Poll of the Day > HALF of Americans HATE Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez and 70% REJECT Socialism!!!

(+) Yeah! (+)

A Rasmussen/Heartland Institute Poll, which gears toward surveying conservative americans show that 50% of Americans have an UNFAVOURABLE opinion of Alexandria Ocasio Cortez and 70% favour a FREE MARKET economic system because they DESPISE SOCIALISM!!

The vast majority of voters prefer the free market economic system over a socialist economic system as 48% see Ocasio-Cortez with a negative opinion with 38 giving her a very unfavourable

Only 37% found a favourable opinoin of her including 18% with a very favourable as 16% were unsure

The survey says that the majority of americans reject socialism and adopt the free market principles

Chris Talgo, the editor for Heartland institute said "Despite increased calls for socialism by many on the far left, the vast majority of likely voters believe the United States should embrace a free market economy. Only a sliver of likely voters think the United States should abandon the free market capitalistic policies that are responsible for making the United States the wealthiest nation in world history. Despite the countless calls for more socialism among elites in media and Hollywood, Americans aren't interested in adopting the same socialist policies that have led to mass poverty whereever they have been tried".

Ocasio-Cortez has also ruffled feathers with moderate democrats in republican states and districts as she lost a seat in the prestigious House Energy and Commerce Committee

They took her on after she called for new leadership in the House and Senate chamber and has had a week long battle with Democrat Joe Manchin of West Virginia

Do you think Progressives will ever convince Conservative America to adopt Government funded healthcare?

https://i.imgur.com/tV5VwTm.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/t9aLUFx.jpg
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So it's not 50% of Americans, it's 50% of conservatives.

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umm, government funded healthcare isn't socialism...

In a weird way no service industry at all can even be socialist since a service industry doesn't produce anything.

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But they still want their covid checks.

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Most people in power who want socialism are insane, hate America, tyrants, or both and a few are antisemetic, which further spits in the face of American values. A Sanders is few and far between and they tend to be older democrats, they won't last forever and we're left with every worst case scenario imaginable. The old, safe establishment is better than the ruin that will result from socialism and the loose cannons that want to run the system.
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Most people don't even fully understand socialism anyways. Probably most liberals who want it don't quite know what they'd really be getting too.

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=snMDGOsziPA&ab_channel=Red-BloodedAmerica

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Well, AOC is a fucking moron so... fair, next?

Granted, AOC wasn't qualified for office and the idiots in her district voted her in, so I guess it's not entirely her fault.

papercup posted...

So it's not 50% of Americans, it's 50% of conservatives.

With Ducky, it's hard to be sure what he means by anything.

Lokarin posted...

umm, government funded healthcare isn't socialism...

It is socialism.

Lokarin posted...

In a weird way no service industry at all can even be socialist since a service industry doesn't produce anything.

That's a stupid way to justify your stupid belief.


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papercup posted...

So it's not 50% of Americans, it's 50% of conservatives.

Damn I figured it would be closer to 100% then.

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Lokarin posted...

umm, government funded healthcare isn't socialism...

It's not Socialism by itself, certainly not the definition of Socialism, but it is a product of Socialism and definitely a Socialist policy.

papercup posted...

So it's not 50% of Americans, it's 50% of conservatives.

I'm confused about this too. Was this survey open to everyone, or just anyone that called themselves a Conservative? Either way, I don't believe this poll to be accurate data on what Conservatives think, because if it's open to everyone then it obviously isn't targeting just Conservatives, and even if it is targeting them, what is stopping some Liberal or Centrist from voting in the poll? And if you're going to ask why they would do such a thing; how about to sway public opinion? We humans are very vulnerable to conforming.

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Zareth posted...

Damn I figured it would be closer to 100% then.

It definitely is lol. Its probably like 99.8%

And the other .2% are confused

I think if socialism wasn't explained by Cold War fearmongers and corporate propaganda, it would not get the flak it does. Pensions, disability, employment insurance, public infrastructure projects... all socialism. Even aspects of the military and other government-funded jobs are. No one system is perfect. Smart people will adopt the parts of a differing ideology that work. If you take two systems, even if one has way more positives than the other, you will still find some aspects are better about the worse one. I think the USSR was a trainwreck, but every kid getting to go to join a sport, no processed foods, and a free college education (that didn't include future barista degrees) are perks it offered over capitalist nations.

