Board 8 > ~~Japanese History~~ Mafia Topic 3 - I am not going to battle to win

(+) Yeah! (+)

Votals as of post #50 (Chris)

[5] Oddity - KBM, Sceptile, Death, Chris, Phoenix, (Scare)
[3] Sceptile - (Oddity), Lolo, (Oddity), (Oddity), Oddity, Dowolf
[2] Scare - (Chris), (Oddity), Plum, (Dowolf), VeryInsane
[1] Death - pezloco
[1] Red - SBell
[1] Lolo - (Tombolo), Tombolo
[0] Chris - (Scare)
[0] VeryInsane - (Phoenix)
[0] Phoenix - (Dowolf), (Oddity)
[0] pezloco - (Chris), (Plum), (SBell), (Tombolo)
[0] Dowolf - (Sceptile), (Tombolo)
[0] No Lynch - (Tombolo), (pezloco)
[0] Plum - (Scare)

With 15 alive, it takes 8 to lynch. Day ends at 9:00:00 PM Eastern TONIGHT (About two hours)
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I'm here... but not really.

I"m still at the office, just hit 11 hours. Kill me.

I need to get out of here but i'll probably not be availabel for lynch.

I know Oddity claimed vaneelers, not really surprised there.

Chris, thoughts on what happens if Oddity flips Town?
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Anything super quick must respond to stuff before I topic dive?
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If Oddity flips town I make a note to talk to Oddity post game about changing his approach to me 100% game to game for no reason.
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DoomTheGyarados posted...

If Oddity flips town I make a note to talk to Oddity post game about changing his approach to me 100% game to game for no reason.

Ok this answer is shit.

Any thoughts that pertain to this game?
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Not a single one for you, Sbell. That boy ain't flipping town.
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ScareChan posted...

If you are scum I feel worse on death again since you are just using him to build your case for you

but yeah oddity should claim ##Vote: Oddity

Plum, if he was forcing a claim he seems to have some idea of votals even if he didn't know exactly how many. I don't think one says much about the other.
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DoomTheGyarados posted...

Not a single one for you, Sbell. That boy ain't flipping town.

While i appreciate your confidence...

For arguments sake, Oddity flips Town. You get killed overnight. You are now silent for the rest of the game.

You already said you like everyone that hopped onto Oddity, based on your confidence of his scumdum. So if he does flip Town, who is the least likely to win your vote of confidence of that group of people moving forward?
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There's a rogue comma in that post. Sorry.
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Fine, mental exercise, I get it.

Pez because his logic on Oddity, if he is town, is basically 'oh boy look at me, I called oddity town I told you guys'
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Of course if Oddity should flip town and you don't die overnight...

Well, open season i suppose.
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Alright, I'm fucking pissed. I know it's not going to avert my lynch but fuck it, I'm past caring.

I'm Enomoto Takeaki, town vanilla. I was an admiral/diplomat. I had to work for the empire of Japan or I would have been killed or something, I set up some new country in Hokkaido and was loyal to the Shogun or something I don't care.

Chris' argument against me is complete bullshit. The hoppy vote thing is true, I've put my vote a lot of different places, but it's just how I play day 1. What really pisses me off is he seems to think my behavior has changed from this game to last game. What did death report back? I was initially wary of Chris but found some towntells on him without 'defaulting to scum' or some such shit. Hmm... what's different here? I found no fucking towntells is what happened here. So my default to scum read never went away.

Alright Chris, which part of your argument against me haven't I addressed?

Also awhile back he mentioned something about 'actually considering my arguments instead of just default to scum' or something. Hmmmmm... when did I do that this game? Was it when I tried to figure the whole scare situation out? Yah it might be that time. I did vote scare to get some information out of him. And then what was the end result of that? I disagreed with chris. Maybe that was my fucking sin, I didn't immediately agree with chris. Was scare's argument bad? Yah, but I think scum scare is smart enough to fabricate something besides chess board. Totally subjective call obviously, but that's what happened.
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Appeal to emotion. Yawn.
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Alright Chris, which part of your argument against me haven't I addressed?

This line should be at the end of my post.
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Oddity, Full Player List.

Towniest to Scumiest.

If you'd please.
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Oddity, it's B8 we can still avoid the Lynch. Did you see my post at the end of the last topic? I think it was near the end of the page you claimed on. Did that sound about right to you?
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Oh yah, forgot:
##Unvote
##Vote: Chris

I think you're better than this as town.

Town

VI
pez
Tom
Sbell

Townish

Scare
dowolf

????
plum
red

Scumish
Death (I'm a little unsure, he capitalized at the perfect time on my weakness but I don't know if I give scum death enough credit to see and strike like that)
Phoenix
KBM

Scummy
Scep
Chris
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Was that the one where you said I was only 60% sure on my worst suspicion of Scep? Yah, right on the money.
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Sbell and I guess whoever else... how do you feel about that dowolf/plum snippet from about an hour ago? I have my own thoughts regarding it. I wanna see how my thoughts line up with other people's.
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Has KBM posted anything substantial??

