Board 8 > KP's Top 100 Games (Win $5 For Guessing Right)

(+) Yeah! (+)

I didn't pay for it so I can't say if it's worth it, but it's an enjoyable experience. Waiting for a sale is probably wise. It took me under 2 hours, though I didn't go back and do everything.

Lightning Round Results

As a side note, after experiencing these games through other means, I did go on to buy them on Steam in support. They deserved it!

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Hint:
1. Has a lot of different dialogue based on how drunk you make people get.

Answers:
Afterparty - 2
VA-11 Hall-A - 1

Did not know that Afterparty was a thing until now. Valhalla (no way I can spell the actual name) is a fun bartending Visual Novel that I discovered through Let's Play. Has a dark cyberpunk/dystopia aesthetic, but still manages to keep things light with its entertaining characters.

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2. I. Hear. A. Sound.
Drakengard - 2
P.T. - 1

P.T. absolutely would have been on this list if I'd remembered it. That game is phenomenal...and you can't play it anymore. Thanks, Konami.

The Drakengard hint is based on the in-game description of its final stage. The game has so much that I love - very dark fantasy aesthetic, insane characters, one of the best OSTs of all time, batshit crazy plot that's like a rollercoaster in perpetual freefall. Unfortunately, none of that compares to the most gruesome part of all: the gameplay. TheDarkId's LP is how I experienced this game, and that's for the best.

I was an early adopter of Nier due to Drakengard. Impulse-bought expecting the same uniqueness with (hopefully) improved gameplay. Was the best impulse buy I've ever made.

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3. Candidate for the most horrifying ending in gaming. The title of the game is four letters long.
SOMA - 2
F.E.A.R. - 1

SOMA largely trades gameplay for story, and I think it was worth it. Which is easy to say when I didn't play it, but ignore that. Was one of the most thought-provoking experiences I've seen. Don't want to say much more for people who haven't gotten to it.

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4. A series finale that pissed off a lot of people early in the game, then again during the ending.
Mass Effect 3 - 2
The Last of Us Part 2 - 1
Danganronpa V3 - 0

Mass Effect 3 pissed people off in the early game? I don't remember at part that would have.

The only Danganronpa game I wholeheartedly like. Mostly because it's the only one that seems to have...teeth, I'll say. The other games have the whole Despair motif but it always felt fake. Very few things drew a legitimate emotional response. V3 actively goes out of its way to hurt the player, and I respect that. It also has my favorite characters in the series.

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5. The title is two primal instincts of humanity. They're core gameplay elements, too.
Fear and Hunger - 2
Killer Instinct - 1

F&H is kinda tragic for me. I think it would've made my Top 20 if I'd somehow discovered it naturally. Don't think I could've discovered it at all without that SuperEyePatch video, though! Then I couldn't stop myself from looking up everything about it.

Thankfully, I was smart enough not to spoil myself on the sequel.

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Mac Arrowny and Hbthebattle both scored 3/5, while MZero got 1/5, making the former two the final winners of Round 4. I'm not doing a second lightning round so screw it, they both get $5 each.

Hints for the next round will be posted soon-ish.

You know I was really unsure about that me3 guess - "wouldnt someone who liked me2 that much have played me3" but i didnt even think about v3. My other thought was VLR but i discarded it for similar reasons, plus the ending specifically isn't what people dislike about it.

KamikazePotato posted...

3. Candidate for the most horrifying ending in gaming. The title of the game is four letters long.

SOMA was my first thought on this one but then I remembered the original Doom's ending with the weirdly realistic severed rabbit head and thought for sure it was gonna be that. Would've missed that one, and Danganronpa V3.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MZlm2K66iCs

I've somehow never heard about that Doom ending, what in the world.

I had F.E.A.R. in there as the depressing ending one for a while despite playing/watching SOMA a few months ago, haha.

Missing VA-11 Hall-A to guess Afterparty makes me feel dumb since I've played the former but not the latter...

KamikazePotato posted...

Mass Effect 3 pissed people off in the early game? I don't remember a part that would have.

