Poll of the Day > DMed my second game of DnD yesterday.

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Mario_VS_DK 07/16/17 4:19:12 PM #52:	It's more hindsight at this point. There's no way I could change it at this point. --- Stupid signature! <cite>Mario_VS_DK posted [p:883026651] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote>It's more hindsight at this point. There's no way I could change it at this point.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Mario_VS_DK 07/16/17 5:01:16 PM #53:	Game should have started by now, and only 1 person is here so far. One canceled on me 15 minutes ago, and I haven't heard a single word from the other two players. --- Stupid signature! <cite>Mario_VS_DK posted [p:883028972] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote>Game should have started by now, and only 1 person is here so far. One canceled on me 15 minutes ago, and I haven't heard a single word from the other two players.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Lightning Bolt 07/16/17 5:26:00 PM #54:	Players are jerks. --- One day dude, I'm just gonna get off the bus, and I'm gonna run in the woods and never come back, and when I come back I'm gonna be the knife master! -The Rev <cite>Lightning Bolt posted [p:883030274] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote>Players are jerks.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Mario_VS_DK 07/16/17 5:32:26 PM #55:	The other two made it, both late, but one is having troubles with Discord. Edit: One of the late players was having a bunch of troubles with his computer, so we're just rescheduling. :/ --- Stupid signature! <cite>Mario_VS_DK posted [p:883030638] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote>The other two made it, both late, but one is having troubles with Discord. Edit: One of the late players was having a bunch of troubles with his computer, so we're just rescheduling. :/</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Mario_VS_DK 07/20/17 11:03:15 AM #56:	Bump because I still haven't saved the posts in here that I need. --- Stupid signature! <cite>Mario_VS_DK posted [p:883264129] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote>Bump because I still haven't saved the posts in here that I need.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
ParanoidObsessive 07/20/17 2:30:39 PM #57:	Adventure paths/modules/scenarios/etc are kind of annoying, because they almost rely on players doing exactly ONE thing, and the GM needing to force the players to do that thing in order to keep the plot moving. While some allow for branching paths or discuss alternative options, most of them just boil down to "railroad the fuck out of your players, and slap the shit out of their characters if they complain." Which is terrible roleplaying, in my opinion. I've always seen the best games being the ones where the GM is willing to compromise and improvise. Build the framework of a plot before a session, then play it out and see how things go. As the players explore the world, casually throw out all sorts of plot hooks and adventure possibilities for them to consider, but don't push in any particular direction. If they latch onto a particular plot hook and begin to pursue it, then you start fleshing out that plot and generally working it into the overall story, but if they blatantly ignore or abandon a plot you wanted to get going, it's better to just shrug and let it drop than it is to try and force them into a story they clearly aren't interested in. On the macro level this can be something as obvious as trying to force a bunch of combat enthusiast players into scenes where combat is useless and they have to scheme or talk their way out of trouble, or where every challenge is some sort of cerebral puzzle, when all they really want to do is hit things really, really hard. But on the micro level it can be stuff like having a friendly NPC ask the players to delve into a ruin to recover an artifact, and then when the players reject the offer, you just keep throwing more and more important NPCs at them getting more and more insistent about them getting it until you basically have the king telling them if they don't go do it he'll throw them in the dungeon. At that point, it's painfully obvious to the players that you don't actually give a shit about their input, and mostly just want them to be a passive audience for the stories you personally want to tell, and why would they want to do that? I'm not sure I've ever played a single campaign long-term that ended in any way I could have predicted when it started. I've always sort of tried to start off a bit aimlessly, shape the narrative in the direction the players clearly wanted to take it, and often asked players outside of the game what sort of stories or plot elements they might want to see worked into the overall story in the future. It helps players feel like they're really contributing to the world they live in, which helps them grow emotionally invested both in their own characters, as well as the NPCs and the world itself. --- "Wall of Text'D!" --- oldskoolplayr76 "POwned again." --- blight family <cite>ParanoidObsessive posted [p:883276088] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote>Adventure paths/modules/scenarios/etc are kind of annoying, because they almost rely on players doing exactly ONE thing, and the GM needing to force the players to do that thing in order to keep the plot moving. While some allow for branching paths or discuss alternative options, most of them just boil down to "railroad the fuck out of your players, and slap the shit out of their characters if they complain." Which is terrible roleplaying, in my opinion. I've always seen the best games being the ones where the GM is willing to compromise and improvise. Build the framework of a plot before a session, then play it out and see how things go. As the players explore the world, casually throw out all sorts of plot hooks and adventure possibilities for them to consider, but don't push in any particular direction. If they latch onto a particular plot hook and begin to pursue it, then you start fleshing out that plot and generally working it into the overall story, but if they blatantly ignore or abandon a plot you wanted to get going, it's better to just shrug and let it drop than it is to try and force them into a story they clearly aren't interested in. On the macro level this can be something as obvious as trying to force a bunch of combat enthusiast players into scenes where combat is useless and they have to scheme or talk their way out of trouble, or where every challenge is some sort of cerebral puzzle, when all they really want to do is hit things really, really hard. But on the micro level it can be stuff like having a friendly NPC ask the players to delve into a ruin to recover an artifact, and then when the players reject the offer, you just keep throwing more and more important NPCs at them getting more and more insistent about them getting it until you basically have the king telling them if they don't go do it he'll throw them in the dungeon. At that point, it's painfully obvious to the players that you don't actually give a shit about their input, and mostly just want them to be a passive audience for the stories you personally want to tell, and why would they want to do that? I'm not sure I've ever played a single campaign long-term that ended in any way I could have predicted when it started. I've always sort of tried to start off a bit aimlessly, shape the narrative in the direction the players clearly wanted to take it, and often asked players outside of the game what sort of stories or plot elements they might want to see worked into the overall story in the future. It helps players feel like they're really contributing to the world they live in, which helps them grow emotionally invested both in their own characters, as well as the NPCs and the world itself. </quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Lightning Bolt 07/20/17 4:20:37 PM #58:	ParanoidObsessive posted... Adventure paths/modules/scenarios/etc are kind of annoying, because they almost rely on players doing exactly ONE thing, and the GM needing to force the players to do that thing in order to keep the plot moving. While some allow for branching paths or discuss alternative options, most of them just boil down to "railroad the fuck out of your players, and slap the shit out of their characters if they complain." Which is terrible roleplaying, in my opinion. APs work fine without narrative agency, and wouldn't be so popular if they didn't. Neither would video games, for that matter. In fact, it's usually the kinds of people that enjoy GMing (not necessarily exclusively) that think players need narrative agency, because GMs are the kinds of people who value narrative agency/worldbuilding. But agency is obtainable in many ways, and expression is only one kind of fun according to the MDA format. As someone who most highly values narrative and challenge aesthetics, I actually prefer playing linear adventures. I can almost be guaranteed curated content and a solid, well-paced story with those. As for getting the players to do what you want, you usually handle that at the buy-in. "This adventure involves you escaping from prison, joining a cult, and working to destroy the government in evil ways. Bring a character that would do that." That's half done right there. --- One day dude, I'm just gonna get off the bus, and I'm gonna run in the woods and never come back, and when I come back I'm gonna be the knife master! -The Rev <cite>Lightning Bolt posted [p:883282974] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote><cite>ParanoidObsessive posted...</cite> <quote>Adventure paths/modules/scenarios/etc are kind of annoying, because they almost rely on players doing exactly ONE thing, and the GM needing to force the players to do that thing in order to keep the plot moving. While some allow for branching paths or discuss alternative options, most of them just boil down to "railroad the fuck out of your players, and slap the shit out of their characters if they complain." Which is terrible roleplaying, in my opinion.</quote> APs work fine without narrative agency, and wouldn't be so popular if they didn't. Neither would video games, for that matter. In fact, it's usually the kinds of people that enjoy GMing (not necessarily exclusively) that think players need narrative agency, because GMs are the kinds of people who value narrative agency/worldbuilding. But agency is obtainable in many ways, and expression is only one kind of fun according to the MDA format. As someone who most highly values narrative and challenge aesthetics, I actually prefer playing linear adventures. I can almost be guaranteed curated content and a solid, well-paced story with those. As for getting the players to do what you want, you usually handle that at the buy-in. "This adventure involves you escaping from prison, joining a cult, and working to destroy the government in evil ways. Bring a character that would do that." That's half done right there.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
shadowsword87 07/20/17 4:23:51 PM #59:	Eh, modules are great for oneshots, I should run a few for you PO, you can see that they are pretty damn good for what they do. You might just be used to DnD and WoD ones which are notoriously awful. Some Delta Green stuff is always great. <cite>shadowsword87 posted [p:883283164] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote>Eh, modules are great for oneshots, I should run a few for you PO, you can see that they are pretty damn good for what they do. You might just be used to DnD and WoD ones which are notoriously awful. Some Delta Green stuff is always great.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
ParanoidObsessive 07/20/17 10:22:51 PM #60:	Lightning Bolt posted... APs work fine without narrative agency, and wouldn't be so popular if they didn't. Neither would video games, for that matter. They're mostly popular because they're "minimal effort" time investments. A GM who doesn't have time to plan can easily run players who don't really care about their characters through a module or adventure relatively easily and everyone involved can be happy. But once you start dealing with players who like to have a bit more freedom or GMs who enjoy building their own worlds, they can start to become more of a hindrance than a help. They're also useful as "training wheels" for newer GMs who aren't entirely comfortable with the idea of improvising everything on the fly quite yet (ie, they're still learning the rules and aren't comfortable focusing on narrative or setting), but I tend to think that it's better for newer GMs to try and branch out on their own as soon as possible, and not get hung up in developing a habit of relying on adventure paths and the like. They can always fall back on pre-printed adventures later (especially once they have the confidence to change anything and everything if they need to), but I feel like a good GM needs to avoid them as much as possible early on. Lightning Bolt posted... In fact, it's usually the kinds of people that enjoy GMing (not necessarily exclusively) that think players need narrative agency, because GMs are the kinds of people who value narrative agency/worldbuilding. I'd argue it's more the kinds of players who tend to want to stretch their options and who get frustrated when GMs say no that are the ones most likely to think players need narrative agency. I'd also tend to argue that, the more invested players become in their characters and the world they're in, the more important it becomes. Yes, some players could absolutely play nothing but pre-written modules for the next 20 years and never be bothered by railroading at all, but other players will start to balk the moment it becomes obvious they really aren't being given any real choice at all in what they're doing. After all, if the results of all of my actions are being dictated by random dice rolls while all the major decisions are being made for me by the GM (or the guy who wrote the module), at what point post-character creation do I have any significant input at all? But yes, it mostly depends on who you're playing with. --- "Wall of Text'D!" --- oldskoolplayr76 "POwned again." --- blight family <cite>ParanoidObsessive posted [p:883304096] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote><cite>Lightning Bolt posted...</cite> <quote>APs work fine without narrative agency, and wouldn't be so popular if they didn't. Neither would video games, for that matter.</quote> They're mostly popular because they're "minimal effort" time investments. A GM who doesn't have time to plan can easily run players who don't really care about their characters through a module or adventure relatively easily and everyone involved can be happy. But once you start dealing with players who like to have a bit more freedom or GMs who enjoy building their own worlds, they can start to become more of a hindrance than a help. They're also useful as "training wheels" for newer GMs who aren't entirely comfortable with the idea of improvising everything on the fly quite yet (ie, they're still learning the rules and aren't comfortable focusing on narrative or setting), but I tend to think that it's better for newer GMs to try and branch out on their own as soon as possible, and not get hung up in developing a habit of relying on adventure paths and the like. They can always fall back on pre-printed adventures later (especially once they have the confidence to change anything and everything if they need to), but I feel like a good GM needs to avoid them as much as possible early on. <cite>Lightning Bolt posted...</cite> <quote>In fact, it's usually the kinds of people that enjoy GMing (not necessarily exclusively) that think players need narrative agency, because GMs are the kinds of people who value narrative agency/worldbuilding.</quote> I'd argue it's more the kinds of players who tend to want to stretch their options and who get frustrated when GMs say no that are the ones most likely to think players need narrative agency. I'd also tend to argue that, the more invested players become in their characters and the world they're in, the more important it becomes. Yes, some players could absolutely play nothing but pre-written modules for the next 20 years and never be bothered by railroading at all, but other players will start to balk the moment it becomes obvious they really aren't being given any real choice at all in what they're doing. After all, if the results of all of my actions are being dictated by random dice rolls while all the major decisions are being made for me by the GM (or the guy who wrote the module), at what point post-character creation do I have any significant input at all? But yes, it mostly depends on who you're playing with. </quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
