Board 8 > [MPFC] Most Powerful Fictional Character: Doom vs. Vin!

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1. No alt voting
2. Matches will last exactly 24 hours. If someone goes up 15 on their opponent and discussion is clearly over, the match might end early.
3. Be honest with your vote. I can't hold anyone to this, but just pick who you think will win the match regardless of other circumstances.
4. Feel free to debate how much and how ever you like.
5. Don't have fun, fun is your enemy.
6. Bold your vote!

Last Match: Cable beat Godzilla senseless.

Mistborn and Marvel spoilers in this topic!

Vin is the main character of the Mistborn trilogy, as well as a Mistborn herself. Mistborn are people who have control of the Allomantic metals. I think the Wiki says it best:


Vin is a Mistborn of great power and skill. She can pierce Copperclouds through usage of the earring she got from her mother, which Hemalurgically increases her abilities to sense other Allomancers. She has great skill with most other metals, and can make use of Duralumin to control Koloss, Kandra, and potentially Steel Inquisitors, although due to Ruin's influence this is never possible. As Preservation's chosen successor,she can draw power from the Mists, and used this ability to kill the Lord Ruler and defeat thirteen Inquisitors at the same time. She can push and pull on metals, and Soothe and Riot with a high degree of power. She has great control of Ironpulls and Steelpushes, using horseshoes to fly forward indefinitely. She can defeat Ham, a trained Thug, using only pewter and is able to win many fights in this manner.

In addition to her Allomantic abilities, Vin posseses great resourcefulness and cunning, attributes gained from her time on the streets of Luthadel. She has a strong sense for danger, and is able to read a battle situation quickly, such as when she defeated Cett's assasins.

VERSUS.

Doctor Doom is one of the major antagonists of the Marvel universe, and the primary foe of the Fantastic Four. Doom's fighting ability is a mixture of the magical, the technological, and using his keen mind to outthink his opponents at any cost. His suit includes several different gadgets that he himself created for use against the Fantastic Four and others including weaponry, scanners, and items for other purposes. Throughout the years Doom has only added to his powers over the mystical, now becoming so great a threat that he poses a threat to even Dr. Strange. His mind may very well be his greatest weapon though, as he is a genius in in physics, robotics, cybernetics, genetics, weapons technology, bio-chemistry, and time travel. His suit allows him to boast superhuman strength and endurance, as well as coming with its own built in force field.

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Ngirl is a toll bridge - Wigs
Gotta pay if you want to come inside! - Ngirl

I wonder which of Doom's suits would be considered more powerful. His normal one, or the girlfriend skin suit?

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We are thought, and reality, and concept, and the unimaginable

oh hey, vin there.

okay so where'd the mistborn guys go. there were a lot of things that could be done regarding metals from what i remember, including one that basically doubled as a high level precog. i remember some others could be used as buffs, but... don't remember what else specifically was doable.

would assume doom's a higher level being than her, but he is in a suit of metal so...

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The King Wang.
Listen up Urinal Cake. I already have something that tells me if I'm too drunk when I pee on it: My friends. - Colbert.

Gut feeling is that Doom is probably well since prepared for that kind of thing, having to live on the same planet as Magneto. Assuming the titanium suit is the one he's wearing

It's also enchanted by the Tibet monks that made it, if that makes any difference

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We are thought, and reality, and concept, and the unimaginable

Mean, considering Maggy is the guy who can molecularly destabilize frigging Adamantium, if he feels like it. Yeah

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We are thought, and reality, and concept, and the unimaginable

i'm pretty sure their control of metal isn't magnetic though. entirely different usage between the two as well. but i've never read the books, so yeah, one of the book guys would be good right about now. wylvane, brett, or the slew of others who were intimately familiar with that series could prob shed some light.

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The King Wang.
Listen up Urinal Cake. I already have something that tells me if I'm too drunk when I pee on it: My friends. - Colbert.