The party makeup annoyed a lot of people early on, specifically none of the ME2 characters being playable. Should've thought of V3! Cases 1 and 6 are by far the best in the game, IMO.

Round 5 Hints:

51. Small bombs.

52. Despite having multiple sequels, this fighting game still has a death grip on a decent portion of the fanbase, who continue to play it to this day.

53. I rooted for the game that preceded it (in its series) to fail. That game underperformed, so we got this one as a response.

54. This game received a follow-up sequel over 10 years after the fact, which while good, didn't quite live up to the original.

55. Climb to the top, and don't give up. You got this.

56. Don't believe everyone's lies despite being considered a lackluster entry by the series' fans, this game is great, especially its updated re-release.

57. Would not be on the list without mods. If you've been paying attention to hints and writeups throughout the topic, you'll have a better chance at figuring this one out.

58. A very successful kickstarter game in the genre of 'the original series is dead, so fuck it, we'll do it ourselves'.

59. A duology. Technically the series has three games, but we don't talk about the third. Nintendo has certainly forgotten about it!

60. This game won its second GameFAQs Contest match, but to the chagrin of its fans, it didn't win by enough.

KamikazePotato posted...

MZero got 1/5

at least I tried

I sent many answers this time that may be technically correct but almost certainly will not be the answer sought

wow, this round is tough! lots of hints with enough vagueness to be many answers

I would've gotten VA-11 HALL-A and Soma from the lightning round. Probably not the others.

changmas posted...

wow, this round is tough! lots of hints with enough vagueness to be many answers

Trying to avoid multiples 10s again!

I would have guessed Dragon Quest 3 if I thought that was a valid response because it's my favorite in the series. I was worried you were going to say it was 5.

And shame on me for not recognizing that the word phoenix in a clue was a reference to Ace Attorney. In my defense, I haven't played past the third game because they're not on Steam.

Leonhart4 posted...

I sent many answers this time that may be technically correct but almost certainly will not be the answer sought

I did that this time too. There's only one game I know I got right, maybe a few others I feel good about, but otherwise it'll be a total crapshoot.

up

bump

Bit swamped with work right now, so this round will probably be left open for little longer than usual. Have received a good amount of submissions though!

I'll give it 24 more hours until Round 5 is over.

Was beginning to wonder if I'd forgotten about/missed the topic and an entire round had gone by already.

Round 5 Results

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14 people submitted guesses.
The most common score was 8 / 10.
The average score was 6.64 / 10.

This one ended up...hoo boy.

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Hint:
51. Small bombs.

Answers:
Umineko no Naku Koro ni 9
Nine Hours, Nine Persons, Nine Doors 1
Super Metroid 1
Metroid Prime 1
Minesweeper 1
Bomberman 1

A reference to Battler's 'amazing' argument from Umineko Episode 4. Became something of a meme in the fanbase. Considering this seems very hard to google, I'm surprised so many people got it!

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Hint:
52. Despite having multiple sequels, this fighting game still has a death grip on a decent portion of the fanbase, who continue to play it to this day.

Answers:
Super Smash Bros. Melee 14

Was wondering if people would get tripped up by the hint calling Melee a 'fighting' game, but I guess that debate is in the past.

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Hint:
53. I rooted for the game that preceded it in its series to fail. That game underperformed, so we got this game as a response.

Answers:
Devil May Cry 5 6
Devil May Cry 3 3
Resident Evil 7 2
Sonic Mania 1
Mass Effect Legendary Edition 1
Final Fantasy XIII-2 1

Spite was the key part of this hint. The previous game couldn't just be a disappointing entry in a series; it was something I was rooting for to fail, which also implies a contentious pre-release buildup period. DmC: Devil May Cry stumbled so Devil May Cry 5 could soar.

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Hint:
54. This game got a follow-up sequel over 10 years after the fact, which while good, didn't quite live up to the original.