ParanoidObsessive 07/20/17 10:23:02 PM #61:	Lightning Bolt posted... As for getting the players to do what you want, you usually handle that at the buy-in. "This adventure involves you escaping from prison, joining a cult, and working to destroy the government in evil ways. Bring a character that would do that." That's half done right there. I'm very much behind the idea of "controlled creation", where you basically set limits for players during character creation. "Don't make any Evil characters", "Try to make a character who isn't a moody loner, you sort of need justification for staying together as a group", or even "Your characters all met before the adventure began and swore vengeance on an evil organization, work that motivation into your backstory" are all fine. I could even see something like "You should all make morally questionable Rogue-type characters" or "You're all apprentice wizards" or "Make vampires from one of the Camarilla Clans because we're playing a Camarilla game." What I'm objecting to is when it happens organically in play. Where you basically get something like this: Player: "Ok, we go left." GM: "Well, you can't go left, because the plot is off to the right." Player: "Yeah, but we want to go left." GM: "Actually, upon reconsidering, your character decides they want to go right." Player: "No, fuck you, we're going left." GM: "At this point the police show up to arrest you, but you can escape by going right!" Player: "Fuck this game." That's obviously an extreme (and very generalized) sort of example, but it's the sort of railroading you tend to get with modules and pre-generated adventures, because they usually have a singular plot path that doesn't allow for much branching (some good ones do, though). If the plot of your story says the heroes have to stay in the haunted mansion until morning and try to outwit the vampire, but they decide they don't give a crap and figure out a way to escape at 7pm, you're either left completely scrapping the entire module or having to keep coming up with ways to force them back into the established plot. Though to be honest, I'd have a lot of respect for a GM who decided they wanted to run the Tomb of Horrors adventure, but then willingly scrapped the whole thing the moment the PCs decided they didn't want to go in, headed back to town, and started up a gold-investment scheme that spirals off into a weird economic/political game where they all wind up becoming merchant lords. shadowsword87 posted... Eh, modules are great for oneshots, I should run a few for you PO, you can see that they are pretty damn good for what they do. I've both run and played in modules before, you know. It's part of why I formed the opinions I have of them. And again, I freely admit they're not terrible, and can work fine if they mesh with what the players want (ie, if you want to run Curse of Strahd, and I want to play Curse of Strahd, I will probably enjoy it if you run Curse of Strahd), but I think a GM is better off mostly avoiding them (or potentially just reading them for ideas but not trying to run them exactly as written). --- "Wall of Text'D!" --- oldskoolplayr76 "POwned again." --- blight family <cite>ParanoidObsessive posted [p:883304103] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote><cite>Lightning Bolt posted...</cite> <quote>As for getting the players to do what you want, you usually handle that at the buy-in. "This adventure involves you escaping from prison, joining a cult, and working to destroy the government in evil ways. Bring a character that would do that." That's half done right there.</quote> I'm very much behind the idea of "controlled creation", where you basically set limits for players during character creation. "Don't make any Evil characters", "Try to make a character who isn't a moody loner, you sort of need justification for staying together as a group", or even "Your characters all met before the adventure began and swore vengeance on an evil organization, work that motivation into your backstory" are all fine. I could even see something like "You should all make morally questionable Rogue-type characters" or "You're all apprentice wizards" or "Make vampires from one of the Camarilla Clans because we're playing a Camarilla game." What I'm objecting to is when it happens organically in play. Where you basically get something like this: Player: "Ok, we go left." GM: "Well, you can't go left, because the plot is off to the right." Player: "Yeah, but we want to go left." GM: "Actually, upon reconsidering, your character decides they want to go right." Player: "No, fuck you, we're going left." GM: "At this point the police show up to arrest you, but you can escape by going right!" Player: "Fuck this game." That's obviously an extreme (and very generalized) sort of example, but it's the sort of railroading you tend to get with modules and pre-generated adventures, because they usually have a singular plot path that doesn't allow for much branching (some good ones do, though). If the plot of your story says the heroes have to stay in the haunted mansion until morning and try to outwit the vampire, but they decide they don't give a crap and figure out a way to escape at 7pm, you're either left completely scrapping the entire module or having to keep coming up with ways to force them back into the established plot. Though to be honest, I'd have a lot of respect for a GM who decided they wanted to run the Tomb of Horrors adventure, but then willingly scrapped the whole thing the moment the PCs decided they didn't want to go in, headed back to town, and started up a gold-investment scheme that spirals off into a weird economic/political game where they all wind up becoming merchant lords. <cite>shadowsword87 posted...</cite> <quote>Eh, modules are great for oneshots, I should run a few for you PO, you can see that they are pretty damn good for what they do. </quote> I've both run and played in modules before, you know. It's part of why I formed the opinions I have of them. And again, I freely admit they're not terrible, and can work fine if they mesh with what the players want (ie, if you want to run Curse of Strahd, and I want to play Curse of Strahd, I will probably enjoy it if you run Curse of Strahd), but I think a GM is better off mostly avoiding them (or potentially just reading them for ideas but not trying to run them exactly as written). </quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
ParanoidObsessive 07/20/17 10:24:08 PM #62:	shadowsword87 posted... You might just be used to DnD and WoD ones which are notoriously awful. Possibly, though keep in mind I own like two dozen different RPG systems and a lot of books that go with them, and that includes a fair number of adventure modules. Personally, I just tend to like the whole Seed/Adventure Hook concept (a la GURPS or L5R/7th Sea) much better than full modules. For example, in L5R they have Adventure Hooks, which are broken down into a Challenge, a Focus, and a Strike. The Challenge is basically just a paragraph or two summary of the situation as-is, the Focus is the developing plot, and the Strike is the resolution (ie, how the characters respond). So you might have a Hook which is basically "Challenge: A samurai lord is accused of a crime, and is ordered to commit seppuku, Focus: The players discover a clue that leads them to believe the samurai may be innocent, Strike: The players have until the end of the day to gather enough evidence to prove the samurai's innocence before he commits seppuku. Then it's left in the hands of the players how to respond - do they actively seek to prove the samurai's innocence? Do they remain silent because they consider the samurai a rival, and want to see him fall? Do they go one step farther, and actively seek out evidence to HIDE it so that no one else can save him, or to potentially use later to blackmail whoever it was who framed him? Or do they just shrug and not care because the samurai isn't an NPC they care about and doesn't really help their own preexisting plans? (And if you're willing to allow PC division, what happens if SOME players want to save him while others want to screw him over?) How the players react to the Hook changes based on what the players want to do, and because it's a self-contained nugget you can use it as a springboard for other plot hooks later. If the players save the samurai, perhaps the person who was trying to frame him now consider THEM enemies, and may attempt to frame (or kill) them. Or perhaps the samurai himself will reward them in some way. Maybe he'll invite the PCs into his castle, where they will meet NPCs such as his daughter or a rival swordsman who will become the seeds for future adventures, or he'll reveal that his rival was trying to kill him to prevent him from revealing a portentous secret... If you're basically starting with a paragraph or two outline, it's easier to come up with a bunch of different possible scenarios, and it's easier to justify throwing them away if players don't seem interested. That way you can grow the plot a bit more organically based on what players actually pursue rather than trying to jam them into a hamster tube and force them into the One True Plot. It also makes a world feel more real, and not as if there's only ever one "story" happening in the world at any one time, and the players are always part of it. So, say, if your PCs are at the archetypal tavern and listening for rumors, rather than just feeding them the one key plot rumor they need to follow "the story as written", they might hear rumors about an old mine outside of town full of gold and monsters, a local noble's daughter who either ran away or was kidnapped, a ship captain looking to hire mercenaries for protection, and that mysterious dark silent figure sitting in the corner looking sinister and plot-y. Then they go after the noble and resolve that plot, only to come back to town later to hear about another group of rival adventurers who looted the mine, and a mysterious assassination that took place shortly after they left. The hooks they don't follow can make plot happen without them, but it's always up to them which hooks matter and which don't. --- "Wall of Text'D!" --- oldskoolplayr76 "POwned again." --- blight family <cite>ParanoidObsessive posted [p:883304157] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote><cite>shadowsword87 posted...</cite> <quote>You might just be used to DnD and WoD ones which are notoriously awful.</quote> Possibly, though keep in mind I own like two dozen different RPG systems and a lot of books that go with them, and that includes a fair number of adventure modules. Personally, I just tend to like the whole Seed/Adventure Hook concept (a la GURPS or L5R/7th Sea) much better than full modules. For example, in L5R they have Adventure Hooks, which are broken down into a Challenge, a Focus, and a Strike. The Challenge is basically just a paragraph or two summary of the situation as-is, the Focus is the developing plot, and the Strike is the resolution (ie, how the characters respond). So you might have a Hook which is basically "Challenge: A samurai lord is accused of a crime, and is ordered to commit seppuku, Focus: The players discover a clue that leads them to believe the samurai may be innocent, Strike: The players have until the end of the day to gather enough evidence to prove the samurai's innocence before he commits seppuku. Then it's left in the hands of the players how to respond - do they actively seek to prove the samurai's innocence? Do they remain silent because they consider the samurai a rival, and want to see him fall? Do they go one step farther, and actively seek out evidence to HIDE it so that no one else can save him, or to potentially use later to blackmail whoever it was who framed him? Or do they just shrug and not care because the samurai isn't an NPC they care about and doesn't really help their own preexisting plans? (And if you're willing to allow PC division, what happens if SOME players want to save him while others want to screw him over?) How the players react to the Hook changes based on what the players want to do, and because it's a self-contained nugget you can use it as a springboard for other plot hooks later. If the players save the samurai, perhaps the person who was trying to frame him now consider THEM enemies, and may attempt to frame (or kill) them. Or perhaps the samurai himself will reward them in some way. Maybe he'll invite the PCs into his castle, where they will meet NPCs such as his daughter or a rival swordsman who will become the seeds for future adventures, or he'll reveal that his rival was trying to kill him to prevent him from revealing a portentous secret... If you're basically starting with a paragraph or two outline, it's easier to come up with a bunch of different possible scenarios, and it's easier to justify throwing them away if players don't seem interested. That way you can grow the plot a bit more organically based on what players actually pursue rather than trying to jam them into a hamster tube and force them into the One True Plot. It also makes a world feel more real, and not as if there's only ever one "story" happening in the world at any one time, and the players are always part of it. So, say, if your PCs are at the archetypal tavern and listening for rumors, rather than just feeding them the one key plot rumor they need to follow "the story as written", they might hear rumors about an old mine outside of town full of gold and monsters, a local noble's daughter who either ran away or was kidnapped, a ship captain looking to hire mercenaries for protection, and that mysterious dark silent figure sitting in the corner looking sinister and plot-y. Then they go after the noble and resolve that plot, only to come back to town later to hear about another group of rival adventurers who looted the mine, and a mysterious assassination that took place shortly after they left. The hooks they don't follow can make plot happen without them, but it's always up to them which hooks matter and which don't. </quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
ParanoidObsessive 07/20/17 10:30:01 PM #63:	Ohh, and one other thing: shadowsword87 posted... Eh, modules are great for oneshots, I should run a few for you PO, you can see that they are pretty damn good for what they do. If you did, you'd have to run them as a freeform forum game where we post in turns, because I don't see it happening any other way. That being said, I was actually thinking about potentially offering to maybe run a freeform forum game just yesterday (I had a ton of free time to think about inane stuff while changing a flat tire), but I know you sort of sounded disgusted the last time the idea even came up in passing. And I have no idea what I'd even run anyway. Or if I'd even realistically have enough time to run it at this point (ie, the same reason I stopped running Mafia games forever ago). (You're also too young to remember when I actually DID run a forum-post RPG on PotD with a homebrew system and about a dozen or so players, which mostly petered out because too many players/scenes + lack of free time = burn out, but that was a thing at one point. I'm not sure there's anyone still LEFT on PotD who was a part of it at the time, though. And I'm not sure if I ever archived my notes for it or if they got eaten in some hard drive crash or another at some point.) --- "Wall of Text'D!" --- oldskoolplayr76 "POwned again." --- blight family <cite>ParanoidObsessive posted [p:883304432] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote>Ohh, and one other thing: <cite>shadowsword87 posted...</cite> <quote>Eh, modules are great for oneshots, I should run a few for you PO, you can see that they are pretty damn good for what they do.</quote> If you did, you'd have to run them as a freeform forum game where we post in turns, because I don't see it happening any other way. That being said, I was actually thinking about potentially offering to maybe run a freeform forum game just yesterday (I had a ton of free time to think about inane stuff while changing a flat tire), but I know you sort of sounded disgusted the last time the idea even came up in passing. And I have no idea what I'd even run anyway. Or if I'd even realistically have enough time to run it at this point (ie, the same reason I stopped running Mafia games forever ago). (You're also too young to remember when I actually DID run a forum-post RPG on PotD with a homebrew system and about a dozen or so players, which mostly petered out because too many players/scenes + lack of free time = burn out, but that was a thing at one point. I'm not sure there's anyone still LEFT on PotD who was a part of it at the time, though. And I'm not sure if I ever archived my notes for it or if they got eaten in some hard drive crash or another at some point.) </quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
