Poll of the Day > my pharmacy tried giving me generic insulin and i told them to fuck off

(+) Yeah! (+)

and then took it anyways because i need it

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I have been refusing to take insulin injections for years. I take glipizide and metformin but won't do shots.

I may die, but I won't be fat when I do.

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do

do you think insulin makes you fat


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helIy posted...

do

do you think insulin makes you fat

It can, doesn't for everyone, but did for my wife and a few others I know. When I was put on gliberide about 7 years ago or so, I was working out all summer to prep for next school year. The year before I lost 20 pounds but that year I gained like 15. Was really not happy. Then my doctor said "Oh yeah, one of the side effects of gliberide is you can gain about 20 pounds). I was not happy.

Anyway, I won't take insulin shots unless I absolutely have to. Maybe if I get down another 20-30 pounds (be pretty close to optimal weight then), since it'll give me wiggle room and I can stop taking it if I start gaining weight fast. I refuse to get so out of shape it's hard for me to walk a few miles etc.

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That is some bullshit

was it all they had or something?

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No, I'm on Glipizide now which is much the same, without the weight gain.

Here are the side effects of Gliburide which my doctor DID NOT tell me about.

The more common side effects that can occur with glyburide include:

• diarrhea.
• dizziness.
• headache.
• heartburn.
• nausea.
• gas.
• weight gain.

I was not very happy after 3 months of no pizza + working out 2+ hours a day to gain weight. I enjoyed the working out, but the no pizza/lasagna at that point in my life really freaking sucked.

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Here are the side effects of regular insulin injections.

My wife was insulin resistant btw, which is why she gained so much weight. I probably would not be, but I don't wanna gain ANY weight and my blood sugars are not horrid if I'm careful (which I am).

Insulin Regular, Injectable Solution - Side Effects - Healthline
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• Severe Hypoglycemia. Hypoglycemia is the most commonly observed adverse reaction in patients using insulin, including LANTUS [see WARNINGS AND PRECAUTIONS]. ...
• Peripheral Edema. ...
• Lipodystrophy. ...
• Insulin Initiation And Intensification Of Glucose Control. ...
• Weight Gain. ...
• Allergic Reactions.

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wolfy42 posted...

It can, doesn't for everyone, but did for my wife and a few others I know.

Have they had their thyroid glands checked out?

wolfy42 posted...

metformin

Poison. Be better off on the insulin.

wolfy42 posted...

glyburide

had not heard of that one before

*googles*

Glyburide has been associated with an increased risk for hypoglycemia and long-term cardiovascular mortality.

wack. totally wack.

Both those drugs are bad, and whoever made them should feel bad.

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metformin is fine lmao

and the reason weight gain is listed for insulin is specifically because of americas obesity problem.

you have these obese diabetic people who, now with insulin, think they can just eat whatever they want like they used to, but they're not actually doing anything to counteract the increase in calories.

basically, if it'll make you fat to begin with, it'll make you fat.

insulin, itself, does not do anything to make you gain weight. it can't.

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helIy posted...

metformin is fine lmao

If you like lactic acidosis poisoning your body, then I guess so.

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helIy posted...

insulin, itself, does not do anything to make you gain weight. it can't.

Gain weight is an ambiguous term, all kinds of tissues and water contribute to body weight.

Insulin most certainly plays a role in the storage of energy as fat (being its prime function).

Mice fed ad libitum treated with insulin accumulate more body fat relative to control mice, without significant differences in food intake.

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KodyKeir posted...

If you like lactic acidosis poisoning your body, then I guess so.

that's like saying don't take Tylenol if you don't want holes in your stomach

Clench281 posted...

Gain weight is an ambiguous term, all kinds of tissues and water contribute to body weight.

Insulin most certainly plays a role in the storage of energy as fat (being its prime function).

Mice fed ad libitum treated with insulin accumulate more body fat relative to control mice, without significant differences in food intake.

uh huh

every study on it comes down to too many calories vs activity, which causes cells to store more glucose which leads to creating fat.

which means, that if something was going to make you fat, then taking insulin isn't going to make much of a difference. mainly because insulin is something your body is supposed to produce, and absorb, naturally. it is not something that's going to magically cause you to gain weight.


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Insulin literally tells the body "hey, take that sugar and store it somewhere." Sugar storage is weight gain. If you've been correcting for an insulin deficiency with your diet, taking insulin is going to cause weigh gain unless you adjust your diet accordingly.

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I really hope I never develop diabetes it seems like such a terrible disease I hope they find a way soon to better treat or reverse it

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helIy posted...

and then took it anyways because i need it

Whats wrong with generic insulin?

KodyKeir posted...

If you like lactic acidosis poisoning your body, then I guess so.

The only time thats a risk is if your renal function is poor.

adjl posted...