Answers:
Psychonauts 3
Psychonauts 2 1
Final Fantasy IV 1
Marvel vs. Capcom 2 1
Planescape: Torment 1
Tekken Tag Tournament 1
Earthbound 1
Kid Icarus: Uprising 1
Battletoads 1
Nier 1
Diablo II 1
Doom 1

A bloodbath of answers. I'd feel bad about making the hint too difficult if you guys didn't ace most of the other questions. One person had the right idea, but seemed to misread the prompt.

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Hint:
55. Climb to the top, and don't give up. You got this.

Answers:
Celeste 10
Getting Over It With Bennett Foddy 2
Journey 1
Metal Gear Solid 3 1

I tried to imbue the hint with Celeste's overall vibe. Getting Over It was also a hilariously accurate false positive.

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Hint:
56. Don't believe everyone's lies despite being considered a lackluster entry by the series' fans, this game is great, especially its updated re-release.

Answers:
Final Fantasy XII 10
The Legend of Zelda: Wind Waker 1
Resident Evil 3 1
Final Fantasy VIII 1
The Legend of Zelda: Skyward Sword 1

'Don't believe Ondore's lies!' was a meme for a hot minute. That combined with the other info made for a fairly clear answer.

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Hint:
57. Would not be on the list without mods. If you've been paying attention to hints and writeups throughout the topic, you'll have a better chance at figuring this one out.

Answers:
The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim 10
Fallout New Vegas 3
The Elder Scrolls IV: Oblivion 1

Fun fact: my last Skyrim playthrough had over 150 mods.

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Hint:
58. A very successful kickstarter game in the genre of 'the original series is dead, so fuck it, we'll do it ourselves'.

Answers:
Bloodstained: Ritual of the Night 11
Pillars of Eternity 1
Wargroove 1
Mighty No. 9 1

I've never been so insulted as the day someone thought I would put Mighty No 9 on my Top 100 list. I mean, yeah, I got suckered into backing it, but that's completely different!

My record for backing good games is actually very poor. The kickstarter games I do like usually end up being stuff I didn't support beforehand although there is one notable exception later on the list. Hopefully Eiyuden can buck the trend as well.

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Hint:
59. A duology. Technically the series has three games, but we don't talk about the third. Nintendo has certainly forgotten about it, at least.

Answers:
Golden Sun / Golden Sun: The Lost Age 12
Paper Mario 1

Dark Dawn was so disappointing.

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Hint:
60. This game won its second GameFAQs Contest match, but to the chagrin of its fans, it didn't win by enough.

Answers:
Deus Ex 8
Undertale 2
Persona 4 1
NieR: Automata 1
Metal Gear Solid 2 1
The Legend of Zelda: A Link Between Worlds 1

Contest knowledge fact-check. Plenty of games have gotten whiny fans during contest matches, but for some reason Deus Ex stood out.

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Drum roll please...the winners of Round 5 are:
Hbthebattle
Mac Arrowny
AxemRedRanger
DanKirby
Kenri

All with a score of 8 / 10! I checked multiple times just to be sure, but no one scored a 9 or higher. Jeez. Guess we're due for another Lightning Round!

To give people extra time to check in, the lightning round will start on Tuesday, November 20th, 4 PM, EST, and will last 24 hours.

I'll also post game writeups in the interim.

You wouldn't have played Skyrim without mods? Eesh. I figured Skyrim and New Vegas were safe from that designation. Oblivion, otoh, I modded the crap out of.

I played Oblivion close to release when I was console-only. Can't exactly mod a 360!

Damn, should have gone with Bloodstained after all, but Pillars felt like it was more in tune with the games on the list so far. (Also I think Bloodstained sucks so I would never assume it's on someone's top 100 list...!)

Also I'm kinda shocked at the consensus on #52 considering the number of fighting games that can fit that description -- but I guess Melee is the obvious one.

Pillars is the kind of game I should like, but it just wasn't very good. Writing was kind of...nonexistent, really. I dropped off after like 8 hours.

Naturally, it's a game I backed.

Considering this seems very hard to google, I'm surprised so many people got it!