Additionally, don't let Chris live till endgame, he'll kill you all.
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I actually feel okay on Chris, which matters to me as I think my instincts on him haven't been that off.

Oddity, I don't know fully what made you decide I was scum. You've been on that all game. What was that?
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Okay let me take off my coat.

*Folds it neatly on the chair*

Now please excuse me as I drink a bottle of water, I am a bit parched.

*Drinks some water*

All better.

Alright, I'm fucking pissed. I know it's not going to avert my lynch but fuck it, I'm past caring.

Anyway for those not familiar with technical mafia terms this is called an 'appeal to emotion.' Oddity is noting he is pissed, for some reason or another. Perhaps it is the calm, deliberate, and focused way I have garnered votes to his lynch. He uses a lot of language in this post that is meant to draw sympathy and characterize me as unreasonable, and we'll get to that. But Oddity here is just appealing to people's general belief that town is fiery and scum is stoic without bringing anything to the table.

Chris' argument against me is complete bullshit. The hoppy vote thing is true, I've put my vote a lot of different places, but it's just how I play day 1. What really pisses me off is he seems to think my behavior has changed from this game to last game. What did death report back? I was initially wary of Chris but found some towntells on him without 'defaulting to scum' or some such shit. Hmm... what's different here? I found no fucking towntells is what happened here. So my default to scum read never went away.

Here's the problem though, he starts calling it complete bullshit but then kind of veers off into the realm of vagueness. We all saw exactly what Death reported back, and we don't need Oddity retelling us the events with his slant to know what we saw,. In that previous game Oddity didn't mention any sort of default slant on me - he mentioned behavior in that game that made him wary. Here because I had "burned him a lot" he starts off as being suspicious of me without laying the proper groundwork for that suspicion, which is a stark and obvious departure from Mercs 4 mafia. Only by not going 1 for 1 and twisting his words to suit his needs can Oddity attempt to match the two games together. What I had Death do was much more telling and obvious to the naked eye that Oddity's stance on how he treats me completely changed game to game. That he is trying to say otherwise now is just a poor attempt to shift the argument.

Also awhile back he mentioned something about 'actually considering my arguments instead of just default to scum' or something. Hmmmmm... when did I do that this game? Was it when I tried to figure the whole scare situation out? Yah it might be that time. I did vote scare to get some information out of him. And then what was the end result of that? I disagreed with chris. Maybe that was my fucking sin, I didn't immediately agree with chris. Was scare's argument bad? Yah, but I think scum scare is smart enough to fabricate something besides chess board. Totally subjective call obviously, but that's what happened.

Again you rely on vagueness and a bit of a twisting of the words. It's a clever attempt, I grant you, but the problem is it misses its mark here. When I say 'consider my arguments' I actually meant both ways there. In M4 you considered my early game and went "by golly, that's scummy" because it didn't match what you remembered from me, whereas here you don't really have anything like that before going "Oh yeah, I always have Chris phobia" when I think you are one of the players who doesn't really have that to such a degree and you certainly didn't with how you handled M4.

My argument is actually very sound, thank you very much.
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You forgot a player, oddity.
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Sceptilesolar posted...

I actually feel okay on Chris, which matters to me as I think my instincts on him haven't been that off.

Oddity, I don't know fully what made you decide I was scum. You've been on that all game. What was that?

It amounted to you set his guy off the worst. But worst is relative. Everyone misread that as he thought he had a strong argument. But really you just seemed off and that means little day 1.
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I didn't decide you were scum, I thought you were the most likely scum of the early active players... I felt you were fading into the background while giving the illusion of activity. Then you were kind of mean to me (understandable, it's mafia) and I never bothered to reevaluate that position. I'd say I'm about.. 70/30 on you now. Could be wrong.
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Was it you, Lolo? You're in my ???? I liked your vote on Scep.
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pezloco posted...

ScareChan posted...

If you are scum I feel worse on death again since you are just using him to build your case for you

but yeah oddity should claim ##Vote: Oddity

Plum, if he was forcing a claim he seems to have some idea of votals even if he didn't know exactly how many. I don't think one says much about the other.

True
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What vagueness? The no towntells thing? I can't go into detail on that because I know it when I see it. I don't even remember the towntells I had on you in that previous game. I didn't mention it in that game because I had more expectations of you that game. There were other things to talk about. When I say I default to chrisfear, I mean that I have a hard time trusting just about anything you say. Doesn't mean I won't engage you. Just that even when you make a well reasoned argument, I second guess your arguments more than others. I have to examine them more because you're good at making well reasoned arguments that are complete bullshit.
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Oddity posted...