Insulin literally tells the body "hey, take that sugar and store it somewhere." Sugar storage is weight gain. If you've been correcting for an insulin deficiency with your diet, taking insulin is going to cause weigh gain unless you adjust your diet accordingly.

yes.

again,

helIy posted...

it comes down to too many calories vs activity, which causes cells to store more glucose which leads to creating fat.

which means, that if something was going to make you fat, then taking insulin isn't going to make much of a difference. mainly because insulin is something your body is supposed to produce, and absorb, naturally. it is not something that's going to magically cause you to gain weight.

it's literally doing what your body is supposed to do. if you don't actually burn off the calories you take in, you will gain weight.

that's how gaining weight fucking works


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BroodRyu posted...

Whats wrong with generic insulin?

nothing lol

i just prefer humalog. the generic is also made by libby, but i don't trust it. why is the makers of humalog making a generic version of their own product. what's wrong with it.

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helIy posted...

why is the makers of humalog making a generic version of their own product. what's wrong with it.

Nothing is wrong with it. It's probably the exact same product with a different label. Plenty of people will choose generic and they want to get as much money as they can. Sure, their profit margin is smaller off the generic label. But it's profit they wouldn't be getting if they didn't put it out under that label.


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it just seems sketchy to me.

if you're making a generic of your own product to offer a cheaper alternative to the "name brand" version, then just make that version cheaper

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helIy posted...

if you're making a generic of your own product to offer a cheaper alternative to the "name brand" version, then just make that version cheaper

Why? They'd lose out on all the extra money that they'd get from people who think like you.


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No matter what they say or tests have shown about weight gain from insulin, i know it can cause weight gain in some people. Glyburide caused me to gain weight (Even if not a ton), but more importantly my wife took a ton of generic insulin shots to get her blood sugars down (and they were still over 200 on average until she started taking Victoza). She was highly insulin resistant and because of that gained about 100 pounds in the first year after starting to take it.

But...but she must have eaten badly and not exercised).

Nope, I always was the cook and did all the shopping. I made sure she ate a healthy diet. She could eat NOTHING for days and her blood sugars would still be high (which happened alot in the hospital as they wouldn't want to give her victoza in the hospital and they couldn't get her blood sugars down just with insulin).

So yes, you can gain weight because of it, even if your really careful and even exercising (just water areobics and walking laps (with a bit of swimming laps) for her, but I got her active every day.

Will i have the same issues? Probably not, most people don't and many take insulin without gaining weight.

But i don't wanna go there if I don't have to. My A1C is usually around 7.5 or so, which is high but not REALLY high, and with more exercise and a more careful diet, i think I can get it lower (I am pretty good but I drink soda sometimes, eat pizza/pasta etc).

My doctor of course thinks I should have been on insulin shots for the last 5 years or so and believes I'll eventually die if i keep going like this. So far at least I have not had any complications not even kidney stones (like my wife used to get) etc. My eyesight sucks, but that isn't due to diabetes (though it probably doesn't help). My hearing loss IS a big problem which I try and get my doctor to focus on, but she only wants to deal with diabetes and nothing else.

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helIy posted...

yes.

again,

it's literally doing what your body is supposed to do. if you don't actually burn off the calories you take in, you will gain weight.

that's how gaining weight fucking works

So you admit it

the insulin literally is resulting in weight gain

/meangirls

Your burn/not burn is a gross oversimplification that doesn't even address what's going on here. This problem has to do with correcting assimilation/excretion, not correcting calorie use and disuse

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what i said is literally the reason

period.

When you take insulin, glucose is able to enter your cells, and glucose levels in your blood drop. This is the desired treatment goal.

But if you take in more calories than you need to maintain a healthy weight given your level of activity your cells will get more glucose than they need. Glucose that your cells don't use accumulates as fat.

https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/diabetes/ in-depth/insulin-and-weight-gain/art-20047836

Insulin-associated weight gain may result from a reduction of blood glucose to levels below the renal threshold without a compensatory reduction in calorie intake, a defensive or unconscious increase in calorie intake caused by the fear or experience of hypoglycaemia, or the 'unphysiological' pharmacokinetic and metabolic profiles that follow subcutaneous administration. There is, however, scope for limiting insulin-associated weight gain. Strategies include limiting dose by increasing insulin sensitivity through diet and exercise or by using adjunctive anorectic or insulin-sparing pharmacotherapies such as pramlintide or metformin. Insulin replacement regimens that attempt to mimic physiological norms should also enable insulin to be dosed with maximum efficiency.

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/17924864/

In this cohort, weight loss had already started at the time of diagnosis and continued until insulin was introduced. The weight patients reached after the introduction of insulin was highly correlated with their maximal weight before diabetes. Onset of weight loss before the diagnosis of diabetes has rarely been observed, even in obese type 2 diabetic patients and even though type 2 diabetes may remain undiagnosed for as long as 912 years (2). Long-term studies of insulin-treated patients with type 2 diabetes suggest that the weight such patients reach is asymptotic, and that most weight gain occurs during the first 3 years (3,4,5). The results of the University Group Diabetes Program (6) were unusual because the patients treated with insulin did not gain weight. In that study, the patients in the placebo group lost weight.

https://care.diabetesjournals.org/content/24/10/1849

it literally is that they don't exercise enough to burn off their calories that their cells are now properly handling, which is how weight gain works.

between me, and you and adjl, which of us actually need insulin therapy and have been actually educated on what it can and can't do, with actual accredited studies that support their claim?