shadowsword87 07/21/17 12:32:08 AM #64:	ParanoidObsessive posted... If you did, you'd have to run them as a freeform forum game where we post in turns, because I don't see it happening any other way. If the stars align and we're in the same city or whatever, I'm sure I can figure something out. That is, if you ever decide to leave your house, which I'm not sure that happens :P ParanoidObsessive posted... That being said, I was actually thinking about potentially offering to maybe run a freeform forum game just yesterday (I had a ton of free time to think about inane stuff while changing a flat tire), but I know you sort of sounded disgusted the last time the idea even came up in passing. And I have no idea what I'd even run anyway. Or if I'd even realistically have enough time to run it at this point (ie, the same reason I stopped running Mafia games forever ago). Eh, I'll give it a try, but it will need to be a setting that I know or I'm interested in (or a setting we all build together, which I'm always up for). My time for typing has gotten more and more limited recently though, so I will have nothing to say over the weekend, and then I will give my short-but-sweet posts like normal. Also no matter the setting, I do want some creative control over the world, maybe a city or two so I can make weird stuff happen there. <cite>shadowsword87 posted [p:883310513] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote><cite>ParanoidObsessive posted...</cite> <quote>If you did, you'd have to run them as a freeform forum game where we post in turns, because I don't see it happening any other way.</quote> If the stars align and we're in the same city or whatever, I'm sure I can figure something out. That is, if you ever decide to leave your house, which I'm not sure that happens :P <cite>ParanoidObsessive posted...</cite> <quote>That being said, I was actually thinking about potentially offering to maybe run a freeform forum game just yesterday (I had a ton of free time to think about inane stuff while changing a flat tire), but I know you sort of sounded disgusted the last time the idea even came up in passing. And I have no idea what I'd even run anyway. Or if I'd even realistically have enough time to run it at this point (ie, the same reason I stopped running Mafia games forever ago). </quote> Eh, I'll give it a try, but it will need to be a setting that I know or I'm interested in (or a setting we all build together, which I'm always up for). My time for typing has gotten more and more limited recently though, so I will have nothing to say over the weekend, and then I will give my short-but-sweet posts like normal. Also no matter the setting, I do want some creative control over the world, maybe a city or two so I can make weird stuff happen there.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
I_Abibde 07/22/17 5:46:56 PM #65:	I feel like a bump is not out of place here, as this seems to have become our newest tabletop gaming topic. --- -- I Abibde / Samuraiter Laughing at Game FAQs since 2002. <cite>I_Abibde posted [p:883406789] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote>I feel like a bump is not out of place here, as this seems to have become our newest tabletop gaming topic.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Mario_VS_DK 07/24/17 4:03:55 PM #66:	Well, yesterday's game was kind of a disaster. Wasted the first 45 minutes trying to get the internet working so I could actually speak in Discord with no luck. After I ended up just typing everything (could still hear), but things still went probably half as quickly as they would have if I could have just spoken. I also couldn't describe things quite so well because I didn't want to slow the game down even more. I snapped this picture though. (Keep in mind, they were mostly talking in Discord, so there was more going on than what the chat shows.) The bard (Titus) ended up casting Charm Person on the one goblin they could see and caused him to fight with the players since he wasn't happy to see his buddy-old-pal bard get attacked by one of the other goblins. And then the Barbarian (Torak) ended up killing him. I was laughing to myself saying, "This isn't going to go nearly as well as you think. You're not going to one shot them like you do all the others." And then he crit with his earthbreaker dealing 47 damage. Internet finally started working an hour later though and was going well for the next hour until someone had to go. The plot finally started to thicken once they got back to town. The mage girl, that they discovered was the reason they were escorting a merchant to and from the town, ended up missing with hardly any clues to go on. The mayor sent them back to the city to request provisions from the city council for the town since they weren't going to make it through the winter without the mage girl's magical food creating cauldron that she was making. They made it back to city and, cautious of what happened last time, two of them decided to not enter for fear that they might get arrested or something. As soon as the other two of them entered the city, the guards stopped them. Of course they're now panicking. (Even though that's not what the issue is, but I can't tell them that...) So they got brought before a big villain (though they don't yet know he's a villain and think he's on their side) who has tasked them with acting as bodyguards to a dwarf aristocrat tomorrow since there is supposedly a planned attack on his life. After that he told them they were free to go and that they should enjoy the festival that is going on in the city. And no one wanted to play any of the games I had spent 2 hours making, even though I said there are prizes. T.T I_Abibde posted... I feel like a bump is not out of place here, as this seems to have become our newest tabletop gaming topic. Yeah, alright. Also, looking at it now, I kind of feel like DMing is like baking and adventure paths are cake recipes. It might be best to follow recipes for a while just so that you understand how to make your own cake. You can certainly try to make a cake without a recipe, but it probably won't turn out quite as well to begin with. But over time, you'll figure out where you're going wrong and correct those mistakes. And if you're doing it without a recipe, you'll better understand how things do and don't go together than if you blindly follow the recipes. --- Stupid signature! <cite>Mario_VS_DK posted [p:883516773] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote>Well, yesterday's game was kind of a disaster. Wasted the first 45 minutes trying to get the internet working so I could actually speak in Discord with no luck. After I ended up just typing everything (could still hear), but things still went probably half as quickly as they would have if I could have just spoken. I also couldn't describe things quite so well because I didn't want to slow the game down even more. I snapped this picture though. (Keep in mind, they were mostly talking in Discord, so there was more going on than what the chat shows.) The bard (Titus) ended up casting Charm Person on the one goblin they could see and caused him to fight with the players since he wasn't happy to see his buddy-old-pal bard get attacked by one of the other goblins. And then the Barbarian (Torak) ended up killing him. I was laughing to myself saying, "This isn't going to go nearly as well as you think. You're not going to one shot them like you do all the others." And then he crit with his earthbreaker dealing 47 damage. Internet finally started working an hour later though and was going well for the next hour until someone had to go. The plot finally started to thicken once they got back to town. The mage girl, that they discovered was the reason they were escorting a merchant to and from the town, ended up missing with hardly any clues to go on. The mayor sent them back to the city to request provisions from the city council for the town since they weren't going to make it through the winter without the mage girl's magical food creating cauldron that she was making. They made it back to city and, cautious of what happened last time, two of them decided to not enter for fear that they might get arrested or something. As soon as the other two of them entered the city, the guards stopped them. Of course they're now panicking. (Even though that's not what the issue is, but I can't tell them that...) So they got brought before a big villain (though they don't yet know he's a villain and think he's on their side) who has tasked them with acting as bodyguards to a dwarf aristocrat tomorrow since there is supposedly a planned attack on his life. After that he told them they were free to go and that they should enjoy the festival that is going on in the city. And no one wanted to play any of the games I had spent 2 hours making, even though I said there are prizes. T.T <cite>I_Abibde posted...</cite> <quote>I feel like a bump is not out of place here, as this seems to have become our newest tabletop gaming topic.</quote> Yeah, alright. Also, looking at it now, I kind of feel like DMing is like baking and adventure paths are cake recipes. It might be best to follow recipes for a while just so that you understand how to make your own cake. You can certainly try to make a cake without a recipe, but it probably won't turn out quite as well to begin with. But over time, you'll figure out where you're going wrong and correct those mistakes. And if you're doing it without a recipe, you'll better understand how things do and don't go together than if you blindly follow the recipes.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Person106 07/24/17 5:28:28 PM #67:	Mario_VS_DK posted... they weren't going to make it through the winter without the mage girl's magical food creating cauldron that she was making. Sounds like a non-spell version of the priest spell, create food and water, that a mage can use. What limitations will it have? --- https://supermariomakerbookmark.nintendo.net/profile/person106 <cite>Person106 posted [p:883521469] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote><cite>Mario_VS_DK posted...</cite> <quote>they weren't going to make it through the winter without the mage girl's magical food creating cauldron that she was making.</quote> Sounds like a non-spell version of the priest spell, create food and water, that a mage can use. What limitations will it have?</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Mario_VS_DK 07/24/17 6:47:20 PM #68:	Person106 posted... Mario_VS_DK posted... they weren't going to make it through the winter without the mage girl's magical food creating cauldron that she was making. Sounds like a non-spell version of the priest spell, create food and water, that a mage can use. What limitations will it have? Yeah, they did find a few scroll of create food and water where she had set up shop. The cauldron is/was supposed to be unlimited use without someone with magical abilities tending to it. --- Stupid signature! <cite>Mario_VS_DK posted [p:883525891] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote><cite>Person106 posted...</cite> <quote><cite>Mario_VS_DK posted...</cite> <quote>they weren't going to make it through the winter without the mage girl's magical food creating cauldron that she was making.</quote> Sounds like a non-spell version of the priest spell, create food and water, that a mage can use. What limitations will it have?</quote> Yeah, they did find a few scroll of create food and water where she had set up shop. The cauldron is/was supposed to be unlimited use without someone with magical abilities tending to it.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
shadowsword87 07/24/17 6:53:14 PM #69:	Not sure if you guys would be interested, but there is a reddit post about the economics of bread, cows, and chickens, and hard into the paint. https://www.reddit.com/r/DnD/comments/6p8vea/5e_the_price_of_bread_a_series_about_economics_in/ <cite>shadowsword87 posted [p:883526237] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote>Not sure if you guys would be interested, but there is a reddit post about the economics of bread, cows, and chickens, and hard into the paint. https://www.reddit.com/r/DnD/comments/6p8vea/5e_the_price_of_bread_a_series_about_economics_in/</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
I_Abibde 07/24/17 7:02:14 PM #70:	Mario_VS_DK posted... And no one wanted to play any of the games I had spent 2 hours making, even though I said there are prizes. I hate it when that happens. Granted, it is a given that it is going to happen from time to time, but it still sucks. (It sucks worse when you get one of those players who try to do it on purpose.) --- -- I Abibde / Samuraiter Laughing at Game FAQs since 2002. <cite>I_Abibde posted [p:883526744] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote><cite>Mario_VS_DK posted...</cite> <quote>And no one wanted to play any of the games I had spent 2 hours making, even though I said there are prizes.</quote> I hate it when that happens. Granted, it is a given that it is going to happen from time to time, but it still sucks. (It sucks worse when you get one of those players who try to do it on purpose.)</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Mario_VS_DK 07/24/17 7:19:27 PM #71:	shadowsword87 posted... Not sure if you guys would be interested, but there is a reddit post about the economics of bread, cows, and chickens, and hard into the paint. https://www.reddit.com/r/DnD/comments/6p8vea/5e_the_price_of_bread_a_series_about_economics_in/ Hm. That is nice. I've mostly calculated how much money is in the world based on how much rare metals that exist on Earth and correspond to the various types of coins in a fantasy world with a population about the same as Earth. The tl;dr is the average person has 50gp in cash at any given time. However, it's important to keep in mind that this is average. If we consider that median would actually be a lot lower because some people would have a completely unnecessary amount of money. Most people probably have around 10gp at any given time. This is a somewhat rough estimate, but it still gives you a good idea of how much things should cost and such. I'll make sure to read through that though to see if anything might be different from my estimate. I_Abibde posted... I hate it when that happens. Granted, it is a given that it is going to happen from time to time, but it still sucks. (It sucks worse when you get one of those players who try to do it on purpose.) Yeah. Oh, well, pretty much. I'll see about finding something better for them next time. --- Stupid signature! <cite>Mario_VS_DK posted [p:883527692] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote><cite>shadowsword87 posted...</cite> <quote>Not sure if you guys would be interested, but there is a reddit post about the economics of bread, cows, and chickens, and hard into the paint. https://www.reddit.com/r/DnD/comments/6p8vea/5e_the_price_of_bread_a_series_about_economics_in/</quote> Hm. That is nice. I've mostly calculated how much money is in the world based on how much rare metals that exist on Earth and correspond to the various types of coins in a fantasy world with a population about the same as Earth. The tl;dr is the average person has 50gp in cash at any given time. However, it's important to keep in mind that this is average. If we consider that median would actually be a lot lower because some people would have a completely unnecessary amount of money. Most people probably have around 10gp at any given time. This is a somewhat rough estimate, but it still gives you a good idea of how much things should cost and such. I'll make sure to read through that though to see if anything might be different from my estimate. <cite>I_Abibde posted...</cite> <quote>I hate it when that happens. Granted, it is a given that it is going to happen from time to time, but it still sucks. (It sucks worse when you get one of those players who try to do it on purpose.)</quote> Yeah. Oh, well, pretty much. I'll see about finding something better for them next time.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
shadowsword87 07/25/17 12:03:44 AM #72:	Ugh PO, this is why you don't play enough games, you have ideas and not do anything with them. <cite>shadowsword87 posted [p:883543475] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote>Ugh PO, this is why you don't play enough games, you have ideas and not do anything with them.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Ogurisama 07/25/17 12:15:25 AM #73:	And you didnt invite me and my level 103747 Elf Ranger? --- http://cdn-android.apptap.com/img/870/mobi.colortrilogy.bitlink/267135850.png https://i.chzbgr.com/completestore/12/10/5/uv4r7nGyrE6ylt2lHGWpiQ2.gif <cite>Ogurisama posted [p:883543980] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote>And you didnt invite me and my level 103747 Elf Ranger?</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
