Current Events > if piracy = lost potential sales

(+) Yeah! (+)

does that mean if someone browses a store without buying anything, theft was just committed?
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It does if it's a book/magazine store and they read without paying.
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Music piracy = more potential people at shows

Game piracy = theft and there's really no arguing around that
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What compels you to make the same topic 5,000 times
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butthole666 posted...

Music piracy = more potential people at shows

Game piracy = theft and there's really no arguing around that

I like how people add these modifiers to the definition of piracy to justify their own piracy.
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Resolution posted...

What compels you to make the same topic 5,000 times

when have i made another topic about piracy?
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why do you defend piracy
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where am i defending it
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In what bizarro universe is pirating the same as browsing?

How is just looking at a shirt the same as playing a complete game?
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Annihilated posted...

In what bizarro universe is pirating the same as browsing?

I think the magazine thing ryangrad is the best example . If you go to a store and read a magazine, you're not stealing. However, you've stopped the selling you the magazine because you've already read it.
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IIRC multiple reports and studies have shown (some by government even) that piracy has had no negative impact on various media sales at all.
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Villain posted...

IIRC multiple reports and studies have shown (some by government even) that piracy has had no negative impact on various media sales at all.

so who are the gullible fools that believe it does?
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fusespliff posted...

I like how people add these modifiers to the definition of piracy to justify their own piracy.

They don't want to feel guilty.
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Piracy is a non-issue. The guys pirating the games weren't going to buy them anyway.
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I thought piracy went down when the size of games went up (making it more complicated for them).
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I know TC is just trolling, but his argument is more akin to kids who would open up the action figure package in the toy isle and playing with the action figure, before leaving the toy and heading home. The store isn't losing any money from it, but there's a reason why those packages now require scissors or a knife to open. >_>
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if i watch a movie with a friend at his/her place did i technically pirate it?
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REMercsChamp posted...

Piracy is a non-issue. The guys pirating the games weren't going to buy them anyway.

yep. so it cant be a lost sale.

thats why im asking the people who believe the whole lost potential sale bs, if they also believe browsing a store and leaving without buying anything is stealing too.
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ManSpread posted...

if i watch a movie with a friend at his/her place did i technically pirate it?

scummy people try to justify that just like the ones that justify porn piracy and anime/manga piracy but have a meltdown when game piracy is involved
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REMercsChamp posted...

Piracy is a non-issue. The guys pirating the games weren't going to buy them anyway.

That's pretty tough to swallow without more info to go alone with it. Why would I purchase a game when I can just simply pirate it first?
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It is very true for movies. Why buy a dvd or a theater ticket when I could download or buy a bootleg?
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Piracy isn't theft, its piracy. You're not stealing anything, you're creating a copy. And if losing a potential sale is theft, why isn't it theft to window shop since you're using a product without paying, which I think TC is arguing.

Is it ethical though? I think most people would say probably not, not that anyone cares. I would argue pirating is fine in some cases though, like if you wanna try out a game before you decide to buy it or not. I'd always suggest actually buying the game if you really like it though, especially if its by a smaller company or something. Piracy is bad in the sense that you're taking something without paying too, just that its not theft.

Property is weird, man
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It doesn't matter that a sale wasn't lost, the issue is people having access to paid content without giving the original creators a dime. Yeah, without piracy you wouldn't have bought it, but you wouldn't have been allowed to enjoy it either.
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but the anti piracy argument has never been "you dont get to enjoy what you didn't buy"
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If someone has a second home, is it unethical to stay in the one they aren't using?
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I'd download a car tbh
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It's intellectual property.
It has an owner.
It's not yours.
It's protected by law.
End of story.
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theft

In common usage, theft is the taking of another person's property or services without that person's permission or consent with the intent to deprive the rightful owner of it.

The last part is the key. Part of theft is incurring a loss.
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LordRazziel posted...

It's intellectual property.
It has an owner.
It's not yours.
It's protected by law.
End of story.

Why does it matter if they weren't going to buy it anyway?
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r4X0r posted...

Part of theft is incurring a loss.

https://pa1.narvii.com/6327/d083f078a1c2b87d3c3e5fc909c36640b1b00a32_hq.gif
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Intro2Logic posted...

If someone has a second home, is it unethical to stay in the one they aren't using?

hmmm
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REMercsChamp posted...

LordRazziel posted...

It's intellectual property.
It has an owner.
It's not yours.
It's protected by law.
End of story.

Why does it matter if they weren't going to buy it anyway?

