Current Events > Do you guys... not realize a question is not offensive?

(+) Yeah! (+)

"transgendering"

damn looks like my afternoon got booked solid, gotta spend all my time transgendering now

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scar the 1 posted...

Most people here who go into discussions aren't interested in learning anything or asking genuine questions. They're usually interested in telling the world they're right.

If a person were generally interested, they would not shy away from reading the summary paragraph on a Wikipedia page

So you are holding him to a higher standard because he wanted to learn from others?

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I don't even know when we started basing restrooms on gender and not sex. We have a unisex restroom, restrooms say men/women/handicapped/family such a thing as female urinal exist a big one not a portable one just not often in the states. I haven't seen a restroom based on gender, I'm told and read they exist though but I find it odd since people identify by a lot of genders I just assume they have one all genders?


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joe40001 posted...

So you are holding him to a higher standard because he wanted to learn from others?

Higher standard compared to whom?

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scar the 1 posted...

Higher standard compared to whom?

The people here who go into discussions aren't interested in learning anything or asking genuine questions.

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cuttin_in_farm posted...

@Jabodie

Thats ignoring the point. This is a message board.

By your logic, every random question about social issues shouldnt be asked because you can Google it.

I was modded for being offensive. Its one thing if they thought I was trolling. Modding things you personally dont agree with (because lets face it, thats what it was. A mod didnt agree with the idea. Even though I didnt call anyone cross dressers), is not a productive way to handle social issues. Full stop.

But anyone using even the slightest bit of context clues can discern my question is genuine. And Mods shouldnt be allowed to mod a post that is included in a chain of replies without first reading the chain. Otherwise you get stupid shit like this.

Unless you dont have to be an adult to be a moderator here, we should be able to confidently discern who is trolling and who isnt. I didnt escalate to insults or jokes. I asked a question since the conversation I was having was relevant. I only asked the question because a previous post didnt make sense to me with the knowledge available.

I wasnt aware I should research facts online after every post when a poster is willingly answering for me.

Blame your fellow GameFAQs users. As has already been stated, 99% of the time when someone asks that question they know exactly what the difference is and theyre doing it to troll under the guise of not understanding.

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joe40001 posted...

The people here who go into discussions aren't interested in learning anything or asking genuine questions.

I'm not holding them to any standard because this isn't about them, it's about TC who refused to do literally any work to try and understand something, and yet he tries to claim he was being genuine.

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scar the 1 posted...

I'm not holding them to any standard because this isn't about them, it's about TC who refused to do literally any work to try and understand something, and yet he tries to claim he was being genuine.

idk I think asking people questions is doing work to understand.

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joe40001 posted...

idk I think asking people questions is doing work to understand.

ok good for you

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Although "Use google" is good advice, that advice also gets modded on many Western yet highly censored forums. Thus, if someone asks a question, it would actually make sense that non-rhetorical questions go unmodded. Even questions that might or might not be rhetorical should probably be let alone, so as to presume innocence rather than guilt. Anyway, I'll certainly never be applying for the moderator job so it's difficult for me to put in much judgement on their choices. A general hands-off approach should be encouraged, though. A good way to enforce a hands-off approach is to allow moderators to war with each other by undeleting each other's deletions. They will feel like their moderations aren't worth as much and won't do it as often. In such a circumstance you could actually allow more people to be mods and not have to worry about quality, much like wikipedia's method.
Best wishes

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cuttin_in_farm posted...

Trolling.

But seriously. What makes a mod think hm. This guy asked a question about transgenderism without using insults or slurs. Clearly his intent is to be offensive even though there is a civil discourse happening! I shall moderate him!

Like, how are people spose to understand each other if people just block and erase different viewpoints?

its called the Berkeley campus strategy. Pretty prevalent around the country anywhere open debate was once encouraged. Now its suppressed and undermined.

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cuttin_in_farm posted...

Trolling.

But seriously. What makes a mod think hm. This guy asked a question about transgenderism without using insults or slurs. Clearly his intent is to be offensive even though there is a civil discourse happening! I shall moderate him!

Like, how are people spose to understand each other if people just block and erase different viewpoints?

This happens all the time they don't even give an explanation and if you try to make one so that everyone can understand you can also receive a moderation for correcting them as well


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LightningAce11 posted...

There are trans users on this board, ask them.

Or better yet, there's entire articles and YouTube series on the subject. At least then you'll have a fundamental basis and won't be asking literal definition level stuff, TC.

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DeathDeathSong posted...

