Poll of the Day > Do you support the Republican Stimulus Bill???

(+) Yeah! (+)

let's see what the majority will vote...

https://i.imgur.com/CH4IdJI.jpg
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If anyone has the time to read it -

https://www.cnn.com/2020/03/19/politics/read-senate-gop-stimulus-bill/index.html

I'm more than confident people effected by the pandemic will receive help from it, so I'm all for it

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JixHedgehog posted...

If anyone has the time to read it -

https://www.cnn.com/2020/03/19/politics/read-senate-gop-stimulus-bill/index.html

I'm more than confident people effected by the pandemic will receive help from it, so I'm all for it

I am not reading 247 pages to find out what is allegedly wrong with the bill. I feel like if there was something so seriously wrong with it that the opposition party wouldve highlighted it with bright colored markers and been shouting it for all to see, and since that hasnt happened Im confident enough that it wouldve helped pretty much everyone who needed it.

The only complaints that Ive seen so far is that it also helps corporations, but that means that it ALSO helps the people in need. I think nows not the time to be bickering when many people will literally be going starving soon.

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Well there are a few things wrong with it.

First i't sbased off taxes so if you didn't file in 2018, your out of luck.

Second if you are making less then a certain amount (number at least was not provided), or have no income for that year (what if your 19 and didn't freaking work cause you were in HS in 2018?) you receive only $600 instead of $1200 (of course the 19 year old probably didn't file taxes in 2018 anyway so wouldn't get anything under that plan).

Third there are no protections on the stimulas money given to corporations if they lay off their workers etc, so it's basically just giving them free money.

So yeah, there are some problems with it.

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How many of the these corporations are going to use this money for stock buybacks like they did with Trump's previous corporate welfare handout?

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dvdjedi posted...

How many of the these corporations are going to use this money for stock buybacks like they did with Trump's previous corporate welfare handout?

All of them. McConnells a dumb ass. Trying to paint this for the uneducated that hes a hero. Fuck him.

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FrndNhbrHdCEman posted...

All of them. McConnells a dumb ass. Trying to paint this for the uneducated that hes a hero. Fuck him.

He's not a dumbass. He knows exactly what he's doing.

Democrats are the dumb asses if they allow money to go to corporations without including in the bill an outlawing of stock buy backs, with actual penalties for breaking said law.

Fun fact: It may seem like a radical change, but stock buy backs were actually illegal and considered insider trading until they were made legal in 1982.

streamofthesky posted...

He's not a dumbass. He knows exactly what he's doing.

No kidding. And hes a dumb ass for not seeing the long term repercussions and selling out for quick cash.

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I'm neither a democrat nor a republican, but in this situation we need to ensure that people are getting what they need, because this situation is serious. We should not be playing politics here, we shouldn't be adding in things with the bill that we want passed, that have nothing to do with actually helping the american people.

I'm fine, I don't need a stimulas package, I'll be ok, but i'm lucky. There are TONS of people living paycheck to paycheck out there, they need help and they need it soon. It's going to get worse REALLY fast if all the states end up shutting down, but people in the states that already have, are going to need help in the next week or two, just to get food alone.

So stop playing pussy foot with each other and trying to one up the other party, or get tax breaks for friends, or loop holes for corporations.

Just freaking pass a bill that gives money to those who really need it (not based on taxes, based on SS#) so that everyone can get what they need to survive until this passes.

What, you think those people who didn't pay taxes or at least didn't file them in 2018 are just gonna magically be ok? They need to eat, they probably have less resources then the people who DID pay taxes, and I highly doubt they are just going to starve quietly if you don't help them.

Give every American enough money to pay for food for themselves, at least, until this is over. I don't think it needs to be $1200 per american, that is a bit much (although I would recomend suspending ALL mortgage and tax payments on property during this period, so you can ALSO suspend ALL rent payments).

This would allow you to give something like $600 per adult for food, along wwth $200 additional per child in the house hold.

It's less over all, but by removing the cost of utilites(that is another thing that should be done) and rent/mortgage/taxes), you will allow most americans to be able to support themselves on the $600 (although there are other things that will need to suspend payments on as well, like health insurance etc).

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FrndNhbrHdCEman posted...

No kidding. And hes a dumb ass for not seeing the long term repercussions and selling out for quick cash.