ParanoidObsessive 07/25/17 12:22:42 AM #74:	shadowsword87 posted... Ugh PO, this is why you don't play enough games, you have ideas and not do anything with them. I've admitted in the past that brainstorming is sort of the most fun part of games for me. Part of why I enjoy haunting RPG threads and just tossing out ideas for other people to either use, ignore, or be inspired by. I like the idea of being more of a chaotic creativity generator than I do going to the effort of hammering all that raw material into a more cohesive framework. It's the same reason most of my attempts to write genre fiction never really went anywhere (that, and my obsessive perfectionism). But honestly, the main reason why I play enough games is because there really isn't a strong local RPG scene near me that I'm aware of, most of my friends are older and don't have the time/interest to RP anymore, and because I refuse to RP online if people want to use mics/cams. It makes it hard to really get a game running on any realistic schedule. But if you're talking about me mentioning the idea of a forum-based game, I DID say I was thinking about the idea, not that I was actually planning to or really wanted to. If anything, I thought I was pretty clear about the unlikelihood of it ever happening. --- "Wall of Text'D!" --- oldskoolplayr76 "POwned again." --- blight family <cite>ParanoidObsessive posted [p:883544301] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote><cite>shadowsword87 posted...</cite> <quote>Ugh PO, this is why you don't play enough games, you have ideas and not do anything with them.</quote> I've admitted in the past that brainstorming is sort of the most fun part of games for me. Part of why I enjoy haunting RPG threads and just tossing out ideas for other people to either use, ignore, or be inspired by. I like the idea of being more of a chaotic creativity generator than I do going to the effort of hammering all that raw material into a more cohesive framework. It's the same reason most of my attempts to write genre fiction never really went anywhere (that, and my obsessive perfectionism). But honestly, the main reason why I play enough games is because there really isn't a strong local RPG scene near me that I'm aware of, most of my friends are older and don't have the time/interest to RP anymore, and because I refuse to RP online if people want to use mics/cams. It makes it hard to really get a game running on any realistic schedule. But if you're talking about me mentioning the idea of a forum-based game, I DID say I was thinking about the idea, not that I was actually planning to or really wanted to. If anything, I thought I was pretty clear about the unlikelihood of it ever happening. </quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
shadowsword87 07/25/17 12:45:03 AM #75:	ParanoidObsessive posted... But if you're talking about me mentioning the idea of a forum-based game, I DID say I was thinking about the idea, not that I was actually planning to or really wanted to. If anything, I thought I was pretty clear about the unlikelihood of it ever happening. Oh I know, it's just that over the years I've realized I don't really like masturbation-RPG stuff, where people sit and think about playing RPGs rather than actually playing them. <cite>shadowsword87 posted [p:883545204] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote><cite>ParanoidObsessive posted...</cite> <quote>But if you're talking about me mentioning the idea of a forum-based game, I DID say I was thinking about the idea, not that I was actually planning to or really wanted to. If anything, I thought I was pretty clear about the unlikelihood of it ever happening.</quote> Oh I know, it's just that over the years I've realized I don't really like masturbation-RPG stuff, where people sit and think about playing RPGs rather than actually playing them.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
ParanoidObsessive 07/25/17 1:50:48 AM #76:	shadowsword87 posted... Oh I know, it's just that over the years I've realized I don't really like masturbation-RPG stuff, where people sit and think about playing RPGs rather than actually playing them. Yeah, but to continue that metaphor, when you live in the middle of the desert alone and masturbation is really the only thing you have, then you're going to flog the hell out of it. Though to be perfectly frank, I technically never sit around and think about RPGs. What I mostly do is sit around and think about narrative and plot and concepts that could be easily used in an RPG, but which could just as easily be in a book, in a TV show or movie, in a video game, or even in the flavor text of a collectable card game. Or, for that matter, as part of interactive improv theater. --- "Wall of Text'D!" --- oldskoolplayr76 "POwned again." --- blight family <cite>ParanoidObsessive posted [p:883547549] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote><cite>shadowsword87 posted...</cite> <quote>Oh I know, it's just that over the years I've realized I don't really like masturbation-RPG stuff, where people sit and think about playing RPGs rather than actually playing them.</quote> Yeah, but to continue that metaphor, when you live in the middle of the desert alone and masturbation is really the only thing you have, then you're going to flog the hell out of it. Though to be perfectly frank, I technically never sit around and think about RPGs. What I mostly do is sit around and think about narrative and plot and concepts that could be easily used in an RPG, but which could just as easily be in a book, in a TV show or movie, in a video game, or even in the flavor text of a collectable card game. Or, for that matter, as part of interactive improv theater. </quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
shadowsword87 07/25/17 2:31:10 AM #77:	Except, you can easily just go over to an island over there a few miles and meet some people. You live in a major city and have access to the internet, it's not impossible in the slightest. You just need to actually go and contact people. God, something has gone horribly if I'm lecturing someone on going out and meeting people. <cite>shadowsword87 posted [p:883548893] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote>Except, you can easily just go over to an island over there a few miles and meet some people. You live in a major city and have access to the internet, it's not impossible in the slightest. You just need to actually go and contact people. God, something has gone horribly if I'm lecturing someone on going out and meeting people.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
ParanoidObsessive 07/25/17 3:12:14 AM #78:	Yeah, but I'm 40. I already went through my meeting new people and hanging out in NYC phases. Remember, I am the specter of your dark future. --- "Wall of Text'D!" --- oldskoolplayr76 "POwned again." --- blight family <cite>ParanoidObsessive posted [p:883549965] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote>Yeah, but I'm 40. I already went through my meeting new people and hanging out in NYC phases. Remember, I am the specter of your dark future. </quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
shadowsword87 07/25/17 3:28:40 AM #79:	No! I will spite you father figure, and forge my own path full of friends and games! <cite>shadowsword87 posted [p:883550367] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote>No! I will spite you father figure, and forge my own path full of friends and games!</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
ParanoidObsessive 07/25/17 3:32:52 AM #80:	I, too, believed such things once. But time and tide shall wear down your illusions. Inexorable fate shall claim you, as it claimed me. The Dark Side waits for us all. --- "Wall of Text'D!" --- oldskoolplayr76 "POwned again." --- blight family <cite>ParanoidObsessive posted [p:883550478] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote>I, too, believed such things once. But time and tide shall wear down your illusions. Inexorable fate shall claim you, as it claimed me. The Dark Side waits for us all. </quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
I_Abibde 07/25/17 8:11:04 PM #81:	insert light saber noises and symphonic music --- -- I Abibde / Samuraiter Laughing at Game FAQs since 2002. <cite>I_Abibde posted [p:883594448] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote>insert light saber noises and symphonic music</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Mario_VS_DK 07/25/17 9:16:27 PM #82:	ParanoidObsessive posted... But honestly, the main reason why I play enough games is ... because I refuse to RP online if people want to use mics/cams. It makes it hard to really get a game running on any realistic schedule. Why exactly? And there's plenty of games that use only text, or that use a mic and/or cam that don't RP. Though, most games are mics only. But one of the games I play in, I hardly RP at all and leave the RPing to the more social players. I don't see why you wouldn't be able to find a group like that too. And what exactly makes it hard to get a game running on a schedule? I will admit that there are those flaky people out there, but once drop them and you find people who actually show up on time then you're golden. --- Stupid signature! <cite>Mario_VS_DK posted [p:883598318] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote><cite>ParanoidObsessive posted...</cite> <quote>But honestly, the main reason why I play enough games is ... because I refuse to RP online if people want to use mics/cams. It makes it hard to really get a game running on any realistic schedule.</quote> Why exactly? And there's plenty of games that use only text, or that use a mic and/or cam that don't RP. Though, most games are mics only. But one of the games I play in, I hardly RP at all and leave the RPing to the more social players. I don't see why you wouldn't be able to find a group like that too. And what exactly makes it hard to get a game running on a schedule? I will admit that there are those flaky people out there, but once drop them and you find people who actually show up on time then you're golden.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
shadowsword87 07/25/17 9:26:55 PM #83:	PO steps down from any voice chat game, for some silly unknown reason. Even when he joined a game that had a set time, and we just typed things out. <cite>shadowsword87 posted [p:883598972] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote>PO steps down from any voice chat game, for some silly unknown reason. Even when he joined a game that had a set time, and we just typed things out. </quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
ParanoidObsessive 07/26/17 1:59:42 AM #84:	Mario_VS_DK posted... Why exactly? Because I'm old, and just have irrational distaste for mics and cams. It's not a "These things are objectively bad!" sort of deal as much as it is just a matter of personal preference. It also doesn't help that I RPed online for years via forums and IM clients, so I'm always apt to immediately call bullshit when people act like you can't run a game online without voice-chat. Generally speaking, if anyone needs to be mic'd at all, it's the GM - everyone else being audible can just create even more problems if constant crosstalk comes into play. Good players who know what they're doing and can generally read/type fast aren't going to slow things down all that much if they're text-only as opposed to on mic. Mario_VS_DK posted... But one of the games I play in, I hardly RP at all and leave the RPing to the more social players. I don't see why you wouldn't be able to find a group like that too. An RPG without actual RP is pretty much the opposite of fun to me. Too many dice-rolling stat monkeys in a game makes me not want to play it. Which is not to say that every player needs to be speaking in their character's specific voice and acting like they're in an improv theater class, but when I ran games I always expected even the meeker players to at least be "I do this," "I say this," and generally try to be a bit more immersive. You should see your character more like a character in a story than a token in a board game or a collection of optimal build stats in a video game. That's also part of why I can't just roll up stats and start playing a character in 20 minutes - if you want me in a game you better give me a good overview of the setting and give me at least a week to come up with a character concept. Because I'm probably going to give you back multiple essays worth of backstory. Mario_VS_DK posted... And what exactly makes it hard to get a game running on a schedule? I will admit that there are those flaky people out there, but once drop them and you find people who actually show up on time then you're golden. Based on PotD's previous experience attempting to run RPGs, it will take you at least a week of discussion to pin down an exact day and time when most people agree to show up to play, and even then, you're almost certainly going to lose at least a few would-be players who can't show up on that day, or who can't be there at that time (often due to time-zone differences). Then, once you actually start RUNNING the game, about a third of your players will show up all of once or twice before informing you that they can't make it on a regular basis anymore and drop out (or they'll just stop showing up without telling you at all). Then, after a few sessions, you'll notice you lose another player about every other week or so as stuff comes up or they decide they're not really as interested in playing anymore. And if by some miracle you actually manage to retain enough of a playerbase to keep playing, or just keep subbing in new players constantly, the GM will probably burn out from juggling all of those plates and wind up dropping the whole thing entirely within three months. While SOME people can absolutely establish long-running and efficient online games, PotD has NEVER been good at it. --- "Wall of Text'D!" --- oldskoolplayr76 "POwned again." --- blight family <cite>ParanoidObsessive posted [p:883612069] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote><cite>Mario_VS_DK posted...</cite> <quote>Why exactly?</quote> Because I'm old, and just have irrational distaste for mics and cams. It's not a "These things are objectively bad!" sort of deal as much as it is just a matter of personal preference. It also doesn't help that I RPed online for years via forums and IM clients, so I'm always apt to immediately call bullshit when people act like you can't run a game online without voice-chat. Generally speaking, if anyone needs to be mic'd at all, it's the GM - everyone else being audible can just create even more problems if constant crosstalk comes into play. Good players who know what they're doing and can generally read/type fast aren't going to slow things down all that much if they're text-only as opposed to on mic. <cite>Mario_VS_DK posted...</cite> <quote>But one of the games I play in, I hardly RP at all and leave the RPing to the more social players. I don't see why you wouldn't be able to find a group like that too. </quote> An RPG without actual RP is pretty much the opposite of fun to me. Too many dice-rolling stat monkeys in a game makes me not want to play it. Which is not to say that every player needs to be speaking in their character's specific voice and acting like they're in an improv theater class, but when I ran games I always expected even the meeker players to at least be "I do this," "I say this," and generally try to be a bit more immersive. You should see your character more like a character in a story than a token in a board game or a collection of optimal build stats in a video game. That's also part of why I can't just roll up stats and start playing a character in 20 minutes - if you want me in a game you better give me a good overview of the setting and give me at least a week to come up with a character concept. Because I'm probably going to give you back multiple essays worth of backstory. <cite>Mario_VS_DK posted...</cite> <quote>And what exactly makes it hard to get a game running on a schedule? I will admit that there are those flaky people out there, but once drop them and you find people who actually show up on time then you're golden.</quote> Based on PotD's previous experience attempting to run RPGs, it will take you at least a week of discussion to pin down an exact day and time when most people agree to show up to play, and even then, you're almost certainly going to lose at least a few would-be players who can't show up on that day, or who can't be there at that time (often due to time-zone differences). Then, once you actually start RUNNING the game, about a third of your players will show up all of once or twice before informing you that they can't make it on a regular basis anymore and drop out (or they'll just stop showing up without telling you at all). Then, after a few sessions, you'll notice you lose another player about every other week or so as stuff comes up or they decide they're not really as interested in playing anymore. And if by some miracle you actually manage to retain enough of a playerbase to keep playing, or just keep subbing in new players constantly, the GM will probably burn out from juggling all of those plates and wind up dropping the whole thing entirely within three months. While SOME people can absolutely establish long-running and efficient online games, PotD has NEVER been good at it. </quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