"transgendering"

damn looks like my afternoon got booked solid, gotta spend all my time transgendering now

Honey came in and she caught me red-handed
Creeping with the girl next door
Picture this we were both butt naked
Transgendering on the bathroom floor

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TC, I saw your question and understand 100%. I think its an older generation thing, it was never an issue or anything bad and definitely was never used for harm. I just think in the recent years its been added to the words that are no longer good.

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BallroomBetch posted...

Bro you're on the most left-leaning board on the most left-leaning site during the period in history when censorship and groupthink are at their all-time highest. If you wanna question something, write it in your diary. Ask dead relatives. Get a Magic 8 Ball. But don't post it online.

This. Why would you even take these people seriously TC? Half of the people here don't work and spend all day on the Internet getting offended by something. Honestly though, what's sadder, them or the person needing acceptance of them?

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The internet in general has lost its mind. I see why so many people went out and bought guns now.

Just imagine if this board was full of the 35-40 year old white women who stay on their soapbox on Twitter and Facebook all day.

It is pretty much the same though but instead of "stay at home mommies" is a bunch of NEETs and incels.

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cuttin_in_farm posted...

Giant yikes guys.

This is why racism and bigotry is so prevalent. If you ask a genuine question about something you dont understand, you get modded?

Are you serious?

Wont that just upset people who dont deal with certain lifestyles and views and make them less likely to accept it?

I feel your pain. Mods here went from dog shit to absolute and complete diarrhea horse shit. I'm done posting in CE, because it's very clear that liberal SJW crybaby mods are all that exist anymore, and they ensure that only their opinions are heard.

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yemmy posted...

The internet in general has lost its mind. I see why so many people went out and bought guns now.

To shoot their computers?

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[LFAQs-redacted-quote]

This. And that's why I marked that post; it came across as disingenuous trolling.

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My arts- https://www.deviantart.com/bleakcreep

Pus_N_Pecans posted...

This. And that's why I marked that post; it came across as disingenuous trolling.

Im feeling like Roy Mustang right now, not gonna lie.

@Pus_N_Pecans , did you read the previous posts before marking?

And were you personally offended by it?

Those are my two questions.

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If only you put this much effort into Googling something and clicking the first link instead of whining about internet karma

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MacadamianNut3 posted...

If only you put this much effort into Googling something and clicking the first link instead of whining about internet karma

I havent lost a single karma. Im upset about posts being removed. Just look at this topic. I dont recall a single offensive post. Yet a bunch of deletions.

One of my posts was deleted because I said most Americans dont encounter someone who has underwent transgender procedure (I hope this is fine?). Thats literally why.

Im thankful the mod actually gave a fucking explanation. Thats new. But this reasoning is insane.

Because again, for the Just use Wikipedia lel, if you do not know you do not know something, and youre in the middle of a conversation where you yourself are being asked questions, one does not think to research in the middle of it

Im sure Id be blamed if I read misinformation btw. Shits crazy.

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cuttin_in_farm posted...

Im feeling like Roy Mustang right now, not gonna lie.

@Pus_N_Pecans , did you read the previous posts before marking?

And were you personally offended by it?

Those are my two questions.

Yes and yes, which is why that was the only one I marked. There comes a point when genuine curiosity crosses into trolling and it seemed like youd reached that point with that post.

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cuttin_in_farm posted...

And also, just to elaborate on why I think this suggestion is unrealistic.

People dont know what they dont know.

I.E., I thought I knew what a transgender was. However responses contradicted what I originally thought to be true, so I was asking questions.

One does not research about arithmetic, for example, before contributing to a conversation on it. Most people believe they know it well enough, even if they may not be good at math.

But new concepts and ideas they were not aware of cause them to realize they have questions.

Personally the first place I go when introduced to new math concepts is some place like Wikipedia if I'm not shit posting. I simply don't consider posting online to be conversational. You have as much time as you want to consider a response. It is different than talking with somebody right in front of you where pulling up something might be strange or rude.

cuttin_in_farm posted...

If you believe this, then I totally disagree with you 100%. This is why misinformation is so rampant already. Nobody looking at context and being complacent with passing judgement/offense off of out of context phrases.

The irony of saying I should do due diligence on sensitive topics while others are free to not do so for me.

Id go as far as to say arrogant, tbh.

I'm not saying they shouldn't do due diligence. I'm saying they won't.

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Pus_N_Pecans posted...

Yes and yes,

No you didnt. Theres no way you read anything with any level of seriousness if you saw that as trolling. Theres a specific reason I backed out of the conversation when I learned social transitioning is a concept.

I have bad news for yall if this is the reaction yall have for people with my questions. I dont live in those big cities or in a progressive state. But there are A LOT of people not knowledgeable about any of this, who may think they have a solid understanding on it.