Obviously, despite me framing it very clearly, that's still going to trigger an idiot to spout off criticisms of the USSR, despite the fact I've already called it a trainwreck and it's just an easy example to use, so let me beat them to the punch: there were shortages of virtually everything, there was rampant corruption, gulags, no freedom of speech, lower average standard of living than the west, etc... It's worse. Duh. I'm not claiming otherwise.

G) No, it's highly unlikely the US will change its general state of mind as to run or let things be run, as a whole. Too many people are dead set on this current brand of "Us vs Them" while vehement, belligerent even, against the idea of taxes despite wanting the programs that require funding from our tax dollars.

Also, "third world" was a Cold War designation for countries not taking either side in the conflict between the US's capitalism and the USSR's communism. If anything, we'd become more like a shade of Japan in regards to how late stage capitalism has caused too many people to either isolate entirely or work themselves to death, but with more "'MURICA!" deep fried into it; that's the fate of "first world" left unchecked.

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Dang, how could you hate AOC. Half of America confirmed mentally ill.

Also-also: Beware any statistic that doesn't list its margin of error, let alone where it finds its sample size. Chances are that such statistics are a heaping, steaming load of manure on a good day.

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Ngl, those stats are above what I'd expect considering the demographic polled.

Also, thread title is garbage.

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Gaawa_chan posted...

Also, thread title is garbage.

It's a Duckbear standard.

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It always amazes me when people claim they hate socialism when America, especially in the mid 20th century was built on socialist ideals which is what FDRs New Deal which helped along with labor unions to usher in home ownership among working class people because prior to that, working people did not own a home period.

The Great Depression opened the eyes to what many working Americans back then knew and that was when it all goes south, there's nowhere to turn and FDR tried to bridge that gap with safety nets and as we've seen during the Covid pandemic, millions of working people are suffering financially right now.

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A Rasmussen poll?

Let me become super concerned.

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Zeus posted...

Granted, AOC wasn't qualified for office and the idiots in her district voted her in, so I guess it's not entirely her fault

im sure you also said this about trump, yes?

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Lokarin posted...

umm, government funded healthcare isn't socialism...

In a weird way no service industry at all can even be socialist since a service industry doesn't produce anything.

if that healthcare is funded solely by tax dollars, it indeed socialism or a socialist idea. farm subsides, public education, streets, roads, bridges are all socialism because we as individuals couldn't pay thee amenities. Suppose we had to pay say $5 bucks for every mile we drove our cars and then that money was put in a fund to be used for road repairs etc. How many of us would leave home?

Heck their are people who whine about paying tolls so you know they would lost their minds if they had to pay $5 bucks per mile when they drove their cars.

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America is the only 'First-World Country' where people medical bills are a serious cause of bankruptcy.
Isn't it also weird that you don't have to pay cops to arrest people or investigate crimes if you were the victim. Or if your house is on fire you don't get a bill from the FD after they put it out. Yet your most important thing, your body, is treated with the same care as cars.

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Radar posted...

America is the only 'First-World Country' where people medical bills are a serious cause of bankruptcy.

You're right. That's because we don't pay a socialist system that pays the doctors so that everyone can have healthcare. It's one or the other. There's no such thing as "free". We do have other social programs in place that result in increased taxes for everyone, and arguably too many. Why should even more of our hard-earned money go to people who likely don't work as hard (or in some cases, at all)? Charity is a good thing, very virtuous, but forced charity isn't virtuous in the slightest. Forced charity is tyranny, and is also ultimately what Socialism and Communism depend on.

tl;dr

You're right. Instead, other "First-World Countries" have taxes in general as a serious case of bankruptcy.

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I'm not sure whats funnier. How much conservatives rage about AOC or how enraged it makes leftists when people say anything negative about her

The funniest thing--and that is "funny" as in strange--is seeing rage where there is none, because tone injection is a thing.

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Entity13 posted...

The funniest thing--and that is "funny" as in strange--is seeing rage where there is none, because tone injection is a thing.