Not really. He gets tons of "campaign contributions" and is fairly wealthy, and will be dead from old age long before shit hits the fan. You're assuming that he gives a damn about his own grandchildren's welfare or doesn't think giving them a leg up by starting off life wealthy will give them an advantage in the Ayn Randian dystopian hell hole the U.S. will turn into.

Stop ascribing stupidity to what is clearly pure evil.

Plan needs tweaking.

But I don't understand the people claiming that the people who have not paid taxes in 2018-19 should be entitled to free shit.

You're not entitled to jack shit if you don't contribute. Once you've stopped being useless to society, you'll be entitled to something. It's like a moron who believes he's entitled to 3 week vacations because he started working last week.

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The_tall_midget posted...

Plan needs tweaking.

But I don't understand the people claiming that the people who have not paid taxes in 2018-19 should be entitled to free shit.

You're not entitled to jack shit if you don't contribute. Once you've stopped being useless to society, you'll be entitled to something. It's like a moron who believes he's entitled to 3 week vacations because he started working last week.

We have to live in the world with those people man. They are out there, and they will get hungry. What do you think they will do when they have no money for food? Just lie down and starve?

Also what about 18 and 19 year olds who just graduated last year and are working now, and in their own place somewhere? They didn't file taxes in 2018, they were in HS at the time (and probably didn't work at all.

Heck there are people who work part time jobs, and live just fine off $800-$1000 a month, they don't need to pay taxes, in fact there is no reason for them to do so, but they still need money to survive.

So yeah, it's a messed up plan because it leaves people who need the help the most, out in the cold (often literally, what about the homeless for instance, they had people helping them, places they could go for shelter, for food etc, but that is all gone or will be). I'm not a fan of giving free stuff out (unless we do a UBI plan or something) but in this case we need to ensure everyone has what they need to survive, not just the people who made over $12k in 2018.

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wolfy42 posted...

We have to live in the world with those people man. They are out there, and they will get hungry. What do you think they will do when they have no money for food? Just lie down and starve?

Also what about 18 and 19 year olds who just graduated last year and are working now, and in their own place somewhere? They didn't file taxes in 2018, they were in HS at the time (and probably didn't work at all.

Heck there are people who work part time jobs, and live just fine off $800-$1000 a month, they don't need to pay taxes, in fact there is no reason for them to do so, but they still need money to survive.

So yeah, it's a messed up plan because it leaves people who need the help the most, out in the cold (often literally, what about the homeless for instance, they had people helping them, places they could go for shelter, for food etc, but that is all gone or will be). I'm not a fan of giving free stuff out (unless we do a UBI plan or something) but in this case we need to ensure everyone has what they need to survive, not just the people who made over $12k in 2018.

Because those are the same morons who believe that anyone who makes more money than them should be taxed into oblivion in order to pay for the free shit they incorrectly believe they're entitled to.

The same trash who should not be allowed to vote because all they do is vote for more free shit for themselves. The same people who refuse to go through the same hoops everyone did because of their entitled beliefs. The same people who made poor life choices and then expect society to pay for their mistakes.

I am all for helping those who have done their share for society and have paid their dues. Even if it is a small amount.

Criminals? Not entitled to it.
Students with student loans and who don't pay for shit? Not entitled to it.
Useless feminists/Marxists who do nothing but whine about how society need to pay for everything for them? Not entitled to it.

You know who deserves to survive on a deserted island? The people working collectively to make sure everyone lives. Not the fat, overweight loser who believes she's a queen/king and does nothing all day. You don't make a working society by giving resources to the lazy, inept, and entitled.

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Theres The_tall_midget assuming and hating people who arent just like them...
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Spot on. This SJW mentality of trying to help everyone needs to go. Some can't be helped, others are leeches abusing the system. How is it fair to those who contribute?

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Why the **** we talking loan forgiveness at a time like this?! Pass the god damn bill so we can get movement already.

We can talk loan forgiveness once this is all over. Jesus H christ people

Jesus people, you gotta error on the side of caution in a case like this, even if you believe those that don't work etc deserve to die.

Again, what about those who just graduated from HS and are starting out? They get nothing, do you think that is right?

What about those who live in areas where Min wage is still 7.25 and they work a 30 hour (because the jobs don't wanna pay for medical) job, but didn't make enough to need to file taxes? Heck if it's a family with a young kid and the mother was home for the first 2 years, that could include up to 24k they would be making without having to file taxes.