ParanoidObsessive 07/26/17 2:15:22 AM #85:	shadowsword87 posted... PO steps down from any voice chat game, for some silly unknown reason. Even when he joined a game that had a set time, and we just typed things out. If you mean Nudo's game, I mostly kept missing that game because Roll20 always ran like hot garbage for me. It froze and crashed multiple times almost every time we played. The sessions where I was actually THERE were nights where Roll20 managed to only crash 2-3 times. The nights you didn't see me were usually the times when Roll20 crashed a dozen times in the first 15 minutes and I just said "Fuck this noise" and told Nudo on AIM I couldn't make it. To be honest, I think I was online for every single session (which is more than you can say for most of the people playing in it). I just couldn't log in, so I was usually just talking to Nudo in AIM about what was going on. I also skipped a couple weeks entirely because I'd asked Nudo what sort of tone he wanted the game to have, and he said relatively serious, so I made a serious-flavored character who didn't even remotely fit since everybody else seemed to make mostly goofy characters. Which is why I eventually dropped my first character and came up with the Dwarf Warlock (who I was actually kind of fond of, and was disappointed I never really had much of a chance to play him). That was also why I was thinking about making the Unseelie Pixie Assassin/Evil Tinkerbell character I mentioned in Dreaming King's topic - I was considering it for Nudo's game before I went Warlock. Though when it comes to voice chat games specifically, if I'm literally the only one not on a mic I'm more likely to drop out (or not join in the first place) mainly because I feel like it makes me the disruptive one, and I'm more or less trying to avoid making the game less fun for other people. I'd rather whoever was running the game just find someone else to take my spot who is willing to play the same way as everyone else to help keep things running smoothly. I'm not really egotistical enough to feel like the entire game should revolve around me and my preferences. --- "Wall of Text'D!" --- oldskoolplayr76 "POwned again." --- blight family <cite>ParanoidObsessive posted [p:883612556] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote><cite>shadowsword87 posted...</cite> <quote>PO steps down from any voice chat game, for some silly unknown reason. Even when he joined a game that had a set time, and we just typed things out. </quote> If you mean Nudo's game, I mostly kept missing that game because Roll20 always ran like hot garbage for me. It froze and crashed multiple times almost every time we played. The sessions where I was actually THERE were nights where Roll20 managed to only crash 2-3 times. The nights you didn't see me were usually the times when Roll20 crashed a dozen times in the first 15 minutes and I just said "Fuck this noise" and told Nudo on AIM I couldn't make it. To be honest, I think I was online for every single session (which is more than you can say for most of the people playing in it). I just couldn't log in, so I was usually just talking to Nudo in AIM about what was going on. I also skipped a couple weeks entirely because I'd asked Nudo what sort of tone he wanted the game to have, and he said relatively serious, so I made a serious-flavored character who didn't even remotely fit since everybody else seemed to make mostly goofy characters. Which is why I eventually dropped my first character and came up with the Dwarf Warlock (who I was actually kind of fond of, and was disappointed I never really had much of a chance to play him). That was also why I was thinking about making the Unseelie Pixie Assassin/Evil Tinkerbell character I mentioned in Dreaming King's topic - I was considering it for Nudo's game before I went Warlock. Though when it comes to voice chat games specifically, if I'm literally the only one not on a mic I'm more likely to drop out (or not join in the first place) mainly because I feel like it makes me the disruptive one, and I'm more or less trying to avoid making the game less fun for other people. I'd rather whoever was running the game just find someone else to take my spot who is willing to play the same way as everyone else to help keep things running smoothly. I'm not really egotistical enough to feel like the entire game should revolve around me and my preferences. </quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
shadowsword87 07/26/17 2:30:23 AM #86:	ParanoidObsessive posted... Which is not to say that every player needs to be speaking in their character's specific voice and acting like they're in an improv theater class, but when I ran games I always expected even the meeker players to at least be "I do this," "I say this," and generally try to be a bit more immersive. You should see your character more like a character in a story than a token in a board game or a collection of optimal build stats in a video game. I'm actually the same way, but more lenient. Like if a player says, "hey, I'm not too good at the social stuff, can I get some help?" every person at the table gives suggestions, great. Also if the player goes, "I just want to roll a persuasion to get past the guard", I want at least some sort of angle of why it would be OK for the PCs to be allowed past the guard, most people can handle things in the abstract. ParanoidObsessive posted... That's also part of why I can't just roll up stats and start playing a character in 20 minutes - if you want me in a game you better give me a good overview of the setting and give me at least a week to come up with a character concept. Because I'm probably going to give you back multiple essays worth of backstory. While I understand the appeal of this, I think too much can absolutely be a detriment. Every paragraph you add solidifies your character before the game actually starts, and while that can work for certain games, you can easily run into situations where you need to change the character's personality to either act as a foil to someone/everyone else, fill a void, or anything else that needs to be done on the fly. ParanoidObsessive posted... While SOME people can absolutely establish long-running and efficient online games, PotD has NEVER been good at it. PotD actually is just an especially bad pool to pull from in terms of setting up. ParanoidObsessive posted... If you mean Nudo's game, I mostly kept missing that game because Roll20 always ran like hot garbage for me. It froze and crashed multiple times almost every time we played. That's because I imagine you have my dad's first computer, with a whole 5MB of RAM. ParanoidObsessive posted... I also skipped a couple weeks entirely because I'd asked Nudo what sort of tone he wanted the game to have, and he said relatively serious, so I made a serious-flavored character who didn't even remotely fit since everybody else seemed to make mostly goofy characters. cough cough That's because you put too much backstory in cough cough ParanoidObsessive posted... Though when it comes to voice chat games specifically, if I'm literally the only one not on a mic I'm more likely to drop out (or not join in the first place) mainly because I feel like it makes me the disruptive one, and I'm more or less trying to avoid making the game less fun for other people. I'd rather whoever was running the game just find someone else to take my spot who is willing to play the same way as everyone else to help keep things running smoothly. I'm not really egotistical enough to feel like the entire game should revolve around me and my preferences. Don't act like I didn't see you skipping out on giving a legitimate reason why you can't use a mic like a normal person by the way. <cite>shadowsword87 posted [p:883612970] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote><cite>ParanoidObsessive posted...</cite> <quote>Which is not to say that every player needs to be speaking in their character's specific voice and acting like they're in an improv theater class, but when I ran games I always expected even the meeker players to at least be "I do this," "I say this," and generally try to be a bit more immersive. You should see your character more like a character in a story than a token in a board game or a collection of optimal build stats in a video game.</quote> I'm actually the same way, but more lenient. Like if a player says, "hey, I'm not too good at the social stuff, can I get some help?" every person at the table gives suggestions, great. Also if the player goes, "I just want to roll a persuasion to get past the guard", I want at least some sort of angle of why it would be OK for the PCs to be allowed past the guard, most people can handle things in the abstract. <cite>ParanoidObsessive posted...</cite> <quote>That's also part of why I can't just roll up stats and start playing a character in 20 minutes - if you want me in a game you better give me a good overview of the setting and give me at least a week to come up with a character concept. Because I'm probably going to give you back multiple essays worth of backstory.</quote> While I understand the appeal of this, I think too much can absolutely be a detriment. Every paragraph you add solidifies your character before the game actually starts, and while that can work for certain games, you can easily run into situations where you need to change the character's personality to either act as a foil to someone/everyone else, fill a void, or anything else that needs to be done on the fly. <cite>ParanoidObsessive posted...</cite> <quote>While SOME people can absolutely establish long-running and efficient online games, PotD has NEVER been good at it.</quote> PotD actually is just an especially bad pool to pull from in terms of setting up. <cite>ParanoidObsessive posted...</cite> <quote>If you mean Nudo's game, I mostly kept missing that game because Roll20 always ran like hot garbage for me. It froze and crashed multiple times almost every time we played.</quote> That's because I imagine you have my dad's first computer, with a whole 5MB of RAM. <cite>ParanoidObsessive posted...</cite> <quote>I also skipped a couple weeks entirely because I'd asked Nudo what sort of tone he wanted the game to have, and he said relatively serious, so I made a serious-flavored character who didn't even remotely fit since everybody else seemed to make mostly goofy characters.</quote> cough cough That's because you put too much backstory in cough cough <cite>ParanoidObsessive posted...</cite> <quote>Though when it comes to voice chat games specifically, if I'm literally the only one not on a mic I'm more likely to drop out (or not join in the first place) mainly because I feel like it makes me the disruptive one, and I'm more or less trying to avoid making the game less fun for other people. I'd rather whoever was running the game just find someone else to take my spot who is willing to play the same way as everyone else to help keep things running smoothly. I'm not really egotistical enough to feel like the entire game should revolve around me and my preferences.</quote> Don't act like I didn't see you skipping out on giving a legitimate reason why you can't use a mic like a normal person by the way.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Mario_VS_DK 07/26/17 2:48:59 AM #87:	ParanoidObsessive posted... First part I suppose I can understand that. I feel like it really makes a game more spontaneous and fun when you're using a mic. I roleplayed quite a bit on a forum a while back, and that was fun, but I also think that it's more fun to do it with mics. It allows shorter things to be said and makes conversations less one sided. I mean, there are players who feel really feel the need to talk, but I've found that they are far and between, and if you actually talk to them about it, they're pretty understanding and willing to quiet down a bit so the other players can get a chance to talk. I was really expecting it from one of my players when I went to GM, and I told him about it before we started. He was pretty understanding and knew it would be a problem once I told him about it. Now that we're actually in the game, there hasn't really been any problems and everyone has gotten the chance to roleplay equally. I think I ran into more problems with cross talking in forums than I have with voice chats. Always from same time posts, or people typing a lengthier post and not hitting refresh before they hit submit. Things don't really get slowed down much from people talking over each other in voice chat, simply because things move quicker in voice chat. People can speak a lot faster than they can type and can't sit there wondering if they should hit the submit button. All that said, to each their own. If you prefer text over voice when playing on the internet, that's your choice. Second part I agree on all points. For me though, I have social problems and can sometimes have trouble talking or role playing. That's not to say I don't do it at all, I just do it less. Lots of times I'm more in the background, but every now and then I can come out of my shell and really roleplay it up. I especially agree on the not just rolling up stats and playing though. It takes me at least a few days for me to come up with a character I want to play. Since I play Pathfinder, I want mechanical things to suit that character's personality. Sometimes, I find a neat archetype or prestige class that makes me come up with a great character, and that's just the best for me. Third part Yeah, people can be flaky. But I'm sure it's like that in real life too. You just need to find a group of people who can consistently make it. You probably won't always get it on the first try, or even the second... But if you hang in there and keep looking for people who will consistently show up on time, eventually you'll find a group to play with. The first online group I played with, I got lucky and everyone is consistent. Our schedules don't always really line up, so we only play once or twice a month, if that and normally someone is still unable to make it, but we play play regardless. And I've been playing with them for about a year now. The second group, we've been through a handful of players, but 3 of us, plus the GM have been persistent and stayed around throughout the whole thing making sure to show up on time every week, and it looks like we have to other stable players now too. And we still play almost every week. Sometimes someone has to skip or we skip the game completely, but that group is very consistent about playing and I've been playing with at least the original players for about 6 months now. The third group I played with... Well, that one lasted 3 sessions... Honestly, I think we were lucky it lasted that long... The fourth group, and the one I'm GMing for, some people have been somewhat late and somewhat inconsistent, so I'm sure there's going to be player replacements in the future, but I'm going to power through it and make sure the group as a whole survives. I've been picky though and only joining groups I think are good. So maybe, that's why I've been lucky. --- Stupid signature! <cite>Mario_VS_DK posted [p:883613564] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote><cite>ParanoidObsessive posted...</cite> <quote>First part</quote> I suppose I can understand that. I feel like it really makes a game more spontaneous and fun when you're using a mic. I roleplayed quite a bit on a forum a while back, and that was fun, but I also think that it's more fun to do it with mics. It allows shorter things to be said and makes conversations less one sided. I mean, there are players who feel really feel the need to talk, but I've found that they are far and between, and if you actually talk to them about it, they're pretty understanding and willing to quiet down a bit so the other players can get a chance to talk. I was really expecting it from one of my players when I went to GM, and I told him about it before we started. He was pretty understanding and knew it would be a problem once I told him about it. Now that we're actually in the game, there hasn't really been any problems and everyone has gotten the chance to roleplay equally. I think I ran into more problems with cross talking in forums than I have with voice chats. Always from same time posts, or people typing a lengthier post and not hitting refresh before they hit submit. Things don't really get slowed down much from people talking over each other in voice chat, simply because things move quicker in voice chat. People can speak a lot faster than they can type and can't sit there wondering if they should hit the submit button. All that said, to each their own. If you prefer text over voice when playing on the internet, that's your choice. <quote>Second part</quote> I agree on all points. For me though, I have social problems and can sometimes have trouble talking or role playing. That's not to say I don't do it at all, I just do it less. Lots of times I'm more in the background, but every now and then I can come out of my shell and really roleplay it up. I especially agree on the not just rolling up stats and playing though. It takes me at least a few days for me to come up with a character I want to play. Since I play Pathfinder, I want mechanical things to suit that character's personality. Sometimes, I find a neat archetype or prestige class that makes me come up with a great character, and that's just the best for me. <quote>Third part</quote> Yeah, people can be flaky. But I'm sure it's like that in real life too. You just need to find a group of people who can consistently make it. You probably won't always get it on the first try, or even the second... But if you hang in there and keep looking for people who will consistently show up on time, eventually you'll find a group to play with. The first online group I played with, I got lucky and everyone is consistent. Our schedules don't always really line up, so we only play once or twice a month, if that and normally someone is still unable to make it, but we play play regardless. And I've been playing with them for about a year now. The second group, we've been through a handful of players, but 3 of us, plus the GM have been persistent and stayed around throughout the whole thing making sure to show up on time every week, and it looks like we have to other stable players now too. And we still play almost every week. Sometimes someone has to skip or we skip the game completely, but that group is very consistent about playing and I've been playing with at least the original players for about 6 months now. The third group I played with... Well, that one lasted 3 sessions... Honestly, I think we were lucky it lasted that long... The fourth group, and the one I'm GMing for, some people have been somewhat late and somewhat inconsistent, so I'm sure there's going to be player replacements in the future, but I'm going to power through it and make sure the group as a whole survives. I've been picky though and only joining groups I think are good. So maybe, that's why I've been lucky.