Current Events > Isn't odd how we are asked to venerate slavers

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Murphiroth
04/25/23 4:30:35 PM
#51:


VFrench1962 posted...
I am confused as to why you respond to my posts, after spending 2 years in my topics saying nothing but inb4 another ban or mocking my thoughts on Cuomo and Franken

Still not convinced you can actually think tbqh
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VFrench1962
04/25/23 4:31:06 PM
#52:


Murphiroth posted...
What is this melty?

I said nothing about slaves, just that you're mythologizing him. Unless you'd like to provide a source for your claim that he "took the crown and threw it on the floor and went back home to Mt Vernon."

Because there's not actually any evidence he was ever actually presented with an offer to be king to begin with.
Yes he fucking was, omfg what is this REVIONIST CRAP?!

He was literally given the opportunity to rule as King.
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#53
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Murphiroth
04/25/23 4:32:13 PM
#54:


VFrench1962 posted...
Yes he fucking was, omfg what is this REVIONIST CRAP?!

He was literally given the opportunity to rule as King.

Cool, then you shouldn't have an issue providing a source, a link, anything.

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VFrench1962
04/25/23 4:33:18 PM
#55:


Murphiroth posted...
Cool, then you shouldn't have an issue providing a source, a link, anything.
Im not sending a link to high school AP US History.

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Murphiroth
04/25/23 4:34:33 PM
#56:


VFrench1962 posted...
Im not sending a link to high school AP US History.

Gotcha, so you can't prove shit and are speaking out of your ass.

https://www.newyorkalmanack.com/2021/05/did-george-washington-turn-down-the-crown-at-newburgh/

https://msuweb.montclair.edu/~furrg/gbi/docs/kingmyth.html#:~:text=Did%20anyone%20ever%20offer%20to,around%20for%20a%20long%20time.

Wow look at those sources! I could find more probably.

Get blown the fuck out.
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#57
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VFrench1962
04/25/23 4:36:14 PM
#58:


Murphiroth posted...
Gotcha, so you can't prove shit and are speaking out of your ass.

https://www.newyorkalmanack.com/2021/05/did-george-washington-turn-down-the-crown-at-newburgh/

https://msuweb.montclair.edu/~furrg/gbi/docs/kingmyth.html#:~:text=Did%20anyone%20ever%20offer%20to,around%20for%20a%20long%20time.

Wow look at those sources! I could find more probably.

Get blown the fuck out.


.

https://www.mountvernon.org/library/digitalhistory/digital-encyclopedia/article/cincinnatus/
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#59
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VFrench1962
04/25/23 4:39:46 PM
#60:


[LFAQs-redacted-quote]



The parallels with General George Washington were not lost on his contemporaries. Called up from his retirement at Mount Vernon to lead the Continental Army, Washington dramatically resigned his commission and returned to his farm once the war had been won. In emulating Cincinnatus, Washington allayed real fears that he might use his position as a successful general to retain power as a military dictator. In the process Washington illustrated that he placed public service above personal gain.
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Murphiroth
04/25/23 4:39:47 PM
#61:


VFrench1962 posted...
.

https://www.mountvernon.org/library/digitalhistory/digital-encyclopedia/article/cincinnatus/

Ctrl + F "king" "crown"

Huh no mention of him turning down a kingship or "throwing down a crown" like you claimed.

What is this supposed to prove again?

Are you trying to conflate him resigning his commission as leader of the Continental Army after the war was won with your earlier claims? Because those aren't the same thing, and it's literally the exact mythologizing I said you were doing.

So thanks for proving my point and getting blown the fuck out again!
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#62
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VFrench1962
04/25/23 4:42:50 PM
#63:


I mean I could hold the words MILITARY DICTATOR if you want. Lol
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#64
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Murphiroth
04/25/23 4:44:45 PM
#65:


VFrench1962 posted...
I mean I could hold the words MILITARY DICTATOR if you want. Lol

LMAO the inability to admit how wrong you are is kind of hilarious, ngl
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mario2000
04/25/23 4:49:57 PM
#66:


User Info: VFrench1962
New User
User Since: Apr 2023
Karma: 5
Active Posts: 52

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garan
04/25/23 4:52:02 PM
#67:


Slavery has existed throughout all human history and still exists in parts of the world today. Lots of 'great' people have owned slaves, and as someone mentioned Muhammad is literally worshiped by nearly 2 billion people today.