Your throwing a ton of working people under the bus if you base it only on 2018 taxes, on top of just basically saying screw you to all homelesss disabled etc people.

And THAT is still not dealing with the fact that however many people there are out there who didn't file taxes in 2018, are now going to have no income or money.....and will still need things to survive....so are we going to have martial law with police/armed forces patrolling the streets and guarding the stores?

Even that wouldn't prevent hungry people from hitting homes when the patrol was gone, so are we going to ensure every citizen has guns to defend themselves?

Or you know, we could just give them enough money to eat with while this is going on and avoid all that.

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DPsx7 posted...

Spot on. This SJW mentality of trying to help everyone needs to go. Some can't be helped, others are leeches abusing the system. How is it fair to those who contribute?

Except you assuming that people who didnt pay taxes in 2018 dont contribute. When, in fact, many of them do. Some could actually pay a great deal of taxes now, and even for 2019. But didnt have a job to have to do anything with taxes in 2018. But its not like people care about anyone but themselves these days. You guys try to say its the younger people that dont care about others, but I don.they see the older people caring about the younger ones. Im with Wolfy. There are some serious flaws with this purposed plan...
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LinkPizza posted...

Ex kept you assum g that people who didnt pay taxes in 2018 dont contribute. When, in fact, many of them do. Some could actually pay a great deal of taxes now, and even for 2019. But didnt have a job to have to do anything with taxes in 2018. But its not like people care about anyone but themselves these days. You guys try to say its the younger people that dont care about others, but I don.they see the older people caring about the younger ones. Im with Wolfy. There are some serious flaws with this purposed plan...

Know the difference between young people who claim they're entitled to free shit and don't care about older people and older people who don't care about younger, entitled people?

The overwhelming majority of older people actually paid their due. The younger people believe they're just entitled to free shit.

With all due respect, one of those groups actually earned the right to make demands. One of those groups allow the other one to make their idiotic demands. The same way the top 10% are the reason why the socialists can cry for free shit.

Yes, I could go on and be a moron who uses minority cases examples and do "WHAT ABOUT" and "WHAT IF" scenarios, but I'm old enough to realize that only people with weak arguments do that. I stick to the majority and reality.

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The_tall_midget posted...

Know the difference between young people who claim they're entitled to free shit and don't care about older people and older people who don't care about younger, entitled people?

The overwhelming majority of older people actually paid their due. The younger people believe they're just entitled to free shit.

With all due respect, one of those groups actually earned the right to make demands. One of those groups allow the other one to make their idiotic demands. The same way the top 10% are the reason why the socialists can cry for free shit.

Yes, I could go on and be a moron who uses minority cases examples and do "WHAT ABOUT" and "WHAT IF" scenarios, but I'm old enough to realize that only people with weak arguments do that. I stick to the majority and reality.

Except you seem to be lumping them into the same group. Not all young people are like that. But you dont care. Theyre apparently all the same to you. You just assume everyone young thinks theyre entitled to everything. Its like you never met a real young person and only go with what you see on tv or read in the internet. You can hear it in every post you make on this site. Like all the time.
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Glad the bill was shut down cause corporations gonna do their thing, lay off their staff and keep the money for themselves. And no limits on who can receive money AND they don't have to disclose who got the money for six months? Sounds like bullshit and free money for trump properties. The last thing we need is no strings attached money in the hands of corporations when we know 100% of the time they're going to do what's worse for the consumer.

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Look, I don't get why people don't like to work, personally working is better than not working in my mind. I even enjoyed working fast food jobs when I was young. I have had jobs I did NOT like mind you, but had to work for awhile until I found something better, but in general I always enjoyed my jobs and did something I felt was making a difference, even if it was only making food for others.

But we live in a technological world where nobody, or almost nobody, actually needs to work anymore. Most menial jobs at least can be automated, and probably will be eventually. There are not enough jobs for all those "worthless people who don't contribute" to work as well currently, and there will be less and less over time (and more and more people).

So what if some people don't work, or don't work as much? That is what makes them happy I guess. More power to them, focus on yourself and what makes you happy and fufilled in your life.

But for all of us, it's good not to put people in positions where they are surrounded by others who have more them them, where people are eating while they starve, and while people are happy while they are suffering with nowhere to live. There is no reason for such suffering at this point, and no reason especially now, to make peoples lives harder than they already are.

