Board 8 > Politics Containment Topic 291: Faucian Pact.

(+) Yeah! (+)

SmartMuffin posted...

Is it because they have a totalitarian state that can successfully hide all the ill effects from the media? They don't.

You sure?
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I can't believe Muffin tried to get sympathy by complaining about having to cancel a wedding. Most of my friends didn't even have a wedding. They just eloped down at the courts.

Of course being upset about not holding an over-indulgent financial sinkhole while people are dying sounds about par for the course.

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UshiromiyaEva posted...

Oh, so you're biased and motivated due to personal, non-financial hardships.

I wonder how many people Smuffin would be willing to let die to have his wedding. Hard number.

Based on what I've seen my guess is about 5 billion, but I might be lowballing it.

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Millions of people die every day. Always have. You never cared until now. Excuse me for not accepting your moral condemnation.

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would you prefer waking up in the middle of the night to your fiance crying because her parents are dead from the coronavirus

The population fatality rate from coronavirus currently stands at less than 0.1%. I'd probably take the chance that her parents have a less than 1-in-1000 chance of dying from coronavirus in exchange for my wedding, yeah. My parents too.

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Lol, the most desperate justification you could have tried to pull off.

do i really have to explain how there's a difference between dying of natural causes and dying from a virus

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SmartMuffin posted...

Millions of people die every day. Always have. You never cared until now. Excuse me for not accepting your moral condemnation.

Off by an order of magnitude here

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SmartMuffin posted...

The population fatality rate from coronavirus currently stands at less than 0.1%.

"currently" being the key word here.

a few months ago it was less than 0.000000001%.

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Millions of people face hardships in their lives every day. You've actively derided them in the past for wanting solutions to help them out. Yet now YOU'RE facing a hardship (and keep in mind, your FIRST thought when trying to gain sympathy was not even "I had to cancel my wedding and I lost a ton of money because of this", which would be a legitimate concern and I would feel at least a LITTLE bad for you, because that sucks...but instead, you went with "I had to cancel my wedding and now my fiance is sad", which...wow. That makes it seem like your finances are so spectacular that the cost of cancelling this wedding isn't even a drop in the bucket for you.), and you expect us to feel sorry for you, and the system to change just so that you, personally, are no longer inconvenienced.

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Honestly Im most surprised that Muffin would marry someone who genuinely cares about the pageantry of a traditional wedding
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I misread that stat.

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it's pretty funny to see muffin's progression on this, though.

a few months ago he was like "the flu is worse" (which is an argument that at least has something resembling logic to it) and now he's resorted to "uh... well... PEOPLE DIE! we don't shut down the economy because of DEATH, do we? CHECKMATE VIRUS BELIEVERS"

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Jakyl25 posted...

Honestly Im most surprised that Muffin would marry someone who genuinely cares about the pageantry of a traditional wedding

the shitty thing is, she doesn't even care that much

if it weren't for the fact that her parents already put down a ton of money in deposits with various vendors (who are all saying "we're happy to reschedule you for later... but no refunds/cancellations" we probably would just go to the courthouse and elope

and it's hard to console her because anything like "well hey at least we're not dead" just makes her cry more because it makes her feel like she's some sort of horrible heartless monster for daring to be upset at having her wedding cancelled when people are dying in the world!

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a few months ago he was like "the flu is worse" (which is an argument that at least has something resembling logic to it) and now he's resorted to "uh... well... PEOPLE DIE! we don't shut down the economy because of DEATH, do we? CHECKMATE VIRUS BELIEVERS"

A few months ago, I was stockpiling toilet paper, hand sanitizer, and non-perishable food while your favorite media outlets were suggesting "the real threat is anti-Asian racism!"

Don't lie about this man. I was early to the knowledge that this would be a big deal, and now I'm early to the knowledge that the cure will be worse than the disease. I'm poised to be right about this on several different occasions even as the facts on the ground shifted aburptly!

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TheRock1525 posted...

I misread that stat.

The stat you are looking for is about 7,700 per day on average in 2017 btw.

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Honestly even if there was no direct stay at home executive order, would many of the companies required to put on a big wedding even be voluntarily operating right now?

Would many of your invited guests even be willing to come?
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That makes it seem like your finances are so spectacular that the cost of cancelling this wedding isn't even a drop in the bucket for you

Her parents paid for all of this. We feel an obligation to ensure that their money is well spent. Deposits have been paid and the vendors are not offering refunds.