The Pharaohs of Egypt owned slaves. The Ancient Babylonians, Greeks, Romans, Aztecs, etc. owned slaves. Many great historical figures did amazing things and yet owned slaves.

Hell, the Woman King came out a year ago and it's literally about slavers with a fictionalized main character inserted to try to make the civilization look better.

If we want to go to something more recent, plenty of companies profit from slave labor today. And lots of people venerated Steve Jobs even though Apple's success is built on the backs of slaves and children.

If anything, what is 'odd' is that people today are able to see the troubling nature of the world. For most of human existence, that was a luxury afforded only to the very rich.

But let me get out of the way, if the rest of you merely want to yell about presidents and other crap like that.
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mario2000
04/25/23 4:57:20 PM
#68:


garan posted...
Slavery has existed throughout all human history and still exists in parts of the world today. Lots of 'great' people have owned slaves, and as someone mentioned Muhammad is literally worshiped by nearly 2 billion people today.

The Pharaohs of Egypt owned slaves. The Ancient Babylonians, Greeks, Romans, Aztecs, etc. owned slaves. Many great historical figures did amazing things and yet owned slaves.

Hell, the Woman King came out a year ago and it's literally about slavers with a fictionalized main character inserted to try to make the civilization look better.

If we want to go to something more recent, plenty of companies profit from slave labor today. And lots of people venerated Steve Jobs even though Apple's success is built on the backs of slaves and children.

If anything, what is 'odd' is that people today are able to see the troubling nature of the world. For most of human existence, that was a luxury afforded only to the very rich.

But let me get out of the way, if the rest of you merely want to yell about presidents and other crap like that.

Murder has existed throughout all human history and still exists. Doesn't mean murder is good or we should excuse it.

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#69
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Murphiroth
04/25/23 4:58:28 PM
#70:


garan posted...
Slavery has existed throughout all human history and still exists in parts of the world today. Lots of 'great' people have owned slaves, and as someone mentioned Muhammad is literally worshiped by nearly 2 billion people today.

The Pharaohs of Egypt owned slaves. The Ancient Babylonians, Greeks, Romans, Aztecs, etc. owned slaves. Many great historical figures did amazing things and yet owned slaves.

Hell, the Woman King came out a year ago and it's literally about slavers with a fictionalized main character inserted to try to make the civilization look better.

If we want to go to something more recent, plenty of companies profit from slave labor today. And lots of people venerated Steve Jobs even though Apple's success is built on the backs of slaves and children.

If anything, what is 'odd' is that people today are able to see the troubling nature of the world. For most of human existence, that was a luxury afforded only to the very rich.

But let me get out of the way, if the rest of you merely want to yell about presidents and other crap like that.

Ok? Not really sure what your point is here other than "Slavery exists"

which like

no shit sherlock

what an astounding revelation that you totally needed to "well ackshually"
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ScazarMeltex
04/25/23 4:58:59 PM
#71:


[LFAQs-redacted-quote]

Lots of weird takes in here today tbh.

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deoxxys
04/25/23 5:01:16 PM
#72:


cjsdowg posted...
Can we use that logic with the Nazis and their actions?
Difference here is that what the Nazi did wasnt a everyday way of life everywhere. Slavery was normalized, taking people and putting them in encampments for torture and murder wasnt.

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VFrench1962
04/25/23 5:01:53 PM
#73:


mario2000 posted...
Murder has existed throughout all human history and still exists. Doesn't mean murder is good or we should excuse it.
Rifht, but that is not what the guy was saying.

