I don't consider it the worst case in the series because there are 2 that make me wish I'd skipped them, which is pretty much what 1-1 is! Some people consider 2-1 as bad as 1-1 but longer, so the badness takes more time. I put 2-1 ahead myself, but can definitely see that line of thinking. 1-1 does have some of the better "Phoenix is stupid" moments too though - Cinder Block, anyone?
Damn, this topic is making me want to do a character ranking list so bad.
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I think 2-1 is WAY better than 1-1. It's just a more solid case all around and the ending is really brilliant. It's still kind of a short, unmemorable tutorial case, sure, but I think 2-1 is more solid.
I think PW2 is honestly really close to the other games in the trilogy in terms of quality. PW1 and PW3 probably only beat it out for me because they have five cases each and PW2 has four. 2-2 is a really great and really underrated case, and 2-3 isn't as bad as everyone says it is.
2-1 was horrible. the beginning was silly and the final twist about the cell phone was the only redeeming feature. maggey (ie?) is among the worst defendants in any of the three PW games. her existence and badness were pretty much indefensible. and the villain with a stupid amnesia sideplot just so we could go through a tutorial... no thanks.
2-2 is a solid case, but both it and 2-3 feel somewhat derivative and formulaic. they're not the first to do anything except introduce the magatama, which felt like it was really best used in 2-4. (i actually don't much like the mechanics of it, thinking back.) for comparison, 1-3 was the first three-day case and it featured DAT FACE TURN by edgeworth - i don't think anything as lasting from the case itself came out of 2-2 or 2-3. we got pearl and we got franziska, but it just doesn't really compare. morgan was a charisma vacuum as well, and she dominated the screen far more than say dee vazquez (another fairly colorless villain) did.
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2-1 is mainly worse because it was so much longer, with a plot that was no more intricate than 1-1's. In fact, it was mostly the same as 1-1's! It just felt dragged out as a result. Some nice moments, and a pretty fun villain, but it as just dull because it took so long while being less interesting overall.
Now, 1-1 may be simple, but it was an incredibly engaging, well paced introduction that drew you into the game very well. It being so short may have limited what it could do, but it used all that time effectively to tell a simple but interesting story, and an excellent introduction overall. It is still one of the weakest cases, probably second weakest, but I couldn't have asked for a better introduction to the series.
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I'm always surprised that so many people think that 3-5 is great. I would rank 3-4 or 3-2 over it anyday (3-2 so good). I won't go into the details because of spoilers, but 3-5 was one of the most boring finales for me, and it felt very contrived. Too much fanservice and a very unsatisfying conclusion.
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I just replayed 2-2 a few days ago, so this seems like as good a place as any to weigh in.
2-2 seems like it was a very difficult case for the developers to write. You have to re-introduce Maya, as well as bring in Pearls and Franziska. There's a lot of stuff going on at once and as such it feels a bit cramped to me and unbelievable. I've replayed this case numerous times, and I still can't see any reason why Phoenix should win this case. I mean, Phoenix's best defense the entire time is "hey there's a hole... eight inches off the ground in the folding screen!" and "look, here's another hole... eight inches off the ground... in the clothing box!" No effort is really made to have to prove that it's been made by a gunshot or that the two holes are related in anyway... it just is.
And then there's Ini/Mimi Miney. All she has to do to get away with the murder is just. Shut. Up. I'm aware this is basically true in every AA case ever, but I don't know, here it just seems really strange. Why are you even testifying about how much your sister likes sports cars? So Phoenix proves you were lying about having a license picture. All you have to do is say you had your picture taken but weren't able to drive yet. And when Phoenix actually does reveal the twist, like, why doesn't she, like deny it? Or something?
2-2 isn't bad - it's actually a pretty good idea for a case that's just implemented sort of poorly. I guess what I mean to say is that Phoenix's defenses seem really weak in the case, and Franziska / the game just lets it slide since it's only 2-2 and they can't really figure out how else to let you win. It probably needed to be a three-day case.
Yeah, I don't get how people don't really consider 1-1 the worst case in the series, objectively speaking. You can beat it in 20 minutes, and it has one good moment: The toupee toss. Granted, the toupee toss is legendary, but other than that, the case is dull.