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Mario_VS_DK 07/26/17 2:52:51 AM #88:	Er, I was referencing post 84 in that post if you couldn't tell from that. I hit the character limit so I can't really edit it to make it clear. (Also, wow, that took a lot longer for me to type than I thought...) The tl;dr of it though is: It just takes time to find the group right for you. ... Or maybe it doesn't say that really, but that's the point I've been trying to get across. --- Stupid signature! <cite>Mario_VS_DK posted [p:883613674] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote>Er, I was referencing post 84 in that post if you couldn't tell from that. I hit the character limit so I can't really edit it to make it clear. (Also, wow, that took a lot longer for me to type than I thought...) The tl;dr of it though is: It just takes time to find the group right for you. ... Or maybe it doesn't say that really, but that's the point I've been trying to get across.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
shadowsword87 07/26/17 2:54:54 AM #89:	Mario_VS_DK posted... I've been picky though and only joining groups I think are good. So maybe, that's why I've been lucky. I think I did find the secret for finding a constant group though: games on the weekday. They're almost always professional when it comes to setting things up, and holy shit it's nice sometimes. <cite>shadowsword87 posted [p:883613730] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote><cite>Mario_VS_DK posted...</cite> <quote>I've been picky though and only joining groups I think are good. So maybe, that's why I've been lucky.</quote> I think I did find the secret for finding a constant group though: games on the weekday. They're almost always professional when it comes to setting things up, and holy shit it's nice sometimes.</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
ParanoidObsessive 07/26/17 1:15:08 PM #90:	shadowsword87 posted... I'm actually the same way, but more lenient. Like if a player says, "hey, I'm not too good at the social stuff, can I get some help?" every person at the table gives suggestions, great. Yeah, I'm not draconian about it, and I've definitely had players across all levels of self-confidence and skill-level when it comes to that sort of thing. But I do tend to try and encourage more creative behavior than simply shrugging and letting players stick in their rut. In one game I deliberately made ridiculously over-the-top NPCs and handed them to players (ie, each player got a sheet of that NPC's overall personality and goals), and they were encouraged to play them whenever that NPC was involved in the story in some way. It led to a lot of overacting (and a lot of terrible accents - one of the NPCs basically wound up being Sean Connery while another was the French knight from Monty Python and the Holy Grail), but the idea of it was to get the players to loosen up a bit with characters that "didn't matter" so they'd feel a bit more comfortable taking chances with their own characters, and I'd like to think it worked. It also made the game a lot funnier and had the players excited any time one of the NPCs showed up because it meant a fair amount of laughs, and I could use it to relax the tone if things started to get a bit too serious. shadowsword87 posted... Also if the player goes, "I just want to roll a persuasion to get past the guard", I want at least some sort of angle of why it would be OK for the PCs to be allowed past the guard, most people can handle things in the abstract. I wouldn't be adverse to saying a player can roll their Charisma/Persuasion/Social/etc to do something their character would be good at but their player might not be (in the same way I'm not entirely against players using Intelligence-type rolls to make a character smarter than they themselves are), but I do at least try to get the player to say out loud what they're roughly trying to get their character to say rather than just going "I try to convince the guard to let us in. ~roll~ Nat 20, we're in!" If nothing else, the logic you attempt to use may effect how likely the guard is to let you in (and in 5e, can influence whether or not the DM gives you Advantage or Disadvantage on the Persuasion roll), and may effect future interactions (ie, if you lie your way into a palace by telling a guard you're the local latrine polisher, the guard may remember that in the future if you try to lie your way past the same guard claiming to be the Court Astrologer. Or you might just wind up in a Sir Gareth situation where you acquire a nickname in future interactions). In the same sense, if I put you in a room and tell you that you have to solve a riddle to get out, and you go "No sweat, I'll just roll Intelligence and my character can solve the puzzle for me," I'm less likely to say "Okay, you succeed" than I am to sort of give you (the player) hints so you can solve it yourself, because I feel like that's way more satisfying than simple number crunching (because remember, again, I'm not a huge fan of "crunch" in general). --- "Wall of Text'D!" --- oldskoolplayr76 "POwned again." --- blight family <cite>ParanoidObsessive posted [p:883634122] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote><cite>shadowsword87 posted...</cite> <quote>I'm actually the same way, but more lenient. Like if a player says, "hey, I'm not too good at the social stuff, can I get some help?" every person at the table gives suggestions, great.</quote> Yeah, I'm not draconian about it, and I've definitely had players across all levels of self-confidence and skill-level when it comes to that sort of thing. But I do tend to try and encourage more creative behavior than simply shrugging and letting players stick in their rut. In one game I deliberately made ridiculously over-the-top NPCs and handed them to players (ie, each player got a sheet of that NPC's overall personality and goals), and they were encouraged to play them whenever that NPC was involved in the story in some way. It led to a lot of overacting (and a lot of terrible accents - one of the NPCs basically wound up being Sean Connery while another was the French knight from Monty Python and the Holy Grail), but the idea of it was to get the players to loosen up a bit with characters that "didn't matter" so they'd feel a bit more comfortable taking chances with their own characters, and I'd like to think it worked. It also made the game a lot funnier and had the players excited any time one of the NPCs showed up because it meant a fair amount of laughs, and I could use it to relax the tone if things started to get a bit too serious. <cite>shadowsword87 posted...</cite> <quote>Also if the player goes, "I just want to roll a persuasion to get past the guard", I want at least some sort of angle of why it would be OK for the PCs to be allowed past the guard, most people can handle things in the abstract.</quote> I wouldn't be adverse to saying a player can roll their Charisma/Persuasion/Social/etc to do something their character would be good at but their player might not be (in the same way I'm not entirely against players using Intelligence-type rolls to make a character smarter than they themselves are), but I do at least try to get the player to say out loud what they're roughly trying to get their character to say rather than just going "I try to convince the guard to let us in. ~roll~ Nat 20, we're in!" If nothing else, the logic you attempt to use may effect how likely the guard is to let you in (and in 5e, can influence whether or not the DM gives you Advantage or Disadvantage on the Persuasion roll), and may effect future interactions (ie, if you lie your way into a palace by telling a guard you're the local latrine polisher, the guard may remember that in the future if you try to lie your way past the same guard claiming to be the Court Astrologer. Or you might just wind up in a Sir Gareth situation where you acquire a nickname in future interactions). In the same sense, if I put you in a room and tell you that you have to solve a riddle to get out, and you go "No sweat, I'll just roll Intelligence and my character can solve the puzzle for me," I'm less likely to say "Okay, you succeed" than I am to sort of give you (the player) hints so you can solve it yourself, because I feel like that's way more satisfying than simple number crunching (because remember, again, I'm not a huge fan of "crunch" in general). </quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
ParanoidObsessive 07/26/17 1:15:18 PM #91:	shadowsword87 posted... While I understand the appeal of this, I think too much can absolutely be a detriment. Every paragraph you add solidifies your character before the game actually starts, and while that can work for certain games, you can easily run into situations where you need to change the character's personality to either act as a foil to someone/everyone else, fill a void, or anything else that needs to be done on the fly. That's part of the problem, though - at no point in my life have I ever been capable of "changing a character's personality" on the fly (nor would I even find doing so enjoyable). I don't see the character as a collection of stats and a blank slate who gets their motivations filled in as the game goes on, and interactions between the GM and other PCs give an idea of what sort of relationship characters "need" to have to progress the story. Even when I play games like Fallout: New Vegas (where you basically start out as a soulless personality-vacuum with zero established backstory or sense of identity) I have to sort of craft at least a rudimentary framework on that character before I can enjoy the narrative. (And to further that narrative, I will absolutely choose sub-optimal outcomes, or even make decisions that -I- personally wouldn't make, because my character WOULD. I could write radically different essays about every Shepard I've ever played in Mass Effect, in spite of every one of them starting with nothing more than a one-word "origin" and "service history". Every one of my Couriers were extremely different. And I've played Dragon Age: Origins about a dozen times over because every single character would up being different and seeing the world in a different way. Even in Skyrim or ESO, every character I play is different from the last, and WHO they are is far more important and interesting to me than what their stats or build is). Basically, I NEED to know who a person is before I can play them, and a large part of that is knowing where they come from (even if it never really comes up as part of the game itself). I need to know how their brain works, because I haven't played "me" in a roleplaying game since 1987 or so. I can't just knee-jerk say "Well, my character does this because I would do this" - I need to understand who they are and why they do what they do. Why are they adventuring in the first place? What led them to choose whatever class they are as a life path? What terrible secrets or long-forgotten rivals might they have for the GM to mine for future plot hooks? Because otherwise I am going to be one of the most passive characters you've ever seen, and I will sit quietly in the corner until the group as a whole says "Hey, we need the Rogue over here to unlock this door." At which point I will tell you "My Rogue goes over and unlocks the door," and then I will go back to sitting quietly in my corner. And I probably won't show up for next week's session, because I won't be having fun. Writing tons of backstory doesn't "lock" me into anything IMO. What it actually does is give me the framework to actually play a fun and interesting character. It's the foundation that shapes who that person is (in the same way that Alignment can help tell you who a character is - come fight me). It's the programming code that tells me whether or not my PC is going to leap in to save a maiden in distress or ignore her in favor of the more lucrative dungeon delve. It's the style choice that's going to determine whether I'd rather help sneak past the bad guy or stab him in the face (and in that sense, it will also influence every stat I take during character creation). Backstory is the wings that help me fly. Without them I'm just wriggling on the ground in the mud. (conclusion to this point next post) --- "Wall of Text'D!" --- oldskoolplayr76 "POwned again." --- blight family <cite>ParanoidObsessive posted [p:883634132] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote><cite>shadowsword87 posted...</cite> <quote>While I understand the appeal of this, I think too much can absolutely be a detriment. Every paragraph you add solidifies your character before the game actually starts, and while that can work for certain games, you can easily run into situations where you need to change the character's personality to either act as a foil to someone/everyone else, fill a void, or anything else that needs to be done on the fly.</quote> That's part of the problem, though - at no point in my life have I ever been capable of "changing a character's personality" on the fly (nor would I even find doing so enjoyable). I don't see the character as a collection of stats and a blank slate who gets their motivations filled in as the game goes on, and interactions between the GM and other PCs give an idea of what sort of relationship characters "need" to have to progress the story. Even when I play games like Fallout: New Vegas (where you basically start out as a soulless personality-vacuum with zero established backstory or sense of identity) I have to sort of craft at least a rudimentary framework on that character before I can enjoy the narrative. (And to further that narrative, I will absolutely choose sub-optimal outcomes, or even make decisions that -I- personally wouldn't make, because my character WOULD. I could write radically different essays about every Shepard I've ever played in Mass Effect, in spite of every one of them starting with nothing more than a one-word "origin" and "service history". Every one of my Couriers were extremely different. And I've played Dragon Age: Origins about a dozen times over because every single character would up being different and seeing the world in a different way. Even in Skyrim or ESO, every character I play is different from the last, and WHO they are is far more important and interesting to me than what their stats or build is). Basically, I NEED to know who a person is before I can play them, and a large part of that is knowing where they come from (even if it never really comes up as part of the game itself). I need to know how their brain works, because I haven't played "me" in a roleplaying game since 1987 or so. I can't just knee-jerk say "Well, my character does this because I would do this" - I need to understand who they are and why they do what they do. Why are they adventuring in the first place? What led them to choose whatever class they are as a life path? What terrible secrets or long-forgotten rivals might they have for the GM to mine for future plot hooks? Because otherwise I am going to be one of the most passive characters you've ever seen, and I will sit quietly in the corner until the group as a whole says "Hey, we need the Rogue over here to unlock this door." At which point I will tell you "My Rogue goes over and unlocks the door," and then I will go back to sitting quietly in my corner. And I probably won't show up for next week's session, because I won't be having fun. Writing tons of backstory doesn't "lock" me into anything IMO. What it actually does is give me the framework to actually play a fun and interesting character. It's the foundation that shapes who that person is (in the same way that Alignment can help tell you who a character is - come fight me). It's the programming code that tells me whether or not my PC is going to leap in to save a maiden in distress or ignore her in favor of the more lucrative dungeon delve. It's the style choice that's going to determine whether I'd rather help sneak past the bad guy or stab him in the face (and in that sense, it will also influence every stat I take during character creation). Backstory is the wings that help me fly. Without them I'm just wriggling on the ground in the mud. (conclusion to this point next post) </quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