Its more like murder has existed throughout human history and yes some of the best people in history have overseen murder; but they are still amazing people who history can judge for the amazing things they did - aside from the murder

FDRs tenure saw all of WWII and tons of death and destruction - still an amazing man

Lincolns tenure saw complete fascism as he suspended Habeas Corpus - still an amazing man.

Sherman burned down all of Atlanta and killed thousands - still an amazing man (who should have finished the job)

We are able to see human beings for their qualities, while also taking into consideration context and history.

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Murphiroth
04/25/23 5:03:30 PM
#74:


We're also able to mythologize and make shit up about folks from history, then double down and deny that we're mythologizing despite proof that we're doing so.

Oh wait no that's just you.
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deoxxys
04/25/23 5:04:13 PM
#75:


Also I have never met anyone who really venerated the founding fathers, just been like, "yep that was them", they did this and thats how it happened.

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CyricZ
04/25/23 5:05:36 PM
#76:


This topic is a certified hoot.

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CyricZ He/him
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#77
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mario2000
04/25/23 5:10:01 PM
#78:


VFrench1962 posted...
Rifht, but that is not what the guy was saying.

Its more like murder has existed throughout human history and yes some of the best people in history have overseen murder; but they are still amazing people who history can judge for the amazing things they did - aside from the murder

FDRs tenure saw all of WWII and tons of death and destruction - still an amazing man

Lincolns tenure saw complete fascism as he suspended Habeas Corpus - still an amazing man.

Sherman burned down all of Atlanta and killed thousands - still an amazing man (who should have finished the job)

We are able to see human beings for their qualities, while also taking into consideration context and history.

Slavery is bad.

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Tyranthraxus
04/25/23 5:10:13 PM
#79:


Dude literally thinks assassin's Creed is real history

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It says right here in Matthew 16:4 "Jesus doth not need a giant Mecha."
https://i.imgur.com/dQgC4kv.jpg
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VFrench1962
04/25/23 5:11:41 PM
#80:


mario2000 posted...
Slavery is bad.
And yet the United States built a superpower off the backs of it.

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#81
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VFrench1962
04/25/23 5:14:42 PM
#82:


Not defending slavery.

Slavery happened. The US benefited from it.

I mean it is just plain facts.

I am, however, defending that spaceplanes 300 years ago can still BE GOOD PEOPLE
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#83
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mario2000
04/25/23 5:21:06 PM
#84:


VFrench1962 posted...
And yet the United States built a superpower off the backs of it.

Yes it did.

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garan
04/25/23 5:21:54 PM
#85:


I can be amazed at what Ramses II built thousands of years ago and still recognize the fact that he was a polygamist warlord who owned slaves.
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legendary_zell
04/25/23 5:25:55 PM
#86:


garan posted...
I can be amazed at what Ramses II built thousands of years ago and still recognize the fact that he was a polygamist warlord who owned slaves.

Yes, but do you need to idolize him, build statues for him, and treat him like he was an enlightened philosopher king? Cause that's what we do with the US founders to this day.

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garan
04/25/23 5:29:51 PM
#87:


legendary_zell posted...
Yes, but do you need to idolize him, build statues for him, and treat him like he was an enlightened philosopher king? Cause that's what we do with the US founders to this day.


And as I said, that's also how people treat Steve Jobs even today. Everyone using their Iphones to browse this site right now are built off the slave labor that mined the rare minerals in Africa and were assembled by slave labor in China.
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mario2000
04/25/23 5:29:57 PM
#88:


I didn't realize Ramses II had anything to do with American history.

garan posted...
And as I said, that's also how people treat Steve Jobs even today. Everyone using their Iphones to browse this site right now are built off the slave labor that mined the rare minerals in Africa and were assembled by slave labor in China.

oh this is where we're going with this

LMAO

will we be wearing the extra floppy clown shoes today, sir?