<_<; and let's also not forget that really if magneto wanted to beat doom.... he would. so even on that angle it's not the best comparison to take. just sayin', it's an entirely different powerset being used; magneto's not somehow using a metal to go from slightly superhuman to easy army killer or something. wouldn't doubt doom being a higher level than her really, but it's a pretty big trump she's got against him there.

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The King Wang.
Listen up Urinal Cake. I already have something that tells me if I'm too drunk when I pee on it: My friends. - Colbert.

Not really. Doom has a mutant nullifier he totes around in his gauntlets. Unless Maggy got on the drop on him, he'd...just kind of die >_>

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We are thought, and reality, and concept, and the unimaginable

Honestly, I'm not really sure what Doom's standard armor is even made of, nowadays. It was originally titanium, but we know he's messed with it since then to make it non-magnetic (hi Maggy), so who knows

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We are thought, and reality, and concept, and the unimaginable

distinctly remembering the idea that having metal on you while facing them was a bad idea. any idea why?

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The King Wang.
Listen up Urinal Cake. I already have something that tells me if I'm too drunk when I pee on it: My friends. - Colbert.

They don't really 'control' metal. Instead, they ingest it (in a diluted, liquified form) and they are able to "burn" (read: magically deplete it) in order to cause certain effects such as enhanced senses, superhuman speed and endurance (running as fast as a horse for hours on end, for instance) and durability and strength, hide their usage of Allomancy (the name of the magic being used) or detect others using it, augmenting the effects of other metals when burned in conjunction, and a form of limited precog (seeing a few seconds into the future), though that ability is greatly limited in duration in a normal fight. They are also able to burn metal to push or pull and can use it to leap great heights by pushing off a coin or to use the coin itself as a powerful, bullet-like projectile. And they can burn metals which can allow them to influence the emotions of those around them by either dampening certain emotions or inflaming others.

From what I know of Doom, I think it sounds like a stomp in his favor


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"Luxe, calme et volupte." - Charles Baudelaire, The Invitation to the Voyage

distinctly remembering the idea that having metal on you while facing them was a bad idea. any idea why?

The major issue would be that if you have metal on you, a Mistborn (like Vin) could manipulate it (e.g. pull you towards her, yank it away from you, push you away, etc.). A normal person who has a knife in their hand would just be asking to get it shoved in their face, essentially. There are some rules to the manipulation of metal on a person, though. For instance, it isn't possible in most circumstances to manipulate metal that has been ingested or is inside someone in another way (for instance, a piercing) except in certain circumstances that I think for the purposes of one of these fights would be considered unrepeatable.


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"Luxe, calme et volupte." - Charles Baudelaire, The Invitation to the Voyage

a suit of armor isn't ingested or inside though. like if this was iron man that'd make sense - his armor quite literally comes from out of his body, but doom's is put on and can be taken off. like wouldn't she be able to crush him if she wanted to? would just be pushing the metal from the outside parts inwards (e.g., front and back part of an arm into each other).

granted, if she'd do it is another story, but still. don't know what her regular 'armament' is either. the precog at least sounded really nice last time around.

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The King Wang.
Listen up Urinal Cake. I already have something that tells me if I'm too drunk when I pee on it: My friends. - Colbert.

She's killed quite a few people.

However, seeing as how the ability is basically magic, wouldn't Doom have some silly broken armor-related ability that would nullify it or somesuch thing?


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"Luxe, calme et volupte." - Charles Baudelaire, The Invitation to the Voyage

Well, he's the second best wizard on Earth. The first best being Dr. Strange

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We are thought, and reality, and concept, and the unimaginable

I like Vin and everything, but she is completely outclassed in every way except acrobatics and stealth.


Doom

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Not changing this sig until I decide to change this sig.
Started: July 6, 2005

He also has that super cheap "If I'm in a real bind, I make eye contact with you, my spirit leaves my body and takes over yours" trick

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We are thought, and reality, and concept, and the unimaginable

Granted, that's a very *last* resort move. He doesn't like using it, since he's Doom and thinks the body he has is superior to any he could steal. But it's there

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We are thought, and reality, and concept, and the unimaginable

I'm guessing Vin doesn't get her uberpowers when she is half of God?