If yall are serious about wanting equality for everyone, yall need to show much more understanding about what people know. And what they dont. Getting loloffended and trying to censor discussion is NOT the right approach. Because all it does is make people angry. And angry people are not prone to reason.

I was infuriated when I saw the moderation because I felt like I genuinely tried to learn, and instead I was told my questions are offensive.

Fortunately Im not thin skinned, but seriously. We need to re-evaluate how discussions around people who are transgender is had. Because I dont see NEARLY the same egg shell walking when it comes to the black community. Which also pisses me off. Black people have been dealing with more shit for much longer, yet I feel like were still treated worse.

I just wont fucking ask anything anymore if mere questions have people clutching their pearls. Dunno how yall handle real life, cause there sure as hell isnt a block button.

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It's gamefaqs. There's snowflakes here. And they make the rules up as they go along.

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Being a crossdresser is obviously different than being trans.

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Jabodie posted...

Personally the first place I go when introduced to new math concepts is some place like Wikipedia if I'm not shit posting.

You have to first realize the math concept is new to do this.

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hockeybub89 posted...

Being a crossdresser is obviously different than being trans.

I didnt fucking say crossdressing was being trans.

New information surfaced about what I previously thought being trans was, so I asked a question to help me understand.

Read the full conversation.

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joe40001 posted...

It kinda does make it less offensive.

I don't really understand how anybody feels justified thinking that a person with no offensive or hurtful intent saying something should be thought of as malicious.

I think most of us are starting way too far in the "of course it's fine to suppress conversation if it offends people" camp. We should have good faith discussions that aren't looking to be offended but instead only moderate people with malice.

In the context of good faith discussions I personally can't think of anything that should be considered offensive.

Offensive doesn't mean malicious. It means just that: offensive. Let's use a more extreme example:

Let's say I used the n word with a black friend IRL about what it meant because I legitimately did not know it was offensive. Would it be unreasonable to for him/her to be offended and ask for an apology? I don't think so. It was still offensive, even if the intent wasn't to be offensive.

The same goes for legit hard-core Christians who preach against homosexuality. In many cases, the goal is not to be offensive at all but literally save people's eternal souls (i don't believe in souls in you're wondering). However, their rhetoric is 100% offensive to gay people. Does their intent not make their statements offensive?

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Why are you this concerned about being moderated though? You're acting like you were banned for asking a question.

Also the premise of this topic is absurd regardless of the context of your individual incident. Obviously I would get moderated if I said something like "Why shouldn't <marginalized group> all be thrown in prison?".

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cuttin_in_farm posted...

You have to first realize the math concept is new to do this.

So you mean like a set of equations on a board where I have no key words to follow? Or like I'm starting from somewhere like "wtf I thought math was just numbers, what are these letters doing here?"

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Jabodie posted...

Let's say I used the n word with a black friend IRL about what it meant because I legitimately did not know it was offensive. Would it be unreasonable to for him/her to be offended and ask for an apology? I don't think so. It was still offensive, even if the intent wasn't to be offensive.

This is where you and I differ. I dont like banning words across the board, so intent has to be a factor when it comes to censoring. A post being removed on a public forum would have to be purposefully offensive for me to agree removing it.

Because if the person doesnt know, there WILL be others who dont either. Removing the question or mistake is akin to banning books that use the N word. Youre stifling discussion and understanding between people with different life experiences.

People can be offensive about anything. Intent has to be present.

Anteaterking posted...

Why are you this concerned about being moderated though? You're acting like you were banned for asking a question.

Also the premise of this topic is absurd regardless of the context of your individual incident. Obviously I would get moderated if I said something like "Why shouldn't <marginalized group> all be thrown in prison?".

Ignore the topic title. I was angry and knee jerk reacted on the title.

But Im upset that things (even in this topic) are being deleted. I dont agree with deleting things that offend you if the person isnt trying to offend.

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cuttin_in_farm posted...

Fortunately Im not thin skinned, but seriously. We need to re-evaluate how discussions around people who are transgender is had. Because I dont see NEARLY the same egg shell walking when it comes to the black community. Which also pisses me off. Black people have been dealing with more s*** for much longer, yet I feel like were still treated worse.

I can agree with you here tbh. Lots of trolling allowed when it comes to these subjects imo.

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Jabodie posted...

So you mean like a set of equations on a board where I have no key words to follow? Or like I'm starting from somewhere like "wtf I thought math was just numbers, what are these letters doing here?"

More like the latter.

Think about parents who thought Math? I was pretty good at this. Ill help you out, son, but then realize how people do math now is completely different than what they thought. At the first sign of difference, people arent going to just cave in and assume they no longer know. They are going to continue for a little bit until its obvious they are behind.

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Im just steering clear of gender topics and try not to comment on them.