The text search for "small bombs" just gives bath bombs and war information, but if you click "Images" the top row is filled with Umineko memes. At least for me.

Skyrim is the most insipid and pointless game without mods

When I typed "small bombs" into the Google search field, "small bombs umineko" was the first suggestion given by the autocomplete.

Dang, I was the Psychonauts 2 person. I remember thinking about it a long time and was like "Oh, it's about Psychonauts 2!" and just put that in.

I love that DMC3 is the second most common guess after DMC5. For some reason, DMC3 is what I chose and didn't even consider 5! Somehow I don't really consider DmC as part of the DMC series...

DanKirby posted...

When I typed "small bombs" into the Google search field, "small bombs umineko" was the first suggestion given by the autocomplete.

Huh, the more you know.

MacArrowny posted...

I love that DMC3 is the second most common guess after DMC5. For some reason, DMC3 is what I chose and didn't even consider 5! Somehow I don't really consider DmC as part of the DMC series...

DmC would've been a fun game if it wasn't Devil May Cry. I'm a believer in things being judged on their own merits, but...there's a limit to how objective a person can be.

Also the story still would've been garbage with or without the Devil May Cry trappings.

60. Deus Ex
Much like Half-Life 1, Deux Ex set a standard for immersive sims that feels like it should have been exceeded by now, but kinda hasn't. Every game in the genre still lives under its decades-long shadow.

That's not to say it's perfect. Age hasn't been kind to Deus Ex's graphics, and the voice acting is straight-up bad. However, the overall quality of its gameplay and writing is frankly astounding. You're given true freedom to explore its world and tackle missions in the way you want, but the game also never loses sight of its core narrative, which tackles heavy, nuanced themes that are more relevant nowadays than they were in 2000. If you were to make a list of the most 'intelligent' games, Deux Ex would easily make the shortlist its writers were clearly keyed into real-world issues and politics.

Granted, the stellar writing can be hard to take seriously when paired with the laughable voice acting, but at least we got some memes out of that.

59. Golden Sun / Golden Sun: The Lost Age
Propped up by nostalgia more than most other games on this list. Us Nintendo-systems-only people took what we could get before branching out! Golden Sun probably isn't worth playing to a modern RPG enthusiast, mostly because the writing...isn't so good. The plot and characters are somehow more boring than a random SNES game, while simultaneously being expressed in 20 times as many words. An editor was sorely needed here.

With that said, Golden Sun still does a lot else right. Its GBA graphics and music hold up shockingly well, and are undoubtedly the best on the system. Combat is simple on the surface but gets far more interesting when combined with the Djinn system especially during boss battles, where you're temporarily sacrificing stats in order to invoke unique effects and prepare for big summons.

And where the developers skimped on writing quality, then went all-out on dungeon design. Golden Sun 1 and 2 give you a variety of special abilities to use outside of combat, making dungeon puzzles actually fun to navigate and solve. I can't fully express how unusual it is for a game in this genre to have fun dungeon puzzles. Off the top of my head, I can't think of an RPG that does it better.

58. Bloodstained: Ritual of the Night
My experience with Bloodstained was extremely different from most other people's. I played it on PC, which means I didn't get the brutal input lag that going by a sales breakdown the majority of players experienced by choosing the Switch version. Additionally, most people who played Bloodstained probably started the game on Normal mode and breezed through a Metroidvania best described as Pretty Good.

I used a cheat code to start on Hard mode after a couple hours of being bored with Normal, because I have a problem. Suddenly, the game went from power fantasy to soulslike. I had to pay close attention to normal enemies, and bosses just plain fucked me up. It turned combat from mindless to thrilling. Wouldn't have worked out that way if the enemies weren't well-designed, but they thankfully are, with clear patterns you can get around with timing and skill.

Adding to that, the difficulty spike made exploration very rewarding. The variety of different abilities you learned from killing enemies actually felt important, and not just like bonus set dressing. You never knew what might help you gain an edge in the next battle. My favorite was when I discovered a tiny shield ability that seemed underwhelming at first due to high MP costs, then realized the shield got bigger as I upgraded it, blocked everything it hit, and could be immediately toggled on/off. Just like that, I'd found the game's secret Parry ability.