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Congratulations to SuperNiceDog, Guru Winner, who was smart enough to pick
your 7 time champion, Link.

that's also the main shot she has to win though. doom is arrogant as all hell. he can be the 2nd best mage but he damn sure doesn't use his magic until his tech fails on him or until he's in a situation where he needs to, which half the time is already too late. doom's all about his tech as point 1, and if that fails he moves on to point 2.


also i'm pretty sure doom's gone down the power rankings mage-wise. at one point he was the 2nd best, but he definitely isn't anymore. but as for super broken stuff relating to armor and magic? i... can't think of any.

like i'm remembering dark avengers and one of his main mage enemies poof'd him with magic. and he was pretty familiar with her too, so if he could he probably would've had something there. the man protects his armor from the undead even, so it's not like he hasn't protected worse.

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The King Wang.
Listen up Urinal Cake. I already have something that tells me if I'm too drunk when I pee on it: My friends. - Colbert.

though with that said mind you, doom if faced with magic would be likely to respond in kind, but that'd happen only after he's hit with something obviously. there's the matter of force fields too, not sure if that'd affect anything. not sure how her powers are 'magic' either. mainly 'cause i don't know her powers exactly.

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The King Wang.
Listen up Urinal Cake. I already have something that tells me if I'm too drunk when I pee on it: My friends. - Colbert.

Worse than that, he apparently used his time machine to go back in time, grab some of Jesus's cross and stick that in his armor. *That* is how he's protected from the undead

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We are thought, and reality, and concept, and the unimaginable

As far as magic goes, Strange actually said at one point that Doom is *better* at it than he is. The only reason he isn't the best mage ever is that, as said, he likes his tech too much. But yeah, he ain't lacking for magic power

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We are thought, and reality, and concept, and the unimaginable

Anyway, Doom. It does not seem like Vin can one-shot him, and she'll only get one chance before he adjusts and fries her

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We are thought, and reality, and concept, and the unimaginable

Why has there been no mention of Vin's most powerful ability, the prescience she gains from burning Atium?

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SuperNiceDog is about 20% cooler then the other gurus.

is that the precog thing?
kinda has been a lack of data more than anything else right now. if you've got some feats, know her capabilities, and/or what she normally has on her/does it'd be helpful. she's been in all of 1 of these before against agent smith last year, which was interesting. mistborn seemed like a unique universe that had a lot of cool stuff in it, but that's been her entire exposure in these runs.

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The King Wang.
Listen up Urinal Cake. I already have something that tells me if I'm too drunk when I pee on it: My friends. - Colbert.

That's a good point, I forgot about atium.

I've only read the first book, but I recall it being explained, essentially, as atium meaning you can predict anything and thus become effectively immune to attack for as long as you have some because you can just move. In addition, the only counter is using atium yourself, or you'll just be attacked by someone who can predict your dodges.

So... could Vin kill Doom in the time it takes her atium to diminish? I don't think she carries as much of it as the regular metals.

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Not changing this sig until I decide to change this sig.
Started: July 6, 2005

When she is burning Atium, she sees what they are going to do in the extremely near future - next few seconds - while still being able to see what they are doing in the present. And the actions of the visions will change as the situation changes / as the person being looked at changes his or her actions. It's very battle-centric, works-in-real-time sort of ability.

The main problem is duration; she would probably have like a minute tops (which even then is a massive, essentially insurmountable advantage in her universe) at the very most, and would probably have more like 20 - 30 seconds worth.


