Board 8 > King of Fighters 2020 (NOT MERCS) R1D47: John Egbert vs Genos (Mid)

(+) Yeah! (+)

Welcome to the King of Fighters 2020 (NOT MERCS) Simulated Character Battle Tournament!

The game is simple. The two* listed characters are placed in an (imaginary) location with a variety of (imaginary) environments, kind of like a picture in a child's schoolbook that describes different types of geological features. Within a ten mile radius, there is an (imaginary) urban downtown, exurbs, plains, snow-clad mountains at the edge, dry plains, etc. Fighters start wherever is most appropriate for them, but feel increasingly compelled to seek out their opponent and fight. Strong-willed fighters can try to hold out in their chosen environment for longer... eventually, all will succumb and actively search for the other to battle.

To participate, just vote in bold for whichever character you believe will win. Giving reasoning is optional, but please be polite and read what others have said and carefully make your decision. I'll ping the nominators (they can opt out) to give arguments if they wish.

Results/Discussion: https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/8-gamefaqs-contests/78797189

TODAY'S PARTICIPANTS:
John Egbert (Homestuck)

Apparently once created "a massive cyclone to drill to the core of a planet" so I guess he's pretty strong

vs

Genos (One Punch Man)

With a cyborg body and unbelievably fast reflex, Genos has basically shonen anime powers distilled

@hombad46 @Johnbobb

FIGHT

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Oh boy, Genos. Gonna be hard to take him seriously given how frequently he jobs in his own series, though admittedly I'm not even caught up to the OPM manga let alone the webcomic so he might have more impressive feats there.

Anyway, John is capable of fighting somewhat evenly with Bec Noir, who is pretty powerful to put it mildly. I guess to try and compare it to OPM, Genos seemed unsure if he could destroy the meteor heading toward Z City. Bec Noir has the same power as Becquerel, who was able to destroy a meteor which I believe was quite a bit larger.

Also, since this battle is happening outside of Homestuck canon, John won't have access to his retcon powers, since they only work in canon, so Genos has that going for him I guess.

Right now I'm gonna have to go with John

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I know nothing about homestuck and don't really want to look it up

I mean Genos jobs but only compared to Saitama (who is literally OP: The Character) and world-ending threats that could only be taken down by Saitama. Compared to literally anything else in that world he's a beast, and he gets considerably stronger in S2. For instance, the meteor was very early in the series. I know in the manga at least he mentions later on that he could easily one-shot it.

In season two he's able to keep up with Speed-O-Sound Sonic, a character that moves at the speed of sound. It's hard to determine exactly how strong he is against enemies since most of the enemies he fights are so strong to the point of ALMOST being invincible, but you can generally make out the effects

https://youtu.be/qwHR9BIdS4s?t=527

https://youtu.be/RMfIgcZwoC0?t=80

he's also able to reattach lost limbs at will

honestly probably worth it to just watch the Death Battle recap on him:

https://youtu.be/XQjXPYeRcEE?t=52

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genos

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Genos just because having wind based abilities seem kind of worthless against him. Also it's an extremely first strike situation for Genos. I don't think Egbert has the tools to go against this.

John Egbert stomps. He's a potential planet buster and goes up against things far beyond Genos level (The Condesce who makes Tatsumaki look like a joke in the psychic department and Bec Noir who is busted).

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ZeeksFire posted...

Genos just because having wind based abilities seem kind of worthless against him. Also it's an extremely first strike situation for Genos. I don't think Egbert has the tools to go against this.

You underestimate John's wind. This is DRILLING THROUGH A PLANET wind we are talking about.

https://i.imgur.com/XN3acDk.gif

He is also able to keep up with Bec Noir who is FTL and can make himself intangible / pull substitution shit with windy thing

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I admittedly didn't finish Homestuck, but from what I remember John goes down in one hit to Bec Noir. There might be something late in the comic that I'm not familiar with though.

rwlh posted...

I admittedly didn't finish Homestuck, but from what I remember John goes down in one hit to Bec Noir. There might be something late in the comic that I'm not familiar with though.

Yeah that was fresh after he got God Tier. He dukes it out with him later after a time skip and has a much more respectable showing

https://www.homestuck.com/story/5334

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Genos

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Pirateking2000 posted...