What a weird post lol

mrduckbear posted...

the free market capitalistic policies that are responsible for making the United States the wealthiest nation in world history

The US is only the wealthiest nation if you look at raw GDP. Look at GDP per capita or national debt/surplus, and it falls well behind many others.

Furthermore, the US mostly became as wealthy as it is not because of free market capitalistic policies, but because it didn't spend half of the 20th century having its manufacturing infrastructure blown up like much of the rest of the world did. The fact that the US was able to expand its infrastructure and economy during the World Wars and didn't have to rebuild much of anything afterwards pretty much single-handedly propelled it to economic superpower status. If anything, there was less of an emphasis on free market policies during some of the country's greatest periods of economic growth than there is now, with higher corporate and personal tax rates, livable minimum wages, and a more robust social security system. The push toward a freer market is relatively recent and more a product of corporate lobbying and Cold War propaganda than any actual, demonstrated benefits of deregulating commerce, and it certainly can't be thanked for the economic prosperity the US has enjoyed for most of the last century.

Zero_Maniac posted...

You're right. Instead, other "First-World Countries" have taxes in general as a serious case of bankruptcy.

I feel like you should be able to find a citation for a claim like "countries with socialized health care see comparable numbers of people bankrupted by taxes as the US sees people bankrupted by medical bills." That's a very empirical claim, after all, and data that is generally pretty readily available. So... why haven't you?

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Do they hate actual socialism, or what Fox told them socialism is?
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I don't agree with a lot of shit she says but I don't really understand where the outright hate comes from.

Pelosi, sure. Hate that old weasel.

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adjl posted...

I feel like you should be able to find a citation for a claim like "countries with socialized health care see comparable numbers of people bankrupted by taxes as the US sees people bankrupted by medical bills." That's a very empirical claim, after all, and data that is generally pretty readily available. So... why haven't you?

Is anyone else citing empirical data in this thread? Didn't think so.

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Zero_Maniac posted...

Is anyone else citing empirical data in this thread? Didn't think so.

AFAIK, you're the only one making the claim that having socialized health care will bankrupt the country... Which if we had it, there would probably still be some kind of rule in effect to stop that from happening. That being said, adjl is correct. If it would bankrupt us, there should be some kind of proof that you could show that it's been bad in the other countries. But it seems the other countries with it are doing fine with it, it seems. Which is kind of proof on it's own. Unless you have something that shows that those countries are doing worse...
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Zero_Maniac posted...

Is anyone else citing empirical data in this thread? Didn't think so.

In the context of "Americans are often bankrupted by medical costs"? That's common knowledge. You don't really need a specific citation for that, much like you don't need to cite a source for saying that water is a liquid at room temperature. Meanwhile, you're trying to convince everyone of something they don't already know to be true. That works a whole lot better when you provide evidence for the claim, especially when it's a claim that very obviously will have evidence supporting it if it's true.

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The healthcare system in this country is for sure broken. There are multiple reasons for that that aren't simply solved by adopting a european style healthcare system though

OhhhJa posted...

The healthcare system in this country is for sure broken. There are multiple reasons for that that aren't simply solved by adopting a european style healthcare system though

I dont think it would immediately fix it. But I do think it would help...
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OhhhJa posted...

The healthcare system in this country is for sure broken. There are multiple reasons for that that aren't simply solved by adopting a european style healthcare system though

First thing is to tell all those corporations trying to profit from the sick and dying to fuck off.

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LinkPizza posted...

AFAIK, you're the only one making the claim that having socialized health care will bankrupt the country... Which if we had it, there would probably still be some kind of rule in effect to stop that from happening. That being said, adjl is correct. If it would bankrupt us, there should be some kind of proof that you could show that it's been bad in the other countries. But it seems the other countries with it are doing fine with it, it seems. Which is kind of proof on it's own. Unless you have something that shows that those countries are doing worse...

"America is the only 'First-World Country' where people medical bills are a serious cause of bankruptcy."

No one cited a source for this. And no, just hand-waiving it as "common knowledge" isn't valid, because it's not necessarily common knowledge for those who don't frequent PotD or other boards on forums in which politics are discussed.

adjl posted...

In the context of "Americans are often bankrupted by medical costs"? That's common knowledge.