HELP whoever needs it. After the crisis is over, whatever, charge them for it I guess, have them work it off, make it a federal loan or something (That you can't get rid of, like taxes and student loans), but help everyone who needs it for now, and do so as fast as possible.

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LinkPizza posted...

Except you seem to be lumping them into the same group. Not all young people are like that. But you dont care. Theyre apparently all the same to you. You just assume everyone young thinks theyre entitled to everything. Its like you never met a real young person and only go with what you see on tv or read in the internet. You can hear it in every post you make on this site. Like all the time.

No, it's because that I understand that there are exceptions to everything and thus fail to see the point to CONSTANTLY mention exceptions. Only imbeciles and virtue signalers always feel the need to specify exceptions for every single little things to try and justify their idiotic beliefs and demands. Which is why I don't stick to minority cases and exceptions and I believe it's an impressive waste of time to constantly need to say it. I work with fantastic teenagers/young adults all the time and I know they have great futures in the field, but it's also reality that I've put far more money in the system than they did.

Furthermore, I'd say to close to 80% of all entitled whiners come from the same 3 groups of people.

Also, not always mentioning the exceptions offends the overly sensitive. It's a plus in my book.

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wolfy42 posted...

HELP whoever needs it. After the crisis is over, whatever, charge them for it I guess, have them work it off, make it a federal loan or something (That you can't get rid of, like taxes and student loans), but help everyone who needs it for now, and do so as fast as possible.

I can actually agree to this.

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Just expand unemployment. It's what it's there for. Both unemployed and underemployed.
Expand it temporarily to people who normally wouldn't qualify (like self-employed) that can't work due to the pandemic and expand it to last longer than the usual period, like was done during the Great Recession.

Why are we doing these stupid blanket hand outs, except with X income restrictions, and only if you filed taxes for 2018, and possibly it's actually a loan you have to pay back, and oh by the way hand outs for giant corporations, too... ?

The_tall_midget posted...

Yes, I could go on and be a moron

Thats your usual approach.

Cacciato posted...

Thats your usual approach.

lmao

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wolfy42 posted...

But we live in a technological world where nobody, or almost nobody, actually needs to work anymore. Most menial jobs at least can be automated, and probably will be eventually. There are not enough jobs for all those "worthless people who don't contribute" to work as well currently, and there will be less and less over time (and more and more people).

Enh, not really. There are plenty of jobs, mostly hands-on kinds of things that automation can never replace. Plumbing, construction, mechanics, etc.

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DPsx7 posted...

Enh, not really. There are plenty of jobs, mostly hands-on kinds of things that automation can never replace. Plumbing, construction, mechanics, etc.

Perhaps, but is it as rewarding as getting a gender studies diploma and then complain on social medias about the lack of "diversity" in the actual useful/paying jobs?

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The_tall_midget posted...

No, it's because that I understand that there are exceptions to everything and thus fail to see the point to CONSTANTLY mention exceptions. Only imbeciles and virtue signalers always feel the need to specify exceptions for every single little things to try and justify their idiotic beliefs and demands. Which is why I don't stick to minority cases and exceptions and I believe it's an impressive waste of time to constantly need to say it. I work with fantastic teenagers/young adults all the time and I know they have great futures in the field, but it's also reality that I've put far more money in the system than they did.

Furthermore, I'd say to close to 80% of all entitled whiners come from the same 3 groups of people.

Also, not always mentioning the exceptions offends the overly sensitive. It's a plus in my book.

But it might not even be exceptions. Its like when everybody says millennials are all the same when many arent. The millennials were all born over like 15 years. Im pretty different from people a few years away. So a 15 year difference can make people very different then people in an arbitrary group. There are many millennials closer to gen X than the other millennials. Just because some people in a group you dont like suck doesnt mean they all are. For all I know, that the loudest minority. Especially because not everyone uses social media. And not all the ones that do suck...
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DPsx7 posted...

Enh, not really. There are plenty of jobs, mostly hands-on kinds of things that automation can never replace. Plumbing, construction, mechanics, etc.

Yet... Doesnt mean they wont get replaced eventually. Technology is always improving. Many thing thought impossible in the past are very easy these days...
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The vast majority of menial jobs, something like 37% I think it was, are replacable NOW by machine, that isn't factoring future technologies etc.