ParanoidObsessive 07/26/17 1:16:12 PM #92:	All that being said, I am ABSOLUTELY capable of having a character's personality change organically through play (ie, a terrible racist winds up in a group with an elf and a dwarf and, through experience, learns to respect them and be less racist, or a wide-eyed idealist slowly becomes more practical and maybe a bit cynical after enduring constant hardship), and I'm more than willing to pre-establish connections with other players or the GM before play starts (I'm not a prima-donna who demands only my personal story be told while every other player is merely my supporting cast - players who think that way are assholes). I acknowledge that players should make more than a passing attempt to make characters who are at least potentially team-players (because otherwise, why are you in the group?), and that players who make deliberately disruptive iconoclasts are generally kind of assholes. But you can be a cooperative and accommodating player and STILL write a lot of personal backstory. (Which, incidentally, is WHY I asked Nudo a ton of questions about his setting and what various cultures were like before making a character. I wanted to make sure my character "fit" in his world, and that he didn't have to radically change things - or have him try and force me to change things - to make things work. I see the world through GM eyes far more than I do PC eyes, so I'm always inclined to try and cooperate with the GM as much as possible.) I'm also more than capable of retconning motivation and backstory of NPCs when I'm GM, because that's an entirely different situation for me. A revolving collection of supporting cast don't need to be as firmly established as the single person you're (hopefully) going to be playing for months or weeks to come. shadowsword87 posted... PotD actually is just an especially bad pool to pull from in terms of setting up. For multiple reasons. Even aside from the scheduling problems, you have the problem of people with radically different levels of skill, different levels of enthusiasm (ie, the difference between the person who shows up for the game and that's it, versus the person who plays the game and then spends 14 hours a week posting about it in the designated topic and constantly obsessing about their character and the story), and creative disagreements of every flavor (like which D&D edition/Pathfinder to use, or whether a game's setting should be fantasy or sci-fi, whether resurrection should be simple or exceedingly difficult, and so on). shadowsword87 posted... That's because I imagine you have my dad's first computer, with a whole 5MB of RAM. I'd never deny that my PC is a relic (mostly because you don't need a PC gaming capable rig when you're adamantly against the entire idea of PC gaming as a whole). But it wasn't actually THAT old/obsolete at the time we were playing (which was like five years ago, remember!). Though also keep in mind that Roll20 ran like shit on my brand new laptop just as much as it did my PC (if anything, it ran better on the PC) in spite of literally nothing else online giving me a fraction of the problems (for either platform). And Roll20 WAS a relatively new-ish program at the time (it was amateur-developed and only a few months out of initial release), and other people had problems with it as well (even if mine were pretty clearly the worst). It may actually be perfect now (not that I'd know, because I'm too biased to ever want to try using it again at this point), but at the time, it was still kind of a mess. That being said, part of the problem was that there weren't really any good alternatives to it, either. The idea of an "active" online RPG client was relatively new, and most earlier attempts were usually worse. --- "Wall of Text'D!" --- oldskoolplayr76 "POwned again." --- blight family <cite>ParanoidObsessive posted [p:883634195] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote>All that being said, I am ABSOLUTELY capable of having a character's personality change organically through play (ie, a terrible racist winds up in a group with an elf and a dwarf and, through experience, learns to respect them and be less racist, or a wide-eyed idealist slowly becomes more practical and maybe a bit cynical after enduring constant hardship), and I'm more than willing to pre-establish connections with other players or the GM before play starts (I'm not a prima-donna who demands only my personal story be told while every other player is merely my supporting cast - players who think that way are assholes). I acknowledge that players should make more than a passing attempt to make characters who are at least potentially team-players (because otherwise, why are you in the group?), and that players who make deliberately disruptive iconoclasts are generally kind of assholes. But you can be a cooperative and accommodating player and STILL write a lot of personal backstory. (Which, incidentally, is WHY I asked Nudo a ton of questions about his setting and what various cultures were like before making a character. I wanted to make sure my character "fit" in his world, and that he didn't have to radically change things - or have him try and force me to change things - to make things work. I see the world through GM eyes far more than I do PC eyes, so I'm always inclined to try and cooperate with the GM as much as possible.) I'm also more than capable of retconning motivation and backstory of NPCs when I'm GM, because that's an entirely different situation for me. A revolving collection of supporting cast don't need to be as firmly established as the single person you're (hopefully) going to be playing for months or weeks to come. <cite>shadowsword87 posted...</cite> <quote>PotD actually is just an especially bad pool to pull from in terms of setting up.</quote> For multiple reasons. Even aside from the scheduling problems, you have the problem of people with radically different levels of skill, different levels of enthusiasm (ie, the difference between the person who shows up for the game and that's it, versus the person who plays the game and then spends 14 hours a week posting about it in the designated topic and constantly obsessing about their character and the story), and creative disagreements of every flavor (like which D&D edition/Pathfinder to use, or whether a game's setting should be fantasy or sci-fi, whether resurrection should be simple or exceedingly difficult, and so on). <cite>shadowsword87 posted...</cite> <quote>That's because I imagine you have my dad's first computer, with a whole 5MB of RAM.</quote> I'd never deny that my PC is a relic (mostly because you don't need a PC gaming capable rig when you're adamantly against the entire idea of PC gaming as a whole). But it wasn't actually THAT old/obsolete at the time we were playing (which was like five years ago, remember!). Though also keep in mind that Roll20 ran like shit on my brand new laptop just as much as it did my PC (if anything, it ran better on the PC) in spite of literally nothing else online giving me a fraction of the problems (for either platform). And Roll20 WAS a relatively new-ish program at the time (it was amateur-developed and only a few months out of initial release), and other people had problems with it as well (even if mine were pretty clearly the worst). It may actually be perfect now (not that I'd know, because I'm too biased to ever want to try using it again at this point), but at the time, it was still kind of a mess. That being said, part of the problem was that there weren't really any good alternatives to it, either. The idea of an "active" online RPG client was relatively new, and most earlier attempts were usually worse. </quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
ParanoidObsessive 07/26/17 1:16:33 PM #93:	shadowsword87 posted... cough cough That's because you put too much backstory in cough cough No, that's what happens when you're told one thing and plan your character around it, only for something entirely different (and opposite) to take place. It wouldn't have been any different if I'd decided to make a Cleric character with no backstory only to discover Nudo's core setting premise (which was that the world was sealed away from the rest of the universe, so there were no gods and resurrection magic didn't really work properly), or if I'd decided to make an elf character based on standard D&D elves only for him to tell me after the game started that in his setting, elves were actually squat 3ft tall humanoids who don't have magic and who live in caves. Or if I'd asked him if it was okay for me to make a Pathfinder Gunslinger character, and he said absolutely, only for him to tell me after we started playing that gunpowder doesn't actually work in his setting so none of my abilities work. Or if I made a Ravenloft-flavored character but played them in Planescape. There are certain implicit things you NEED to know when creating a character, and I consider tone to be one of the more important ones. It helps make a lot of concept, narrative, and stat choices for you, and even if you're trying to be as agnostic about your character as you possibly can ("Okay, I'm a level 1 Wizard but I woke up in the back of a cart with amnesia 20 minutes before the first session starts so I know literally nothing about my personality or backstory"), what the world is like and what the tone/genre of the game is going to be will make a fair number of decisions for you (and will give you problems if dissonance kicks in later). And it's the GM's job to TELL players what to expect. Don't tell me we're playing LotR and then run CoC. My question was "What's the tone?", and that affected how I made the character, but if I didn't know anything about who the character was and where they came from until multiple sessions in, I wouldn't have been able to play them anyway. They'd have been stats on a page with no personality (and without a seed, they never would have developed one, either). And it's not even as if this was a huge problem (though talking about it in depth makes it seem like it was) - making a new character that better fit the tone wasn't all THAT difficult (and it wasn't even disruptive - it's not as if my first character was crucial to the plot, and Nudo had deliberately made the setting so that PCs could shuffle in and out whenever). It really only became a problem integrating the new character because Roll20 kept dumping me every other week, and then you guys were in the middle of the wilderness for like three weeks so it didn't make sense to bring a new character into the middle of the scene (and again, it wasn't worth being disruptive about it when there was only a 30% chance Roll20 was going to let me play anyway). shadowsword87 posted... Don't act like I didn't see you skipping out on giving a legitimate reason why you can't use a mic like a normal person by the way. "Because I don't like being mic'd" is a perfectly legitimate reason even if you damned young'uns can't comprehend the concept. Just because you filthy millennials live your lives on Facebook and the Twitters and love voice-chat in your MMOs and FPSes and post all your private pics to Snapchat and Instagram and so on doesn't mean that someone born in the 1970s is going to see all of those things in the same light. And no, it's not even because I have a terrible squeeky voice or anything - I HAVE been on mic (against my will), and there are about three PotDers (past and present) who've heard my voice. I just don't LIKE using mics. Personal bias. --- "Wall of Text'D!" --- oldskoolplayr76 "POwned again." --- blight family <cite>ParanoidObsessive posted [p:883634211] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote><cite>shadowsword87 posted...</cite> <quote>cough cough That's because you put too much backstory in cough cough</quote> No, that's what happens when you're told one thing and plan your character around it, only for something entirely different (and opposite) to take place. It wouldn't have been any different if I'd decided to make a Cleric character with no backstory only to discover Nudo's core setting premise (which was that the world was sealed away from the rest of the universe, so there were no gods and resurrection magic didn't really work properly), or if I'd decided to make an elf character based on standard D&D elves only for him to tell me after the game started that in his setting, elves were actually squat 3ft tall humanoids who don't have magic and who live in caves. Or if I'd asked him if it was okay for me to make a Pathfinder Gunslinger character, and he said absolutely, only for him to tell me after we started playing that gunpowder doesn't actually work in his setting so none of my abilities work. Or if I made a Ravenloft-flavored character but played them in Planescape. There are certain implicit things you NEED to know when creating a character, and I consider tone to be one of the more important ones. It helps make a lot of concept, narrative, and stat choices for you, and even if you're trying to be as agnostic about your character as you possibly can ("Okay, I'm a level 1 Wizard but I woke up in the back of a cart with amnesia 20 minutes before the first session starts so I know literally nothing about my personality or backstory"), what the world is like and what the tone/genre of the game is going to be will make a fair number of decisions for you (and will give you problems if dissonance kicks in later). And it's the GM's job to TELL players what to expect. Don't tell me we're playing LotR and then run CoC. My question was "What's the tone?", and that affected how I made the character, but if I didn't know anything about who the character was and where they came from until multiple sessions in, I wouldn't have been able to play them anyway. They'd have been stats on a page with no personality (and without a seed, they never would have developed one, either). And it's not even as if this was a huge problem (though talking about it in depth makes it seem like it was) - making a new character that better fit the tone wasn't all THAT difficult (and it wasn't even disruptive - it's not as if my first character was crucial to the plot, and Nudo had deliberately made the setting so that PCs could shuffle in and out whenever). It really only became a problem integrating the new character because Roll20 kept dumping me every other week, and then you guys were in the middle of the wilderness for like three weeks so it didn't make sense to bring a new character into the middle of the scene (and again, it wasn't worth being disruptive about it when there was only a 30% chance Roll20 was going to let me play anyway). <cite>shadowsword87 posted...</cite> <quote>Don't act like I didn't see you skipping out on giving a legitimate reason why you can't use a mic like a normal person by the way.</quote> "Because I don't like being mic'd" is a perfectly legitimate reason even if you damned young'uns can't comprehend the concept. Just because you filthy millennials live your lives on Facebook and the Twitters and love voice-chat in your MMOs and FPSes and post all your private pics to Snapchat and Instagram and so on doesn't mean that someone born in the 1970s is going to see all of those things in the same light. And no, it's not even because I have a terrible squeeky voice or anything - I HAVE been on mic (against my will), and there are about three PotDers (past and present) who've heard my voice. I just don't LIKE using mics. Personal bias. </quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