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VFrench1962
04/25/23 5:33:42 PM
#89:


mario2000 posted...
I didn't realize Ramses II had anything to do with American history.

oh this is where we're going with this

LMAO
He is 100% correct. Steve Jobs utilized Foxconn to build Apple into what it is today - a company that had employees literally jumping out of windows to get out of their slavery and end their misery.
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CyricZ
04/25/23 5:37:01 PM
#90:


VFrench1962 posted...
He is 100% correct. Steve Jobs utilized Foxconn to build Apple into what it is today - a company that had employees literally jumping out of windows to get out of their slavery and end their misery.
So what's the message "We all benefit from slavery, we should at least enjoy it as much as I do?"

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Murphiroth
04/25/23 5:38:57 PM
#91:


CyricZ posted...
So what's the message "We all benefit from slavery, we should at least enjoy it as much as I do?"

Pretty much, yeah, but he's too much of a coward to actually say what he means.
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mario2000
04/25/23 5:39:34 PM
#92:


VFrench1962 posted...
He is 100% correct. Steve Jobs utilized Foxconn to build Apple into what it is today - a company that had employees literally jumping out of windows to get out of their slavery and end their misery.

Yes he did.

idk why you're assuming I didn't know this or that I idolize Steve Jobs

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VFrench1962
04/25/23 5:40:57 PM
#93:


CyricZ posted...
So what's the message "We all benefit from slavery, we should at least enjoy it as much as I do?"
No, the message is dont be naive to how this country was built and continues to be built - because you have benefited from it. Instead see the nuance of every person differently, in comparison to the paradigm of their time
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garan
04/25/23 5:42:21 PM
#94:


I'm saying it's disingenuous to act like this is a thing that only relates to American presidents.
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mario2000
04/25/23 5:42:40 PM
#95:


VFrench1962 posted...
No, the message is dont be naive to how this country was built and continues to be built - because you have benefited from it. Instead see the nuance of every person differently, in comparison to the paradigm of their time

"please worship slave owners as much as I do"

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Murphiroth
04/25/23 5:42:48 PM
#96:


VFrench1962 posted...
No, the message is dont be naive to how this country was built and continues to be built - because you have benefited from it. Instead see the nuance of every person differently, in comparison to the paradigm of their time

So "well ackshually" but for slavery, got it.

Literally everyone knows how the country was built you absolute chucklefuck.
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Murphiroth
04/25/23 5:43:12 PM
#97:


garan posted...
I'm saying it's disingenuous to act like this is a thing that only relates to American presidents.

Cite where this happened.
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mario2000
04/25/23 5:43:58 PM
#98:


garan posted...
I'm saying it's disingenuous to act like this is a thing that only relates to American presidents.

No one thinks only American presidents owned slaves.

Did losing Tucker break you peoples' brains that badly?

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Foppe
04/25/23 5:47:08 PM
#99:


deoxxys posted...
Difference here is that what the Nazi did wasnt a everyday way of life everywhere. Slavery was normalized, taking people and putting them in encampments for torture and murder wasnt.
The Nazis didnt invent concentration camps and they were not the last one to use them.
The word comes from the Spanish word reconcentracion, and they used them in Cuba at the late 1800.
UK and Germany used them in Africa in the early 1900.
During WWI they popped up everywhere. UK, Germany, France, Russia, Turkey, Austro-Hunhary, Brazil, Japan, China, India, Haiti, Cuba, Singapore, Siam, New Zealand, and other countries.
These WWI camps were at least nicer compared to both earlier and the Nazi ones, at least in the more civilized countries. And while they mostly only had "foreigners" and, depending on country, had enough food to not starve to death, they made it acceptable that a targeted group might turn itself in and be detained during a crisis, with a reasonable expectation to one day be released without "permanent" harm (mental illness and shattered minority communities wasnt seen as harm back then).
The Ottoman on the other hand used them for their Armenian genocide.
So yes, concentration camps were a normalized thing back then, the Nazis just took them to the next level.

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VFrench1962
04/25/23 5:50:19 PM
#100:


mario2000 posted...
"please worship slave owners as much as I do"
ok
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