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"Luxe, calme et volupte." - Charles Baudelaire, The Invitation to the Voyage

i think vin also beat someone with it, so you aren't unbeatable in it. but i don't remember the circumstances, just that they were very unusual and not the most reproducable thing in the world. doom isn't the fastest guy in the world (he can reach high speeds sure, but his combat speed isn't the same to match it).

but yeah, that's what i think that metal was. was thinking atrium or something to that spelling so that'd work. precog to the point where you would know everything seconds before it happens, a major speed boost too i think? main thing i remember that turned them into army killers at least.


overpowering doom though, straight up? i.... don't think that's the easiest thign considering her universe's generally low power and while doom isn't crazy high he's got a lot of tricks, his force fields are solid, and can blast people to high hell. you don't exactly take on the fantastic four and be a jobber - between the Thing and Sue you've got a lot of power needed, and ways to get around both direct and indirect combat.

but he's a dude in metal. figure, counts for something. don't know the rest of her tools, so yeah. data necessary.

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The King Wang.
Listen up Urinal Cake. I already have something that tells me if I'm too drunk when I pee on it: My friends. - Colbert.

whoo?

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The King Wang.
Listen up Urinal Cake. I already have something that tells me if I'm too drunk when I pee on it: My friends. - Colbert.

As resident Magneto fanboy I know that Victor is essentially 1-1 in his encounters with Magneto. Magnus may not manipulate metal the same way Vin does, but he does it exponentially better. So splitting the career series with Erik is enough justification for me to put DoomIS winning. The only way Vin would ever beat Magneto is if he died laughing from someone trying to manipulate metal against him.

Even if it's argued that Vin is magical while Mags is straight electromagnetism, Doom's magic is crazy. Strange himself has said he could be the Sorcerer Supreme if he weren't so damn evil.

--
The King of GameFAQs Brawl posting from his phone.
http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/board8/images/8/8b/ViviffChampS1.jpg

up

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"intention doesn't matter? clearly your cashier degree did not require a law course." - ND to Joyrock on the legality of drinking a soda before paying

That... Doesn't make sense. 'these two people manipulate metals in completely different ways and this guy has been able to beat one (not really true) therefore I will compare them to each other instead of the actual opponent in question, even though the guy is intimately familiar with the guy he 'beat' and is a plan whore. "

seriously, what. Different powers, situation, level of power, and especially knowledge play a pretty big difference there. He would treat them completely different and they ARE different. That's just all around bad.

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The King Wang.
Listen up Urinal Cake. I already have something that tells me if I'm too drunk when I pee on it: My friends. - Colbert.

Oh, and to clarify there, it's less a matter of doom beating maggy, but the circumstances with his wins. Always with prep, which isn't unsurprising because maggy is way more powerful. Prep, a lot of detailed information, knowledge, and things designed specifically against maggy and other mutants. Or just maggy. He knows that he can't be as he normally behaves with the guy and is always at the ready for him, losing tends to mean maggy just outsmarted him before overpowering. Most if not all the stuff wouldn't be applicable here due to the different powers. Entirety different behavior too. While he'll go for magic quickly against maggy, he won't to damn near anyone else. Just really bad comparison for a slew of reasons.

Without prep doom has lost to guys like spiderman even, though that isn't the norm. It's not unheard of him losing to the b class guys though, simply because of the difference between them not making him bust out the good stuff quick enough. And the lack of prep or knowledge plays a big role. He plays better if his opponent is better and he knows it. If he doesn't, or they aren't obvious enough with it? Different story.

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The King Wang.
Listen up Urinal Cake. I already have something that tells me if I'm too drunk when I pee on it: My friends. - Colbert.

Kinglicious posted...
Without prep doom has lost to guys like spiderman even

Merely a Doombot.

--
Not changing this sig until I decide to change this sig.
Started: July 6, 2005

Yeah, prep makes Doom nigh invincible, and poor writing/necessity makes him job to dumb people. Peak Doom doesn't job to any Spiderman. I guess if you want another argument, i can think of multiple ways Doom wins, and none for Vin. Hell, being on Mags' level is justIfication enough. Vin is simply outclassed by the good doctor.