Not really. Not to me it isn't.

adjl posted...

Meanwhile, you're trying to convince everyone of something they don't already know to be true.

And you're trying to convince me of something I don't already know to be true. Your claim was made first, so you should provide evidence first.

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Zero_Maniac posted...

"America is the only 'First-World Country' where people medical bills are a serious cause of bankruptcy."

No one cited a source for this. And no, just hand-waiving it as "common knowledge" isn't valid, because it's not necessarily common knowledge for those who don't frequent PotD or other boards on forums in which politics are discussed.

As others have said, it's common knowledge. What you're saying is:

-Not common Knowledge
-Goes against information from other countries that haven't gone bankrupt due to their healthcare.

it's pretty easy to understand. Common knowledge is good enough, though. So, in this case, you can't prove anything, so whatever, I guess... And you can always see past topics if you look for them. But we're not saying common knowledge to only those who frequent PotD. Common knowledge to those that live in the US. Or know even a little about the US...

Zero_Maniac posted...

And you're trying to convince me of something I don't already know to be true. Your claim was made first, so you should provide evidence first.

Maybe I missed something, but wasn't you claim first. I thought you made a claim in post #25 and he replied in post #29. Meaning that you would have claimed first, right?
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papercup posted...

So it's not 50% of Americans, it's 50% of conservatives.

well that still seems like good numbers even if it were the case.

DT had like a 51% approval rating right?

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LinkPizza posted...

Maybe I missed something, but wasn't you claim first. I thought you made a claim in post #25 and he replied in post #29. Meaning that you would have claimed first, right?

You did miss something. That post was in response to his claim. I literally quoted his claim in that post. He asserted the claim, starting the debate, and did not back it up whatsoever. That alone is grounds for me to not take this seriously, which is why I'm not bothering to dig anything up to back my own claim.


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Zero_Maniac posted...

You did miss something. That post was in response to his claim.

Oh. I see. I know who adjl is, but I didn't know that Radar and adjl were the same person...

Zero_Maniac posted...

and did not back it up whatsoever. That alone is grounds for me to not take this seriously

You don't have to take it seriously, but that's probably why people aren't taking you post seriously, as well...

Zero_Maniac posted...

which is why I'm not bothering to dig anything up to back my own claim.

You don't have to, but since most people here have used common sense to understand that you're claim is most likely wrong, that's fine. You can give whatever reasons you want. But most will probably understand that you didn't have proof and just used this reasoning as a scapegoat or whatever...
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LinkPizza posted...

Oh. I see. I know who adjl is, but I didn't know that Radar and adjl were the same person...

I didn't know that either. Weird...

But seriously, I know what you're getting at. The reason I said:

Zero_Maniac posted...

And you're trying to convince me of something I don't already know to be true

Is because I'm assuming they're on the same "side" and arguing for the same thing. Perhaps they're not, I'm perfectly open to being wrong about this, but it seemed to me like they are/were.

LinkPizza posted...

You don't have to take it seriously, but that's probably why people aren't taking you post seriously, as well...

I'm alright with that. Post #10 is the only post in this topic where I'm being serious, and yes I'm also saying that this very post isn't one I want to be taken seriously either.

LinkPizza posted...

You don't have to, but since most people here have used common sense to understand that you're claim is most likely wrong, that's fine. You can give whatever reasons you want. But most will probably understand that you didn't have proof and just used this reasoning as a scapegoat or whatever...

That's fine. People can cite "common knowledge" all they like, but that's not going to convince me of anything because this is the first I've heard of medical bills being a leading cause of bankruptcy. Not that you or anyone else should care about convincing me. I'm certain that you don't.

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Same side is one thing, but you did make it sound like he was the one you responded to. In that case, it would fall on Radar to post evidence. But something you said earlier still rings true. You mentioned about the common sense stuff. Thing is, it should be common since to pretty much anyone, not just posters, that the American Health systems sucks and cost way too much. Which does contribute to bankruptcy. Trying to deny that, even without someone posting evidence, isn't a good look... You asking them to provide evidence which they have before. Not to mentioned evidence of the obvious. If you live in the US, it's be a surprise if you didn't know how bad the health care system is. I hate politics and everything surrounding it, and I know... Either way, they probably aren't going to try to convince you. Especially since you are saying not to that the post seriously...
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LinkPizza posted...