And many are alreaay being replaced, many fast food jobs are, many warehouse jobs are etc.

That is some of the arguments for a UBI etc, because we basically know there will not be enough jobs eventually. I imagine we are not pushing to replace humans specifically because we don't have anything set up for that eventuality yet.

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LinkPizza posted...

But it might not even be exceptions. Its like when everybody says millennials are all the same when many arent. (Truncated) Just because some people in a group you dont like suck doesnt mean they all are. For all I know, that the loudest minority. Especially because not everyone uses social media. And not all the ones that do suck...

How many times will I have to say that I am aware of that there are exceptions pretty much everything? I mean, just read what you just fucking wrote, you spend a ridiculous amount of time repeating over and over "YES, BUT NOT EVERYONE." Which is why I don't waste my time doing that. I stick to the majority case scenario. I am aware exceptions exist, as should anyone with a brain, so it does not need to be said over and over.

Truly amazing.

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wolfy42 posted...

That is some of the arguments for a UBI etc, because we basically know there will not be enough jobs eventually. I imagine we are not pushing to replace humans specifically because we don't have anything set up for that eventuality yet.

The problem is getting an amount that will pay everyones bills when they cant work. But it would be different for everyone...
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LinkPizza posted...

The problem is getting an amount that will pay everyones bills when they cant work. But it would be different for everyone...

We are eventually going to need to provide some sort of rent control, not by forcing people to rent at X price mind you, but by providing government housing (not slums/projects but real apartments) at affordable prices. This will bring down the prices everyone else can charge because nobody is going to pay a ton more if ttey have an option for say $800 a month.

This is something that needs to be done now....before UBI is even considered, in my opinion. We need to normalize the cost of rent (and reduce it) first. That will enable us to determine a real cost of living and then if we create a UBI we can provide something that will let you live fairly comfortably, but not extragavently, so you have incentive to work, but if you don't want to, or can't, you can still live with a roof over your head, decent food, internet and entertainment.

I think that is our future, but I think it may be painful getting there.

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The_tall_midget posted...

How many times will I have to say that I am aware of that there are exceptions pretty much everything? I mean, just read what you just fucking wrote, you spend a ridiculous amount of time repeating over and over "YES, BUT NOT EVERYONE." Which is why I don't waste my time doing that. I stick to the majority case scenario. I am aware exceptions exist, as should anyone with a brain, so it does not need to be said over and over.

Truly amazing.

And what Im saying is why if the exceptions are actually the majority? So it sounds like you didnt read what I did. Just because you see a lot of them on social media doesnt mean thats the majority. Thats what Im saying.
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wolfy42 posted...

We are eventually going to need to provide some sort of rent control, not by forcing people to rent at X price mind you, but by providing government housing (not slums/projects but real apartments) at affordable prices. This will bring down the prices everyone else can charge because nobody is going to pay a ton more if ttey have an option for say $800 a month.

This is something that needs to be done now....before UBI is even considered, in my opinion. We need to normalize the cost of rent (and reduce it) first. That will enable us to determine a real cost of living and then if we create a UBI we can provide something that will let you live fairly comfortably, but not extragavently, so you have incentive to work, but if you don't want to, or can't, you can still live with a roof over your head, decent food, internet and entertainment.

I think that is our future, but I think it may be painful getting there.

Thats going to cost a lot, though. They would need buy other houses, tear them down, and rebuild. Mostly because I dont think we have enough room as it is. But it also knocks people out of their normal lifestyle. Like people who built themselves up. Either way, I hope Im gone before that stuff happens... I was talking to someone about this. They dont have a plan, but dont seem to care...
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It's the GOP, it's probably loaded with corporate handouts far more so than civilian handouts

I only heard about the Boeing part, $1.5 billion to Boeing, because they definitely need that. I heard it gets worse.

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I just don't understand the corporate bailout. Just give the money to those who need it the most.

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LinkPizza posted...

Yet... Doesnt mean they wont get replaced eventually. Technology is always improving. Many thing thought impossible in the past are very easy these days...

It's a safe bet they won't. Automation works for repetitive tasks. Not things that require problem solving or frequent moving. It's a terrible thing that so many kids assume college is necessary only to find out it was a pointless study or no jobs are available. It's not feasible to automate everything.