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The King of GameFAQs Brawl posting from his phone.
http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/board8/images/8/8b/ViviffChampS1.jpg

It's his character, not poor writing, for his losses there. But doom isn't close maggy, he's just good at cheating those higher than him. And vin has the problem of not knowing her or her feats.

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The King Wang.
Listen up Urinal Cake. I already have something that tells me if I'm too drunk when I pee on it: My friends. - Colbert.

Oh hey a Mistborn match, I should probably post in here.

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(Maniac64 at work)
Guns don't kill people, Kinder eggs do. I saw it in a post on GameFAQs. ~FAHtastic

Vin definitely will gain an advantage from Doom's armor and Atium will keep her alive let her land some big blows in the like 30 seconds to a minute that it lasts. But I don't see her beating him in that time and afterwards she will have pissed off doom at which point he has way to many weapons for her to deal with.

Dr. Doom

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(Maniac64 at work)
Guns don't kill people, Kinder eggs do. I saw it in a post on GameFAQs. ~FAHtastic

Can you get more specific than that with her, or does the series stick to being kinda vague? Like what big blows can she do, has she done. What would she do to the armor. Stuff like that.

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The King Wang.
Listen up Urinal Cake. I already have something that tells me if I'm too drunk when I pee on it: My friends. - Colbert.

The series is actually really really specific on how things work but it is all mechanics not stats.

Let's see, strength feats? Well at one point a soldier was grabbing her in a bear hug and she slammed her head against his so hard that his head basically exploded. She's kicked an armored soldier in the breastplate and killed him (she actually does that quite a few times). A different mistborn bent steel bars without much trouble. Lots of shattering bones with strikes. Soldiers getting sent flying through the air due to the metal armor. Coins being fired hard enough to rip through an armored soldier and out the other side.

I can't remember much more in the way of specifics, but it has been awhile since I read more than the first book. And that was before we found the metal that lets you use all the power of a burning metal in on big blast.

Meeting time, I will answer more questions later.

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(Maniac64 at work)
Guns don't kill people, Kinder eggs do. I saw it in a post on GameFAQs. ~FAHtastic

Doom once killed a lion while entirely naked. Advantage: Doom

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We are thought, and reality, and concept, and the unimaginable

Here we are



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We are thought, and reality, and concept, and the unimaginable

...actually i almost forgot the most basic way she could win.

doom, much like strange, needs his hands if he wants to mage it up right (proof of this with Strange is the fact that Hulk busted 'em during WWH and left Strange to be pretty much a half assed mage worthless in a fight on his own until he recovered). so long as Vin actually breaks them, crushes them, or any number of things to them to render him incapable of it, that akes out a lot of his magey arsenal and a lot of his tech. don't forget the blasters are out of his hands. don't forget that while he has a hammerspace of items, if he can't actually use his hands he's kinda boned there.


so he's actually got a very clear weak point to him that's also a point that i'd assume is a target that isn't the head or body. >_>;

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The King Wang.
Listen up Urinal Cake. I already have something that tells me if I'm too drunk when I pee on it: My friends. - Colbert.

Sounds like crappy writing. Strange has never needed his hands to do stuff

http://imageshack.us/f/203/timerever12fl.jpg/

The guy can STOP TIME by thinking really hard about it <_<

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We are thought, and reality, and concept, and the unimaginable

gonna go with Dr. Doom

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XBL GT: Demon Ninja X2
"There comes a time in every man's or woman's life where they have to make **** up to cover their ass." - Hazama

honestly i wouldn't be surprised if it were! but being not too far removed from 'there is no chaos magic' makes everything look better.

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The King Wang.
Listen up Urinal Cake. I already have something that tells me if I'm too drunk when I pee on it: My friends. - Colbert.

Going to have to go with the good Doctor Victor Von Doom on this one also long live the finger lazers.

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A signature I just don't know what to say in it besides LIVE FROM NEW YORK IT'S SATURDAY NIGHT!!!