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SmartMuffin posted...

the shitty thing is, she doesn't even care that much

if it weren't for the fact that her parents already put down a ton of money in deposits with various vendors (who are all saying "we're happy to reschedule you for later... but no refunds/cancellations" we probably would just go to the courthouse and elope

and it's hard to console her because anything like "well hey at least we're not dead" just makes her cry more because it makes her feel like she's some sort of horrible heartless monster for daring to be upset at having her wedding cancelled when people are dying in the world!

This doesn't sound canceled at all. It sounds like it's postponed.

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Jakyl25 posted...

Honestly even if there was no direct stay at home executive order, would many of the companies required to put on a big wedding even be voluntarily operating right now?

Would many of your invited guests even be willing to come?

The answer to 1 is basically all of them. They're small businesses facing devastation. Right up until the local authorities here ordered lockdowns, they were all saying "we will operate until the authorities order us not to."

The answer to 2 is more tricky. Most of our guests are local and totally would have come, except for my family which are several states away and probably wouldn't. One major reason we're rescheduling is so that my parents will be able to see at least one of their children actually get married in person (my sister already did the 'sneak off and elope and tell people later' thing).

We're not asking for special treatment here, or even sympathy. We're just normal people trying to do right by our families.

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SmartMuffin posted...

if it weren't for the fact that her parents already put down a ton of money in deposits with various vendors (who are all saying "we're happy to reschedule you for later... but no refunds/cancellations" we probably would just go to the courthouse and elope

and it's hard to console her because anything like "well hey at least we're not dead" just makes her cry more because it makes her feel like she's some sort of horrible heartless monster for daring to be upset at having her wedding cancelled when people are dying in the world!

I...dont really even understand what she feels shes missing out on then?

The official piece of paper? Being able to file taxes jointly next year?
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This doesn't sound canceled at all. It sounds like it's postponed.

Officially postponed for now. I don't dare tell her this, but I think there's a non-trivial chance our re-scheduled date won't be able to happen either. The official position of the medical bureaucracy that now seems to be unilaterally running the nation is that we cannot lift lockdowns until a vaccine is available, and that won't happen for another 1-2 years at least.

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I...dont really even understand what she feels shes missing out on then?

Don't get me wrong - in a normal world she would want the big, traditional wedding. I kind of would too!

But in this crazy environment, had everything been fully refundable, we probably would have just gone to the courthouse.

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SmartMuffin posted...

The answer to 2 is more tricky. Most of our guests are local and totally would have come, except for my family which are several states away and probably wouldn't. One major reason we're rescheduling is so that my parents will be able to see at least one of their children actually get married in person (my sister already did the 'sneak off and elope and tell people later' thing).

So really the core of the issue is not the lockdown, but your parents unwillingness to travel during a pandemic

Why would they hypothetically choose to not travel? Because they believe the mainstream medias lies?
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SmartMuffin posted...

and it's hard to console her because anything like "well hey at least we're not dead" just makes her cry more because it makes her feel like she's some sort of horrible heartless monster for daring to be upset at having her wedding cancelled when people are dying in the world!

you should let her read your posts in this topic. i'm sure they will make her feel a lot less guilty!

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SmartMuffin posted...

Don't get me wrong - in a normal world she would want the big, traditional wedding. I kind of would too!

Right but youre still going to get that at SOME point
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Right but youre still going to get that at SOME point

Maybe... honestly this whole process has just been so emotionally draining, I think if the new date doesn't work out we're probably just going to call it and elope and cost her parents a ton of money and my parents the chance at ever seeing a child of theirs get married and we'll just have to live with that.

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Serious question - what's stopping you from just signing the piece of paper now and having a big party later, when the plague recedes?

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Jakyl25 posted...

Being able to file taxes jointly next year?

with muffin this could legit be a thing.

'talk taxes to me baby. mmm, joint filing.'


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Not_an_Owl posted...

Serious question - what's stopping you from just signing the piece of paper now and having a big party later, when the plague recedes?

This

You can officially get married now and still have the wedding later
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Serious question - what's stopping you from just signing the piece of paper now and having a big party later, when the plague recedes?

We thought about that - but what's the point of that really? There's no hurry to sign a piece of paper. The party itself is the big thing! And if the party doesn't feature the actual ceremony, we suspect fewer people would come.

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Man this entire cultural tradition is bonkers
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SmartMuffin posted...

There's no hurry to sign a piece of paper.

Then why ever consider eloping if the new date doesnt work out?

Could you maybe explain whats emotionally draining about well all of our plans are paid for and in place, now we wait?
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i mean if that paper could've gotten you more trump bucks i'd say that's a hurry.
especially if another batch of checks rolls out next month.


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Kinglicious posted...

i mean if that paper could've gotten you more trump bucks i'd say that's a hurry.
especially if another batch of checks rolls out next month.