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Sure, why not?

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DPsx7 posted...

It's a safe bet they won't. Automation works for repetitive tasks. Not things that require problem solving or frequent moving. It's a terrible thing that so many kids assume college is necessary only to find out it was a pointless study or no jobs are available. It's not feasible to automate everything.

There are enough jobs that require a degree. And if its in a field you enjoy, it makes sense. While there are jobs you can get going to trade school, those are limited, as well... If everyone tried to go for that, then the same thing would happen. Too many people went and nowhere near enough jobs.

As for automation, we just arent there yet. They may make them to do more specific tasks. They also may have a way to control it without leaving the office... Depending on the house and stuff. But its possible they dont. But with the way technology is, it could be possible in the future...
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I read up on this awhile ago and I believe the long term estimation would be 1 job for every 2 americans. My solution is different then UBI, my solution is to make jobs (full time) shorter, instead of a 40 hour work week, everyone works 3 days (or 24 total hours a week).

That would solve the same problem, but keep people actually working and feeling productive.

As far as gov controlled land or places to build the cheap housing, alot is already available and used for other things, homes are owned by banks and not sold etc, and there are usually places nearby that could be taken over easily to build such areas. It would be hard in busy cities, but you could emminant domain some stuff that isn't really needed, or older properties etc. Take back parking lots for instance (buy them back) then make 1 out of 4 multi-stack parking places (in big cities) and create large apartment complexes in their place.

Things like that could drastically reduce the average rental prices and set a reasonable norm, so people are not having to pay $2400 a month for a freaking 1 bedroom apartment anymore.

Mind you this won't happen easily because the wealthy and home owners are going to fight tooth and nail to not have their property values plummet, and something will need to be done about that for people who have mortgages etc (you can't just unilateralll halve property values without having tons of people be seriously under water).

So it's complicated, but there are ways to find a solution.

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gguirao posted...

I just don't understand the corporate bailout. Just give the money to those who need it the most.

They're Republicans. They only give the money to the people who already have the most money.

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wolfy42 posted...

I read up on this awhile ago and I believe the long term estimation would be 1 job for every 2 americans. My solution is different then UBI, my solution is to make jobs (full time) shorter, instead of a 40 hour work week, everyone works 3 days (or 24 total hours a week).

That would solve the same problem, but keep people actually working and feeling productive.

As far as gov controlled land or places to build the cheap housing, alot is already available and used for other things, homes are owned by banks and not sold etc, and there are usually places nearby that could be taken over easily to build such areas. It would be hard in busy cities, but you could emminant domain some stuff that isn't really needed, or older properties etc. Take back parking lots for instance (buy them back) then make 1 out of 4 multi-stack parking places (in big cities) and create large apartment complexes in their place.

Things like that could drastically reduce the average rental prices and set a reasonable norm, so people are not having to pay $2400 a month for a freaking 1 bedroom apartment anymore.

Mind you this won't happen easily because the wealthy and home owners are going to fight tooth and nail to not have their property values plummet, and something will need to be done about that for people who have mortgages etc (you can't just unilateralll halve property values without having tons of people be seriously under water).

So it's complicated, but there are ways to find a solution.

It way too complicated. Ive also thought of housing solutions. The problem is going through with it. People wont do it and will fight against it. People are the problem. Especially since theyll say they are doing it for people. But that also ruins lives. And can make living hard for many people. Whether its because its hard to move closer to family or hard to live brand new life without stuff they are use to...
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LinkPizza posted...

t way too complicated. Ive also thought of housing solutions. The problem is going through with it. People wont do it and will fight against it. People are the problem. Especially since theyll say they are doing it for people. But that also ruins lives. And can make living hard for many people. Whether its because its hard to move closer to family or hard to live brand new life without stuff they are use to...

I don't know man, this current system is just not fair for the young. I had roomates when I was young, but I didn't HAVE to have roomates (I just really liked saving money and well, my roomates were friends and we all hung out all the spare time we had anyway, so it made sense.

Today there are many cities and areas (not even major cities) where you can't rent a small one bedroom for less then $1000 and entry level jobs pay like $350 a week after taxes etc. That is just too much, and we need to do something to make it possible for young people who are just starting off, to actually have their own place.

That is outside of the current situation, but we have a serious housing problem right now, and we really need to remedy it.