Because you're speculating future activity based on current intent. There's no rule that they wouldn't change their mind about wanting to buy it later. But if they've already consumed it then there's less incentive to do so.

LJRENEGADE posted...

And if losing a potential sale is theft, why isn't it theft to window shop since you're using a product without paying, which I think TC is arguing.

You aren't using the product, only looking at it. That's why it's called "window shopping."
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Villain posted...

IIRC multiple reports and studies have shown (some by government even) that piracy has had no negative impact on various media sales at all.

There are multiple small game developers that have talked about having more accounts for customer service than actual game sales. That's lost sales. Period.

As someone that has partaken, I find it laughable that people try to act like there's no impact.
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Annihilated posted...

REMercsChamp posted...

LordRazziel posted...

It's intellectual property.
It has an owner.
It's not yours.
It's protected by law.
End of story.

Why does it matter if they weren't going to buy it anyway?

Because you're speculating future activity based on current intent. There's no rule that they wouldn't change their mind about wanting to buy it later. But if they've already consumed it then there's less incentive to do so.

Yeah, the whole argument about how they weren't going to buy it anyway is bullshit. There's no way anyone could possibly know that.

Look, Pirates. Why the fuck do you keep trying to justify what you do? Shittiest pirates ever.

r4X0r posted...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theft

In common usage, theft is the taking of another person's property or services without that person's permission or consent with the intent to deprive the rightful owner of it.

The last part is the key. Part of theft is incurring a loss.

The money they are owed for your use of their product is the loss.
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ModLogic posted...

but the anti piracy argument has never been "you dont get to enjoy what you didn't buy"

That's literally always the argument.
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I believe I have the right to commit piracy because if I wouldn't pay for the thing anyway, I'm not losing a sale by having it for free.
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FigureOfSpeech posted...

I believe I have the right to commit piracy because if I wouldn't pay for the thing anyway, I'm not losing a sale by having it for free.

Sure, you're not losing a sale. The people trying to make a living arguably are though =P
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Ryangrad posted...

It does if it's a book/magazine store and they read without paying.

Nope? You would not be charged with theft if you read a magazine in a magazine store...

Trespassing maybe, eventually... but not theft.

You kinda proved the TC's point btw.
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butthole666 posted...

Music piracy = more potential people at shows

Game piracy = theft and there's really no arguing around that

wouldn't the whole "more potential people" angle also work with game piracy?

an example, people pirating old snes/n64/gamebube games. after they tried out some of the old Nintendo games, they become Nintendo fans. after being a Nintendo fan they are more likely to get the latest versions of Nintendo games (Switch) since that isn't pirated yet/
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I think piracy is just a failure to price something approlriately. People pirate because the price isn't what theyre willing to pay. I used to pirate games because I go through them fast and couldn't justify $60 each. But with steam sales and things like humble bundle I can get a triple A game, a price I'm glad to wait a few months and pay. Ill also pay close to full price for a game I think is worth it like Guild Wars, Witcher 3, or GTA5. But $60 for some 15 hour long adventure game? Fuck no.

Same for music. I listen to several albums a day and would never pay $15 each but now I pay $5 a month for Tidal and listen to over a hundred albums a month for that price.

Pretty much what I'm saying is companies shouldn't take the $60 price of a game for granted and should be more flexible and dynamic with pricing and sales and do more market research to figure out what different segments are willing to pay.
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darkjedilink posted...

There are multiple small game developers that have talked about having more accounts for customer service than actual game sales. That's lost sales. Period.

its not a lost sale if they weren't going to buy anyway
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ModLogic posted...

darkjedilink posted...

There are multiple small game developers that have talked about having more accounts for customer service than actual game sales. That's lost sales. Period.

its not a lost sale if they weren't going to buy anyway

How can you even prove that?
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REMercsChamp posted...

Why does it matter if they weren't going to buy it anyway?

Do you think every thief intends to buy what they steal?
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butthole666 posted...

Music piracy = more potential people at shows

More specifically, more potential people at shows with barely any impact on the artist.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kjYjOnc8JP4
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A_Good_Boy posted...

ModLogic posted...

darkjedilink posted...

There are multiple small game developers that have talked about having more accounts for customer service than actual game sales. That's lost sales. Period.

its not a lost sale if they weren't going to buy anyway

How can you even prove that?

It's not provable. Which is why it's a bullshit argument. Worst pirates ever. I would not have a grog with any of you.

I used to pirate shit. I embraced that I was doing something wrong. Why the hell do people care about doing something like that so much that they have to justify it to themselves. Own your lawlessness.