They still would be based on 2019 at the latest though
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Could you maybe explain whats emotionally draining about well all of our plans are paid for and in place, now we wait?

Facing constant uncertainty about plans for a major event is emotionally draining.

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Its probably not a one to one comparison, but in my family high school graduations were a huge deal. All my cousins, my brother and sister got huge parties after they graduated where hundreds of people were invited. I'm the youngest of my cousins so I was supposed to be the last one for the generation.

A week before the party my uncle killed himself.

I never got the same huge party everyone else did, and it never upset me because I knew how badly everyone (including me) was hurting.

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SmartMuffin posted...

Facing constant uncertainty about plans for a major event is emotionally draining.

Emotionally draining is having to come home and strip down to your underwear every day before you even step into the house, immediately jump into the shower and live in one room in your entire house because you don't want to get your recently heart-attacked father sick and kill him.

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SmartMuffin posted...

Facing constant uncertainty about plans for a major event is emotionally draining.

So would you agree that we should have medicare for all, so that the people who don't know if they'll be able to afford food/rent and the exorbitant price for their medications in a single month, won't have to worry about that sort of emotionally draining uncertainty?

What about student loan forgiveness? Increasing the minimum wage? Really, ANY "socialist" measure that might cost someone well-to-do like yourself more in taxes, to ensure that people in the lower class have a chance to avoid that sort of emotionally draining thinking? Would you support those sorts of things?

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Muffin, good luck getting married at the courthouse right now when the courts are mostly closed.

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Inviso posted...

So would you agree that we should have medicare for all, so that the people who don't know if they'll be able to afford food/rent and the exorbitant price for their medications in a single month, won't have to worry about that sort of emotionally draining uncertainty?

What about student loan forgiveness? Increasing the minimum wage? Really, ANY "socialist" measure that might cost someone well-to-do like yourself more in taxes, to ensure that people in the lower class have a chance to avoid that sort of emotionally draining thinking? Would you support those sorts of things?

Can we compromise on cutting taxes for people who aren't well off? People don't have money to pay for all of those things after their money is taken to pay social security tax, medicare tax, sales tax, speeding tickets, parking tickets, car registration fees, etc. Yes, those are all regressive taxes where people who earn less pay a higher percentage.

If you want to increase income tax and capital gains tax to make up the shortfall from getting rid of these taxes - fine.

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Our wedding was postponed this is awful. Well actually its only bad because my fianc cries about it at night. And actually were not even in any hurry to be married we just feel obligated to have the party. And actually were not in any hurry to have the party either. BUT THIS IS SO EMOTIONALLY DRAINING FOR ME

It sounds like literally the only hardship to you is the being woken up part

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https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/15/us/trump-radio-show-rush-limbaugh.html

...

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Grimlyn posted...

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/15/us/trump-radio-show-rush-limbaugh.html

...

Trump and Fauci in the Mor-ning!
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I never got the same huge party everyone else did, and it never upset me because I knew how badly everyone (including me) was hurting.

I don't know anyone who has COVID at all, let alone anyone who has died from it.

Perhaps I'd be less concerned about my wedding if I did. But I don't. So far, my wedding being cancelled is literally the worst COVID-related thing to happen to anyone I know, unless you count some of my cousins being furloughed from their jobs or something.

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SmartMuffin posted...

I don't know anyone who has COVID at all, let alone anyone who has died from it.

You know TimJab!
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Also:

Socialized healthcare - Yes, this is a win-win where everyone will benefit except maybe the top 5-10% of the population. The country as a whole will probably pay around 40% less based on the experience of other countries.

Student loan forgiveness - No, even though I would personally benefit. The actual effect will be to provide a massive windfall to colleges when they raise their tuition even higher now that everyone will be able to afford college since they are billing the taxpayers directly. The net results will be that the country as a whole pays more and the colleges become even more filthy rich than they already are.

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I have a family member who is a doctor in NYC who got coronavirus. None of my relatives in China have gotten it.

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But yeah, if they're not going to abolish social security, they should at least make social security/medicare tax progressive. How about 0% for the first 30k, 3% for 30k-50k, 5% for 50k-80k, 7% for 80k-130k, and 10% for 130k+?

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SmartMuffin posted...

I don't know anyone who has COVID at all, let alone anyone who has died from it.

Perhaps I'd be less concerned about my wedding if I did. But I don't. So far, my wedding being cancelled is literally the worst COVID-related thing to happen to anyone I know, unless you count some of my cousins being furloughed from their jobs or something.

Ladies and gentlemen: I give you, the entire context behind my argument from the first several pages of this topic.

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