay away from his 'watchful eye' was okay enough to plan and plot whatever you really wanted (or a lab). like even the counter towards when he re-invaded earth was one of the population growing too big.
Not if you have ability to return to it.
disagreed with this. though it doesn't play... at all to this fight really.
So you're saying that if a teleporter chucks Thor to a place 300k kilometers away he loses, in spite of going at twice the speed of light or faster. 'ok'
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...you seriously can't be arguing that a guy who literally left everyone standing around like morons as he cackled, despite knowing fully well after multiple occasions of them growing above their level, as anything but a moron. he let the people of earth live, grow, and continue to get better even with him directly in front of them. hell, the last fight he had was a fist fight against Simon.
he's a grade A idiot that dicks with his opponents at the level they're at. he aims for 'just a bit above', and a billion characters like to prove 'hey wait i did that.' Kurama included considering by the end of the series, that's pretty much what his Yoko Kurama form actually was. >_>;
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The future must protect the clone's past. "Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.
...you seriously can't be arguing that a guy who literally left everyone standing around like morons as he cackled, despite knowing fully well after multiple occasions of them growing above their level, as anything but a moron. he let the people of earth live, grow, and continue to get better even with him directly in front of them. hell, the last fight he had was a fist fight against Simon.
AS already stompd the spiral race once and they surrendered. He said cool but keep your asses in check ok? If you guys cross the line I have the moon fall on your asses so you DON'T get out of control capiche?
Second when he fist fought simon simon was basically god mode level
You act like AS is an idiot but your wrong. He had contingency plan after contingency plan to make sure they wouldn't get to that point. Simon is just spiral mode god and just said "screw your hax"
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XBL GT: Demon Ninja X2 "There comes a time in every man's or woman's life where they have to make **** up to cover their ass." - Hazama
From: Wanglicious | #038 ...never said that either and not sure how you got that.
You quoted my comment about not losing the fight if you have the ability to return to it and said you disagreed with it. I posited an example of a character being sent away from his opponent while still having the ability to return to the battlefield. How is the first part different from the second part? I'm not advocating letting a character return to the fight an hour later if he could do it 'eventually'. I'm talking about letting characters with absurd range snipe their opponents, and characters with massive speed being capable of returning to a fight as long as it happens really, really fast.
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Currently playing: League of Legends, Chrono Cross. Current Projects: Fool's Overture, CYOA: http://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/8-gamefaqs-contests/60143513
It's a logical rule. This isn't SSB and there's no "get *this* far away and lose" clause. You only lose to getting chucked elsewhere if it takes you too long to return to the fight. If you can still affect the fight in any meaningful way from far away doing that is allowed. It doesn't make sense to force a character with world-wide teleportation to fight in melee range if he doesn't feel like it, now does it?
Yes, it does, because it keeps matches constrained to the zone you specified. Why specify a neutral terrain if one of the characters can pop back to his base and change the dynamic of the fight freely?
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"As the size of an explosion increases, the number of social situations it is incapable of solving approaches zero." -Vaarsuvius, Order of the Stick
...Simon was, quite literally, in his human body when he fought. against AS in, you guessed it, a humanoid body. there was nothing godly about that fight. that was the entire point towards that dramatic finish - they left all the god stuff already and were just gonna punch each other a lot.
the only rule he had against earth was that they didn't breed until X number. there's a reason Genome managed to make a bunch of mechs, an escape plan, etc. yes, that is stupidity. leaving enemies that waged war on you to live - not because you're a good guy who shows mercy (which is dumb but at least an semi-understandable trait) - but because you felt like it is dumb. his 'contingency plans' were beaten down by brute force, which is the only thing he ever showed to be good at. damn well wasn't his brain that was ever good.
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The future must protect the clone's past. "Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.
From: Sceptilesolarbeam | #041 Yes, it does, because it keeps matches constrained to the zone you specified. Why specify a neutral terrain if one of the characters can pop back to his base and change the dynamic of the fight freely?