A lot of people assume you're an asshole and getting labeled as a homophobic white dude..... is ironic.

But that's fine, assume whatever you want. You dont even know the truth and are quick to see enemies.

cuttin_in_farm posted...

Think about parents who thought Math? I was pretty good at this. Ill help you out, son, but then realize how people do math now is completely different than what they thought. At the first sign of difference, people arent going to just cave in and assume they no longer know. They are going to continue for a little bit until its obvious they are behind.

I mean the reason this is a bad comparison is usually in this situation, those parents just get mad and rant about common core and the new curriculum being bad when in reality they never actually understood the math in the first place.

cuttin_in_farm posted...

People can be offensive about anything. Intent has to be present.

Flipping someone off in western culture is offensive. If you do it without knowing what it meant, it's still offensive. The ignorance of the person doing it might impact how you approach the situation in terms of possible learning and such, but it doesn't mean it's not offensive.

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cuttin_in_farm posted...

I was infuriated when I saw the moderation because I felt like I genuinely tried to learn, and instead I was told my questions are offensive.

You learned that it was offensive to refer to trans people as crossdressers if nothing else. And nothing was censored anyway, you even got your question answered in another post before you were moderated.

I'm out now by the way.

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Getting moderated for being offensive is why racism is so prevalent? So moderation causes racism is your theory TC? Should be easy to set up an experiment to test this, are highly moderated posters more likely to be racist?

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Anteaterking posted...

I mean the reason this is a bad comparison is usually in this situation, those parents just get mad and rant about common core and the new curriculum being bad when in reality they never actually understood the math in the first place.

No, that doesnt make it a bad comparison. It only reinforces my point.

If people dont know things, they can have many reactions. Im more open-minded, so Im willing to change what I thought I knew.

Now imagine people like those stubborn parents or someone stuck in their ways. Removing their voice when they didnt know pretty much ensures they will never learn out of spite.

This is not the right approach.

Anteaterking posted...

Flipping someone off in western culture is offensive. If you do it without knowing what it meant, it's still offensive. The ignorance of the person doing it might impact how you approach the situation in terms of possible learning and such, but it doesn't mean it's not offensive.

Consequences should vary. Someone who is counting and so happens to drop to his middle finger shouldnt be seens as someone trying to flip someone off in a humorous fashion.

Or more realistically, I use my middle finger to rub my eyes or straighten my eye brows a lot. One person once asked why I flipped them off to my confusion. When talking about it, I discovered my habit, and they came to understand flipping him off wasnt my intention.

But we talked about it. No harm no foul.

On Gamefaq, you cannot. If I was to dispute the two moderations I have, mods wont care.

In this very topic people are saying Well, duh. EVERYONE knows that! Ever hear of wikipedia?? *snort*

There is no discussion. Just accusations.

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cuttin_in_farm posted...

A post being removed on a public forum would have to be purposefully offensive for me to agree removing it.

Sure, but tbh I'm as concerned about the moderation itself. Moreso the underlying question of can something be offensive if effective that wasn't the intent.

cuttin_in_farm posted...

People can be offensive about anything. Intent has to be present.

And in this respect we seem to have some agreement.

But we do disagree; I don't think it's unreasonable to remove content considered offensive even if that was the intent in a forum moderation context. The purpose of moderation is primarily to avoid updating visitors. I can agree it stifles certain conversations, and it might not be how I would run the website, but I don't think it is an unreasonable stance to take.

I enjoyed this discussion but it seems we're at an impasse here. This is probably one of the more enjoyable conversations I've had on CE.

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Pus_N_Pecans posted...

You learned that it was offensive to refer to trans people as crossdressers if nothing else. And nothing was censored anyway, you even got your question answered in another post before you were moderated.

I'm out now by the way.

You couldnt have joined the conversation and informed them like other people in that topic?

Pus_N_Pecans posted...

You learned that it was offensive to refer to trans people as crossdressers if nothing else. And nothing was censored anyway, you even got your question answered in another post before you were moderated.

I'm out now by the way.

[LFAQs-redacted-quote]


Yes.

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Proofpyros posted...

You couldnt have joined the conversation and informed them like other people in that topic?

That would require them to actually try being helpful and productive.

People nowadays just block things they dont like and call that progress.

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shockthemonkey posted...

So you got your question answered and didnt lose karma and youre still melting down about this?

Come on man. It was a dumb moderation but, how bored can you be that this is worth it?

This is a serious issue to me. The constant need to assume the absolute worst intent of others CONSTANTLY in life is whats leading to so many issues imo. I want to address it.

If its not worth it for you, cool. It is to me. You dont have to post here if its not important for you. I mean that nicely.

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