Yeah that was fresh after he got God Tier. He dukes it out with him later after a time skip and has a much more respectable showing

https://www.homestuck.com/story/5334

I'll take your word for it. Trying to avoid spoilers in case I ever finish the comic. This probably means I shouldn't vote in the match, honestly.

Johnbobb posted...

I know nothing about homestuck and don't really want to look it up

this was a good decision

John's powers seem so inconsistent and complicated that I'm not sure I understand him well enough to vote

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John Egbert
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ZeeksFire posted...

Genos just because having wind based abilities seem kind of worthless against him. Also it's an extremely first strike situation for Genos. I don't think Egbert has the tools to go against this.

Sneak Attacks/First Strikes against Homestuck characters on John's level tend to just cause them to revive immediately
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Pirateking2000 posted...

You underestimate John's wind. This is DRILLING THROUGH A PLANET wind we are talking about.

https://i.imgur.com/XN3acDk.gif

He is also able to keep up with Bec Noir who is FTL and can make himself intangible / pull substitution shit with windy thing

tbh I still think that's below Genos

reaction time and movement speed alone I think makes it hard for homestuck to hit him

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Johnbobb posted...

tbh I still think that's below Genos

reaction time and movement speed alone I think makes it hard for homestuck to hit him

How? Nothing in OPM has shown literally drilling the entirety of a planet straight through in levels of power as far as I am aware (though I haven't been keeping up to current OPM last I checked Boros was still considered the strongest they had fought). Also refer to https://www.homestuck.com/story/5334

John stomps Genos on both speed and power

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Okay so if we're scaling Genos to Speed-o-sound Sonic, I think it's fair to scale John to Bec Noir, who defeated Bro, who can do this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CgrMgKNeZQQ&feature=emb_logo

Which I think would be at least sonic speed

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it might be if it was clear what was going on there, is Bro the monkey? those are some fast dance moves to be sonic speed

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Shonen_Bat posted...

it might be if it was clear what was going on there, is Bro the monkey? those are some fast dance moves to be sonic speed

Bro is that slight shade you see behind the dummy. He is beating Dave's ass with the puppet with constant flash stepping + puppeteering. That is how fast he is moving and Jack Noir / Bec Noir is insanely beyond Bro as he was being outmatched as he needed help against him pre Bec boost, then got btfo immediately once he got the Bec boost

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Pirateking2000 posted...

Bro is that slight shade you see behind the dummy. He is beating Dave's ass with the puppet with constant flash stepping + puppeteering. That is how fast he is moving

Yes, this. Sorry I didn't make that clear.

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ugh i hate homestuck so much

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Johnbobb posted...

ugh i hate homestuck so much

The problem here is that John shouldn't be in mid tier but there are a lot of mismatched entry tierings it seems

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This is actually high I just forgot to update the day/tier in the title

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the Homestuck clips here barely say anything about the characters to a casual viewer lol

John hitting Bec (assuming that was Bec) over the head with a hammer while he was distracted and seemingly just annoying him doesn't feel like something that puts him on Genos' level

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Egbert

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Shonen_Bat posted...

the Homestuck clips here barely say anything about the characters to a casual viewer lol

John hitting Bec (assuming that was Bec) over the head with a hammer while he was distracted and seemingly just annoying him doesn't feel like something that puts him on Genos' level

Bec Noir is one of the most powerful characters in the whole thing and a universe buster in certain circumstances which is why the damage looked insignificant (and that was with a bunch of ultra endgame super gear on top of being a god tier. Bec is busted powerful). He pops planets like nothing and flies between them with ease. He also chases their ship going FTL for years.

Some comparison you can try making for him if you want to go from clips

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4xfLEthnrYM

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that video makes even less sense!

John failing to damage Bec tells me as much as Genos not being able to hit Saitama when they fought.

I'm leaning Genos right now because figuring out how strong he is requires a lot less guesswork and mind-numbing Homestuck lore but I'm not sure if I want to vote based on that, or at all really

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Shonen_Bat posted...

that video makes even less sense!

John failing to damage Bec tells me as much as Genos not being able to hit Saitama when they fought.

I'm leaning Genos right now because figuring out how strong he is requires a lot less guesswork and mind-numbing Homestuck lore but I'm not sure if I want to vote based on that, or at all really

Not sure what else to tell you. When John is keeping up with the guy casually flying between planets (something John is also capable of) that alone should tell you he is WAY beyond sonic speed. The planetary wind drill / planet storms and one bonking giant monsters shows that he also out damages and out scales Genos. He is also able to just make himself intangible so Genos ends up flying through air if he is able to get close enough for a tackle. As far as I am aware Genos has shown nothing close to this level unless something happened in the manga that I am unaware of?