I already tended to start games on higher difficulties before Bloodstained, but this game cemented that practice.

57. The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim (modded)
I didn't enjoy base Skyrim very much. It felt like Oblivion with all the whimsy sucked out of it. Where's the Acrobatics stat, Bethesda???

https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrimspecialedition/mods/56478

Never mind, I found it.

Skyrim is the closest thing that gaming has to a build-your-own game experience. You can modify it to be...so many different things. Want psuedo-Dark Souls combat? There's mods for that. Want it to be a true stealth game instead? There's mods for that. Disappointed with the base game's list of spells?...You get the idea. As long as you enjoy the fantasy world aesthetic, and you're willing to put up with some jank, you can make Skyrim into anything your heart desires.

I'm exaggerating, but not by much. What Skyrim's community has done for it is ridiculously impressive, giving the game a significantly longer shelf life than it would've normally had. Like, Skyrim modders have gotten so good that one mod spun off into its game that won awards. I'm not even remotely interested in trying Starfield until 2-3 years of mods are out for it.

56. Final Fantasy XII
The Zodiac Age version is the best version, but I was a big fan even before it came out. FF12 just happens to hit a lot of sweet spots I really love. Medieval fantasy world, music from the FFT guy, big areas to explore, pseudo-MMORPG combat, and a more grounded anime art style are all huge selling points for me. Engrossing gameplay (when you turn off gambits) combined with amazing aesthetics goes a long way. I've replayed FF12 four times and wouldn't mind going for a fifth sometime in the future.

It's also worth noting that I've only finished FF12 once. My playthroughs always end whenever I get my fill of hunts, and side content, because...

Well, there's no two ways around it: the plot and character suck. I don't actually disagree with people who dislike this game, because it fails at the fundamental reason why people are drawn to RPGs in the first place. It's also super obvious when the developers ran out of time/budget, because the frequency of cutscenes falls off a cliff halfway through. No amount of updated re-releases can fix that.

I actually think FFXII has a handful of really good (or at least interesting) characters. The story just doesn't know how to use them effectively most of the time.

Leonhart4 posted...

I actually think FFXII has a handful of really good (or at least interesting) characters. The story just doesn't know how to use them effectively most of the time.

I think it has characters that had the potential to be good, but not many, and even those were all underutilized. Just look at the main party. Vaan and Penelo are worthless, and Fran doesn't exist in 99% of the plot except as a Baltheir hanger-on, meaning the other three have the carry the story alone. And they don't.

I really like Balthier, Ashe, and Basch. Gabranth and Dr. Cid are good, too. Heck, even Vossler kinda teased you into thinking the story was going to be deeper than it was early on.

I think they could've carried the story. The story just didn't give them enough to work with. I blame the plot way more than the cast.

That's fair. Personally, I didn't like most of those characters as much, so I'm not sure the narrative would've worked for me regardless. I think my favorite side character who could've helped carry things if they were given more screen time was Reddas, who...didn't last long.

DanKirby posted...

When I typed "small bombs" into the Google search field, "small bombs umineko" was the first suggestion given by the autocomplete.

Yeah autocomplete came in clutch for me too. Actually searching only returns war news though.

KamikazePotato posted...

Additionally, most people who played Bloodstained probably started the game on Normal mode and breezed through a Metroidvania best described as Pretty Good.

I found Bloodstained actually kinda difficult even on normal, at least compared to most games in the genre. I was playing on Switch though, but it was after the first major patch that attempted to fix that version's issues (it didn't fix that version's issues). I replayed it recently to try one of the new characters and wow it was even glitchier and with worse performance than the first time I played it.

Suffice to say I'm not a fan, but I think even if all the technical issues were fixed I'd still find it pretty uninspired (also ugly for whatever that's worth). Really really wanted to like the game (I backed it at like the $150 level!) but yeah, nope.