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Your point seems to be, "well yeah adding insulin results in fat accumulation, but only if you don't adjust your diet and activity levels to perfectly counteract the effects of insulin."

I can also pretend to always be right if I temper every statement with "... so long as you also apply X Y Z conditions that make my claim true."

Let's go back to the start.

helIy posted...

insulin, itself, does not do anything to make you gain weight. it can't.

If we wanted to know the effects of insulin, by itself, how would we conduct that experiment?

We would take one group of people who are currently maintaining their weight, give them insulin, and tell them to maintain their lifestyle identically as before.

We would take a second group of people who are maintaining their weight, give them placebo, and tell them to maintain their lifestyle identically as before.

What difference in outcome might you expect from such experiment, and why?

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Clench281 posted...

What difference in outcome might you expect from such experiment, and why?

helIy posted...

In this cohort, weight loss had already started at the time of diagnosis and continued until insulin was introduced. The weight patients reached after the introduction of insulin was highly correlated with their maximal weight before diabetes. Onset of weight loss before the diagnosis of diabetes has rarely been observed, even in obese type 2 diabetic patients and even though type 2 diabetes may remain undiagnosed for as long as 912 years (2). Long-term studies of insulin-treated patients with type 2 diabetes suggest that the weight such patients reach is asymptotic, and that most weight gain occurs during the first 3 years (3,4,5). The results of the University Group Diabetes Program (6) were unusual because the patients treated with insulin did not gain weight. In that study, the patients in the placebo group lost weight.
https://care.diabetesjournals.org/content/24/10/1849

that.

it has already been studied.

and hey look at that, no one gained weight.

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helIy posted...

that.

it has already been studied.

and hey look at that, no one gained weight.

First off, that's a retrospective study, not an experimental (prospective) study. Only the latter allows one to control variables and observe outcome after the fact.

But even more importantly... The study you linked literally says that they started insulin therapy and subsequently gained weight. The title is certainly misleading, as the point made by the article is that the average weight gained by insulin will usually not produce a new level of heaviest weight

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which falls handily in line with

helIy posted...

burn off their calories that their cells are now properly handling, which is how weight gain works.

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helIy posted...

and hey look at that, no one gained weight.

Being unable to admit you're wrong is such a gross personality trait

Everyone can see you're acting foolish now, so bye


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everyone can see that i'm right lmao

i even posted studies that say the same thing i'm saying~

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Insulin is often seen in liquid form

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that is true

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This is a great opportunity for my cleverest user tag yet

insulint

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Lol

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seems like it would be hard to find a use case for it

they'd have to be insolent while also needing insulin

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helIy posted...

it's literally doing what your body is supposed to do. if you don't actually burn off the calories you take in, you will gain weight.

that's how gaining weight f***ing works

Indeed. With no other changes, increasing the amount of insulin in your blood will cause weight gain. In practice, because increasing the amount of insulin in your blood affects your appetite, you'll often self-correct the amount you're eating and ultimately end up stabilizing at a similar weight to what you had prior to starting on it, but that's introducing extra variables. All other things being equal, starting insulin can be expected to cause weight gain.

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increasing the amount of insulin in your blood actually suppresses appetite.

i don't wanna type a whole bunch of shit out, so here:

In a healthy body, insulin works to turn what you eat into energy. When you eat a meal, your blood sugar levels rise. This triggers the pancreas to produce insulin and release it into the bloodstream, where it helps the glucose enter the cells in your muscles, fat, and liver. This energy is either used or stored until needed.
Unfortunately, with diabetes, insulin either does not work correctly, or the body does not produce enough or any at all. Without the necessary insulin, the blood sugar remains in the bloodstream, leaving the muscles and other cells in the body starved for the energy they need. This stimulates cravings for food and the feelings of hunger you may experience.
Hyperglycemia and Hunger
Hyperglycemia refers to high blood glucose levels in the body. This occurs when the body produces too little, or no insulin or the insulin the body produces does not perform properly.
As mentioned above, when this occurs, the body is unable to take the food you eat and convert it to energy. Because of this, your body still craves food in order to meet energy demands. Your body continues to tell you it is hungry, and, in many cases, you may give in to these cravings.
Unfortunately, no matter how much you eat, simply eating will not eliminate the feelings of hunger. Continued eating, however, will continue to increase your blood sugar levels.

unless you are referring to hypoglycemia, in which case, sure. you'd have a point there, but then you're getting into insulin mismanagement in general which is a whole other thing entirely

so, once again, the only reason you would gain weight while on insulin is because the cells in your body are finally functioning properly, and you aren't burning off the calories in what you are eating, which is how gaining weight works in general, and is not exclusive to insulin therapy.

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