Another instance of wind intangibility
https://imgur.com/a/Nf7uk

John putting out fires across his entire planet
https://imgur.com/a/EtgJ5

Planet post wind drill
https://comicvine.gamespot.com/images/1300-5485038

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Shonen_Bat posted...

the Homestuck clips here barely say anything about the characters to a casual viewer lol

John hitting Bec (assuming that was Bec) over the head with a hammer while he was distracted and seemingly just annoying him doesn't feel like something that puts him on Genos' level

It's more that he was keeping up with him throughout the rest of the fight, and even managed to knock his sword out of his hand at one point. Though the fact that the hit he got in made Bec Noir visibly lose health from his health bar is impressive IMO.

Gonna try and go over different stats for John here:

Durability: Was hit with the Condesce's beams multiple times over the course of the final battle. And I guess the ability to completely nullify attacks by turning into wind can go under durability.

Speed: Kept up with Bec Noir, who defeated both Bro and Davesprite simultaneously. Bro being fast enough to utterly clown on Dave with a puppet and also slice a meteor clean in two.

Attack strength: His control over wind is strong enough to drill to the core of a small planet and even lift an entire battleship as seen in that earlier gif. He also put out a fire covering a different small planet.

Shonen_Bat posted...

John failing to damage Bec tells me as much as Genos not being able to hit Saitama when they fought.

He did damage him though. You can see his health bar when he lands that blow to the head.

I'm trying to find the best way to scale John without going full "Let me tell you about Homestuck". It's proving rather difficult.

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Pirateking2000 posted...

Planet post wind drill
https://comicvine.gamespot.com/images/1300-5485038

This doesn't seem to load for me

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hombad46 posted...

This doesn't seem to load for me

https://i.imgur.com/rvTMX9t.gif
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hombad46 posted...

This doesn't seem to load for me

Weird loaded for me before but then had trouble. Anyway yeah that

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John Egbert

he could even beat Saitama by retconning his decision to become a hero, the hell is mr cyborg jobber gonna do against that kind of power

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hombad46 posted...

Also, since this battle is happening outside of Homestuck canon, John won't have access to his retcon powers, since they only work in canon, so Genos has that going for him I guess.

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Who says his retcon powers only work in his own universe? That is just speculation.

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PrinceKaro posted...

Who says his retcon powers only work in his own universe? That is just speculation.

While they are dubiously canon, didn't his retcon powers stop working in the Candy path of the Epilogues? I haven't really been keeping up with the epilogues myself tbh.

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him being in high and not broken says he can't just rewrite the contest to make himself the winner of every match

Genos constantly goes up against these world-ending threats and gets back up, puts himself back together and keeps trucking along, it's going to take more than John probably has to put him down for good

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Shonen_Bat posted...

him being in high and not broken says he can't just rewrite the contest to make himself the winner of every match

Genos constantly goes up against these world-ending threats and gets back up, puts himself back together and keeps trucking along, it's going to take more than John probably has to put him down for good

Has Genos ever shown that he can output enough power to beat John's feats, though?
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Yeah retcon powers shouldn't really be a factor given stuff that happens in the epilogue and then that opens up that whole can of worms of "canon vs non canon" nonsense going on.

Besides it should be pretty clear cut. John massively out speeds Genos, takes on more threatening opponents (beings capable of actually obliterating planets full stop or chucking them around like toys (see [S]Game Over)) and has more damage output. Genos isn't going around doing planetary level attacks.

Shonen_Bat posted...

Genos constantly goes up against these world-ending threats and gets back up, puts himself back together and keeps trucking along.

Yes. He gets btfo by said threats and has to be put back together again for later with help. Genos isn't getting help here unless Kuseno is hiding somewhere and can retrieve him.

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John Egbert

Someone who keeps up with a canonical universe buster is far beyond the scope of Genos. At the simplest level, that's really all you need to know.

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Genos consistently loses fights to foes that have significantly less power output and speed feats than John does. I don't think he really stands a chance here.
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Having a decent knowledge of both sides, John and not that closely. John is pretty overpowered to put it lightly

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