You'd probably find Normal mode easier without the input lag, lmao. Kind of criminal that they released the game in that state on Switch. Makes me happy I have a gaming PC - I say, before immediately remembering the many horrible PC ports over the years.

Yeah I'm sure the (lack of) input lag would make a difference! I think I got Bloodstained on PC in a bundle recently so maybe I'll give it a third try sometime.

Well, if you thought the actual game felt uninspired and ugly (I can't really argue with the latter statement) then I doubt your feelings will change much. I probably would've been relatively unimpressed if I didn't really vibe with the combination of hard-but-fair combat and character customization.

Overall my opinions on the Metroidvania genre don't really match up with other people's. It's a genre I like, but rarely ever love. I thought Hollow Knight got tedious by the end, and that's considered a holy grail. The games I've appreciated the most are the ones where I have the choice to focus on action and combat rather than exploration.

55. Celeste
My favorite 2-D platformer. Considering that's a genre I don't usually enjoy, Celeste being this high up on my list means a lot. I love pretty much every part of this game. The precision gameplay is perfectly tuned to its difficulty, making hard sections in short bursts. Celeste throws a lot of challenges at you, but the checkpointing is so frequent that it never comes across as insurmountable. It feels designed to ensure that anyone could beat this game as long as they keep at it and don't give up.

Which ties in perfectly with the narrative. Celeste has a simple story about overcoming mental demons, but it's exactly what works for this type of experience. Gonna bust out the term Ludonarrative Harmony, as Celeste does that better than almost any other game I can think of, culminating in one of my favorite final levels ever.

54. Psychonauts
Psychonauts is an exceptionally charming game. It's the kind of experience where you get the impression that the writers put all their best little ideas in one package. While the story isn't particularly complex, taking place mostly at a summer camp, its exploration of character psychology provides plenty of nuance. The game does a fantastic job at using unique visuals to infer information to the player.

Speaking of visuals they're worthy of praise as well. I love how weird everything looks in Psychonauts. The characters are practically mutants, and their mindscapes are a variety of over-the-top environments. Rather than making things look pretty, the game focuses on making things look memorable, which is to its benefit.

The gameplay being just 'okay' holds it back somewhat, but I'm not actually sure Psychonauts would have benefited from a robust combat system or whatever. Its focus was never supposed to be on that aspect. The collectathon angle provide enough moment-to-moment enjoyment regardless, and it thankfully it doesn't go overboard with that.

Psychonauts 2 is great too (although not quite meeting 1's standard), but Game Pass deleted my save file halfway through. Thanks, Microsoft.

53. Devil May Cry 5
https://i.imgflip.com/86gohk.jpg

DMC5 is fucking phenomenal when it's good. The problem is, it's not always good! V's 'just okay' combat really drag down the pacing, especially compared to Nero's 9/10 combat and Dante's 10/10 combat. I respect the developer for shaking things up with a completely different playstyle, but it just didn't end up being very interesting.

The plot also takes too long to kick in. While story isn't the focus of a character action game, games like DMC3 and Metal Gear Rising have shown that entertaining plots can really elevate the experience. Unfortunately, the first 2/3 of DMC5 mostly feels like it's spinning its wheels. Thankfully, the last 1/3 is great, and it all ends on an extremely strong note. If this ends up being the final DMC game, I'll be satisfied.

Special shoutout to Pull My Devil Trigger and Bury the Light, two absolutely fantastic songs that helped elevate the DMC5 experience.

52. Super Smash Brother: Melee
I think this was my #1 favorite game when I was like, 14 years old. How the mighty have fallen...kind of. At its core, Melee still has the most fun gameplay in the series. Captain Falcon with SSBM physics is a peak fighting game experience. And while later Smash games have eclipsed Melee's roster, back then, it really felt like something special. Like you were seeing the potential of what an ultimate gaming crossover would be like.