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wolfy42 posted...

I don't know man, this current system is just not fair for the young. I had roomates when I was young, but I didn't HAVE to have roomates (I just really liked saving money and well, my roomates were friends and we all hung out all the spare time we had anyway, so it made sense.

Today there are many cities and areas (not even major cities) where you can't rent a small one bedroom for less then $1000 and entry level jobs pay like $350 a week after taxes etc. That is just too much, and we need to do something to make it possible for young people who are just starting off, to actually have their own place.

That is outside of the current situation, but we have a serious housing problem right now, and we really need to remedy it.

I agree the current situation is bad, but I think youre idea needs work, as well. Choosing between those is a lose-lose situation. Many people would choose to keep what they have now rather than switch to yours. Especially since its not totally fleshed our yet...
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LinkPizza posted...

There are enough jobs that require a degree. And if its in a field you enjoy, it makes sense. While there are jobs you can get going to trade school, those are limited, as well... If everyone tried to go for that, then the same thing would happen. Too many people went and nowhere near enough jobs.

As for automation, we just arent there yet. They may make them to do more specific tasks. They also may have a way to control it without leaving the office... Depending on the house and stuff. But its possible they dont. But with the way technology is, it could be possible in the future...

I think more do not and those jobs will always have demand, whether you work for someone or start your own business. Landscaping, roofing, waste management, not sure if you need more than training for firefighting. The problem is they don't want hard work. My field isn't exactly bursting with volunteers. Not to imply degrees are bad if you have something to aim for. Going to college 'just because' is a recipe for debt.

Really, what would be the point? Trying to automate plumbing for example, it's not an unsafe job and would require more work to program than to send a person. Look at the years they're putting into self driving cars. You can't predict every possible situation.

Moral of the story is there's a ton of work out there that will exist for years. Newcomers can't be afraid to get dirty, break a sweat.

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DPsx7 posted...

I think more do not and those jobs will always have demand, whether you work for someone or start your own business. Landscaping, roofing, waste management, not sure if you need more than training for firefighting. The problem is they don't want hard work. My field isn't exactly bursting with volunteers. Not to imply degrees are bad if you have something to aim for. Going to college 'just because' is a recipe for debt.

Really, what would be the point? Trying to automate plumbing for example, it's not an unsafe job and would require more work to program than to send a person. Look at the years they're putting into self driving cars. You can't predict every possible situation.

Moral of the story is there's a ton of work out there that will exist for years. Newcomers can't be afraid to get dirty, break a sweat.

Theres a demand right now because not enough people go to trade school. But if everyone did, wed have the same problem we did with college, which is more people than jobs. Even split equally between both college and trade school, there would probably still be too many people, tbh... We just have a lot of people... And starting your own business is good and all, but it cost a lot to start.

As for automation, the reason is to save money. It cost a lot to start, but you dont have to pay people. Eventually, they will try to automate everything. If you really think they wont try, then you arent living in the real world. Whether they can do it or not has yet to be seen. But they will definitely try. All technology we had seemed impossible or like magic in the past. But e have them now.

Not everyone is worried about working. But it depends on the area. And the people working. My friend recently got a job as a plumbers assistant without going to trade school because his brother works there. They picked him over other people who probably did go to trade school. meaning that even going doesnt guarantee you a job. There are not infinite jobs. Especially with many other jobs being automated. That means less jobs. Those people have to work somewhere, as well. So, we will run out of jobs with the way jobs are disappearing...
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wolfy42 posted...

Well there are a few things wrong with it.

First i't sbased off taxes so if you didn't file in 2018, your out of luck.

Second if you are making less then a certain amount (number at least was not provided), or have no income for that year (what if your 19 and didn't freaking work cause you were in HS in 2018?) you receive only $600 instead of $1200 (of course the 19 year old probably didn't file taxes in 2018 anyway so wouldn't get anything under that plan).

Third there are no protections on the stimulas money given to corporations if they lay off their workers etc, so it's basically just giving them free money.

So yeah, there are some problems with it.

People are still filing their 2019 taxes, so how would they be able to base it off anything else?

I'm unclear on if I qualify, I pay almost nothing in taxes but paid a $700 healthcare fine which seems substantial to me.

That hand out to the people who don't need it is why it failed, I'm kind of frustrated it failed but it's mostly aimed at republicans for continuing to play games.