Oh yah, forgot:
##Unvote
##Vote: Chris

I think you're better than this as town.

Town

VI
pez
Tom
Sbell

Townish

Scare
dowolf

????
plum
red

Scumish
Death (I'm a little unsure, he capitalized at the perfect time on my weakness but I don't know if I give scum death enough credit to see and strike like that)
Phoenix
KBM

Scummy
Scep
Chris

Nope.jpg

Not buying the Chris is good so he obviously knows I am Town argument when the argument is actually good.

Like if this was a "Chris but" crusade I could buy it
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Chris gut*
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I didn't mention it in that game...

it is the default scum position.
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Oddity's countervote is weird.DoomTheGyarados posted...

Here's the problem though, he starts calling it complete bullshit but then kind of veers off into the realm of vagueness. We all saw exactly what Death reported back, and we don't need Oddity retelling us the events with his slant to know what we saw,. In that previous game Oddity didn't mention any sort of default slant on me - he mentioned behavior in that game that made him wary. Here because I had "burned him a lot" he starts off as being suspicious of me without laying the proper groundwork for that suspicion, which is a stark and obvious departure from Mercs 4 mafia. Only by not going 1 for 1 and twisting his words to suit his needs can Oddity attempt to match the two games together. What I had Death do was much more telling and obvious to the naked eye that Oddity's stance on how he treats me completely changed game to game. That he is trying to say otherwise now is just a poor attempt to shift the argument.

Seems to me you're twisting Oddity's words, not the other way around, tbqh.
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Your early game here was a magic trick. I evaluated it as a town tell. Then you went onto Scare, right? Ummm... I came to that argument. What argument do you think I failed to evaluate of yours, Chris?
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No, not that at all actually. The comparison between YOU. No towntells is what it is, but you trying to say you've acted similar between M4 and this game is wildly inaccurate and we have the posts to prove it, and posted them. You engaged me a lot in M4 while drawing a conclusion that I could be scum, here you didn't lay the groundwork properly.
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Phoenix-Smasher posted...

Sbell and I guess whoever else... how do you feel about that dowolf/plum snippet from about an hour ago? I have my own thoughts regarding it. I wanna see how my thoughts line up with other people's.

i also want to know what people thought about that, bee tee dubs.

Including you, Phoenix.
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oh good lolo is here

##vote: Lolo
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Correction: I evaluated as a null tell
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Dowolf you are welcome to that belief but I don't think it has much of a basis in reality.
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Right now, I would contend that reality doesn't have much of a basis in reality.

It's been a long day.

But that's beside the point.
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Look, I don't care what I posted in that game, this is this game. My attitude towards you is exactly the same in both games. I default towards scummy unless I see something that gives me a towntell. I laid more groundwork for the scummy thing in that game because it had been a long time and I could easily describe the reasons behind my scumread of you. In this game I believe I said I have gut that you are scum or some such. That's it. What more do you want me to say? Gut in itself is indescribable in this particular case. It's just how I feel.
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Some reason you needed to wait for me to be here, scare? Tom didn't, after all.
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Lolo_Guru posted...

You forgot a player, oddity.

did he really though

Oddity posted...

f*** it, I'm past caring.

oh okay bye then! I'm not sure what you could've done to sway me but gettin' mad and rollin' over wasn't it.

Sadly I don't know much at all about the flavor here, despite my weebiness >_>
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This is me rolling over? Yah, thanks Tom.
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Oddity posted...

Look, I don't care what I posted in that game, this is this game. My attitude towards you is exactly the same in both games. I default towards scummy unless I see something that gives me a towntell. I laid more groundwork for the scummy thing in that game because it had been a long time and I could easily describe the reasons behind my scumread of you. In this game I believe I said I have gut that you are scum or some such. That's it. What more do you want me to say? Gut in itself is indescribable in this particular case. It's just how I feel.

By the way folks, here it is. I don't care what I posted in that game, my attitude towards you is the exact same.

Plum my old friend, do you remember what I always tell you about how scum are afraid to show weakness?

"my attitude towards you is exactly the same."

Can't even admit it isn't, a tragic flaw to scum.
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I mean you say you're past caring but then you try to go super saiyan on me with the big roar and stuff and I am not going to feed into that.
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Oddity posted...

This is me rolling over? Yah, thanks Tom.

It was before I refreshed!
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Even people who are defending Oddity like pez noted there is clearly a difference. It is just that to them, in theory, differences can be explained by circumstance.

Oddity as scum though felt like that point was make or break and has to defend it. "No you are wrong," he protests. No, I'm not. I've laid out my argument clearly and without being unfair in any way.
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##Unvote;
##Vote: Plum

this is getting annoying, and I have a headache already anyways.
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Tom Bombadil posted...

Lolo_Guru posted...

You forgot a player, oddity.

did he really though

sick burn, bro
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thanks
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