However, SSBM is also held back by its age. I haven't touched it in over ten years. There's no online, no HD re-release, and no one in my vicinity who'd be interested in playing. Unlike games with a focus on story, where I can at least remember the plot and characters years after finishing it, Melee is on Top 100 List life support. It'll drop more and more as time goes on, and my nostalgic memories of Falcon Punching CPUs fades to dust.

As for the other Smash games I considered Ultimate for this list, but decided against it 100% due to the awful online. There was an entire pandemic where Smash Ultimate would have been a fun game to play, but alas.

51. Umineko no Naku Koro ni
Speaking of games that used to be #1 on my list...where do I even begin to talk about Umineko?

Few games have affected my life more than it did. I've made enduring friendships specifically because of Umineko. For a couple years on B8 I was the 'Umineko guy' because of how hard I pushed it. More than almost any other game on this list, it was an event for me.

But all that was back when only the first half of the story was released. To be blunt; I really don't like Umineko Episodes 5, 6, and 8. Episode 7 was cool. The other three...not so much. If I were to partition Umineko, Episodes 1-4 would be in the Top 20 on this list, while 5-8 wouldn't make the list at all. They really soured me on the experience as a whole. I'll always appreciate the fun times Umineko gave me, but I'm not sure I can even call it a good story when everything is taken as a whole.

Even so, I've made my peace with the second half by now. I can still look back and appreciate the entertaining parts. Especially the music, which will always be fantastic.

Personally, I enjoyed Bloodstained a lot. All the silly powers are super fun, particularly Accelerator, which is some of the most joy I've had in a Metroidvania.

I quite liked FF12 when I played it, but I worry I'd be disappointed trying it again.

Erika Furudo top tier

All my playthroughs of FF12 after the first have actually been Vaan solo. It's not something I recommend to other people, but I thought it was very fun, especially in the Zodiac system with limited class options. You have to carefully build him around being able to cover multiple weaknesses, as well as making use of all your items and abilities.

Honestly I think almost any way of playing FF12 is better than what the default gives you. The Gambit system isn't great.

MacArrowny posted...

Erika Furudo top tier

I don't hate Erika, and her existence was probably necessary, but she felt too much like the author's pet character.

Triple post.

UltimaterializerX posted...

5-7 are very good. 8 is just an abomination.

5 and 6 are too closely tied to 8. They all further the themes of concealing the truth if it hurts. 7 feels oddly detached from the other three, which is absolutely to its benefit.

The first half of Umineko (barring the beginning of episode 1 and most of the Ange stuff of 4) is so great. I would get hooked and read for hours at a time.

That being said, I do love 5 and 6. They're just such good spectacle, even as they kinda begin to spit on what the first half of the story established. 8 just took it way too far. It's such a shame it ended that way. I'm honestly not big on 7. Will doesn't really do it for me as the protagonist, and it's a little too different for me. Ending is great though.

(Erika sucks)

KamikazePotato posted...

I don't hate Erika, and her existence was probably necessary, but she felt too much like the author's pet character.

She definitely has some bad scenes where they're talking too much about the nature of mysteries or whatever.

The scene where she cuts off all the heads of the people who were pretending to be dead hit me really hard though. Couldn't believe it happened.

That was a really good moment from Erika. Stuff like that is why I don't outright dislike her.

UltimaterializerX posted...

The truth in red in 7 is what actually happens, right? Its not an Eva lying kind of deal? Because I love that version of events.

I think so? It's been a while. There's a moment in 7 that implies Kinzo was actually a scumbag even in the beginning and betrayed the military dudes in order to steal the money but I think overall 7 is meant to be mostly representative of what actually happened.

KamikazePotato posted...

That was a really good moment from Erika. Stuff like that is why I don't outright dislike her.

I think so? It's been a while. There's a moment in 7 that implies Kinzo was actually a scumbag even in the beginning and betrayed the military dudes in order to steal the money but I think overall 7 is meant to be mostly representative of what actually happened.

The ending of 7 is meant to be what really happened in Ange's timeline, yes.

Also the twist that the people telling the story could lie about themselves like with Kinzo was pretty great.