Their base doesn't exist in the neutral universe. The idea is if a character can warp away and spam attacks from way outside of their opponent's range, they don't lose just because they're far away. Now if they were trying to escape the fight then yeah, that'd likely be a surrender right there >_>
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MMBN style fighting game made by me in the link below! http://sandbox.yoyogames.com/games/184947-b8bn
From: Sceptilesolarbeam | #041 It's a logical rule. This isn't SSB and there's no "get *this* far away and lose" clause. You only lose to getting chucked elsewhere if it takes you too long to return to the fight. If you can still affect the fight in any meaningful way from far away doing that is allowed. It doesn't make sense to force a character with world-wide teleportation to fight in melee range if he doesn't feel like it, now does it?
Yes, it does, because it keeps matches constrained to the zone you specified. Why specify a neutral terrain if one of the characters can pop back to his base and change the dynamic of the fight freely?
Because the base doesn't exist unless that's your interpretation of neutral. Lemme use four examples to clear things up.
A) Supersonic character gets teleported to another galaxy. He loses because even if he has space travel it will take him an eternity to get back to the fight.
B) Teleporting character with universe-wide attacks teleports to another galaxy. He doesn't lose because he can still attack his enemy.
C) Massively FTL bruiser is chucked to another galaxy. If he is FTL enough he may continue fighting because he returns quickly enough to the fray.
D) Character capable of dimension hopping steps into another dimension. If he can still attack his opponent from that dimension or *immediately* returns to the normal dimension, he can continue fighting. If he decides to chill in his dimension for an hour or two he loses.
Does this clear things up a little?
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...Simon was, quite literally, in his human body when he fought. against AS in, you guessed it, a humanoid body. there was nothing godly about that fight. that was the entire point towards that dramatic finish - they left all the god stuff already and were just gonna punch each other a lot.
Simon's spiral power is further emphasized, showing him surpassing the power level that the Super Tengen Toppa was previously at using only the smallest and weakest form of the Gurren Lagann. After the Anti-Spiral shatters the Super Tengen Toppa's Giga Drill, the latter is forced to downgrade to the smallest form of the Gurren Lagann; despite the infinitesimally smaller mecha, Simon manages to summon enough spiral power to destroy the Anti-Spiral's Giga Drill. Simon then matches that same power level without any mecha at all.
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XBL GT: Demon Ninja X2 "There comes a time in every man's or woman's life where they have to make **** up to cover their ass." - Hazama
So then, is the rule that even for dimensional hoppers and the like, the whole of reality that they can access is all neutral ground?
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"As the size of an explosion increases, the number of social situations it is incapable of solving approaches zero." -Vaarsuvius, Order of the Stick
your statement's dead wrong and your example doesn't really work with it. trying to remove an enemy might work and it might not, depends on how good they are at it, where to, and the parties in question. but 'it's okay to leave as long as you can come back' is dead, dead wrong. it's entirely possible to willingly leave the fight. retreat's a loss, and it doesn't matter if you can come back. what counts as a retreat or not is up to each individual person, not a rule, and explaining that the leaving was not them actually leaving but something something else is up to those arguing there.
but again. that's nothing to do with this fight really.
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The future must protect the clone's past. "Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.
....man, whoever wrote that really sucked at seeing the show/movie they were watching if that's all they got. though you're just as bad as you're taking the run for the cockpit scene as if that means he punches people in the face like that when it really obviously isn't the case.
and stronger hobos have existed.
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The future must protect the clone's past. "Maybe it's a tentacle, molesting the planet itself. - Aschen Brodel.
From: Sceptilesolarbeam | #047 So then, is the rule that even for dimensional hoppers and the like, the whole of reality that they can access is all neutral ground?
Yes, but again, keep in mind that they must be able to affect their opponent or return quickly to the fight.
From: Wanglicious | #048 your statement's dead wrong and your example doesn't really work with it. trying to remove an enemy might work and it might not, depends on how good they are at it, where to, and the parties in question. but 'it's okay to leave as long as you can come back' is dead, dead wrong. it's entirely possible to willingly leave the fight. retreat's a loss, and it doesn't matter if you can come back. what counts as a retreat or not is up to each individual person, not a rule, and explaining that the leaving was not them actually leaving but something something else is up to those arguing there.
but again. that's nothing to do with this fight really.
Dodging a bullet by dimensionhopping isn't a retreat. Going into another dimension and hitting your enemy with mindrapes from there is also not a retreat. The fight is still on, one of the characters is just unable to hit the other. It's just as you said, except you're trying to restrict power applications while I am not. If you can get out of range and still fight, you're cool.
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