Trying to deny that, even without someone posting evidence, isn't a good look...

And I'm supposed to care about what random schmucks on the internet think of me? I don't, but perhaps you do which is why you're so focused on appearances. I just like to debate.

LinkPizza posted...

You asking them to provide evidence which they have before.

Um...? When did this happen? Certainly not in this thread, and that's what matters in this case.

LinkPizza posted...

If you live in the US, it's be a surprise if you didn't know how bad the health care system is.

I've heard it's bad, but I haven't heard exactly why in-depth. Even if you show me just how bad it is, you're not going to convince me that Socialism is the solution.

LinkPizza posted...

Either way, they probably aren't going to try to convince you

Good.

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Zero_Maniac posted...

And I'm supposed to care about what random schmucks on the internet think of me? I don't, but perhaps you do which is why you're so focused on appearances.

I don't know why you're talking about appearances. Though, you don't have to care what they think of you...

Zero_Maniac posted...

Um...? When did this happen? Certainly not in this thread, and that's what matters in this case.

No. I thought that was clear that it wasn't this thread. It has happened in other threads. Though, as I said earlier, it's not something people argue against, as it is common knowledge... Plus, when somebody ask for evidence on obvious stuff like this, they never actually look at it. And people get tired of wasting their time. Especially in cases like this where what they said is common knowledge...

Zero_Maniac posted...

I've heard it's bad, but I haven't heard exactly why in-depth. Even if you show me just how bad it is, you're not going to convince me that Socialism is the solution.

I can't say socialism will fix everything. But I definitely believe we'd be in a much better position. People would probably be healthier if they could go to the doctor without going bankrupt. People fear going to the doctor because of the bill. If people could go without that fear, people would be healthier. And might even need the doctor less. Which could definitely help...
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LinkPizza posted...

I don't know why you're talking about appearances. Though, you don't have to care what they think of you...

Lol. You're going to accuse me of projecting when you're the first person who mentioned how I "look"? Let's analyze what you actually said:

"Trying to deny that, even without someone posting evidence, isn't a good look.."

You're the one who brought up appearances or perceptions of people, not me. The terms "look" and "appearance" are synonymous in this context. It's hilarious how you're essentially saying, "No u".

LinkPizza posted...

No. I thought that was clear that it wasn't this thread. It has happened in other threads

Right, but you're assuming I've read these other threads. I haven't.

LinkPizza posted...

Plus, when somebody ask for evidence on obvious stuff like this, they never actually look at it.

I actually would. I don't expect you to believe me though.

LinkPizza posted...

I can't say socialism will fix everything. But I definitely believe we'd be in a much better position. People would probably be healthier if they could go to the doctor without going bankrupt. People fear going to the doctor because of the bill. If people could go without that fear, people would be healthier. And might even need the doctor less. Which could definitely help...

Hey, you might be right. Socializing healthcare could make life better for everyone. Should we do the same with dental care?

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Zero_Maniac posted...

Lol. You're going to accuse me of projecting when you're the first person who mentioned how I "look"? Let's analyze what you actually said:

"Trying to deny that, even without someone posting evidence, isn't a good look.."

You're the one who brought up appearances or perceptions of people, not me. The terms "look" and "appearance" are synonymous in this context. It's hilarious how you're essentially saying, "No u".

Ah. I see. You though "not a good look" meant something about appearances. That would be false. I was using it in another way. In the context I use it in, "Look" and "Appearance" are not synonymous. That's where your mistake was...

Zero_Maniac posted...

Right, but you're assuming I've read these other threads. I haven't.

Sure. I still don't really see and issue, though...

Zero_Maniac posted...

I actually would. I don't expect you to believe me though.

It is hard to when everybody says the same thing...

Zero_Maniac posted...

Hey, you might be right. Socializing healthcare could make life better for everyone. Should we do the same with dental care?

Probably, tbh...
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Zero_Maniac posted...

Socializing healthcare could make life better for everyone. Should we do the same with dental care?

uh

dental care falls under healthcare, so yes.

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