ParanoidObsessive 07/26/17 1:46:30 PM #94:	Mario_VS_DK posted... I suppose I can understand that. I feel like it really makes a game more spontaneous and fun when you're using a mic. I roleplayed quite a bit on a forum a while back, and that was fun, but I also think that it's more fun to do it with mics. The flip-side is that text-only can make it easier for some players to be more immersive. The same player who feels self-conscious as fuck about saying "Forsooth! Let us tarry in yon drinking establishment on this fine spring evening!" might be far more comfortable simply typing it. That being said, there's always some balance between extremes. In my older days of heavy forum RP the standard practice for a lot of us was to post actions, descriptions, and dialogue in a specific chat client (SeaChat, if I remember correctly? Maybe not...), but we'd also use AIM (either text-only or mic'd) to discuss OOC stuff or ask game-related questions that would affect the scene. Which made it relatively easy to export scenes as document files that could be read by anyone after the fact without a ton of dice rolls or game mechanic cruft, so even non-players could read it like a story and enjoy it for the narrative alone. Mario_VS_DK posted... I mean, there are players who feel really feel the need to talk, but I've found that they are far and between, and if you actually talk to them about it, they're pretty understanding and willing to quiet down a bit so the other players can get a chance to talk. For in-person games I think it's more indicative of other issues, but in a purely online scenario, I think the problem is the reduced number of social cues and problems caused by lag and delay. People can wind up talking over each other without meaning to, and just casual table talk can become a problem. It's not insurmountable, and it's not something that ruins live-mic RP entirely, but it's just one of the factors that can add up to problems if other things are also piling up. Mario_VS_DK posted... I think I ran into more problems with cross talking in forums than I have with voice chats. Always from same time posts, or people typing a lengthier post and not hitting refresh before they hit submit. The difference there is that you can still READ cross-talked posts, whereas if two people talk over each other you may miss what someone says entirely, and more passive players may back down rather than reassert what they wanted to say. Again, not saying this is a specific reason why one style is terrible while the other is great - both styles have pluses and minuses. If anything, I tend to feel like it's just a matter of personal preference more than anything. (That being said, as per earlier, cross-talk and similar problems CAN be avoided easily in a forum-based game simply by coordinating via a chat client or in PMs or even just keeping OOC talk to a different forum. Or keeping it to the same forum, but deliberately formatting posts differently for OOC talk and IC actions.) --- "Wall of Text'D!" --- oldskoolplayr76 "POwned again." --- blight family <cite>ParanoidObsessive posted [p:883635894] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote><cite>Mario_VS_DK posted...</cite> <quote>I suppose I can understand that. I feel like it really makes a game more spontaneous and fun when you're using a mic. I roleplayed quite a bit on a forum a while back, and that was fun, but I also think that it's more fun to do it with mics.</quote> The flip-side is that text-only can make it easier for some players to be more immersive. The same player who feels self-conscious as fuck about saying "Forsooth! Let us tarry in yon drinking establishment on this fine spring evening!" might be far more comfortable simply typing it. That being said, there's always some balance between extremes. In my older days of heavy forum RP the standard practice for a lot of us was to post actions, descriptions, and dialogue in a specific chat client (SeaChat, if I remember correctly? Maybe not...), but we'd also use AIM (either text-only or mic'd) to discuss OOC stuff or ask game-related questions that would affect the scene. Which made it relatively easy to export scenes as document files that could be read by anyone after the fact without a ton of dice rolls or game mechanic cruft, so even non-players could read it like a story and enjoy it for the narrative alone. <cite>Mario_VS_DK posted...</cite> <quote>I mean, there are players who feel really feel the need to talk, but I've found that they are far and between, and if you actually talk to them about it, they're pretty understanding and willing to quiet down a bit so the other players can get a chance to talk.</quote> For in-person games I think it's more indicative of other issues, but in a purely online scenario, I think the problem is the reduced number of social cues and problems caused by lag and delay. People can wind up talking over each other without meaning to, and just casual table talk can become a problem. It's not insurmountable, and it's not something that ruins live-mic RP entirely, but it's just one of the factors that can add up to problems if other things are also piling up. <cite>Mario_VS_DK posted...</cite> <quote>I think I ran into more problems with cross talking in forums than I have with voice chats. Always from same time posts, or people typing a lengthier post and not hitting refresh before they hit submit.</quote> The difference there is that you can still READ cross-talked posts, whereas if two people talk over each other you may miss what someone says entirely, and more passive players may back down rather than reassert what they wanted to say. Again, not saying this is a specific reason why one style is terrible while the other is great - both styles have pluses and minuses. If anything, I tend to feel like it's just a matter of personal preference more than anything. (That being said, as per earlier, cross-talk and similar problems CAN be avoided easily in a forum-based game simply by coordinating via a chat client or in PMs or even just keeping OOC talk to a different forum. Or keeping it to the same forum, but deliberately formatting posts differently for OOC talk and IC actions.) </quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
ParanoidObsessive 07/26/17 1:46:39 PM #95:	Mario_VS_DK posted... I especially agree on the not just rolling up stats and playing though. It takes me at least a few days for me to come up with a character I want to play. Since I play Pathfinder, I want mechanical things to suit that character's personality. Sometimes, I find a neat archetype or prestige class that makes me come up with a great character, and that's just the best for me. That's one of the nice things about some games, where they have "Adventure Paths" or "Heritage Tables" where you can randomly generate backstory to help give you ideas for a character, or games that allow for "Quirks" or the like that give you personality traits that aren't handled mechanically as much as narratively. Or even games like Fate where you basically have Aspects that help define you as an archetypal character more than just a collection of stats. Back when I used to make a ton of NPCs for games, I used to trawl fashion model sites online for pictures, then basically build an entire personality around a random person's appearance. From there you could easily start to establish the more mechanistic aspects of a character based on WHO that person was to you. Some people do things like draw a predetermined number of Tarot cards and allowing the meaning or imagery of each card to inspire ideas about what sort of character they're crafting. And yes, some people can just start from "I want to DPS so I'll play a Rogue, I'll make them an elf for the stat boosts, I'll give them these abilities because I think they'll be useful in play, and now I will slowly begin to craft a backstory to justify all of those things." Even if that's never really been MY bag. Mario_VS_DK posted... Yeah, people can be flaky. But I'm sure it's like that in real life too. You just need to find a group of people who can consistently make it. You probably won't always get it on the first try, or even the second... But if you hang in there and keep looking for people who will consistently show up on time, eventually you'll find a group to play with. Oh, I agree. The problem is more that PotD in general seems to encourage a more unstable recruiting pool than your average attempt to establish online RP games. Vastly different time-zones, the fickleness of interest (since we're not on an RPG-focused site as much as we are a video game site where some people like the idea of RP), differing skill levels, technical issues, and the general burn-out of organizing an online game tends to kill attempts faster than it would on an RPG-centric site (or real-life). Mario_VS_DK posted... I've been picky though and only joining groups I think are good. So maybe, that's why I've been lucky. I have as well (for the most part - I've been in bad groups from time-to-time). Which is another reason why I have no real interest in heading to NYC to RP-beg my way into one group or another or put my ad in the Nerd Personals in an attempt to find a local group to glom onto. I've been kind of spoiled by good groups in the past (most of which were friends who wanted to have fun and thus ran a game rather than strangers who wanted to play and thus maybe became friends later), so I don't really feel like putting in the effort to go trawling for a local group at this point in my life (especially when attempts to do so on the past usually never panned out). Sort of the same reason why, in spite of enjoying Magic: the Gathering and not really getting a lot of chances to play it lately, I don't really feel like going to a local store and playing in tournaments or trying to find other players. I don't love the game as much as I love the idea of playing games with people I already know and like. --- "Wall of Text'D!" --- oldskoolplayr76 "POwned again." --- blight family <cite>ParanoidObsessive posted [p:883635904] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote><cite>Mario_VS_DK posted...</cite> <quote>I especially agree on the not just rolling up stats and playing though. It takes me at least a few days for me to come up with a character I want to play. Since I play Pathfinder, I want mechanical things to suit that character's personality. Sometimes, I find a neat archetype or prestige class that makes me come up with a great character, and that's just the best for me. </quote> That's one of the nice things about some games, where they have "Adventure Paths" or "Heritage Tables" where you can randomly generate backstory to help give you ideas for a character, or games that allow for "Quirks" or the like that give you personality traits that aren't handled mechanically as much as narratively. Or even games like Fate where you basically have Aspects that help define you as an archetypal character more than just a collection of stats. Back when I used to make a ton of NPCs for games, I used to trawl fashion model sites online for pictures, then basically build an entire personality around a random person's appearance. From there you could easily start to establish the more mechanistic aspects of a character based on WHO that person was to you. Some people do things like draw a predetermined number of Tarot cards and allowing the meaning or imagery of each card to inspire ideas about what sort of character they're crafting. And yes, some people can just start from "I want to DPS so I'll play a Rogue, I'll make them an elf for the stat boosts, I'll give them these abilities because I think they'll be useful in play, and now I will slowly begin to craft a backstory to justify all of those things." Even if that's never really been MY bag. <cite>Mario_VS_DK posted...</cite> <quote>Yeah, people can be flaky. But I'm sure it's like that in real life too. You just need to find a group of people who can consistently make it. You probably won't always get it on the first try, or even the second... But if you hang in there and keep looking for people who will consistently show up on time, eventually you'll find a group to play with.</quote> Oh, I agree. The problem is more that PotD in general seems to encourage a more unstable recruiting pool than your average attempt to establish online RP games. Vastly different time-zones, the fickleness of interest (since we're not on an RPG-focused site as much as we are a video game site where some people like the idea of RP), differing skill levels, technical issues, and the general burn-out of organizing an online game tends to kill attempts faster than it would on an RPG-centric site (or real-life). <cite>Mario_VS_DK posted...</cite> <quote>I've been picky though and only joining groups I think are good. So maybe, that's why I've been lucky.</quote> I have as well (for the most part - I've been in bad groups from time-to-time). Which is another reason why I have no real interest in heading to NYC to RP-beg my way into one group or another or put my ad in the Nerd Personals in an attempt to find a local group to glom onto. I've been kind of spoiled by good groups in the past (most of which were friends who wanted to have fun and thus ran a game rather than strangers who wanted to play and thus maybe became friends later), so I don't really feel like putting in the effort to go trawling for a local group at this point in my life (especially when attempts to do so on the past usually never panned out). Sort of the same reason why, in spite of enjoying Magic: the Gathering and not really getting a lot of chances to play it lately, I don't really feel like going to a local store and playing in tournaments or trying to find other players. I don't love the game as much as I love the idea of playing games with people I already know and like. </quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Mario_VS_DK 07/29/17 1:05:44 AM #96:	Ugh. Had to cancel this week's game. I swear this game is group is cursed. (I mean, I didn't really have anything planned for the game yet, so at least I can make sure next session is better... That's not they reason I canceled it though!) --- Stupid signature! <cite>Mario_VS_DK posted [p:883798271] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote>Ugh. Had to cancel this week's game. I swear this game is group is cursed. (I mean, I didn't really have anything planned for the game yet, so at least I can make sure next session is better... That's not they reason I canceled it though!)</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
ParanoidObsessive 07/29/17 4:52:23 AM #97:	Cancel? Psssht! My players once harassed me into driving to one of their houses during an ice storm about two weeks after I'd had my gall bladder removed, where simply walking from one place to another took most of my physical effort and concentration, and left me busted out in a cold sweat. If you can run/make it to a game, you'd better be dead! --- "Wall of Text'D!" --- oldskoolplayr76 "POwned again." --- blight family <cite>ParanoidObsessive posted [p:883804363] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote>Cancel? Psssht! My players once harassed me into driving to one of their houses during an ice storm about two weeks after I'd had my gall bladder removed, where simply walking from one place to another took most of my physical effort and concentration, and left me busted out in a cold sweat. If you can run/make it to a game, you'd better be dead! </quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Mario_VS_DK 07/29/17 4:58:43 AM #98:	This one is my issue. Which means only one person in the group so far hasn't had issues so far in the 6 weeks we've been a group. And he's the one who probably has the most issues making it to each game since it's 11PM when it starts for him. Makes me feel kind of guilty. :( --- Stupid signature! <cite>Mario_VS_DK posted [p:883804475] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote>This one is my issue. Which means only one person in the group so far hasn't had issues so far in the 6 weeks we've been a group. And he's the one who probably has the most issues making it to each game since it's 11PM when it starts for him. Makes me feel kind of guilty. :(</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
ParanoidObsessive 07/29/17 5:01:59 AM #99:	Mario_VS_DK posted... This one is my issue. That's what I mean! You're the GM - you're not allowed to have issues! There is important RP business to get done! --- "Wall of Text'D!" --- oldskoolplayr76 "POwned again." --- blight family <cite>ParanoidObsessive posted [p:883804524] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote><cite>Mario_VS_DK posted...</cite> <quote>This one is my issue.</quote> That's what I mean! You're the GM - you're not allowed to have issues! There is important RP business to get done! </quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Mario_VS_DK 08/01/17 7:57:58 PM #100:	Should I bump this? --- Stupid signature! <cite>Mario_VS_DK posted [p:884014211] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote>Should I bump this?</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
Lightning Bolt 08/01/17 8:11:07 PM #101:	Probably --- One day dude, I'm just gonna get off the bus, and I'm gonna run in the woods and never come back, and when I come back I'm gonna be the knife master! -The Rev <cite>Lightning Bolt posted [p:884014886] in DMed my se... [t:75526415]...</cite> <quote>Probably</quote> ... Copied to Clipboard!
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Poll of the Day > DMed my second game of DnD yesterday. (+) Yeah! (+)

Poll of the Day > DMed my second game of DnD yesterday.