"Mr. Butz. Is it not true that the victim had recently dumped you?" "I wasn't dumped! She just wasn't taking my phone calls. Or seeing me... Ever." "Mr. Butz, what you describe is generally what we mean by 'dumped.'"
"I'm guilty! Tell them I'm guilty!"
Larry Butz in general. Yeah, I'm not seeing this "1-1 is bottom tier thing". Then again I think it's pretty ridiculous to rate cases on length! Obviously length limits how good a case can be but it also limits how bad a case can be. 1-1 effectively introduces the world and the legal system (which is incredibly important because it's a weird legal system and if you tried to introduce it in the middle of an epic case it would feel contrived and stupid like... say, 1-5's evidence law nonsense). I actually don't think they could have written it much better than they did.
When you compare that to the disastrous later Apollo Justice cases? Yeah, 1-1 comes out ahead. Easily.
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I dunno. I think a lot of 1-1's weakness comes from cross-examinations. Most presses yield absolutely nothing than a repetition of the facts, which is pretty disappointing.
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i don't think anything as lasting from the case itself came out of 2-2 or 2-3.
Wait, what.
2-2 is a really important case when you consider the entire series. 2-3 is kind of throwaway, but then again, which X-3 case ISN'T throwaway? At the very least, 2-3 helps tie in the theme of PW2, which is the whole sympathetic murders thing. The whole thing about Dr. Grey being a jerk while Miney killing him for ruining her life was bad enough, but 2-3 just kind of blows that out of the water with the whole Acro/Regina thing.
Now, 1-1 may be simple, but it was an incredibly engaging, well paced introduction that drew you into the game very well.
I agree.
But I also think almost every single PW case did the exact same thing, too with the exception of a certain AJ case. I think 1-1 is a solid introduction. The only thing I would improve is the pressing and the writing. 1-1's writing just felt really off, after playing through the entire series. I think 2-1 just flowed a lot better and was more enjoyable.
Larry Butz in general. Yeah, I'm not seeing this "1-1 is bottom tier thing".
Larry Butz is completely amazing. It's not so much 1-1 is bottom tier as it is 1-1 isn't as good as every other case.
Can we all agree that the monstrosity that is 4-3 is by far the worst case?
If we count 4-0, I think there would be no doubts that would be the worst case, by far. I actually kind of like 4-3, but it's definitely Bottom 3.
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4-3 was okay. I mean, still one of the weakest cases but it had a lot to like. I don't really get the hate. I mean, yeah, I suppose it would be bottom 3 with 2-1 and 1-1 (maybe interchangeable with 2-3) but I still liked it.
Actually, 2-1 is the only case I flat-out dislike!
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I would say I legitimately like every Phoenix Wright case.
I don't outright hate 4-3, but it has so many logic problems that aren't even addressed in the case, and it's frustrating. Plus, it highlights one of the most annoying Klavier traits throughout.
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I think it might be unpopular to go this far, but 4-2, 4-3, and 4-4 are my three least favorite cases in the entire series, in no particular order. Even 1-1 and 2-1 get ranked above them. The only case from AJ I consider to be good is 4-1, and even it is overrated.
on the case of 2-2 (which I liked a lot by the way)
Was it just me or did that thing with the Key not really make any sense?
Like Phoenix says "well there's no way I could have this key yet I do therefore Maya left the room at some point since Pearl had it"
but when they found who they thought was Maya, the assumption wouldve been that person had the key on them... so why couldnt it leave the room then? Like, Pearls gives it to Phoenix after 'Maya' was 'taken care of' by Morgan. So anything is fair game to what happens to the key at that point, no?
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Well, the point is that there was absolutely no way Phoenix should have the key. Whether she left the room is irrelevant because she didn't have the opportunity to change clothes or do anything of the sort before she was arrested. The police SHOULD have found the key on her person during a search, or Morgan should have had it.
The fact that they didn't meant something was up. Phoenix hazarded a guess as to what it could have meant. He wasn't correct, obviously, but the fact that he was the one who found the key meant that the case warranted further investigation, and it bought him another day.
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